nitronuts Posted January 21, 2009 Author Share Posted January 21, 2009 (edited) Do they have plans to rezone and densify the Broadway corridor with highrises to increase ridership and justify the expense? Or will the creme-de-la-creme westside residents block any such attempts? Probably just more of the latter for west of Arbutus, while Central Broadway would see increased densification but not radical Downtown or Metrotown-like, more like mid-rise type. With that said, there would still be densification west of Arbutus: but probably nothing more than 4 or 5 storeys, and mainly along Broadway (similar to the new developments at West Point Grey Village). The Safeway sites at both Sasamat and Macdonald are ripe for dense developments. The projected ridership already justifies the expense though. The route is 12-kms long. In 2002, before U-Pass was introduced, a Translink/City study estimated that a SkyTrain extension to Arbutus and Rapid Bus from Arbutus to UBC would rake in 150,000 passengers per day. Consider that the extension will now be finished over a decade after that study was made, consider the U-Pass introduced after the study, consider the bus improvements made since, consider the Canada Line's transfers, consider the Evergreen Line, consider the Evergreen Line's and Surrey extensions added ridership, etc. Consider everything and I am willing to say that 200,000 passengers per day from Commercial to UBC is a conservative estimate for 2014. In comparison, the Evergreen Line is expected to carry 70,000 passengers a day; the Canada Line at 100,000/day; while the Expo and Millennium Line currently rake in more than 250,000 passengers per day. Edited January 21, 2009 by nitronuts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Common sense Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 What's the point of that stop at Main Mall? If you're going to UBC, you're expected to walk around campus. That being said, I'm disappointed that it's above-ground. Imagine having a slab of concrete cut across this: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buggernut Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 What's the point of that stop at Main Mall? If you're going to UBC, you're expected to walk around campus. Is it so bad to spread out the onslaught of passengers over two stations instead of one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitronuts Posted January 21, 2009 Author Share Posted January 21, 2009 (edited) What's the point of that stop at Main Mall? If you're going to UBC, you're expected to walk around campus. That being said, I'm disappointed that it's above-ground. Imagine having a slab of concrete cut across this: This is very far from final, just a sneak peak inside Translink.....the Main Mall would likely be cut out, same goes with the trenches and the slab of concrete cut across the Mall. But the reasoning behind the Main Mall Station is to disperse the passenger loads and to maintain a high frequency. I'm not a fan of the Main Mall Station either, but my main reasoning is cost. I could definitely see the efficiencies of having two UBC stations, and an added benefit of serving an immediately wider area (West Mall/Village, Main Mall). As well, ideally I would like to have one large station below the underground bus loop. That's right: Ground level - entrance into transit hub - 5 escalators, two large staircases, 2 elevators - Underground level 1 - large ticketing concourse with fare gates, bus platforms (capable of accommodating existing buses including trolleys and future double deckers) - 4 escalators, two staircases, 1 elevator - Underground level 2 - SkyTrain platform (110-metres long) Edited January 21, 2009 by nitronuts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hwy19man Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 That takes intelligence have you ever seen translink execute a smart move? Right on! Translink has zero intelligence most of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronthecivil Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Do they have plans to rezone and densify the Broadway corridor with highrises to increase ridership and justify the expense? Or will the creme-de-la-creme westside residents block any such attempts? The broadway corridor is already more dense than anwhere in Coquitlam or Surrey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronthecivil Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 (edited) Probably just more of the latter for west of Arbutus, while Central Broadway would see increased densification but not radical Downtown or Metrotown-like, more like mid-rise type. With that said, there would still be densification west of Arbutus: but probably nothing more than 4 or 5 storeys, and mainly along Broadway (similar to the new developments at West Point Grey Village). The Safeway sites at both Sasamat and Macdonald are ripe for dense developments. The projected ridership already justifies the expense though. The route is 12-kms long. In 2002, before U-Pass was introduced, a Translink/City study estimated that a SkyTrain extension to Arbutus and Rapid Bus from Arbutus to UBC would rake in 150,000 passengers per day. Consider that the extension will now be finished over a decade after that study was made, consider the U-Pass introduced after the study, consider the bus improvements made since, consider the Canada Line's transfers, consider the Evergreen Line, consider the Evergreen Line's and Surrey extensions added ridership, etc. Consider everything and I am willing to say that 200,000 passengers per day from Commercial to UBC is a conservative estimate for 2014. In comparison, the Evergreen Line is expected to carry 70,000 passengers a day; the Canada Line at 100,000/day; while the Expo and Millennium Line currently rake in more than 250,000 passengers per day. They are of course looking at radical plan E, an extension of the millenium line all the way to UBC, no? Having it elevated along university blvd between blanca (not alma, that's the start of the bored tunnel) and the campus WOULD look cool. Just gotta keep the golf balls off the track. Edited January 21, 2009 by ronthecivil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hullo. Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 This is very far from final, just a sneak peak inside Translink.....the Main Mall would likely be cut out, same goes with the trenches and the slab of concrete cut across the Mall. But the reasoning behind the Main Mall Station is to disperse the passenger loads and to maintain a high frequency. Very true. As evidenced by the misspelling of WESBROOK (not Westbrook) mall on all the renderings and the fact that this rendering is completely mislabeled (or mirror imaged) Broadway should be on the other side of 10th in that view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitronuts Posted January 21, 2009 Author Share Posted January 21, 2009 Very true. As evidenced by the misspelling of WESBROOK (not Westbrook) mall on all the renderings and the fact that this rendering is completely mislabeled (or mirror imaged) Broadway should be on the other side of 10th in that view. You're right about the misspelling, but the drawing is 100% correct - the streets aren't wrong....the above diagram is looking northwest, 10th Avenue is located immediately south of Broadway. The train tunnel itself is located under 10th Avenue but station entrances are located on Broadway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronthecivil Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Now that they are putting in the skytrain elevated down university it sure looks stupid now to have it planned for being underground at the translit loop don't it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverpig Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Now that they are putting in the skytrain elevated down university it sure looks stupid now to have it planned for being underground at the translit loop don't it! It is a little weird to have it elevated along university, then to have it dive down to the underground station, but it actually makes sense. The view along university is something that would be nice to have, and if you make it dive down just before East Mall, it should work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronthecivil Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 It is a little weird to have it elevated along university, then to have it dive down to the underground station, but it actually makes sense. The view along university is something that would be nice to have, and if you make it dive down just before East Mall, it should work. You can make it work but having the university station above ground would have been cheaper and more user friendly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitronuts Posted January 21, 2009 Author Share Posted January 21, 2009 Now that they are putting in the skytrain elevated down university it sure looks stupid now to have it planned for being underground at the translit loop don't it! The decision on the mode for the university stations is far from being complete: it's still up in the air on whether to have it underground or elevated or even at-grade. All are options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronthecivil Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 The decision on the mode for the university stations is far from being complete: it's still up in the air on whether to have it underground or elevated or even at-grade. All are options. I haven't been out there in a while but I thought the whole point of moving the buses around was to build something there, i.e. there is some sort of structure in way now. Once you get out of the portal at blanca you could run it at grade for a LONG way before moving it above ground to move into a station that would have a bus-loop below it and a concourse beside it where the hill is. That would work the best IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronthecivil Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 The decision on the mode for the university stations is far from being complete: it's still up in the air on whether to have it underground or elevated or even at-grade. All are options. I haven't been out there in a while but I thought the whole point of moving the buses around was to build something there, i.e. there is some sort of structure in way now. Once you get out of the portal at blanca you could run it at grade for a LONG way before moving it above ground to move into a station that would have a bus-loop below it and a concourse beside it where the hill is. That would work the best IMO. Oh, and point it south at the end if that's not the last station as thurderbird stadium would actually be a nice place to build a real stadium. Done right it could for example be a good place to put kerfoots soccer stadium, with a little fill it would still be overlooking the water. Wouldn't be too hard to negotiate a lease where the T-Birds still play there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitronuts Posted January 21, 2009 Author Share Posted January 21, 2009 Once you get out of