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Justin Trudeau - Suffering from Foot in Mouth - Canadian Style


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#61 ConnorFutureGM

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 02:54 PM

A lot of people posting on here look at one small area of Harper or Trudeau's campaign and state that is what makes him a good leader.

The big difference is that Harper has already been Prime Minister for several years now while Trudeau has been a amateur sports adviser. He has already shown that his campaign will be run by splitting up Canada and appeasing the larger side of the split.

#62 Kryten

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 03:35 PM

Justin is right, Alberta sucks. I lived in Calgary for a decade and coming back to BC was a great feeling. Kind of like taking a hot shower after spending a day working in scum.

I was on Harper's bandwagon on many of his issues but what has me livid with him and his party is the continued muzzling of Canadian scientists, especially concerning environmental issues. Any party that feels entitled to interfere with free speech of this nature to push an archaic economic agenda is bad news. I would expect this type of censorship from American conservatives, not our own.
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#63 Electro Rock

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 03:54 PM

Beat Harper at what exactly, teaching drama class, embarrassing statements or appearing on posters on his supporters bedroom walls?
"The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name of 'liberalism' they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, until one day America will be a Socialist nation, without knowing how it happened."

Norman Thomas

#64 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 04:22 PM

I missed that election. Can you provide a link.

'Can', not 'did.'

The poll indicating the possibilty of a Trudeau-led Liberal minority gov't was published the day before the Cons' attack on Trudeau.

Scared?

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#65 Tearloch7

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 06:06 PM

Beat Harper at what exactly, teaching drama class, embarrassing statements or appearing on posters on his supporters bedroom walls?


Oooh!!, someone hates Justin? .. you could be in for a long "spite-session", laddie .. :lol:

"To Thine Own Self Be True"

 

"Always tell the Truth. That way, you don’t have to remember what you said"  ~ Mark Twain ~
 


#66 Electro Rock

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 06:30 PM

Oooh!!, someone hates Justin? .. you could be in for a long "spite-session", laddie .. :lol:


Yeah I don't like him or his party, his father was a great man though, whether it was Jagger, Richards or one of the roadies.
"The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name of 'liberalism' they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, until one day America will be a Socialist nation, without knowing how it happened."

Norman Thomas

#67 Tearloch7

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 06:41 PM

Yeah I don't like him or his party, his father was a great man though, whether it was Jagger, Richards or one of the roadies.


You are acting like a spoiled turd .. :bored:

"To Thine Own Self Be True"

 

"Always tell the Truth. That way, you don’t have to remember what you said"  ~ Mark Twain ~
 


#68 Wetcoaster

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 08:01 PM

'Can', not 'did.'

The poll indicating the possibilty of a Trudeau-led Liberal minority gov't was published the day before the Cons' attack on Trudeau.

Scared?

Nope.
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#69 Truculence

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 08:53 PM

Takes after his mom a bit too much.
Prime Minister Mulcair sounds pretty good.

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#70 n00bxQb

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 09:40 PM

I hate the Liberal party, both provincial and federal. If Trudeau becomes their leader, I'll hate them even more. The guy is one smug idiot living off his daddy's legacy.

#71 Trelane42

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 11:53 PM

Yes. Selective memory is a wonderful thing for would be governing dynasties. Trudeau broke some kinds of negative approval records in his final years but now the masses clamor for his scion to come to their rescue. Another one for the “you can make this stuff up” file.

Nonetheless, there is sure to be some entertainment value when this pretentious punk assumes the position. Since, as per Mencken, “democracy is the theory that the voting public knows what it wants and deserves to get it good and hard,” Canadians will follow through. In terms of reasons for voting, name familiarity seems close enough to running while black for the modern, discerning, democracy exercising sophisticates.

Daddy was all about bilingual babelism, immigration, sex and dope. And junior, being a bigger nitwit still, will doubtless double down on more of the same. The one world banking elite will be happy to have the likes of him at the helm as our ship enters “brave new world” phase.

