shogun1
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Posts posted by shogun1
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Anybody else and that fight would have been called 2 minutes in. Lesnar was barely protecting himself.
which of the following constitutes barely protecting oneself?
a) covering up like you're supposed to?
grabbing somebody and pulling them close to you to stop them from punching you?c) pushing somebody off when the ref threatened to stops the fight?
d) all of the above?
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Love seeing Lesnar haters/Fedor lovers in here crying about his win.
How was Frate Trane exposed? Shane Carwin has finished 12 men in the first round. Everybody was saying that Brock has a suspect chin. Shane Carwin dropped hell on Brock for 4 minutes. Brock was battered after round 1... 10-8, maybe 10-7 round. Then he came out and did what he does. Win.
Brock's stand-up isn't great. But if he's fighting somebody not known for their power he can risk throwing wild shots. Carwin has the heaviest hands in MMA. Brock ate some big shots. He didn't go to sleep. He didn't quit. He took his beating, then he put Shane Carwin in the hospital.
Keep in mind that he's coming off a one year layoff where he could've lost his life and almost lost his career.
People spouting off about Carwin's 12-1 record being better than Brock's 5-1 record should compare who these men have fought... then ask how each guy has done in UFC HW championship bouts. And for people calling for the fight to be stopped, look at Brock's first loss... that fight should've been stopped too... instead Mazz took a point away with no warning.
Brock Lesnar is the #1 HW in the world. 3-0 in UFC title fights and has only been fighting for a few years. No heavyweight on the planet has faced the type of competition Brock has in their first 6 fights.
So.....
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This thread turned into a Heavyweight argument thread. :D
Come on guys, everybody knows that Big Country Roy would demolish Fedor, Arlovski, Lesnar, Carwin, Rogers, Overeem, Mir and anyone you guys are arguing are the best!
I'm actually semi-excited to see Roy take on Dos Santos next..I hope Dos Santos destroys him.
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Coleman in his prime, Hunt, Lindland are not joke competition. Lindland is a natural 185 guy sure but look the weight difference Fedor takes on every fight. The guy doesn't cut weight. Hell Anderson Silva weighs about the same as him, but he choose to cut 40 pounds so he can have the biggest advantage possible. I know guys like Zulu and choi by no stretch to the imagination are top level fighter but that wasn't the arguement. It was who has he fought lately? For you to discredit the careers of Arlvoski, Rogers, Sylvia is not really fair. They were all top level guys WHEN THEY FOUGHT FEDOR. Their careers are no where near which they once were but thats not the point.
Coleman wasn't in his prime when they fought in Vegas. and I'm not discrediting AA at all. When he fought fought Fedor he was a top-5 heavyweight. Possibly top-3. He was in my top-3. Tim Sylvia was top-10 by default. When Big Tim was the UFC HW champ (2 wins over AA) Pride still existed. The whole "UFC Champ is 1 or 2" rule didn't exist back then. Tim Sylvia was #5 or #6 after his 2nd win over AA. Fedor, Nogs, Mirko, Barnett were all ranked ahead of him. He never moved higher than #5 in the World. He stayed at #5 with his win over Monson. Randy came in after retirement, weighed 50-70 pounds less than him, and embarrassed him. That dropped him to 8 or 9 imo. He beat a LHW in Brandon Vera by holding him against the cage. Kept him at 8 or 9. He was then subbed by Nogs. No shame there, was winning up to the sub. Stays at 8 or 9 or could even be dropped to 10 or 11. He was still top-10, but he was on his way out and barely holding on.
Brett Rogers was NOT a top-10 opponent no matter what any Fedor-loving ranking maker wants you to believe. In MMA there are a bunch of different crowds, but there are two super-crowds; the UFC-lovers and the UFC-haters. UFC-lovers discredit everything outside the UFC. UFC-haters over-rate everything outside the UFC. There are also a huge crowd of Fedor-huggers. And they will do anything they can to validate a Fedor opponent. The combination of UFC-haters/Fedor-huggers have tricked the world into believing that a single win over a ranked fighter makes you a top-10 guy. I would argue for Rogers to break the top-10 if he beat Arlovski before Arlovski had his soul stolen in the Fedor fight, but he didn't. Rogers was barely top-20. He might have been undefeated, but who was he undefeated against?
