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[Discussion] Do You Have the Stomach For a Rebuild?

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Warhippy

Would You Accept A Rebuild?  

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1 hour ago, Coconuts said:

Doesn't have to be one or the other, Pettersson, Hughes, and Podz are realistically the three pieces you absolutely hold on to if things trend towards rebuild territory. Assuming they want to stay. 

 

They're young enough that they could be closer to their peak in 4-6 seasons. 

Yzerman sold on a 25yr Mantha cause his age & salary demand, didn't fit his plans and he took, the FIRST best deal he got; a very similar decision, to CHI when they traded Dach and Debricant.  It seems once committed, a team has no choice but to commit and it will come down to a patient & competent FO, with the understanding & courage to rebuild and eventually turn the page cause we had seen what a incompetent FO can accomplish with a rebuild: Oilers & Sabres.  Although, both are doing well, right now; the Sabres might be better equipped to contend long term cause of their young D -  and if Levi developes into a goalie, they can depend on.  Perhaps their new FO, has learned some important  lessons from the incompetent Botterill regime - and as one of the ever rebuilding clubs, atleast their fans can look forward to a top 3 prospect, ever so often...

Edited by ShawnAntoski
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7 hours ago, DrJockitch said:

A team that is not good enough to contend perennially but tries to add one more UFA piece to push us into scraping into the playoffs where “anything can happen”. 
sure sounds like the JFJ Leafs to me. 

Take the Leafs and rangers 1997 through 2011 for $500 Alex

 

This is so bang on

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If we weren't doing this rebuild on the fly BS, we would still have Forsling and Mccan. I know he had attitude issues but maybe if they weren't in win-now mode, they would have given him the time to grow up a bit 

 

What does our line combos look like with them on the team ?

 

What other players would be in the lineup if not for the short cut trades ?

 

 

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15 hours ago, MaxVerstappen33 said:

If we weren't doing this rebuild on the fly BS, we would still have Forsling and Mccan. I know he had attitude issues but maybe if they weren't in win-now mode, they would have given him the time to grow up a bit 

 

What does our line combos look like with them on the team ?

 

What other players would be in the lineup if not for the short cut trades ?

 

 

Words vs Actions - Aquaman must really think the longtime fans, are not paying attention.  The playoff chasing strategy is really, getting tiresome and I really don't see a Cup coming, as long as, chasing a playoff spot is the strategy.  Anyways, to their own peril cause it seems apathy, has started to set in for some long timers..

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Just now, Warhippy said:

Fantelli

Michkov

Carlson

Bedard

 

We don't even have to bottom out.  Just top 4 would be pretty beneficial

Let's be honest, at this point any grade 'A' prospect at virtually any position would benefit our barren prospect pool. 

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5 minutes ago, Fanuck said:

Let's be honest, at this point any grade 'A' prospect at virtually any position would benefit our barren prospect pool. 

Have been watching Buffalo.  Since 2012 here is their draft and trade history

 

Drafting  top ten, two 1st overall franchise defining defencemen, while also trading a ppg 2nd overall forward and packing in those 1st and 2nd round picks for a solid decade.  They're looking all world right now

 

Draft history:  https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/teams/dr00005054.html

Trade history:  https://www.capfriendly.com/trades/sabres

 

In the last 10 years, 16 first round picks; 10 in the top 10, two 1st overall and two 2nd overall.  Sixteen picks in the 2nd round.  

 

They sucked like mad.  But over the last 3 years, since 2019.  Look at their trades, what they targeted and who.  Look who they were willing to let go to make it happen.  

 

Since 2012 here are the Canucks trade history and draft history

 

Draft history:  https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/teams/dr00008756.html

Trade history:  https://www.capfriendly.com/trades/canucks

 

In the last 10 years, eleven 1st round picks; 6 in the top 10, highest were two 5th overall picks.  Seven picks in the 2nd round.

 

You can see over the last 3-5 years the trading mentality of the Canucks "going for it" vs that of the Sabres who started int he last 3 years to truly "build for it"

 

Buffalo is our sister team and I miss Sabres Fan for his take on things because he must be loving things now.  As our sister team it is galling to see we've had similar trajectories for the last decade in terms of overall wins but where things lie now in terms of youth, depth and overall prospects/cap space

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Alot people on here don't seem comprehend or understand what a rebuild entails. When you rebuild, you expect the team to struggle and not be very competitive but you're building towards that and should understand it's going to take a few years at least,

 

When you watch the team struggle and they are spending  up against the cap it's a completely different feeling lol. You don't expect it. 

 

So yes, I've had the stomach for it for about 5 years now lol. But's it's become clear ownership covets a "playoff appearance" and subsequent revenue higher than actually competing for a cup. Dollars is dollars I guess. I think they are now past the point of a full rebuild, you'll likely see more tweaking on the fly...and hoping we see different results than the last 8 years of "tweaking on the fly" has given us....which is mediocrity, no cap room, thin prospect pool and lack of picks.

 

Fingers crossed.

Edited by Harold Drunken
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Worst teams in the NHL over the last 10 years.  All but one of those teams is projecting upwards.  Of all the ones that are, they have built, rebuilt and stockpiled youth; depth and top flight picks in positions of recognized organizational need.  Buffalo started progressing the moment they started targeting areas of need instead of just the best forwards in picks and trades.  Yzermans first pick in Detroit reflects that with Seider.  Sens targeted a mix of defense and forwards and even Jersey is getting it right having targeted defense in numerous recent trades.

 

Food for thought when you look and realize the records aren't that far off of each other.

 

 

Screenshot 2022-11-02 at 8.28.20 AM.png

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I think I would actually enjoy a rebuild at this point. Rutherford and Allvin (who was absolutely the wrong choice imo) are not inspiring any confidence they would be the right ones to carry out such a strategy though. 
 

Hiring Rutherford could have been the right move if he resisted the urge to bring over his Pittsburgh group and focus on gimmicky diversity hiring rather than finding the absolute best people for the jobs. 
 

Ownership will never authorize a true rebuild so it’s all moot. 

Edited by wallstreetamigo
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23 hours ago, Harold Drunken said:

Alot people on here don't seem comprehend or understand what a rebuild entails. When you rebuild, you expect the team to struggle and not be very competitive but you're building towards that and should understand it's going to take a few years at least,

 

When you watch the team struggle and they are spending  up against the cap it's a completely different feeling lol. You don't expect it. 

 

So yes, I've had the stomach for it for about 5 years now lol. But's it's become clear ownership covets a "playoff appearance" and subsequent revenue higher than actually competing for a cup. Dollars is dollars I guess. I think they are now past the point of a full rebuild, you'll likely see more tweaking on the fly...and hoping we see different results than the last 8 years of "tweaking on the fly" has given us....which is mediocrity, no cap room, thin prospect pool and lack of picks.

 

Fingers crossed.

#newownerneeded

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1 hour ago, Warhippy said:

Worst teams in the NHL over the last 10 years.  All but one of those teams is projecting upwards.  Of all the ones that are, they have built, rebuilt and stockpiled youth; depth and top flight picks in positions of recognized organizational need.  Buffalo started progressing the moment they started targeting areas of need instead of just the best forwards in picks and trades.  Yzermans first pick in Detroit reflects that with Seider.  Sens targeted a mix of defense and forwards and even Jersey is getting it right having targeted defense in numerous recent trades.

 

Food for thought when you look and realize the records aren't that far off of each other.

 

 

Screenshot 2022-11-02 at 8.28.20 AM.png

This is 100% bang on....and very depressing. 

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