Anyone feeling more confident in the plan or direction that management sort of set for this team?

[Dr. Crossbar]

100% confident.

 

I've been saying this for years ... we're not going to win the way we've been doing it in some nice guy, character, balanced approach. We need to get down and dirty and actually do what it takes to win, which at times isn't pretty or nice.

 

We're not going to win being nice guys. We need an east coast edge to our game instead of west coast chill, complacency and country club. As much as I liked Bo, it was the right move to start fresh with the C. 

 

I want to truly reassess after year three but what they're doing right now with Tocchet in weeding out passengers and creating a new culture is and has been so SO necessary. I hated to see Bruce go, I really did, but getting Tocchet in here for the tank to assess was the right move. Bruce would be gunning for wins. This is an extended training camp. 

 

I said earlier a couple months ago, they could accelerate this retool by getting another 1st in this year's draft, and going all in on this draft. They got another 1st from Bo, and I'm hoping we get more in the way of 2nds, 3rds. 

 

Management is fully aware of the D issues. These guys - JR, PA, Tocchet, Gonchar, Foote - are all Cup winners. They know what it takes. Especially how defense wins games. I'm looking forward to them reshaping our blueline over the next couple seasons. They've got to start this offseason.

 

I'm really liking what they're doing with Abbotsford. It finally feels like we're doing things right, which helps give confidence. Even Tocchet today said they're going to take their time to develop Raty since he's still so young. Also, Colliton gives me a lot of confidence as coach in Abby. He's great and perfect for that job right now. 

 

There really is a reassessment and recalibration happening. Fans need to let it happen even if it's not pretty. 

[BlackRedYellow]

OEL should be sent to Abbortsford next season. Replaced by a 1M Schenn (or similar) and that would be an upgrade! Without being punished for 8 years (buyout). And if we’re lucky, OEL will give up and go home…

[DownUndaCanuck]

I'd like to know what the plan for next season is - are we going to try to make the playoffs with a quick turnaround, or are we conceding to another year of maybe-losing? 

 

Honestly this team is so trash on paper I don't see it competing with the playoff teams any time soon. I know we're talking about a retool but we haven't really made much of an impact on this roster on paper and it's not like we have loads of great star young kids coming through either. It'd be wiser to just admit to a slower retool (I mean that's really a rebuild but whatever the Canucks marketing want to call it to make it more palatable is fine) and try to acquire top picks or prospects, rather than young players.

[Fred65]

What you hear from the Canucks this summer will not be what they will ice or even compete. The first item on the agenda is pointing out to the brain dead the immediate future is in for . Flim flam

[Provost]

What plan?  Haven’t seen one yet.  Sign an older player for a long term deal rather than get futures; trade a younger player for futures; spend all available cap on surplus wingers; other wise remain status quo?

 

If that is the actual plan, I guess I am confident they are executing on it well.  Not sure it is any sort of coherent plan that will result in us winning a Cup in my lifetime….

[DSVII]

 

Feeling a little more confident.

[IBatch]

On 2/23/2023 at 7:19 PM, Provost said:

What plan?  Haven’t seen one yet.  Sign an older player for a long term deal rather than get futures; trade a younger player for futures; spend all available cap on surplus wingers; other wise remain status quo?

 

If that is the actual plan, I guess I am confident they are executing on it well.  Not sure it is any sort of coherent plan that will result in us winning a Cup in my lifetime….

It's just not as simple as NHL video games unfortunately (last one I played was made in 1993 lol).   Not saying you're one of those fans,  but have seen enough unrealistic not pragmatic suggestions on here to think a lot of fans believe it's that simple.   Trading Horvat pissed some people off - quite a few who were very critical of the previous regime.   Nobody was that mad when we signed Miller in the summer though to his deal.   Sure a few were.    Bruce Bump gave false hope, at least management was smart enough to always be quite reserved around hiring him in the first place, and brought in Kuzmenko who's been a big hit.    And well Tochett, Foote and Gonchar (in that order for me as far as players go) ... 

 

Cant trade cap that doesn't want to be traded just because we don't like it.    To me this summer will be a big success if we can ink EP to 10 year for 11.5 or less.    

And we can thank our lucky stars Demko has been out and didn't play like last season all year too.     Horvat/Miller doesn't need to be connected and can be mutually exclusive.    Believe they misread the team, so did a ton of others as well.   At least they set a course correction. 

 

Edit:  Bear was also a solid move and and Dickie was bad either.    Cost of removing contracts for that long .. time will tell.    Don't mind waiting and glad they aren't all over the map which seemed to be JB "plan". 

Edited February 25, 2023 by IBatch

[Provost]

Just now, IBatch said:

It's just not as simple as NHL video games unfortunately (last one I played was made in 1993 lol).   Not saying you're one of those fans,  but have seen enough unrealistic not pragmatic suggestions on here to think a lot of fans believe it's that simple.   Trading Horvat pissed some people off - quite a few who were very critical of the previous regime.   Nobody was that mad when we signed Miller in the summer though to his deal.   Sure a few were.    Bruce Bump gave false hope, at least management was smart enough to always be quite reserved around hiring him in the first place, and brought in Kuzmenko who's been a big hit.    And well Tochett, Foote and Gonchar (in that order for me as far as players go) ... 