In my opinion, Fedor has two top-level fights over his last 4; Werdum and AA. Both top-ranked guys. And even then, the Werdum fight was laughed at because it looked so one-sided on paper. Your argument is that no other heavyweight has as many top-10 fights in the same period, but Brock, Mir, Carwin, and Nogs all have at least 2 top-level fights on their record since the beginning of 2008.
People (Fedor fans) have been saying that it doesn't matter who Fedor fights, he stays at #1 until he loses. Now that he's lost, he's still #1 because nobody has the same record as he does. blah blah blah blah blah. The simple fact is this; Fedor is not fighting the best fighters in the world anymore. The UFC owns 8 of the top 10 heavyweight fighters in the World. 7 if you put Overeem in the Top-10. I do/don't because as you said "he hasn't faced any top competition". And after those 3 (Fedor, Werdum, Overeem) the UFC probably has the 17 that make up the top-20. The winner of Brock/Carwin is the #1 heavyweight fighter on the planet. Not the greatest heavyweight of all time, but the best heavyweight fighter in the world right now. Fedor is still great and still one of the p4p kings, but as far as rankings go, he's no longer #1.
And while I agree that people who completely go off the deep-end trying to discredit Fedor are annoying, people who go the other way with their ridiculous nuthugging are just as annoying. Fedor still holds the title of best HW of all-time. But he is no longer the current best heavyweight.
edit: just read the italics in the quote box. I agree with a lot of it. I too wanted to see him in the UFC. And don't dislike him at all. He's one of the very best fighters and people in the sport. But the people behind him (M-1) are an embarrassment and his hardcore fans are almost as bad as BJ Penn fans. Anyways, sorry for lumping you in with the "huggers", I've read so much garbage since the loss from both sides of the fence and just jumped in. Should've read more of the back-posts before responding to you.
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WAMMA (World Alliance of Mixed Martial Arts)
The loss that they were talking about was back in 2000( 10 years ago). 15 seconds into the fight Fedor got cut by an illegal elbow above the eye. Normally this would result in a DQ win for Fedor or a No Contest but the fight was under tournament rules, so one fighter had to advance and one has to be eliminated. So Fedor was given a loss and eliminated in the tournament. Alot of people dont really look at that fight as a loss but a loss is a loss and he has a chance to avenge that loss. 5 years after the original bout, the 2 faced of a again and Fedor layed a pretty big donkey kicking resulting in a corner stoppage after the 1st round.
Wamma is an absolute joke.
Seriously.
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This is what i hate right here. The loss doesn't bother me. Its dicks like you that bad mouth the greatest MMA fighter alive and of all time based on having no knowledge of the sport. Before Werdum do you know who were the the last 3 guys Fedor fought?
Arlovski (former UFC champ ranked in top 3 at the time)
Tim Sylvia ( Former UFC champ ranked in top 5 at the time)
Brett Rogers (undefeated Top 10 fighter)
To say he's fought nobody in the last few years is ridiculous. And then to say Randy Couture would beat him? Really? His 2 biggest heavyweight wins are against Gonzaga and Sylvia. Who else has he beat at heavyweight thats so great? Look at what Couture is doing/has done recently. Randy fought an over-rated Brandon Vera in a fight where he should've lost but had one of the biggest gift decision wins of the year given to him. Fought a 45 year old Mark Coleman. Really? This guy isn't even ranked in the top 25. Now he's fighting James Toney, a man who hasn't had a single MMA match in his career.