Edited by debluvscanucks, 25 November 2012 - 11:54 AM.


#72 Tearloch7

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 12:02 AM

Yes. Selective memory is a wonderful thing for would be governing dynasties. Trudeau broke some kinds of negative approval records in his final years but now the masses clamor for his scion to come to their rescue. Another one for the “you can make this stuff up” file.

Nonetheless, there is sure to be some entertainment value when this pretentious punk assumes the position. Since, as per Mencken, “democracy is the theory that the voting public knows what it wants and deserves to get it good and hard,” Canadians will follow through. In terms of reasons for voting, name familiarity seems close enough to running while black for the modern, discerning, democracy exercising sophisticates.

Daddy was all about bilingual babelism, immigration, sex and dope. And junior, being a bigger nitwit still, will doubtless double down on more of the same. The one world banking elite will be happy to have the likes of him at the helm as our ship enters “brave new world” phase.


Very well written .. perhaps not well meaning, tho .. but damned well written .. history is so easily twisted to suit a current narrative .. it is why the Bible is so popular .. gone are the years of discernment, I fear .. :rolleyes:

"To Thine Own Self Be True"

 

"Always tell the Truth. That way, you don’t have to remember what you said"  ~ Mark Twain ~
 


#73 EmployeeoftheMonth

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 12:22 AM

This thread contains a lot of crazy.
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#74 DonLever

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 12:23 AM

Yes. Selective memory is a wonderful thing for would be governing dynasties. Trudeau broke some kinds of negative approval records in his final years but now the masses clamor for his scion to come to their rescue. Another one for the “you can make this stuff up” file.

Nonetheless, there is sure to be some entertainment value when this pretentious punk assumes the position. Since, as per Mencken, “democracy is the theory that the voting public knows what it wants and deserves to get it good and hard,” Canadians will follow through. In terms of reasons for voting, name familiarity seems close enough to running while black for the modern, discerning, democracy exercising sophisticates.

Daddy was all about bilingual babelism, immigration, sex and dope. And junior, being a bigger nitwit still, will doubtless double down on more of the same. The one world banking elite will be happy to have the likes of him at the helm as our ship enters “brave new world” phase.


I have a feeling you don't think much of Justin Trudeau. Isn't it a bit unfair to attack someone just because he has a famous father. He should be judged on what he says and do.

#75 inane

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 12:34 AM

This thread contains a lot of crazy.


Seriously. It was painful just reading it.

#76 Wetcoaster

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 01:32 AM

I have a feeling you don't think much of Justin Trudeau. Isn't it a bit unfair to attack someone just because he has a famous father. He should be judged on what he says and do.

Well he has said stupid things and accomplished very little - so sure I go with that approach.
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#77 DonLever

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 01:45 AM

According to a recent poll, the Liberals under Justin Trudeau would win a minority government.


http://news.national...-poll-suggests/



Female voters: 42% Lib, 26% Tory, 25% NDP

Male Voters: 35% Lib, 35% Tory, 21% NDP

18-34 age group: 27% Lib., 27% Tory, 34% NDP

And he also wins the over age 45 group decisively.

His strongest support comes from women. Why? Just because he is good lucky guy? Is that a good reason to vote for him?

Edited by DonLever, 25 November 2012 - 01:49 AM.


#78 Wetcoaster

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 01:53 AM

According to a recent poll, the Liberals under Justin Trudeau would win a minority government.


http://news.national...-poll-suggests/



Female voters: 42% Lib, 26% Tory, 25% NDP

Male Voters: 35% Lib, 35% Tory, 21% NDP

18-34 age group: 27% Lib., 27% Tory, 34% NDP

And he also wins the over age 45 group decisively.

His strongest support comes from women. Why? Just because he is good lucky guy? Is that a good reason to vote for him?

Not much basis since he has yet to be elected leader of the LPC and show he can perform as the leader. And based upon his record thus far he looks like cannon fodder. There were similar polls for Prime Minsters Dion and Iganatieff... and how did that work out?