 

Cant trade cap that doesn't want to be traded just because we don't like it.    To me this summer will be a big success if we can ink EP to 10 year for 11.5 or less.    

And we can thank our lucky stars Demko has been out and didn't play like last season all year too.     Horvat/Miller doesn't need to be connected and can be mutually exclusive.    Believe they misread the team, so did a ton of others as well.   At least they set a course correction. 

I have never played a hockey video game in my life.

MANY folks were critical of the Miller signing at the time it happened, including me.  Go read the thread and you will see a lot of people who thought it was a terrible idea.  Anyone without massive homer glasses could see the team wasn't any good, and with no prospects had no real chance of getting good in the near term.

If we weren't going to be any good, and couldn't even afford to keep a really bad roster together due to cap considerations, AND had no way to shed bad contracts without giving up future assets which would make us even worse... signing Miller was a stupid decision.  He will likely be well into a decline or a complete anchor by the time the team could be ready to really compete.

You will be disappointed about the summer, unfortunately league rules mean we aren't allowed to sign Petterson for 10 years.

[Cali Canuck]

5 hours ago, Provost said:

I have never played a hockey video game in my life.

MANY folks were critical of the Miller signing at the time it happened, including me.  Go read the thread and you will see a lot of people who thought it was a terrible idea.  Anyone without massive homer glasses could see the team wasn't any good, and with no prospects had no real chance of getting good in the near term.

If we weren't going to be any good, and couldn't even afford to keep a really bad roster together due to cap considerations, AND had no way to shed bad contracts without giving up future assets which would make us even worse... signing Miller was a stupid decision.  He will likely be well into a decline or a complete anchor by the time the team could be ready to really compete.

You will be disappointed about the summer, unfortunately league rules mean we aren't allowed to sign Petterson for 10 years.

Agree 100%  Bad decision on Miller should have traded him at the draft when they had the chance.

 

Short answer I thought they had a chance to right the ship but the summer was a disaster.  Sign more wingers who they don't need and ignore upgrading the D-core.  Honestly the D played better tonight than in a long time.  With Stillman out Myers is by far their wort D-man.  OEL and Myers might be their two worst D-men this year with Stillman pushing hard.

[Ballisticsports.]

59 minutes ago, Cali Canuck said:

Agree 100%  Bad decision on Miller should have traded him at the draft when they had the chance.

 

Short answer I thought they had a chance to right the ship but the summer was a disaster.  Sign more wingers who they don't need and ignore upgrading the D-core.  Honestly the D played better tonight than in a long time.  With Stillman out Myers is by far their wort D-man.  OEL and Myers might be their two worst D-men this year with Stillman pushing hard.

They probably couldn't afford to upgrade the defence or didn't see the one that had value to them

I like the upgrade on wings and wasn't at a big cost or term

I still believe BB was  to shine with EP, get traded and got hurt instead

These new wingers will most likely be replacements for Garland and BB

 

We don't really need another small gifted centre either, so should we pass on Bedard if we get 1st overall and draft by position and get a lesser Dman?

Many pro managers will always say, you always take the bpa,

I can see the Canucks getting 6th and taking a winger and the outrage from some on here

I could be disappointed myself if they did that, but the scouts themselves would have to believe it is too big of a gap to just take a dman and they will pick the best impact player for the team as a 6 pick- If they were even i am sure they choose a dman

[Sativika]

59 minutes ago, Ballisticsports. said:

They probably couldn't afford to upgrade the defence or didn't see the one that had value to them

I like the upgrade on wings and wasn't at a big cost or term

I still believe BB was  to shine with EP, get traded and got hurt instead

These new wingers will most likely be replacements for Garland and BB

 

We don't really need another small gifted centre either, so should we pass on Bedard if we get 1st overall and draft by position and get a lesser Dman?

Many pro managers will always say, you always take the bpa,

I can see the Canucks getting 6th and taking a winger and the outrage from some on here

I could be disappointed myself if they did that, but the scouts themselves would have to believe it is too big of a gap to just take a dman and they will pick the best impact player for the team as a 6 pick- If they were even i am sure they choose a dman

More than likely all the forwards management has acquired since taking over is in part to replace Flow, Gar, Pearson, etc. The other part is to have additional assets to trade for a Dman of significance down the road. Draft 2023 hasn't any stud D players. Interesting ones, but no definitive top pairing types.

 

"......We don't really need another small gifted centre either, so should we pass on Bedard if we get 1st overall and draft by position and get a lesser Dman?

Many pro managers will always say, you always take the bpa,......."

 

Egads. No!!!!! You can be sure any team 1st overall this draft year will take Bedard. It's Bedard and only Bedard if we're fortunate enough to land 1st overall! We can get a Dman later. Maybe someone decent with our 1st from the Islanders. Who knows.....we might get lucky.

