Russianfan

This gave me a laugh reading this.. This is an example of such old school thinking it is almost unbelievable. I can see this coming from an old timer who grew up in the 9-5 era, with the mentality to put in 30 years of work and retire with benefits. Sorry my friend, those years are long gone. Today we are forced with ever expanding versatile workforce who demand flexibility and movement from one one career to another. People say you will change careers 4-5 times in your life to survive in the modern society. Let me point out some of the flaws in your argument: A) Work like an immigrant - that is a joke right? Immigrants are the last to be hired, and the least to be paid. Immigrants come here with 10 years of education and theys still drive trucks and wait tables with PhD's. That is a joke, and you want me to be like that? I was born here, in Canada, I supported this country from the start, it is time it gave something back to me. I am not an immigrant, I think i deserve a little more respect than to work my behind off 80 hours a week, I am more fortunate than that, I am a Canadian citizen and I deserve first dibs on what is available, anyone would agree with that. B ) No matter how smart you are and how good you think you are, there are 100 people ready to take your job- what a joke. Where did you and so many of the posters on this forum got the idea that somehow the economy is so bad that there are 100 people sitting around bidding on jobs? There are way more jobs than qualified people on the market place, there are tons of jobs available and not enough talent to fill it. No one can do what I can do, I am very driven, I know computers well, I know how to socialize, I know what I am doing when it comes to convincing people and being assertive. There is no way there is even close to 100 people who can do what i can do in Canada, let alone in Vancouver. Sure I have not theoretically proved it yet on the workplace, but I believe I can do it, and I have the skills required. If I can explain that to the employer they would have no reason to doubt me. I also have no reason to believe there are 100 people who will go against me for any job openings, as any real qualified professional people already have jobs and arent sitting around lazying about. I am sorry the competition for jobs is not as high as you think, 100 people for 1 job? Get real. C) From the ages of 25 to 29, I was honestly working 75 hour weeks- thats your own fault and your own mistake. I am not planning to work any more than I have to, 40 hours a week max. I have other interests in my life than work, I like to hang with my girl, chill with my buddies, I play video games and I like to hang out at the beach etc. It is pathetic that you wasted your youth busting 75 hour weeks, that is nothing to be proud of. My goal is not to work beyond what is required, in our society your value isnt measured by amount of time invested its by the quality of work you bring and the results you bring. I can do in 40 hours what you can do in 80, this is the difference between you and I my friend, work smarter not harder is my tip to you. D) I had to show my employer (and future employers), that I could work my tail off without complaint- this is the philosophy of people who think " you have to pay your dues" to make it. A old school, out dated and archaic philosophy. These days you dont have to prove anyhting, you have to come off as an assertive, confident and knowlegable person. If you can convince the hiring manager you can do it then you are in, this is my plan and I have no doubt I can pull it off. You want to be exploited by the system and work endless hours to prove your self that is your mistake. As I am a highly qualified specilaist who is a graduate of one of the best universities in Canada (SFU) I think I am entitled to a bit more than the average joe with my salary expectations. A true employee can request certain break times, work hours expected, bonuses, vacation days and sick days are all negotiable, I intend to make the most of mine. I am not a weak person to accept whatever is given without negotiation, this is why I am ahead of others my age and in my position, not because I will work longer or more, but because I will negotiate a better start.

Most people never qualify for grad school, only the best of the best do. It is not so easy to get 3.0+ GPA I am not sure why you are so surprised so few people make it? That is what I keep telling you, just to finish college and not fail out is a huge achievement, not many people can withstand the pressure of university. Furthermore, it is even harder than you think to get into grad school because the GPA requirements are killer, and most of us dont have the GPA to live up to it. That being said if so few people have the high grades, that means they should be rewarded with instant careers after gradschool, should they not? Considering how difficult it is to even get into gradschool.

Working in the "trades" is not a sexy role at all, regardless of how much you make. I can go up North to BC and join the mining industry, or the logging industry, or be a deep sea diver or a crab fisherman etc who all make 6 figures. But at what cost? At a cost to their health, their standard of living, enduring long days, cold nights, danger all around you? When you tell a woman you are in trades she will label you as blue color low class. That is NOT why I went to university for. I went to school to be white color, to be looked up to and respected, not be a grease monkey or some tradesmen. Having a job in marketing or advertising is sexy, women flock all over me when I say that. I dress the part, I am good with my words etc, good luck picking up a woman as a trades man. Your career speaks volumes about you, that is why I want a coushy job behind a desk, safe from the elements, safe from the danger. I dont want to work 100 hours a week + OT to hit 6 figures, I want to work smarter not harder. I want to work in an office, go out to staff parties, have an expense account, go to lunches and dinners on the company card, have car allowance and have tickets to shows and events given to me. That is why I went to school and this is what I fully expect when I come out of it to make my college investment worth while. People keep saying there are "plenty of other grads" but there is not. Most college grads are either working or traveling or have their own businesses, they are not sitting around doing nothing or on EI. The job market is hot, I see tons of job openings and not enough people to fill them. This gives me the impression it is the grads like my self, the employees who have the bargaining power these days NOT the employers.

