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[Trade] Canucks trade Bo Horvat to Islanders for Anthony Beauvillier, Aatu Raty, 2023 1st-round draft pick


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8 hours ago, Pure961089 said:

The last time the Canucks were in a position like this was 2015. When we drafted Virtanen and McCann.   Let’s hope we draft better this time.   Kinda freakin’ out here because Harvey hasn’t really given me a lot of confidence in his drafting ability.  Lekkerimaki has been a disaster.  Let’s be honest.  So there’s cause to be concerned. 

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2014 draft minus Virtanen was a gold mine for us.

 

McCann (top 6 forward)

Demko (#1G)

Tryamkin (#4-6D)

Forsling (Top 4D)

 

If we picked Ehlers or Nylander and stayed patient and developed McCann and Forsling; and if we didn't play hardball with Tryamkin...

 

5 roster players.

 

What it could have been...

 

2014: Ehlers*, McCann, Demko, Tryamkin, Forsling

2015: Boeser

2016: Tkachuk* -- trade his a$$ later for a haul

2017: Petey

2018: Hughes

2019: Podz and Hogs

 

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1 minute ago, Timråfan said:

I promise you that were Chytil, Lundqvist and a 1st on the table for Miller they would have taken it at once.

The absolute only thing that could stop that is if the owner said no. 

 

Probably what happened as the Canucks were chasing a playoff spot.

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5 minutes ago, HorvatToBaertschi said:

I know nothing about value since the FA market is always.... interesting? 

 

Orlov 

Severson

Graves 

Gavrikov

Soucy

Gudas

Mayfield

Clifton
Stecher

 

All of these players would improve our defense more than Lundqvist, while staying at a price range around Beau's cap hit of 4.1. Some of them will probably go up to 6 mil though... Hard pass on that

Would love to bring back Stecher on a cheap $2M deal.  Guy was all heart and fit well in the  bottom 6D role.

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I think we all know that Canucks have a glut of wingers that need to be traded along with (hopefully) Myers (after July 1st).  I don’t see anyone wanting OEL (and I doubt he will waive his NMC).

 

JR and PA not done trading yet.

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22 minutes ago, jyu said:

2014 draft minus Virtanen was a gold mine for us.

 

McCann (top 6 forward)

Demko (#1G)

Tryamkin (#4-6D)

Forsling (Top 4D)

 

If we picked Ehlers or Nylander and stayed patient and developed McCann and Forsling; and if we didn't play hardball with Tryamkin...

 

5 roster players.

 

What it could have been...

 

2014: Ehlers*, McCann, Demko, Tryamkin, Forsling

2015: Boeser

2016: Tkachuk* -- trade his a$$ later for a haul

2017: Petey

2018: Hughes

2019: Podz and Hogs

 

We would have been better in the standings for years subsequent to 2014.  Probably would never been able to draft Petey or Quinn.

 

Butterfly Effect

 

 

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3 hours ago, wai_lai416 said:

what are you talking about.. they literally only have to play at a better clip then florida who they are already doing and 1 of pittsburgh or washington.. buffalo will start the annual slide to a high pick soon.

Never trust any prediction anyone makes on this site about where teams will finish in the standings. They are so horribly wrong and usually just reflect desperate hopes. From Van, to Vegas, to Seattle, Colorado, Jersey, Boston ... it's just hilarious really.

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22 minutes ago, jyu said:

2014 draft minus Virtanen was a gold mine for us.

 

McCann (top 6 forward)

Demko (#1G)

Tryamkin (#4-6D)

Forsling (Top 4D)

 

If we picked Ehlers or Nylander and stayed patient and developed McCann and Forsling; and if we didn't play hardball with Tryamkin...

 

5 roster players.

 

What it could have been...

 

2014: Ehlers*, McCann, Demko, Tryamkin, Forsling

2015: Boeser

2016: Tkachuk* -- trade his a$$ later for a haul

2017: Petey

2018: Hughes

2019: Podz and Hogs

 

We didn't play hardball with Tryamkin. He left. He didn't like Twitchy. His wife found it difficult to get work here.

If anything the club handled him with kid gloves. He refused to play in the AHL when he came to camp out of shape.

No one cares about that, yet Jake got crucified over that. But Jake was a long sad saga.

Tram is his own boss. Makes his own decisions. He bolts yet he's worshipped on CDC.

 

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1 minute ago, Gawdzukes said:

Never trust any prediction anyone makes on this site about where teams will finish in the standings. They are so horribly wrong and usually just reflect desperate hopes. From Van, to Vegas, to Seattle, Colorado, Jersey, Boston ... it's just hilarious really.

There's always Hope. But it's also a few kilometers up river.

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54 minutes ago, jyu said:

The latter is better today.

 

1. Horvat > Miller. I prefer to have a goal scoring faceoff machine of a 2C rather than a pouty scoring winger who doesn't use his size.

2. Chytil > Raty (for now).

3. Lunkvist < Beauvillier. I think Beauvillier will serve an important role on this team but Lunkvist is an RD and replaces one of the two aging defenders on the right side.

4. NYR 1st < NYI 1st.

 

Raty projects to be about as good a player as Chytil. He will be a 2C/3C. Hopefully he becomes a better player. 

 

NYI 1st is likely to get us a better player than NYR 1st.

 

I'd trade Miller for Chytil, Lundkvist, 1st if that was ever on the table.

 

My guess is nobody put in a decent enough offer for Miller.

 

 

 

From what I can see online, Horvat has 37 hits so far this year in 49 games and Miller has 99 in the same amount of games. Horvat is 10-ply compared to Miller.