The only poll that counts my friends is the one on election day. ~ WAC Bennett.
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#79 Common sense

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 02:48 AM

Oooh!!, someone hates Justin? .. you could be in for a long "spite-session", laddie .. :lol:


Judging by how long the last two LPC leaders lasted, I'd say only 2.5 more years to go!

#80 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 11:15 AM

Yeah but men are voting for the guy too. Maybe there's more to looks about it. (Like his surname) Or maybe people have been waiting for a legit alternative to Harper. Note that a Bob Rae-led Liberal party is off the map.i

According to a recent poll, the Liberals under Justin Trudeau would win a minority government.


http://news.national...-poll-suggests/



Female voters: 42% Lib, 26% Tory, 25% NDP

Male Voters: 35% Lib, 35% Tory, 21% NDP

18-34 age group: 27% Lib., 27% Tory, 34% NDP

And he also wins the over age 45 group decisively.

His strongest support comes from women. Why? Just because he is good lucky guy? Is that a good reason to vote for him?


comeundone.gif


#81 Wetcoaster

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 12:56 PM

Yeah but men are voting for the guy too. Maybe there's more to looks about it. (Like his surname) Or maybe people have been waiting for a legit alternative to Harper. Note that a Bob Rae-led Liberal party is off the map.i

No one is voting for anyone at this point in time.
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#82 Tearloch7

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 01:10 PM

Pierre Elliot Trudeau did more to shape Canada as it is today than any other PM in our history .. if you hate Trudeau, then you hate Canada, for Canada is a reflection of the man .. say what you will, but his repatriation of the BNA single handily did more to help Canada become the multicultural mecca that it is today than any other act .. every night, each of us should drop to our knees and thank him for the Charter of Rights and Freedoms .. Mulroney was a complete doosh bag and Harper is the "spewage" from said "doosharooney" ..

Pierre, perhaps the greatest Canadian PM in history .. he WILL be judged by history, thankfully, and not the right-wing-nut fringe that stalk the halls of CDC .. peace out, mothers .. :lol:

"To Thine Own Self Be True"

 

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#83 Wetcoaster

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 01:25 PM

Pierre Elliot Trudeau did more to shape Canada as it is today than any other PM in our history .. if you hate Trudeau, then you hate Canada, for Canada is a reflection of the man .. say what you will, but his repatriation of the BNA single handily did more to help Canada become the multicultural mecca that it is today than any other act .. every night, each of us should drop to our knees and thank him for the Charter of Rights and Freedoms .. Mulroney was a complete doosh bag and Harper is the "spewage" from said "doosharooney" ..

Pierre, perhaps the greatest Canadian PM in history .. he WILL be judged by history, thankfully, and not the right-wing-nut fringe that stalk the halls of CDC .. peace out, mothers .. :lol:

Unfortunately for the Liberals it is Justin Trudeau who is seeking to lead the party.

He is not even a pale imitation of his father who had intellect, an extensive and impressive resume before entering Parliament and before becoming leader.

In some areas Pierre Elliott Trudeau excelled as you note but in others such as the economy (NEP, wage and price controls, etc). not so much.
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#84 Bertuzzi Babe

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 01:37 PM


You need to do a little more research before taking someone to task.

.08534196637 posts/day hardly qualifies anyone for what you've suggested above.

Edited by Bertuzzi Babe, 25 November 2012 - 02:05 PM.

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#85 Wetcoaster

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 02:41 PM

And a brief recap.

In the interview on Les francs-tireurs, Trudeau said that “Canada isn’t doing well right now because it’s Albertans who control our community and socio-democratic agenda.”

He also said Canada would be better served if there were more Quebecers than Albertans in charge.

