riffraff
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Posts posted by riffraff
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Just now, samurai said:
saw it but wondering who they are cause it lobs some pretty big bombs.
For example
Furthermore, studies have shown that the internationally used virus test kits may give a false positive result in some cases. In these cases, the persons may not have contracted the new coronavirus, but presumably one of the many existing human coronaviruses that are part of the annual (and currently ongoing) common cold and flu epidemics. (1)
And then
Thus the most important indicator for judging the danger of the disease is not the frequently reported number of positively-tested persons and deaths, but the number of persons actually and unexpectedly developing or dying from pneumonia (so-called excess mortality).
Agree. Astounding info.
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12 minutes ago, samurai said:
who is this site?
Link at top
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Interesting read:
https://swprs.org/a-swiss-doctor-on-covid-19/
Facts about Covid-19
Published: March 14, 2020; Updated: April 2, 2020
Languages: CZ, DE, EN, FR, ES, HU, IT, NL, NO, PL, RU, SI, SK, TRFully referenced facts about Covid-19, provided by experts in the field, to help our readers make a realistic risk assessment. (Updated daily, see below)
„The only means to fight the plague is honesty.“ Albert Camus, The Plague (1947)
According to the latest data of the Italian National Health Institute ISS, the average age of the positively-tested deceased in Italy is currently about 81 years. 10% of the deceased are over 90 years old. 90% of the deceased are over 70 years old.
80% of the deceased had suffered from two or more chronic diseases. 50% of the deceased had suffered from three or more chronic diseases. The chronic diseases include in particular cardiovascular problems, diabetes, respiratory problems and cancer.
Less than 1% of the deceased were healthy persons, i.e. persons without pre-existing chronic diseases. Only about 30% of the deceased are women.
The Italian Institute of Health moreover distinguishes between those who died fromthe coronavirus and those who died with the coronavirus. In many cases it is not yet clear whether the persons died from the virus or from their pre-existing chronic diseases or from a combination of both.
The two Italians deceased under 40 years of age (both 39 years old) were a cancer patient and a diabetes patient with additional complications. In these cases, too, the exact cause of death was not yet clear (i.e. if from the virus or from their pre-existing diseases).
The partial overloading of the hospitals is due to the general rush of patients and the increased number of patients requiring special or intensive care. In particular, the aim is to stabilize respiratory function and, in severe cases, to provide anti-viral therapies.
(Update: The Italian National Institute of Health published a statistical report on test-positive patients and deceased, confirming the above data.)
The following aspects should also be taken into account:
Northern Italy has one of the oldest populations and the worst air quality in Europe, which had already led to an increased number of respiratory diseases and deaths in the past and is likely an additional risk factor in the current epidemic.
South Korea, for instance, has experienced a much milder course than Italy and has already passed the peak of the epidemic. In South Korea, only about 70 deaths with a positive test result have been reported so far. As in Italy, those affected were mostly high-risk patients.
The few dozen test-positive Swiss deaths so far were also high-risk patients with chronic diseases, an average age of more than 80 years and a maximum age of 97 years, whose exact cause of death, i.e. from the virus or from their pre-existing diseases, is not yet known.
Furthermore, studies have shown that the internationally used virus test kits may give a false positive result in some cases. In these cases, the persons may not have contracted the new coronavirus, but presumably one of the many existing human coronaviruses that are part of the annual (and currently ongoing) common cold and flu epidemics. (1)
Thus the most important indicator for judging the danger of the disease is not the frequently reported number of positively-tested persons and deaths, but the number of persons actually and unexpectedly developing or dying from pneumonia (so-called excess mortality).
According to all current data, for the healthy general population of school and working age, a mild to moderate course of the Covid-19 disease can be expected. Senior citizens and persons with existing chronic diseases should be protected. The medical capacities should be optimally prepared.
Medical literature
(1) Patrick et al., An Outbreak of Human Coronavirus OC43 Infection and Serological Cross-reactivity with SARS Coronavirus, CJIDMM, 2006.
(2) Grasselli et al., Critical Care Utilization for the COVID-19 Outbreak in Lombardy, JAMA, March 2020.
(3) WHO, Report of the WHO-China Joint Mission on Coronavirus Disease 2019, February 2020.
Reference values
Important reference values include the number of annual flu deaths, which is up to 8,000 in Italy and up to 60,000 in the US; normal overall mortality, which in Italy is up to 2,000 deaths per day; and the average number of pneumonia cases per year, which in Italy is over 120,000.