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3 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

For argument's sake to get a few people riled up, which is the better team:

 

Miller + Raty + Beauvillier + 1st

 

Or

 

Horvat + Chytil + Lundqvist + 1st

Should be noted that the islanders pick is in the middle of the deepest draft ever and the Rangers pick was at the end of an average draft. Insane difference. Pretty much two second round picks or more of difference in value.

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1 hour ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

They spent their 1st last year in the Winnipeg trade so may have been a first this year which would be in the 22OA region. 

They spent their first on Copp... that was the same first they would have offered on JT instead of Copp

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56 minutes ago, coho8888 said:

We would have been better in the standings for years subsequent to 2014.  Probably would never been able to draft Petey or Quinn.

 

Butterfly Effect

 

 

That is a good point.

 

Ehlers and Tkachuk would have been on the team in 2017 and we would not have had the 5th overall pick in that year. Same for 2018.

 

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1 hour ago, HorvatToBaertschi said:

I know nothing about value since the FA market is always.... interesting? 

 

Orlov 

Severson

Graves 

Gavrikov

Soucy

Gudas

Mayfield

Clifton
Stecher

 

All of these players would improve our defense more than Lundqvist, while staying at a price range around Beau's cap hit of 4.1. Some of them will probably go up to 6 mil though... Hard pass on that

We need to avoid building our top 4 d through free agency. Add solid depth pieces on team friendly deals. Need to build D through draft and trades. Only exception should be if a player really wants to come here and take a bit less as a result.

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2 hours ago, jyu said:

The latter is better today.

 

1. Horvat > Miller. I prefer to have a goal scoring faceoff machine of a 2C rather than a pouty scoring winger who doesn't use his size.

2. Chytil > Raty (for now).

3. Lunkvist < Beauvillier. I think Beauvillier will serve an important role on this team but Lunkvist is an RD and replaces one of the two aging defenders on the right side.

4. NYR 1st < NYI 1st.

 

Raty projects to be about as good a player as Chytil. He will be a 2C/3C. Hopefully he becomes a better player. 

 

NYI 1st is likely to get us a better player than NYR 1st.

 

I'd trade Miller for Chytil, Lundkvist, 1st if that was ever on the table.

 

My guess is nobody put in a decent enough offer for Miller.

 

 

 

It has never been verified that this offer existed.  It's becoming Canuck folk lore.  It appears that

the management did not 'shop' Miller, which implied that he was 'their guy'.  When JT was signed last

summer, there was no indication that Bo was going to vastly improve his stats in the coming

season.   Hence the low ball offers and final realization that they weren't going to be able to

sign Bo at the price he wanted.

 

This season, Chytil has played better than anyone thought, but he doesn't play C and his skillset

is very different from Raty's.  However, jumping into the NHL at 18yrs is certainly a factor that

most young players cannot add to their resume, which temporarily moves the needle in

Chytil's favour.

 

I like the Bo trade (especially Raty), but the real win for the Canucks will be if the NYI pick lands

Reinbacher.  Although he's a lefty, Simashev would be awesome as well.

Edited by higgyfan
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9 hours ago, Gawdzukes said:

Isn't that EA sports or does this happen in real life and I'm caught in a time warp? ::D

Seems unlikely but it'd be the smartest move tbh 

 

If they're looking to be too far out of it and they haven't been able to lock Horvat down they're better off retaining on his deal and getting a return for him 

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17 hours ago, Bure_Pavel said:

To be fair Horvat has been given garbage wingers his whole career and still managed to produce year after year. Miller saw a lot of his success on the lotto line and loaded top powerplay.

Horvat doesn't use his wingers anyways, not sure it would matter.

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3 minutes ago, higgyfan said:

It has never been verified that this offer existed.  It's becoming Canuck folk lore.  It appears that

the management did not 'shop' Miller, which implied that he was 'their guy'.  When JT was signed last

summer, there was no indication that Bo was going to vastly improve his stats in the coming

season.   Hence the low ball offers and final realization that they weren't going to be able to

able to sign Boat the price he wanted.

 

This season, Chytil has played better than anyone thought, but he doesn't play C and his skillset

is very different from Raty's.  However, jumping into the NHL at 18yrs is certainly a factor that

most young players cannot add to their resume, which temporarily moves the needle in

Chytil's favour.

 

I like the Bo trade (especially Raty), but the real win for the Canucks will be if the NYI pick lands

Reinbacher.  Although he's a lefty, Simashev would be awesome as well.

Chytil doesn't play center? I haven't watched NYR lately but the last time I watched them, he was centering Kakko and Lafreniere... 

 

When it comes to Bo vs Miller decision, I agree with what you are saying.

 

I think the management wanted to keep them both. Miller was coming off a career season so they prioritized him knowing that they won't be able to sign him cheap and they probably felt 8 mil was fair.

 

They tried to sign Bo cheap and it obviously back fired.

 

JR's comments about liking the core and PA saying they made a fair offer to Bo, which Bo's camp rejected are the basis for me thinking they wanted to keep Bo if possible and the trade is a consequence of their miscalculation.

 

But at the end of the day, Bo got us the pieces that we need for the future whereas, I highly doubt Miller would have gotten the same pieces. 

 

And we could still trade Miller or we might not but it doesn't matter in the view of getting the retool going in the right direction as Horvat trade achieves much of what needed to be done. Now, if we can unload couple more contracts (Boeser and/or Garland) and/or wait until they expire (Myers, Pearson), we will be in a great situation cap wise with a pretty decent prospect pool, which will only get better after 2023 draft.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, MattWN. said:

Horvat doesn't use his wingers anyways, not sure it would matter.

This is true. Wingers use Horvat, not the other way around.

 

But good wingers who can make plays would definitely make a difference and bump up Bo's stats.

 

 

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