This is the philosophy i live by: Quotes from a world renowned group HEDLEY in their hit single "Anything". This song represents modern societies view on youth and their supression of their dreams. The song says that if you want to be anything you wanna be, go for it, there are no consiquences for going after your true desires. The song illustrates that if you want to be someone you have to persue that goal no matter what, and try your best to be whatever it is you want to be, because ultiamtely that is the best way to go about life. For those interested the full lyrics can be found here: http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/hedley/anything.html

Thats what you think mofo. Why do you think so many top end businesses have representations on campuses all around the world? Why do you think Google takes interns from 18-21 years old as majority? Why do you think Wall Street investment banks hire top students and not 20 year old experienced reps for positions? I can go on and on, fact is that every employer wants fresh blood, hard working, brand new graduates who have passed the gruling test of universities. I am not sure where you are getting the fact that "many" people have degrees, a degree is not that easy to get. It requires money, 4 years of your life, it requires capability to pass courses at minimum 60% which by the way is not easy at all. Some calculus, economics and stat courses are impossible to pass for many people. It is not easy at all to do well on research papers and assignments, it requires a lot of dedication and focus. 90% of people on this planet I am assuming canot do it, because it was hard for me, and if its hard for me it must be even harder for someone else. Thus to make it past even college/unviersity like I did that already qualifies me into top 10% of the working class. Next if we to compare a college grad to a high school grad obviously the employer will pick me over a high school grad with 5 year experience vs a college grad with no experience but a degree. Because you seem to think employers choose experience over education, that is a big falacy and I am going to tell you that is an urban legend, a myth that dumb people made up to feel better about them selves because they couldnt make it to unversity. Fact is that new graduates get jobs at a far greater scale than washed up old professionals. That is exactly why I feel I am in a great position to demand more money than someone with so called "experience". Why? Because I am a product of the education system that taught me the "latest" in technology, in courses, in theories, in studies etc. All the up coming tools and tricks of the trade school taught me, the reason why i paid so much for it is to get ahead of the rest of the population who didnt go to uni. Uni is a short cut, that is the message we are taught and that is a fact, quit denying this is not true. Quit saying this is a lie, it isnt and I am about to find out for my self once i graduate. I am serious, I will ask for 65 k because i feel this is perfectly normal, especially for a great degree like communucations which many of you have downplayed, but failed to realize that only SFU offers this highly saught after degree in BC. Give your head a shake people.

Rather than focusing on how low my salary would be, ask your self ARE YOU HAPPY WITH YOURS? If anything I can get into network marketing or commission sales and make 100k a year right off the bat, but what do you do? Ask your self, are you getting paid what you feel you are worth in Vancouver? Have you compared other cities and what they offer to Vancouver? How underpaid are you? Think about those things, and understand that we need to change the way we rationalize salaries, as we can not continue to be exploited and punished for living in a beautiful place like Vancouver. That ultimately is my point.

What are you talkign about Mr. CEO. Jobs are about attitude ok? My grades have nothing to do with anything, 2.8 GPA is nothing to worry about, it may not be a 4.8 GPA student but that just shows you I am well rounded. An employer will look at that GPA and will see I didnt spend my time in a library like a bookworm or bust my ass off 10 hours a day doing extra credit work and attending every lecture to get the best grade like a goodie good. I made friends, i played sports, I went drinking, I socialized, I networked, I had a lot of different girls, i traveled, I enjoyed life. The one mistake you keep making is your assumption of a newly graduate student like me who has quote unquote "no marketable skils" are you kidding me? We have the most marketable skills you can imagine. Prolific with computers, up to date with all the latest social media platforms, driven, eager to learn, big on team work, can work long hours and dedicate one self to work. The grad students have the best skills, they may lack experience, but the one mistake you make is you think employers care about experience too much, that is a old myth, an urban legend. What employers truly want is to be impressed, with attitude and drive. And I will impress them when I ask for 60,000 when everyone else is willing to settle for 35,000. That my friend is how i roll.