Trudeau apologized on Friday, saying his comments were meant to be directed at Prime Minister Stephen Harper, who rose to power as an MP from Calgary. He spun it claiming that his comment about the lack of Quebecers in power was an attempt to urge voters in Quebec to support a national party rather than the Bloc Quebecois. It certainly does not read that way when his words are taken in context. :sadno:

And how about the view from Quebec about Justin Trudeau's anti-Albertan remarks?

Yves Boisvert of Montreal’s La Presse said Quebecers would be outraged if another high-profile politician made similar statements about their own province.

“We can easily imagine the howls we’d make if a contender for the leadership of a federal party spoke in such generalizing terms about Quebecers,” Boisvert said in a column on the newspaper’s website.

Boisvert suggested that Trudeau supporters should “start to ask serious questions about the quality of his political judgment, and his judgment in general.”

A writer for the magazine L’Actualite, meanwhile, said the comments could hurt Trudeau for a long time to come as he tries to make inroads in Western Canada.

“In one fell swoop, this particular interview revives doubts shared by many in Western Canada about the federal Liberals,” Manon Cornellier said in a blog post.

“What should they believe? What Justin Trudeau said only two years ago or what he’s saying now, as he seeks their support in his bid for the Liberal Party of Canada.”

And Rex Murphy's take on the Trudeau "fox pass"... not only does it help the Conservatives but he has managed to give Mulcair and the NDP an advantage that they had seemingly lost.

Said the young prince in that rediscovered video clip: “Canada isn’t doing well right now because it’s Albertans who control our community and socio-democratic agenda. It doesn’t work.” Wow.

The real butter on the contentious popcorn was when he added that Canada has been “better served when there are more Quebecers in charge than Albertans.”

Let’s load up on Quebec prime ministers, in other words. Can’t be too many of them.

How such disparaging remarks will contribute to a “less divisive” Canada — one of Mr. Trudeau’s high themes as he seeks the Liberal leadership — is a puzzle for hungry Jesuits to unravel. Sounds more like a slur against a region of the country to me.

Till Mr. Trudeau’s ruminations made the front pages, I thought the McGuinty brothers, outgoing Ontario premier Dalton and his brother David, were the national leaders when it comes to side-jabs at Alberta. Just this week, David, the Liberal Ottawa-area MP, resigned his critic’s post after telling reporters that Alberta’s Conservative MPs “should go back to Alberta and run either for municipal council in a city that’s deeply affected by the oilsands business or go run for the Alberta legislature.”

All of this cuts squarely across the newly-minded accommodation with the West that Mr. Trudeau has been sounding in his speeches, and his condemnation of the NDP as a party that “plays one region of the country against another.” Thomas Mulcair has got the first and best of all the Christmas presents he will receive this year.

This places Mr. Trudeau, at an early and inauspicious time, squarely in the tradition he wanted to overwrite: that of his father’s unhappy, voteless and sometimes contemptuous dealings with Western Canada. People on the Prairies are going to hear the son’s words, but they will shiver at the father’s memory.

Mr. Mulcair, Mr. Trudeau’s real, immediate opponent, had early on upset some of the West with his remarks about Canada’s allegedly oil-engendered “Dutch Disease.” But since then, Mr. Mulcair has been in Alberta, and taken on a very congenial matter, and moderate tone, when discussing that province.

In politics, it’s good to have your head well above the high grass, but it should never, ever, be in the clouds. That’s where Justin’s was when he gave the interview that he now, no doubt, very much regrets.

http://fullcomment.n...s-new-bogeyman/

And as Andrew Coyne writes in the National Post the McGuinty and Trudeau comments are qualitatively quite different and McGuinty's are more defensible than Trudeau's even if you believe the spin that Trudeau is trying to put on his remarks talking about "context"... and BTW I personally do not find his spin holding up under even cursory scrutiny.

Justin Trudeau hurt more than saved by context of anti-Alberta comments


Two Liberal MPs, two errant statements about Albertans, two days apart. It all adds up to a mess of trouble for the Liberal Party in the province, and the region, where they must make inroads if they hope to be competitive in the long run — and where they hope to steal a by-election next Monday.