Please whats you're arguement that he fights nobodies? That he fought a giant 7"3 asian guy that weighed at least 100 poinds more then him back in 2007? I can't think of one HW fighter thats fought more top level guys then Fedor has.So please name a few before you bad mouth him or discredit his career.
What do Fedor and Jose Canseco have in common? They've both fought Hong-man Choi.
Seriously though, he's fought NOBODY but Arlovski since his epic fight with Cro Cop.
Zulu - lol.
Mark Coleman (2nd time) - really? lol. And in Vegas so Coleman was off the juice.
Mark Hunt - Getting subbed by Barnett earns him a shot at Pride's top heavyweight?
Matt Lindland - Natural 185er.
Hong Man Choi - Biggest MMA win is over JOSE CANCESO. Got heel-hooked by Minowa.
Tim Sylvia - Walking sloth. Leading up to the Fedor fight, he had just been subbed by Big Nogs. He was also dominated by a 44-year old man. And barely beat a 205er by holding him against the cage for 3 rounds. His final fight before the Fedor fight was a sub-loss to Nogs. Imagine that, getting subbed by somebody earns you an immediate shot at Fedor. Was knocked out in 8 seconds by 40-something Ray Mercer in his next fight.
Andrei Arlovski - Other than Werdum, this is the only fighter who deserved to be ranked in the Top-5 at the time he fought Fedor. Arlovski was arguably the #3 or #4 heavyweight at this point and the UFC still wanted him. He wasn't a washout like Big Tim.
Brett Rogers - Spout off about his undefeated record all you want, but he only has one top-20 fighter on his record before fighting Fedor, and that was Arlovski, who was a shell of his former self after the Fedor loss.
And why are you talking about Randy? Randy isn't even a top-10 heavyweight. But Dos Santos, Carwin, Mir, Velasquez, and Brock all are. And I find it funny that you discredit Randy's recent fights while listing Tim Sylvia as a notable Fedor victory. Tim Sylvia also fought Brandon Vera (at HW though) and Tim Sylvia also has a fight against a 40+ boxer on his record. And Tim Sylvia had a loss to the overrated Randy on his record leading up to the Fedor fight.
I get that you love Fedor and all, but open your eyes and look at who he has fought since CroCop. A fight is a fight and anything can happen, but other than the Arlovski fight, you can't tell me that the guys he was fighting were the best competition he could find.
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Yep, he did.
no.
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Fedor almost KO'd him..holy crap Werdum you triangle armbar mofo.
no he didn't. fedor threw 5 or 6 punches. only 2 landed. the first one was softer and landed on the side of werdum's cheek, the second one glanced off his head. the punch that looked like it dropped him missed by a mile. werdum even said after the fight that he was trying to bait fedor into jumping into his guard.
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WTF WAS THAT REF DOING IN THE SAKURABA/RALAK GRACIE FIGHT TONIGHT?
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Tim Sylvia (former UFC champ) vs Mariusz Pudzianowski (World's Strongest Man)
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so happy.
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wec 48 = solid 9.5 out 10.
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wec prelims on spikeTV have been awesome.
garcia/jung is nuts.
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tuf was good.
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These things have happened before and they will happen again and again.
the last time something like this happened... the diaz bros were involved with KJ Noons and his drunk dad.
the time before was either Cabbage/Tank or Shogun's arm break and Coleman's roid rage ref toss.
they have happened and will happen again, but I doubt we'll see it in the UFC. The closest we'll get is an amped up fighter cursing out somebody for eating their strawberries.
it's funny that people were all up in Brock's business like he totally disrespected the sport of MMA and turned it into a farce, and now a lot of those same people are throwing up gang signs and shouting War 420 Stockton for Life 209 Ain't no B*tch Diaz Bros Hardcore What.
Being mad at somebody eating your last batch of strawberries >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Anything either Diaz has ever done in or for the sport of MMA.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vau4RSvV834
a joke of an mma event capped off by this garbage. strikeforce will never be on cbs again.