Current all-cause mortality in Europe and in Italy is still normal or even below-average. Any excess mortality due to Covid-19 should become visible in the European monitoring charts.
Winter smog (NO2) in Northern Italy in February 2020 (ESA)
Updates
Regular updates on the situation (all sources referenced).
March 17, 2020 (I)
- The mortality profile remains puzzling from a virological point of view because, in contrast to influenza viruses, children are spared and men are affected about twice as often as women. On the other hand, this profile corresponds to natural mortality, which is close to zero for children and almost twice as high for 75-year-old men as for women of the same age.
- The younger test-positive deceased almost always had severe pre-existing conditions. For example, a 21-year-old Spanish soccer coach had died test-positive, making international headlines. However, the doctors diagnosed an unrecognized leukemia, whose typical complications include severe pneumonia.
- The decisive factor in assessing the danger of the disease is therefore not the number of test-positive persons and deceased, which is often mentioned in the media, but the number of people actually and unexpectedly developing or dying from pneumonia (so-called excess mortality). So far, this value remains very low in most countries.
- In Switzerland, some emergency units are already overloaded simply because of the large number of people who want to be tested. This points to an additional psychological and logistical component of the current situation.
March 17, 2020 (II)
- Italian immunology professor Sergio Romagnani from the University of Florence comes to the conclusion in a study on 3000 people that 50 to 75% of the test-positive people of all ages remain completely symptom-free – significantly more than previously assumed.
- The occupancy rate of the North Italian ICUs in the winter months is typically already 85 to 90%. Some or many of these existing patients could also be test-positive by now. However, the number of additional unexpected pneumonia cases is not yet known.
- A hospital doctor in the Spanish city of Malaga writes on Twitter that people are currently more likely to die from panic and systemic collapse than from the virus. The hospital is being overrun by people with colds, flu and possibly Covid19 and doctors have lost control.
March 18, 2020
- A new epidemiological study (preprint) concludes that the fatality of Covid19 even in the Chinese city of Wuhan was only 0.04% to 0.12% and thus rather lowerthan that of seasonal flu, which has a mortality rate of about 0.1%. As a reason for the overestimated fatality of Covid19, the researchers suspect that initially only a small number of cases were recorded in Wuhan, as the disease was probably asymptomatic or mild in many people.
- Chinese researchers argue that extreme winter smog in the city of Wuhan may have played a causal role in the outbreak of pneumonia. In the summer of 2019, public protests were already taking place in Wuhan because of the poor air quality.
- New satellite images show how Northern Italy has the highest levels of air pollutionin Europe, and how this air pollution has been greatly reduced by the quarantine.
- A manufacturer of the Covid19 test kit states that it should only be used for research purposes and not for diagnostic applications, as it has not yet been clinically validated.
Datasheet of Covid19 virus test kit
March 19, 2020 (I)
The Italian National Health Institute ISS has published a new report on test-positive deaths:
- The median age is 80.5 years (79.5 for men, 83.7 for women).
- 10% of the deceased was over 90 years old; 90% of the deceased was over 70 years old.
- At most 0.8% of the deceased had no pre-existing chronic illnesses.
- Approximately 75% of the deceased had two or more pre-existing conditions, 50% had three more pre-existing conditions, in particular heart disease, diabetes and cancer.
- Five of the deceased were between 31 and 39 years old, all of them with serious pre-existing health conditions (e.g. cancer or heart disease).
- The National Health Institute hasn’t yet determined what the patients examined ultimately died of and refers to them in general terms as Covid19-positive deaths.
March 19, 2020 (II)
- A report in the Italian newspaper Corriere della Sera points out that Italian intensive care units already collapsed under the marked flu wave in 2017/2018. They had to postpone operations, call nurses back from holiday and ran out of blood donations.
- German virologist Hendrik Streeck arguesthat Covid19 is unlikely to increase total mortality in Germany, which normally is around 2500 people per day. Streeck mentions the case of a 78-year-old man with preconditions who died of heart failure, subsequently tested positive for Covid19 and thus was included in the statistics of Covid19 deaths.
- According to Stanford Professor John Ioannidis, the new coronavirus may be no more dangerous than some of the common coronaviruses, even in older people. Ioannidis argues that there is no reliable medical data backing the measures currently decided upon.