the portal at blanca you could run it at grade for a LONG way before moving it above ground to move into a station that would have a bus-loop below it and a concourse beside it where the hill is. That would work the best IMO. You'd be surprised to know that there's a marginal cost difference between elevated and at-grade....I'd go for elevated along the boulevard for aesthetic purposes, and the golf course needs access to the other side. Oh, and point it south at the end if that's not the last station as thurderbird stadium would actually be a nice place to build a real stadium. Done right it could for example be a good place to put kerfoots soccer stadium, with a little fill it would still be overlooking the water. Wouldn't be too hard to negotiate a lease where the T-Birds still play there. Either Westbrook or the Main Mall will be the last station. It's not worth the money to have it all the way to Thunderbird Stadium just for the few events played there....a station there would also receive little ridership. Consider that the university incompetently allowed condo towers to be built too close to the stadium site, and now events there have to shut down ridiculously early. As for the Whitecaps, Kerfoot has made it quite clear that he will not settle for any location other than downtown or right next to downtown. It's either downtown or BC Place for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronthecivil Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 You'd be surprised to know that there's a marginal cost difference between elevated and at-grade....I'd go for elevated along the boulevard for aesthetic purposes, and the golf course needs access to the other side. Either Westbrook or the Main Mall will be the last station. It's not worth the money to have it all the way to Thunderbird Stadium just for the few events played there....a station there would also receive little ridership. Consider that the university incompetently allowed condo towers to be built too close to the stadium site, and now events there have to shut down ridiculously early. As for the Whitecaps, Kerfoot has made it quite clear that he will not settle for any location other than downtown or right next to downtown. It's either downtown or BC Place for him. I wouldn't be that surprised, sure, elevate it then. Still seems silly to go below grade once you get to campus then... And I wouldn't put it all the way to the stadium, just point the end of it that way so you could if things change in a generation (when the entire area is condos with 20k residents, for example.) As for the bolded part, does that mean for example no Art's County Fair this year? What the hell were they thinking when they moved there. Sometimes I really REALLY hate people in this city. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitronuts Posted January 21, 2009 Author Share Posted January 21, 2009 I wouldn't be that surprised, sure, elevate it then. Still seems silly to go below grade once you get to campus then... And I wouldn't put it all the way to the stadium, just point the end of it that way so you could if things change in a generation (when the entire area is condos with 20k residents, for example.) As for the bolded part, does that mean for example no Art's County Fair this year? What the hell were they thinking when they moved there. Sometimes I really REALLY hate people in this city. But an additional station takes the whole walkability vibe about the campus....three stations plus more than a dozen frequent bus routes for 20,000 people seems a bit excessive. As for the Arts County Fair.... .....it was actually canceled a few years ago because it was losing a lot of money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old_time_hockey Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Either Westbrook or the Main Mall will be the last station. It's not worth the money to have it all the way to Thunderbird Stadium just for the few events played there....a station there would also receive little ridership. Consider that the university incompetently allowed condo towers to be built too close to the stadium site, and now events there have to shut down ridiculously early. As for the Whitecaps, Kerfoot has made it quite clear that he will not settle for any location other than downtown or right next to downtown. It's either downtown or BC Place for him. Yeah, and the residents of that area are also complaining that students make too much noise, especially on Pit Nights when they make their drunken trek from the SUB back to their dorms. Excuse me? You chose to move onto a university campus and knew how close that res was to where you bought. Suck it up, it was your choice to live here. There is also some talk that the residents are also concerned what is coming out of fume hood smoke stacks. These University Neighbourhoods were just a poorly thought out idea that really havn't benefited the university much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buggernut Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 It's not worth the money to have it all the way to Thunderbird Stadium just for the few events played there....a station there would also receive little ridership. Consider that the university incompetently allowed condo towers to be built too close to the stadium site, and now events there have to shut down ridiculously early. I bet those geriatric NIMBY's wouldn't complain about the noise if Elvis were brought back from the dead to play there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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