This makes me laugh, the ignorance here is baffling. There are no hundreds of grads, there is a shortage of highly educated professionals in Canada. There are always jobs available, most top companies always say " We are always looking for motivated people" on their career page. That means they are always hiring always looking for top talent. Second point, every new release of grads has an advantage over the previous one because they learn more, they learn the latest techniques, read the latest editions of text books, learn from the best new professors. Every new grad class is an upgrade from the previous, so employers look to new grads all the time. In fact you can not replace a highly educated grad that easily because the other "100 or so" who will take his place will also demand a high wage. No one is stupid to accept a 30 k job when you can hold out for more, its about respect and dignity. Also no one works 2 jobs at starbucks and works 9-5 at a full time job, that is social suicide. I wanna go out I wanna have fun with my girl, i wanna party with friends live it up, spend some money, drop some cash on my friends.. I dont have time to work 2 jobs, i want 1 full time stable easy job where I can make good cash and enjoy my life stress free. That is why I went to school.

The real problem is societie's view on newly graduated students, that is sad how you are treating this situation. This is the reason why employers dont want to pay premium to grads, it is because of the envy and putdowns of the general public. It is unreal to me that you have the audacity to bring me down and say I need to work in the service industry when I am aiming for a mid management role right out of school, which only the best and the brightest can pull off. My reasons are simple, my cost of living is high, my rent is high, I have a huge student loan, I want to live in Yaletown and have a nice car. All these things cost money, ok? I am sure you understand that, and because the life style I aim for is expensive I need a salary that justifies such a life style. And a 30-40k salary is not going to cut it, how am I not clear about that?

I truly feel I deserve a chance at a job of my choosing, I deserve that chance because: - I have a certified degree in a profession that is the focus of my studies - I have a degree from a reputable university - I have a respectable 2.8 GPA graduation average - I have recomendation letters from my professor and my uncle who will vouch for me - I have a team first attitude, I love to work with groups and designate tasks - I am ambitious and am able to take on responsibilities that come with higher compensation - I am friendly, very good with people, social and communicative Just based on these elements above i would say 98% of people in our society dont have these atributes, but I do. And because I have them is why I ask for a higher salary than the average Joe coming out of school.

Thats an ignroant statement. Universities are government agents they follow pre-set government education systems and grading statures. They charge a certain dollar amount because they expect you to earn that back through salary. The better the university the more they charge the more money you can request in salary because your school shows you what you deserve to be paid based on the quality of your school. Furthermore, you can keep telling me degrees are worth nothing that is such an ignorant statement. The whole point of school is to educate us, to impower us to do something with our lives, and primarily to get a job! Everyone knows that school is the first step to get a career, there are tons of people who will be hired. I have no doubt that getting a job after school is easy, to me a job is not enough, i want a top level job with a mangement role and salary because I feel I am more driven and dedicated than the majority of people my age, including my grad class. It is that simple.

This is my whole point, employers are desperately looking for top talent, there is a lot of jobs available and few qualified people to fill them. There is no one to pick like you say "someone else" there is no someone else like you may think. Sure I went to school with a lot of people but they too will get jobs, everyone is pretty much guaranteed a job out of school that is how the system works, you pay your dues, you go to school to get a job. This is how it always was, always will be and will continue to be marketed to us as such. There are a lot more jobs than people available if you are driven and dedicated, I dont care if my classmates have the same degrees, they are not as ambitious as I am . They will go for entry level jobs while I am aiming for middle-management, that shows someone who has guts, someone who isnt afraid of a challenge. I think an employer will be impressed I am aiming high and give me a shot at a management position, youll see.

What food? I am a singe young male, which is always a preference of the employers. I have no family to feed, I dont need to make sacrafises, I am in a position to bargain and expect a lot. Perhaps a desperate immigrant who really will work for nothing will take any job, but not me. This is why I have the advantage, because employers have no choice but to pay top dollar for educated out of school grads who have the most up to date knowlege of the latest methods of technology, research and education that school provides.

Ths is completely false, I refuse to believe this. People rather hold out than to make less than what they are worth. Example: PK Suban, look at the nHL and how their attitude towards jobs are. I refuse to believe people would take on a lower salary, they will hold out rather than to work for nothing. Trust me, employers are not looking to pay the LEAST, they know top talent is worth a lot. If I go in there and demand a high wage the employer will get the impression that I am worth what I am asking for, they will understand that I have self value that I will not be bullied into taking change. This is why I believe the more assertive people like me can make a difference, the cream always rises to the top they say. Creme de la crop!