The tendency is to treat the two situations as the same: Liberal Alberta-hatred, if you’re a Conservative; Conservative gotcha politics, if you’re a Liberal. But in fact the two are quite distinct.


The statements of David McGuinty, that Tory MPs from Alberta were too narrowly devoted to the interests of the oil industry — “shilling” was the word he used — to the detriment of the national interest, more nearly fit the “gotcha” mould. It is perfectly defensible for one MP to challenge another to take a broader view of an issue than just that of his own particular region or industry. I only wish more MPs did the same.


It’s also perfectly defensible for MPs to defend their region or industry, if they think it is being treated unjustly — if it is not the broader interest to which they are being asked to yield, but some narrower agenda. As bad as the National Energy Program was for Alberta, the truer indictment of it is that it was bad for the country. It wasn’t in the national interest to deprive Alberta of the world price of oil: it was strictly in the interest of central Canadian manufacturers.


No doubt there are people today who take a similarly blinkered view of the oil industry: the “Dutch disease” theorists come to mind. There is nothing wrong in principle with asserting that a boom in the resource sector often comes at the cost of a decline in manufacturing (though it may be wrong in fact). What’s wrong is the assumption that this is necessarily to be deplored, as if the interests of manufacturing should naturally take precedence over those of resources.


But if it is wrong to equate the national interest with the interests of manufacturing, it is equally wrong to equate it with those of the oil patch. The offensiveness or otherwise of McGuinty’s remarks, therefore, depends on the context — on the specific terms of his dispute with the Alberta MPs, not the mere fact that McGuinty accused them of parochialism. If he was out of line, it should be easily demonstrated. The MPs’ practised displays of outrage reek more of opportunism than offence.


Justin Trudeau’s statements, on the other hand, are a different matter. True, it was in 2010, not this week, that he complained to an interviewer in Quebec that “it’s Albertans who control our community and social-democratic agenda — it doesn’t work,” adding that “I’m a Liberal, so of course I think” the country is better governed by Quebecers than Albertans.

But it does not alter the fact that he said these things, and presumably believed them.


To be sure, there is a context here, too: Trudeau was making these remarks by way of defending Quebec’s participation in Canada, against Quebec nationalists who insist it must withdraw into itself to defend the French language and culture. This is wholly honourable, even praiseworthy.


But context only partly saves him. If he was not deliberately exploiting divisions for partisan gain — it was Canada he was defending, not the Liberal Party — but rather was caught in an unguarded moment, it was all the more revealing for that: these were his real thoughts, not a card he was playing.


If it suggests he was not thinking of national leadership at the time (for if he had he could hardly have imagined this would not cause trouble for him elsewhere) it also suggests a sincere belief that Albertans are a wholly alien people, who cannot be permitted to “control our community” — who are, indeed, ill-equipped to govern the country. His defence, a day after the controversy broke, that he had mistaken Stephen Harper’s views for those of Albertans, does little to erase this impression.


This is not the first time, after all, that Trudeau has unburdened himself on this topic. In another infamous interview for the Quebec media, in which he intimated that if he concluded Stephen Harper’s values were those of Canada, he might one day be a separatist, too, he conveyed the same sense of Quebec’s approach to government being, if not altogether different, then superior, more progressive than those of les autres — as if Quebec’s role was to civilize the rest of Canada. “It’s not necessarily that Canadians don’t have the same values as us Quebecers,” he said then. “It’s that there’s a way of seeing social responsibility, openness toward others, a cultural pride here in Quebec that’s necessary for Canada.”


Look: there are differences in values, or at least in priorities, between different regions. Many people in Quebec would share Trudeau’s view of the province’s mission civilisatrice, as indeed do its admirers in the rest of Canada. It’s just hard to square that with a national leadership role — as a practical matter if nothing else.