March 20, 2020
- According to the latest European monitoring report, overall mortality in all countries (including Italy) and in all age groups remains within or even below the normal range so far.
- According to the latest German statistics, the median age of test-positive deaths is about 83 years, most with pre-existing health conditions that might be a possible cause of death.
- A 2006 Canadian study referred to by Stanford Professor John Ioannidis found that common cold coronaviruses may also cause death rates of up to 6% in risk groups such as residents of a care facility, and that virus test kits initially falsely indicated an infection with SARS coronaviruses.
March 21, 2020 (I)
- Spain reports only three test-positive deaths under the age of 65 (out of a total of about 1000). Their pre-existing health conditions and actual cause of death are not yet known.
- On March 20, Italy reported 627 nationwide test-positive deaths in one day. By comparison, normal overall mortality in Italy is about 1800 deaths per day. Since February 21, Italy has reported about 4000 test-positive deaths. Normal overall mortality during this time frame is up to 50,000 deaths. It is not yet known to what extent normal overall mortality has increased, or to what extent it has simply turned test-positive. Moreover, Italy and Europe have had a very mild flu season in 2019/2020 that has spared many otherwise vulnerable people.
- According to Italian news reports, 90% of test-positive deceased in the Lombardy region have died outside of intensive care units, mostly at home or in general care sections. Their cause of death and the possible role of quarantine measures in their deaths remain unclear. Only 260 out of 2168 test-positive persons have died in ICUs.
- Bloomberg highlights that „99% of Those Who Died From Virus Had Other Illness, Italy Says“
Italy test-positive deaths by prior illnesses (ISS / Bloomberg)
March 21, 2020 (II)
- The Japan Times asks: Japan was expecting a coronavirus explosion. Where is it? Despite being one of the first countries getting positive test results and having imposed no lockdown, Japan is one of the least-affected nations. Quote: „Even if Japan may not be counting all those infected, hospitals aren’t being stretched thin and there has been no spike in pneumonia cases.“
- Italian researchers argue that the extreme smog in Northern Italy, the worst in Europe, may be playing a causative role in the current pneumonia outbreak there, as in Wuhan before.
- In a new interview, Professor Sucharit Bhakdi, a world renowned expert in medical microbiology, says blaming the new coronavirus alone for deaths is „wrong“ and „dangerously misleading“, as there are other more important factors at play, notably pre-existing health conditions and poor air quality in Chinese and Northern Italian cities. Professor Bhakdi describes the currently discussed or imposed measures as „grotesque“, „useless“, „self-destructive“ and a „collective suicide“ that will shorten the lifespan of the elderly and should not be accepted by society.
March 22, 2020 (I)
Regarding the situation in Italy: Most major media falsely report that Italy has up to 800 deaths per day from the coronavirus. In reality, the president of the Italian Civil Protection Service stresses that these are deaths „with the coronavirus and not fromthe coronavirus“ (minute 03:30 of the press conference). In other words, these persons died while also testing positive.
As Professors Ioannidis and Bhakdi have shown, countries like South Korea and Japan that introduced no lockdown measures have experienced near-zero excess mortality in connection with Covid-19, while the Diamond Princess cruise ship experienced an extrapolated mortality figure in the per mille range, i.e. at or below the level of the seasonal flu.
Current test-positive death figures in Italy are still less than 50% of normal daily overall mortality in Italy, which is around 1800 deaths per day. Thus it is possible, perhaps even likely, that a large part of normal daily mortality now simply counts as „Covid19“ deaths (as they test positive). This is the point stressed by the President of the Italian Civil Protection Service.
However, by now it is clear that certain regions in Northern Italy, i.e. those facing the toughest lockdown measures, are experiencing markedly increased daily mortality figures. It is also known that in the Lombardy region, 90% of test-positive deaths occur not in intensive care units, but instead mostly at home. And more than 99% have serious pre-existing health conditions.
Professor Sucharit Bhakdi has calledlockdown measures „useless“, „self-destructive“ and a „collective suicide“. Thus the extremely troubling question arises as to what extent the increased mortality of these elderly, isolated, highly stressed people with multiple pre-existing health conditions may in fact be caused by the weeks-long lockdown measures still in force.
If so, it may be one of those cases where the treatment is worse than the disease. (See update below: only 12% of death certificates show the coronavirus as a cause.)
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32 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:
That Mofo was going for the choke submission.
Got a good chin too. Sign that Roo.