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Dana has tweeted it but I'm pretty sure Fitch has to pass a medical or something before it can be made official since UFC 111 and UFC 115 are only like 2 months apart. He'll pass though since he took no damage lying on top of Saunders
it's not Fitch who has to pass the medical (I don't believe he was medically suspended after 111). Thiago Alves has to be cleared by the NJAC as he was not cleared to fight on that card due to an irregularity in his brain. He underwent successful brain surgery a week or so ago and has started training again but still needs to be cleared in Jersey to be able to fight anywhere else.
At least that's what I've gathered from the whole situation.
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i managed to watch some of the silva "fight" online and i gave up on it after the second round..what a joke..
i'd recommend watching the whole fight. just to get an idea of the kind of fighter demian maia is right now and the potential he has. he turned it on after the third and did all he could. very admirable.
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I thought this card was pretty good (maybe not worth 55 bucks though)
Grove-Munoz came to bang.
Etim-Dos Anjos had it's moments.
Renzo-Hughes was slow going but Hughes put on a show near the end.
Edgar-Penn was absolutely beautiful to watch.
Silva-Maia was a disgrace. Maia earned fans the way people said Hardy did against GSP. People said Hardy showed heart in a very one-sided beatdown where he did nothing. Maia tried all fight to do something and took a beating in the process. He shot for takedowns, pulled guard, and tried to land some shots. He seemed out of it very early but after round 3 he went for it and Silva ran away. Kinda funny to see Silva taunting for 3 rounds telling Maia to come get some and then he gasses and runs for the rest of the fight. Maia might never be champion as long as Silva is around, but he went for broke and I respect him for that.
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Just watched the 2nd episode..
Too bad that guy had a shoulder injury.. I was rooting for him..
Tito seems like a pretty good coach so far though.
only 14 guys in the house.
green hair could come back as the wild card.
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Sub-par episode...
Tito comes off pretty cocky but you can tell he is a good coach.
2nd episode usually is. Fighter picks. Move into the house. Somebody acts like a jerk. Somebody else acts like a jerk. Dana swears. Fight announcement. Weigh-ins. More Dana swearing. Fight. Recap. Hype for next week.
There's a ton of talent in the house this season, hopefully they focus more on that than the pranks and bs.
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All I can say about Fitch is that he is content to sit in his opponents guard and use his strength to hold them down for 3 rounds. It's not like where GSP is always passing and trying to go for subs even if they end up putting him in a bad position (Alves/Hardy fights where he ended up on his back a couple times). Fitch is happy grinding it out and taking it to decision. GSP tries to finish multiple times every time he fights.
I think Alves will hurt Fitch. Alves shrugged off some of GSP's takedowns and Fitch is nowhere near the takedown artist GSP is. If Alves can work his sprawl and keep his back off the cage, I can see Alves landing some devastating shots. It'll probably go to decision and Fitch will probably win 2 rounds to 1, but he'll get beat up in the process.
I also don't think Fitch offers anything to GSP in a rematch. Fitch's wrestling has stayed the same, Fitch's striking has stayed the same, Fitch is the same fighter, GSP is not.
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danawhite ALVES vs FITCH in vancouver!!!!!!
hopefully it doesn't fall through again. was so pumped for this at 111. nice that alves is ok after "minor" brain surgery.
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Dana White on teammates refusing to fight:
"It' s over man," White said. "This whole 'we won't fight each other' thing is over. How long can they go on when they have two of the top guys in the division and they won't fight each other?"It's crazy, man."
grabbing somebody and pulling them close to you to stop them from punching you?
***The UFC/MMA THREAD***
in Off-Topic General
Posted
could've been stopped. but it definitely shouldn't have been stopped. right call was made for sure. Rosenthal is the best in the business.
I'm also looking forward to the rematch. Carwin will be smarter with more gas and Brock will have improved even more in all areas. I expect to see his hand look a lot better when he fights Cain.
Carwin has 2 or 3 wins before another shot with Cain/JDS/Nelson in the mix.