Whatever the accuracy or otherwise of Trudeau’s views, people in Alberta would be entitled to conclude from them that he did not much care for their province, and to cast their votes accordingly. And people in other parts of the country would be equally entitled to wonder whether this person had the breadth of vision, or the judgement, to be a force for unity, rather than division — to govern for the whole country, rather than a part of it.


Even if you thought these things, after all, why would you say them? It is no defence, for those in positions of political leadership, that what they say is true. It was probably true, as a sociological fact, that “the ethnic vote” played a crucial role in defeating the 1995 referendum in Quebec. But sociological facts, in the mouth of a premier, take on rather a darker colouring. As always, context is everything.

http://fullcomment.n...berta-comments/

Edited by Wetcoaster, 25 November 2012 - 02:47 PM.

To err is human - but to really screw up you need a computer.

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#86 Tearloch7

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 02:54 PM

Spin is spin, Wet! .. politics is war .. war is unworthy of human endeavor .. Quebec and Alberta deserve each other .. NFL is great .. CFL not so much .. go Lions .. :rolleyes:

"To Thine Own Self Be True"

 

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#87 Wetcoaster

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 03:03 PM

Spin is spin, Wet! .. politics is war .. war is unworthy of human endeavor .. Quebec and Alberta deserve each other .. NFL is great .. CFL not so much .. go Lions .. :rolleyes:

Spin is fine but it should at least have a tenuous grasp on reality and that is missing from the Justin Trudeau spin cycle.

And given the Conservative's history of exploiting weakness and cutting off political opposition at the knees with their own words, this does not augur well for the young prince.
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#88 DonLever

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 03:21 PM

Pierre Elliot Trudeau did more to shape Canada as it is today than any other PM in our history .. if you hate Trudeau, then you hate Canada, for Canada is a reflection of the man .. say what you will, but his repatriation of the BNA single handily did more to help Canada become the multicultural mecca that it is today than any other act .. every night, each of us should drop to our knees and thank him for the Charter of Rights and Freedoms .. Mulroney was a complete doosh bag and Harper is the "spewage" from said "doosharooney" ..

Pierre, perhaps the greatest Canadian PM in history .. he WILL be judged by history, thankfully, and not the right-wing-nut fringe that stalk the halls of CDC .. peace out, mothers .. :lol:


Really? Most of the programs taken for granted like bi-lingualism, pensions, universal health care were all done before Trudeau ever took power. Tommy Douglas was known as the father of universal health care. Pearson was the one who selected the current flag. Even Diefenbaker had his Bill of Rights. Bi-Lingualism was already in the Constitutional act of 1867 where both language were to be used in Parliament and the courts.

What Trudeau did was expand the programs. He did not invent them.

Historians already say Mackenzie King was the greatest PM, not Trudeau. Yes, the best PM will not be judged by the left wing wackos in the halls of CDC.

Edited by DonLever, 25 November 2012 - 03:24 PM.


#89 Tearloch7

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 03:53 PM

What Trudeau did to stabilize and enshrine many of the social programs we take for granted is legend! .. and neither shall history not be judged by those who jump from side to side so often they have splinters in their collective nether regions .. :lol:

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#90 Tearloch7

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 03:56 PM

Spin is fine but it should at least have a tenuous grasp on reality and that is missing from the Justin Trudeau spin cycle.

And given the Conservative's history of exploiting weakness and cutting off political opposition at the knees with their own words, this does not augur well for the young prince.


Unfortunately, Justin may be just what Canadiana deserves ,, look at some of our political leaders of late and ask yourself .. could he much worse?.. Chretien and Martin balanced the budget and established banking regulations that helped allow Harper and his CRAP party to ride out the recession .. now they are hooped and need the Liberals for a few year to get us back on track .. sorta like what the Dem's do ever few years down South ... clean up the right-wing-nuts mess ..

Edited by Tearloch7, 25 November 2012 - 03:56 PM.

"To Thine Own Self Be True"

 

"Always tell the Truth. That way, you don’t have to remember what you said"  ~ Mark Twain ~
 





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