Rematch would be worth some bucks!
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6 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:
I saw a deer fight today.
They punch like sissies...but they do have those nasty hooves. That and they throw punches in bunches. No hesitation, I admired that.
I think maybe, just maybe I might just be missing watching mma fights due to covid... when I am analysing doe vs doe throw downs
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10 minutes ago, nuckin_futz said:
Why is New Orleans' coronavirus death rate twice New York's?
Fri 3 Apr 2020 02:17:47 GMTVia Reuters.
New Orleans a per-capita death rate twice that of New York City, and over four times that of Seattle- 97% of those killed by COVID-19 in Louisiana had a pre-existing condition
- Diabetes in 40% of the deaths
- obesity in 25%
- chronic kidney disease in 23%
- cardiac problems in 21%
- A host of other factors could contribute to New Orleans' high death rate from COVID-19, ranging from access to healthcare and hospital quality, to the prevalence of other conditions, including lung disease, health officials say.
Shocker.
wonder what living under oppressive atmospheric pollution will do? Like the 29/100 cities in Italy that make the top 100 worst cities in Europe for air quality.
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Just now, Chris12345 said:
Don't know wtf you are talking about to be honest.
I really just care if he's growi g cherry tomatoes.
Animal parts are used in ingredients for many things humans are exposed to.
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1 minute ago, Chris12345 said:
What are you growing?
Where?
Will you be 100% self sustaining?
None of those question matter. If you are willing to eat Unidentified food you’re not part of a solution .
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3 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:
I don't know why you want to give major corporations and food producers the go ahead to hide potentially dangerous ingredients.
That's a step backwards. I think most would agree. Actually you do agree...I prefer having first world problems than third world problems for sure.
Eating a bats arse is what got the world into this problem in the first place.
Well animal parts got into humans somehow. Eating them is one way.
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3 hours ago, higgyfan said:
I really don't have a problem with snitching; especially when we are at an important phase in managing this virus. Be interesting if the Neighbourhood Watch in each community could be in on this.
You could move to Halton, Ontario.
cheer for the leafs and rat out your fellow citizen.
please consider what you wish for people.
virus pandemic. Rat out your neighbour from inside “your home”.
3 years later. New pandemic. Go inside. Rat out your neighbourhood again.
once again. Finger pointing blame games instead of personal responsibility.
have fun world.
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1 minute ago, coastal.view said:
i do physical work
so the exercising is not really the issue for me
the increase in idleness is the issue
health studies show that sitting too much
is not overcome by exercise
it is important to stay moving
but we are stuck at home with limited options
and the richest options are sitting and watching (and learning in that process as well)
I won’t get to into what “exercise” is or can be but I agree with you that movement is key at the very least.
i recommend a book by Todd Hargrove called A guide to better movement.
itll be a context provider re my posts.
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When we love ourselves and take care of ourselves it will become natural to want and help others to do the same.
do not take for granted this one shot deal with mind and body.
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1 minute ago, coastal.view said:
we all know this stuff
but doing everything solo
does impact on motivation
in a non helpful way
Agreed. I concede that exercising solo is difficult for many people to maintain as a daily routine.
but A start is a start and something is better than none.
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12 minutes ago, RonMexico said:
Define healthy choices though. So much of what is healthy is just marketed to appear that way. Which leads to people consuming a lot of something thinking they can't do themselves any harm. It's healthy right? No such thing as being toooo healthy!
Then you have healthy people who get cancer or take your pick of a host of horrible diseases that inflict humans. C19 is knocking off 'healthy' people too. Disease knows no bounds no matter how healthy or unhealthy you are. Does being healthier increase your risk of survival? For sure but it's not a catch-all defence system.
By all means though, do whatever you think will improve your longevity. Our minds are very powerful and you can will yourself to live longer. My FIL is a classic example of the power of desire. He has lived with colorectal cancer for 15 years. It has metastasized 3 more times since the original occurrence (liver, lymphnodes and same spot in lymphnodes that wasn't properly treated the first time). Each time he has gone into remission and currently is considered cancer free. His diet consisted of alcohol, chocolate, ice cream, every junk food you could dream up, pb toast and canned soup. He quit the booze but smokes pot like a madman and still barely eats vegetables or fruit or anything remotely considered healthy. How is he still alive? He says he lots to live for and isn't interested in dying.
