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[Proposal] Boeser to Winnipeg just makes too much sense for all three parties


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The problem: Winnipeg has trouble attracting free agents and getting players to sign long term with them.  Getting a rental is a very risky proposition for them as the player usually signs somewhere else in the summer.  

 

The solution: Vancouver trades Brock Boeser to Winnipeg with two years left beyond this one.  To make this more palatable for Winnipeg as far as salary goes, we agree to retain 1 million per year, and Winnipeg sends us their 3rd round pick this year, and their 3rd round pick next year.  

 

Benefit for Brock:  Fresh start, and he's geographically really close to home without actually moving to Minnesota. 

 

Benefit for Winnipeg: Player with term that can easily hit 30 goals especially with a fresh start.  25 years old and fits in well with all their core guys.  

 

Benefit for Vancouver: Kuzmenko, Beauvillier, Garland, and our other young wingers get promoted up a spot.  We clear a lot of salary despite retaining for two more years.  

 

 

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26 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

So what are we getting back? If it's a late first rounder I'm ok with that.

Boeser 1 million retained 

 

for 

 

2023 3rd round pick 

2024 3rd round pick 

 

If you think that we could ask for more, that's fair but my initial assessment is that we might be looking at a couple of 3rd rounders.  Maybe flip one of the 3rd rounders to their 2024 2nd rounder.  

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Its fair value

But nothing about playing with middling 6 wingers matters with OEL and Myers eating a major chunk of salary, playing top minutes, and being their regular selves the real problem of this team.  The structure is inept. It does save some cash to help.

 

Only somewhat likely Winnipeg is even interested.  

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4 minutes ago, CoquitlamDave said:

Its fair value

But nothing about playing with middling 6 wingers matters with OEL and Myers eating a major chunk of salary, playing top minutes, and being their regular selves the real problem of this team.  The structure is inept. It does save some cash to help.

 

Only somewhat likely Winnipeg is even interested.  

One step at a time...  

 

Don't wanna get into the big picture, but yeah we have lots of issues to fix. 

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So, I must be dumb or something........

 

I always thought the issue was that Boeser was over paid by a million for a 55 point winger

 

So we lower the price by a million, so he is not....................

 

Then you tell me that a 55 point winger is only worth 2 X 3rders

 

I guess maybe? But I am confused???

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4 minutes ago, J.I.A.H.N said:

So, I must be dumb or something........

 

I always thought the issue was that Boeser was over paid by a million for a 55 point winger

 

So we lower the price by a million, so he is not....................

 

Then you tell me that a 55 point winger is only worth 2 X 3rders

 

I guess maybe? But I am confused???

If a team really likes Brock, he could fetch more then 2 x 3rd round picks, I was just trying to be realistic and conservative.  

 

Also Winnipeg is missing their 2nd round pick in this year's draft.  

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Just now, VancouverHabitant said:

If a team really likes Brock, he could fetch more then 2 x 3rd round picks, I was just trying to be realistic and conservative.  

 

Also Winnipeg is missing their 2nd round pick in this year's draft.  

I probably came on too strong ...sorry about that!

 

But I actually see that same reasoning, on Hockey Futures, and it always puzzles me.....

 

It was a decent proposal......I could have worded it better!

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6 minutes ago, J.I.A.H.N said:

I probably came on too strong ...sorry about that!

 

But I actually see that same reasoning, on Hockey Futures, and it always puzzles me.....

 

It was a decent proposal......I could have worded it better!

Oh it's all good, but on the subject of value of a 60 point winger we have to look at all other details that include his age, contract, and health.  

 

Brock is fairly young at 25, and given a small retention would have a contract that's decent for the acquiring team.  Health has been a concern.  

 

Now that I've laid it all out, I don't think that asking for their 2024 2nd round pick + 2023 3rd round pick would be too much if we do retain a bit. 

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Two third round picks? I think we can do a lot better and if we can't, I'd rather keep Brock. He's only 25, his best years may well be 27-32. I'd hate to think he becomes a 30+ goal scorer and we're left with a couple of thirds. If we had amazing late-drafting history then maybe, but we haven't, I don't see those third round picks materializing into anything spectacular. A couple of seconds and we're maybe talking but even then, they'll be late 2nds.

 

 

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Seems pretty reasonable to me.   I'd ask for a good D prospect back too.   And change the 2024 into a second.   As for those that don't think this is a good deal, they could be right.   But the team structure is flawed.   And are going to need to spend on our D to fix it.    We can find UFA wingers in the 5-5.5 range that will get us 25/25 playing Brocks top six minutes, which he's going to need to get 30/30.   Brock doesn't score on the third line that much has been proven.   Requires top six and power play time to do his thing.   AB seems to have already meshed with EP.      We have at least one redundant winger.   And could afford to part with two.   PLD is an interesting future proposal.   Doesn't want to stay in WNP.    Sure would be nice to try and pry him out.   

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Good proposal. Boeser would be lucky to hit the numbers Bjorkstrand did last year, and his salary is $1.25M higher. So the return in the proposal is fairly reasonable. People who think we’re getting a 1st for him are out to lunch.