I never said executive suite. I just want to understand how employers not understand that living in Vancouver is tough, and because rent is so expensive it makes sense that salaries here need to be raised. I dont see how people are surviving in Vancouver off 30-40k salaries, why dont they complain or stand up to the bullies that these megacorporations are? I am the young generation and a representative of your future, I for one refuse to take on a small salary, I will ask for more and get more. The squeeky wheel gets the oil, you cant be serious that I wont be expecting a lot when I graduate. Considering the promises made to me, the amount of student debt I have, the expense of living here etc all needs to be taken into account by employers when setting salaries. Salaries is a sum total of expenses of their employees + a little spending money. The higher the expenses the higher the salaries, that is standard economics.

I think people here seriously underestimate salaries. What you think people make 30-40k, people are actually making 55-60k. Go out there, Craigslist is full of jobs, I see no problems landing a job. It is not about landing a job, I want optimum salary, I am looking for tips and tricks to convince and coin the employer to side with me on my salary expectations. I am looking for advise on how to maximize my earning potential straight out of school, and NO dont tell me its not possible, and dont tell me to gain experience first, because I dont buy that. I need real advise on how to get a high paying job right out of university.

I still dont understand why jobs in any field dont start out at 50-60k range and go up from there. Where are these 30-40k wage expectations coming from? No one in their right mind would accept a wage that low, people have integrity, dignity. If students out of university said "no that is too low wage for me" the employers will have no choice but to raise wages. You have to spend money to earn money. You have to understand that your employees is one place you cant afford to save money on, you need to attract top talent and pay them premium. Look at the NHL, there is always compettition for most players, hell once you made it to the NHL there is a "minimum salary" that is still exceptional, that is how I see life/career after university. Once I made it past university that is like getting into the NHL there is a certain minimum salary base which in my eyes is at least 60k, it could be more in other cities, but if you arent making at least 60k in Vancouver you wont survive. And as a young man looking to survive in Vancouver, and I want to live in Yaletown and looking to lease a nice car I want to represent the image of success I see on the streets of Vancouver and it drives me mad, up the wall that these sucessful people have what i want and I need that and want that too. So rather than accepting that salaries are low, why not fight to raise them and try to get the most for your efforts?

I failed some courses, cause SFU forces you to have a balance of Math, Fine Arts and Science. So you are forced to take a few electives of all 3, its not easy. I just dont like work, and I dont want to spend hours reading books when all my friends are on the beach drinking beer. It was so hard for me to justify to go to school when so many of my friends went to work 9-5 after high school and I couldnt stand being in a library instead of at a house party. At least I am honest, I am so proud of my self for my sacrafise, and I still stayed in school and got through it. I hated it, but now that I am done I want to get the most out of it. Its my pride on the line, I have to show my friends school wasnt for nothing, I want to prove to my parents that I can be a somebody, I made so many boasts to my current girlfriend that once I am done school I will support her, I will get a great job etc.. She is expecting a lot from me, I am expecting a lot from my self, there is no turning back now.

I understand the people on this board are bitter or insecure with their own expertise. Picture your self, a 26 year old male fresh out of school, you have the world at your feet, full of optimisim. I will dress nice, talk the part and draw up my resume the best i can. A good resume goes a long way, and front of the list on the resume will be my schooling. I believe your education tells the emloyer a lot, if school was not important no one will go, if school wasnt not the gateway to financial security no one will attend. Hate to break it to you, but it is, and always will be. This is what I was made to believe and I refuse to believe anything else because I banked my whole future on it. If education wasnt an easy answer I would have joined trades and worked my ass off, but I was given an easier path to riches. To hang out with mom and dad, play games relax, and just cruise through a degree and ask for a good salary on my way to an early retirement. You have NO IDEA what our graduates can earn these days, just because you couldnt find a job out of school does not mean I can not, or wont. My goal isnt to find a job, that is too easy, I want a high paying job that fulfills my criteria. I feel I am a special person full of skills, I worked hard and finish a university degree, which by the way is no easy feat. I had to spend years redoing courses, passing exams, doing homework, I hated every minute of it, I wish I didnt have to pull all nighters. I joined as many team projects as I could so my team can pull the weight, I paid asian students to help me write exams and do labs, I used online essay websites to record top grade papers, i spend hours and hours googling how to beat scantron cards and look for patterns on multiplechoice questions. I took the path less traveled, because I am an innovator, and an honest person with a good heart and strong mind. I know I can make it, the power of the will can not be underestimated.