Define healthy?
first one needs to understand how the body functions properly and why it does so.
but until people are educated in that area I suppose the basics:
eat well
sleep enough
move your body
challenge your brain continuously
repeat until dead.
wadr to your Fil, when you say define healthy as a question? I say define living.
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Just saw a provincial gvt vehicle in a Tims drive thru.
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Draw simple bell curve graph
at the bottom is low health risk/healthy human.
at the top is terminal health conditions.
start honestly adding known unhealthy choices, non exercise being one, and see how high up the curve you climb.....as you climb look around to see how many are with you.....do you even make it to the top?
now make a choice to be healthy. As you subtract poor choices do you go back down the curve? And do you leave a lot of people behind?
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3 minutes ago, Canuckster86 said:
What is pizza hut donating? My girlfriend ordered pizza from them a few days back, order was delayed by almost 40 min, told her she had to wait and didn't do anything to compensate for the long wait. She told them she just got off work from working at the hospital, they offered nothing to her for compensating the triple long wait time or for her working at the hospital
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31 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:
Randomly I was just reading an article on General Patton.
These points made me think of your comments this morn...
Patton's principles for good health:
Brainpower comes from the lungs.
An active mind cannot exist in an inactive body.
There is no power in a bushel of blubber.
Make the mind command the body. Never let the body command the mind.
To gain strength, always go beyond exhaustion.
You have spent the better part of a lifetime in martial arts........
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13 minutes ago, RUPERTKBD said:
They're vices....
...if they were easy to quit, no-one would have them and there would be no market for cigarettes, booze, junk food, etc......
Not exercising is not a vice.
it is laziness. It is the middle finger to science and common sense. It is irresponsible. It affects us all in a free health care system.
and the above examples, well half of them are taxed and provide income to the gvt.
vices come after choices.
starbucks Pizza Hut and dunkn doughnuts are donating to health care workers as we speak.
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1 hour ago, coastal.view said:
i agree
hard to establish new reliable routines in this time of crisis
i still work
but my down time is completely messed up
and am way way more idle these days (there are no easy stimulating options besides sitting and watching)
so reminders are not a bad thing in my view
food has fallen a little into the entertainment category
and does provide some comfort for me these days
never viewed food this way before
25-75 years ago your doctor would regularly tell you to stop drinking and smoking. My granddad was literally told to or he will die. So he quit.
why has this changed.
we know have even more ways to smoke even more things.
we speak about the condition of the mind here during isolation. People are online more, watching media more, watching scary epidemic sci fi movies on Netflix......:more addiction to tech, more addiction to the internet, more addiction to tv. More addiction to fear. Go to bed scared and anxious every night without social interaction and or exercise. See how that all plays out.
go outside in the sun and sweat for half an hour. Enjoy the endorphins.....you know, the natural good feels your own body creates.....
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28 minutes ago, debluvscanucks said:
People also have responded in a "yeah I should stop" way that is likely being influenced by others and a positive reaction. So the discussion is a good one to have and supporting one another...even with baby steps, important.
It can be a normal reaction to eat (stuff it down), drink (numbing), etc. when worry sets in. But you really make a good point and it is a personal responsibility to react in a way that protects you as much as possible.Even in the sense that people who have preventable heart attacks/strokes will call on services that are needed elsewhere right now. How it all ties together in a big picture way.
Great point of discussion, RR.
I’m talking biiiiig picture future generations context here as in adopt personal responsibility for health so the strain on the health care system is always low.
would you rather take responsibility for your health, something that you have the ability to control - it’s yours, your body. You get one: once.
or
live unhealthy, waiting for a vaccine that may or may not ever work and have gvts tell you what you can and can’t do?
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5 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:
is that something people need to be reminded of anymore?
Absolutely 100% sadly and obviously.
we see it here in this forum:
”I’ve been smashing bags of chips and liquor while watching Netflix all day er day.” Literally flaunting it. Meanwhile screaming for social distancing.
people need to to take responsibility for their own health.
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How many days and not one word from cbc news on how to be healthy, to stop smoking, to eat better, to drink less, to exercise more.
never was never will.
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25 minutes ago, Trebreh said:
Christy Clark’s neighbour in the Shaughnesseys
Winter smog (NO2) in Northern Italy in February 2020 (ESA)
Datasheet of Covid19 virus test kit
Italy test-positive deaths by prior illnesses (ISS / Bloomberg)
.
Coronavirus outbreak
in Off-Topic General
Posted
It was sent to me.