 

[*Buzzsaw*]

No... not until I see some good D added.

[Ballisticsports.]

1 hour ago, Sativika said:

More than likely all the forwards management has acquired since taking over is in part to replace Flow, Gar, Pearson, etc. The other part is to have additional assets to trade for a Dman of significance down the road. Draft 2023 hasn't any stud D players. Interesting ones, but no definitive top pairing types.

 

"......We don't really need another small gifted centre either, so should we pass on Bedard if we get 1st overall and draft by position and get a lesser Dman?

Many pro managers will always say, you always take the bpa,......."

 

Egads. No!!!!! You can be sure any team 1st overall this draft year will take Bedard. It's Bedard and only Bedard if we're fortunate enough to land 1st overall! We can get a Dman later. Maybe someone decent with our 1st from the Islanders. Who knows.....we might get lucky.

 

That was said Tongue in cheek. because of the comment of how we got upgrades on forwards for cheaper as a waste, that some may complain if we took Bedard and mention the  last thing we need is another small center 

 

We needed a major shakeup to untangle the mess and culture that has been here for some time now and be faster, younger, with more drive to play a team game

Just as smart skilled defencemen can make a goalie and forward look better with positioning and moving the puck out, forwards can help the defence too

Lol We are playing grade school team defence. Even Ethan Bear says there now playing a good system and preaching the right things and if not coming from Carolina that he wouldn't have understood it and now excited to see hope

 

I agree with what you added otherwise

[Timråfan]

On 2/23/2023 at 3:40 AM, Alflives said:

Buy out OEL and Garland this summer. Then the direction looks better. 

Too little effect on cap.

It’s better to have a system OEL can flourish in. And probably an excellent RHD to support his offence.

[Timråfan]

16 hours ago, Provost said:

I have never played a hockey video game in my life.

MANY folks were critical of the Miller signing at the time it happened, including me.  Go read the thread and you will see a lot of people who thought it was a terrible idea.  Anyone without massive homer glasses could see the team wasn't any good, and with no prospects had no real chance of getting good in the near term.

I’m not a fan of Miller and there were many that wanted him signed and they talked about 9-10 mill a year.

So if I think it’s a fair deal with 8 mill I’m surprised about those thinking it’s a terrible deal.

[Provost]

1 hour ago, Timråfan said:

I’m not a fan of Miller and there were many that wanted him signed and they talked about 9-10 mill a year.

So if I think it’s a fair deal with 8 mill I’m surprised about those thinking it’s a terrible deal.

Two very important things.

 

1.  He immediately became worth less once his contract was signed, so that is how you can view his deal.  If he were a pending free agent right now we could get a really large haul for him.  More than what we got for Bo probably.

 

2.  I didn’t even reference the value of the deal.  It was a terrible idea for us at pretty much any number.    We will not be contending for the foreseeable future.   Why sign a 30 year old when the expected good years are going to be wasted when the team is bad… and then be stuck with all the later years of the contract when we do have a chance of being better and the player is steeply declining.  Not many players are producing at a top rate at 37 years old.

[Alflives]

2 hours ago, Timråfan said:

Too little effect on cap.

It’s better to have a system OEL can flourish in. And probably an excellent RHD to support his offence.

If OEL would make the commitment to train with the Twins then he could (maybe?) Get his career back. 

[Timråfan]

1 hour ago, Provost said:

Two very important things.

 

1.  He immediately became worth less once his contract was signed, so that is how you can view his deal.  If he were a pending free agent right now we could get a really large haul for him.  More than what we got for Bo probably.

 

2.  I didn’t even reference the value of the deal.  It was a terrible idea for us at pretty much any number.    We will not be contending for the foreseeable future.   Why sign a 30 year old when the expected good years are going to be wasted when the team is bad… and then be stuck with all the later years of the contract when we do have a chance of being better and the player is steeply declining.  Not many players are producing at a top rate at 37 years old.

Ok

I believe it’s alright to have a few vets follow the team through transition.

Obviously it will be Miler and OEL if nothing exceptional happen.

Every player coming from a lesser contract and get a raise will immediately be worth less. 
So why bother about that?

 

To know more about why they offered him that contract we have to know how they think.

Do you do that?

Miller is almost a PPG player this year and will continue at least three more seasons like that.

 

How long is a foreseeble future for you? 
I think we start competing in play off next year and go far in two years.

By then Miller will be very valuable with all ghe young players we have. 

[Timråfan]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

If OEL would make the commitment to train with the Twins then he could (maybe?) Get his career back. 

He probably has some nagging injurie that might be fixed til next year.

Then we hope he makes an EK-like return to the spotlight.

[Canuckfanforlife82]

I feel less confident after that press conference and after the Hronek trade that the outcome is going to be any different than the Benning era. It's just different people running the ship but with the same mentality. Ownership is very very dense. They are not smart hockey people at all. Keep throwing your money away. That's the problem with people with too much money. They can afford to not care . Egos are way too big and they are just going to do it until it works. Then they can say to everyone. See it does work.