 

And Winnipeg is a good fit. Not only for the reasons you mentioned, but also, their weakest position is RW. They have: Wheeler, Appleton, and… a mish-mash of fringe guys (featuring Sam Gagner & Karson Kuhlman). Adding Boeser fills a top-6 spot, and pushes the other guys down into the bottom-6, where they belong.

 

Realistic on all sides. I think Vancouver would take it. 

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5 hours ago, Paul-walker said:

No way we spent a 1st rounder to get him and that was a gamble and he didn’t even score 20+ goals. If we don’t get a first for him I say no

We used firsts on Jake and OJ too. Where a 25 year old player was drafted has no bearing on his current trade value. Brock’s value is about his play and contract. He’s just not playing like a guy getting paid what he does. 

This proposal is a good one. I think we need to retain to make Brock’s cap 5 mil and then we should get back a mid round pick.

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8 hours ago, VancouverHabitant said:

The problem: Winnipeg has trouble attracting free agents and getting players to sign long term with them.  Getting a rental is a very risky proposition for them as the player usually signs somewhere else in the summer.  

 

The solution: Vancouver trades Brock Boeser to Winnipeg with two years left beyond this one.  To make this more palatable for Winnipeg as far as salary goes, we agree to retain 1 million per year, and Winnipeg sends us their 3rd round pick this year, and their 3rd round pick next year.  

 

Benefit for Brock:  Fresh start, and he's geographically really close to home without actually moving to Minnesota. 

 

Benefit for Winnipeg: Player with term that can easily hit 30 goals especially with a fresh start.  25 years old and fits in well with all their core guys.  

 

Benefit for Vancouver: Kuzmenko, Beauvillier, Garland, and our other young wingers get promoted up a spot.  We clear a lot of salary despite retaining for two more years.  

 

 

How can it be easy for a guy, who has never hit 30 goals before...?

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9 hours ago, Paul-walker said:

No way we spent a 1st rounder to get him and that was a gamble and he didn’t even score 20+ goals. If we don’t get a first for him I say no

Here's some perspective.   There are loads of guys in the bottom six making peanuts that score 15 goals.    Bottom six.    It's all about cap unfortunately, and Vancouver has wasted a ton on Brock waiting for him to score 30 goals - what he's been paid to do since his second contract. 

 

Anyways.   Hopefully bigger brains can figure out what to do.   He's expensive.   He was expensive last contract too. 

Edited by IBatch
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I see the reasoning behind why they might want Boeser (esp. with Wheeler expiring after next season, and unless they flip Ehlers to the right side RW is looking pretty weak).  The issue might be timing though -- if they would trade for Boeser in this offseason, by next year they'd only have around $10 million to re-sign PLD, Rittich and a bunch of depth guys.  If need be, we should take on the role of taking on cap to maximize our return, as I also think that 2 x 3rds is too little for Brock.

Should we trade him, I'd also start with Heinola (word has it that he wants out of Winnipeg since he's buried in the AHL due to their depth; he's only 21 and a former 1st round pick).  Hopefully we could also tack on a depth energy forward (Jonsson-Fjallby/ Manelainen/ Barron/ Harkins) as part of the return to fill out the bottom-6, or an RD prospect like Chisholm or Gawanke who offer some size and upside based on their AHL scoring so far.  Since guys like DeMelo/ Pionk are probably too important to add in trades for them, we might as well ask for futures in these prospects to fill roster holes (in this case RD).  Two prospects plus a 2024 2nd should be good value for Brock IMO, since some teams may really highly value 2nds this year.  

Edited by Phil_314
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On 2/21/2023 at 4:49 PM, Phil_314 said:

I see the reasoning behind why they might want Boeser (esp. with Wheeler expiring after next season, and unless they flip Ehlers to the right side RW is looking pretty weak).  The issue might be timing though -- if they would trade for Boeser in this offseason, by next year they'd only have around $10 million to re-sign PLD, Rittich and a bunch of depth guys.  If need be, we should take on the role of taking on cap to maximize our return, as I also think that 2 x 3rds is too little for Brock.

Should we trade him, I'd also start with Heinola (word has it that he wants out of Winnipeg since he's buried in the AHL due to their depth; he's only 21 and a former 1st round pick).  Hopefully we could also tack on a depth energy forward (Jonsson-Fjallby/ Manelainen/ Barron/ Harkins) as part of the return to fill out the bottom-6, or an RD prospect like Chisholm or Gawanke who offer some size and upside based on their AHL scoring so far.  Since guys like DeMelo/ Pionk are probably too important to add in trades for them, we might as well ask for futures in these prospects to fill roster holes (in this case RD).  Two prospects plus a 2024 2nd should be good value for Brock IMO, since some teams may really highly value 2nds this year.  

See I think that PLD going elsewhere is pretty much a foregone conclusion.  They may have to take on a contract in return to make it work for an acquiring team this summer (PLD is an RFA), but I don't think that Boeser's salary is an issue especially if we retain a bit.  

 

Good to read about some of those other suggestions.  I'm not familiar with any of their prospects outside of Heinola, who would be a nice get for sure. 

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