I dont understand where you are getting the "40k" figure? If average rent is $1500, average cost of a degree is $30,000 and there are only 1 out of 10 people to compete with, then according to my calculations there is a lot of jobs available and few people to fill them. Why would anyone be out of work if they have a degree in a special field? New jobs are created all the time, ecnomy is growing constantly, the need for jobs is always high. I dont doubt I will find a job, its a matter of how high I can negotiate a salary to, the key to getting a large wage is putting your foot down with the employers and showing them you will not back down, you will not be intimidated or f*ed around for low wages. I almost want to come to an interview, put my feet on the emloyers desk and say " I know what I am worth I want to negotiate" I mean you really need to let them know you are not a pussy and you are willing to work hard for their company. Employers dont have 40k in their mind, they will give you what you feel you are worth. Based on the ecnomomic conditions of Vancouver there is no reason why we cant ask for higher salaries, especially because so few people I would suspect finish college/university, and those who did already have jobs.

Thank you for those who responded: I ) I graduated from SFU with a Communications degree specializing in Marketing. From what I was told all my life is that if I go to school and I finish university I will be better off than 90% of other people. For those who said " a degree is a dime a dozen" give your head a shake. Stats show 1 out of 10 people finish post-secondary, that already puts me in the top 10% of income earners because I finished secondary education. Everyone knows and everyone who I knew growing up encourgaged me to go to school and finish college. Keep in mind 90% of people can not afford college and are not smart enough to withstand the demanding GPA requirements to get in and to finish. Guess what, I DID! As a result I fully expect to be rewarded with a good salary in a position that matches my school of study. There is no reason not to have high expectations, we live in a society where our parents provided us with every tool, every opportunity and every chance to get ahead, and I feel my generation have every right to ask for high salaries because we are the future of the retiring "Baby Boomers" you need us more than ever and we can ask for whatever we want. People seem to think "university kids are a dime a dozen" guess what, I havent checked out the job market but I bet you everyone with a degree has a job. Like I said 1 in 10 have degrees, they are the first people hired and they have a lot of bargaining power with employers. II ) Its not just about experience its about skill and power of your degree. There are kids going to Wall Street right out of college at 21 years old landing 100k year jobs, lawyers, doctors, electricians, miners, sales people etc.. Experience means nothing if you have a degree and you have high grades, thats the beauty of school. School is a short cut to experience, its either you go to work after high school hoping to rise through the ranks or you take a short cut and go to school and expet to make just as much as someone who didnt 5 years back. III ) I fully expect 60k MINIMUM out of school, considering how expensive my degree was it is only fair to ask for that much back. Consdering how expensive housing here is, how hard it was to get my education, the countless hours of homework etc i think i deserve to be rewarded with a nice job and income. Employers are not stupid they know the cost of housing, they know how hard it is to finish school, they know how good kids are out of school there is no reason not to pay them well and pay them high. So with that being said, is $60,000 too little to ask for? I cant imagine the job market being any less than that for an average out of school salary, providing you have a post-secondary degree.

I am about to graduate from college and I was thinking of what I can expect as a new graduate. All my life my parents, my school staff, the media, literature etc has told me that if I went to school and hung on to get my degree i will be rewarded with an amazing future. My parents started with 60,000$ a year and full benefits in the 70s, and I am expecting something similar out of marketing school. I feel that with a lot of old timers retiring the companies will be desperate for new staff, especially highly trained college educated staff. How much should I be asking for on my first job interviews? Do you feel $55,.000-$60,000 a year is an appropriate income for a business professional such as my self? I always told my self I should be making 100k a year within first 3 years of coming out of college, because Vancouver is so expensive to live in, my rent is $1500 which is huge vs what I make now. What is scaring me is that I read an article saying Vancouver salaries are among the lowest in Canada, how does that make sense if our housing is the highest in Canada? How does that relate? Please help me understand, should I be asking for a higher salary from my employers to justify the high rent I pay and the increasing real estate? Is it time to push for higher salaries?

How are you all so excited over the coach and management? 90% of the team success is what type of players you have on it, not the coach or GM. If the team is full of stars and young hard working guys the coach will make a marginal difference, we should be rebuilding the team not celebrating front office hires!

I am very concerned about the $14 million dollar pay check to the Sedins.. FOr $5 million a year we can have 3 super players because $5 million is what Kesler type players make, imagne 3 Keslers for 2 sedins.. A trade I will take any time.

How did the Sedins go from 100 points to 70 points in just 1 year? How is their decline so obvious, there is no way they are worth 7 million... Are we really stuck with them?