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how come the NHLPA does not adress the Ref situation?


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#1 surtur

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 07:16 PM

as the titles says why have they not tried to address the horrible inconsistencies with the refs.
imo the teams need more ability to challenge the calls made by the refs during a game.
i think the NHLPA should not allow re alinement of the teams until something is addressed with the reffing in the league.
not just the Canucks but all teams need to be able to challenge without being penalized or fined .

what would you do to correct the bad officiating in the league to make it more fair.
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#2 MikeyBoy44

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 07:55 PM

Ak47s?
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#3 SOB for MVP

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 09:04 PM

Reffing unions are tight. If there is an incident, or poor performance by officials, etc, it is discussed internally. Whether a ref is disciplined, talked to, reamed out, or any other form of scrutiny, is all done behind closed doors, and we, the fans, will never hear a word of it.

NHLPA calling out the officiating would not do any good

Edited by SOB for MVP, 24 February 2013 - 09:05 PM.

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#4 surtur

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 09:19 PM

Reffing unions are tight. If there is an incident, or poor performance by officials, etc, it is discussed internally. Whether a ref is disciplined, talked to, reamed out, or any other form of scrutiny, is all done behind closed doors, and we, the fans, will never hear a word of it.

NHLPA calling out the officiating would not do any good

not what i mean ..
what i am saying is why is there no way for a team to challenge the on ice calls ... like throw a flag and they need to review a call.
maybe get two challenges a game or something.
make any Call that is challenged video reviewable or something.

didn't mean punish the ref's for bad call just give a team a chance at challenging esp if it can cost them the game.
I think it would make them more accountable for bad calls i mean how many times would you want to make a blatant bad call get called out on it and have it over turned it would be embarrassing ... They are human and make mistakes but let them be accountable for it esp when one wrong call can be the end of a season for a team in the playoffs.

Edited by surtur, 24 February 2013 - 09:23 PM.

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#5 SOB for MVP

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 09:38 PM

not what i mean ..
what i am saying is why is there no way for a team to challenge the on ice calls ... like throw a flag and they need to review a call.
maybe get two challenges a game or something.
make any Call that is challenged video reviewable or something.

didn't mean punish the ref's for bad call just give a team a chance at challenging esp if it can cost them the game.
I think it would make them more accountable for bad calls i mean how many times would you want to make a blatant bad call get called out on it and have it over turned it would be embarrassing ... They are human and make mistakes but let them be accountable for it esp when one wrong call can be the end of a season for a team in the playoffs.


ah, yes okay.

Coaches challenges will likely be implemented next year, as per Bob McKenzie

Sorry, I thought you meant off-ice.
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#6 Raffi Torres's Smirk

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 10:19 PM

I wonder if EA can/will incorporate this into NHL 14.
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#7 Zamboni_14

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 12:15 AM

the only problem I see about challenging some of the calls is what to do after.

Off-sides; ok your team is called off-sides, so you throw the flag and it's proven to be correct. The only thing the refs can do is move the face-off into the offensive zone at that point.

icing; your team sent the puck down the ice and your player touched it first (but the ref blew it dead.) you challenge successfully, and the only thing that can be done is move the face-off into the offensive zone.

goals are already reviewed, so that's not going to change anything (unless you say that the only time they get reviewed is if the coach challenges the goal/no goal call.)

penalties will be the most difficult to challenge. If the ref calls it a trip and you throw the flag... odds are it'll still be called a trip. Same with high sticking, hooking, etc. About all you can hope for is getting the other team a penalty for diving.

I dunno.. maybe I'm off base here or I am missing something that could easily be challenged like in the NFL.
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#8 The Bookie

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 01:28 AM

Hockey is a much harder sport to implement challenges than football. In the NFL, plays basically always last a few seconds, but the in the NHL they can go on much longer obviously. There are times when half a period might go by without a whistle. So it could get messy to challenge a missed call that happened, say, 7 min. before.

Here's a scenario: a potentially missed off-side occurs, play continues, moves back down the ice, then at some point returns to that end and the team scores. Coach challenges, wins - does the goal get disallowed and all the time put back on the clock?

I seem to remember a weird play maybe 2 or 3 seasons ago. The other team scored off a bomb of a slapshot on the Canucks, but puck went straight through the net. The Canucks came back up the ice and scored, but video review showed the first goal happening, so the Canucks goal was disallowed (I think, going by memory here). Anyways, my point is weird, murky scenarios abound when considering challenges. Not saying it shouldn't happen, but the problem of implementation is a lot deeper than it seems at first.
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#9 brewdog

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 01:42 AM

I'd hate to see the game slowed down any more by increased examination of plays in the middle of a game. Bad/missed calls go both ways over the course of a season. It all evens out, within a small margin of error. Besides, I like screaming at the TV when the refs make a horrible call/non-call (in my expert armchair opinion). It gets me fired up and makes me love watching the game even more. :)
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#10 MM16

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 05:20 AM

the only problem I see about challenging some of the calls is what to do after.

Off-sides; ok your team is called off-sides, so you throw the flag and it's proven to be correct. The only thing the refs can do is move the face-off into the offensive zone at that point.

icing; your team sent the puck down the ice and your player touched it first (but the ref blew it dead.) you challenge successfully, and the only thing that can be done is move the face-off into the offensive zone.

goals are already reviewed, so that's not going to change anything (unless you say that the only time they get reviewed is if the coach challenges the goal/no goal call.)

penalties will be the most difficult to challenge. If the ref calls it a trip and you throw the flag... odds are it'll still be called a trip. Same with high sticking, hooking, etc. About all you can hope for is getting the other team a penalty for diving.

I dunno.. maybe I'm off base here or I am missing something that could easily be challenged like in the NFL.


I think high sticking could be challenged, how many times have we seen a call where the player was never even touched (*cough* Patrick Kane *cough*) or cant remember who it was but they lifted the other players stick into their own face (wish i coild remember who that was). I think the over the glass dely of game could be challenged as well

But you're right about the other points icing and offsides being challenged.

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#11 surtur

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 09:15 AM

I think icing could be one esp if the guys are tired.. Challenging and winning could save a goal because you can make a line change and get a face off in the other zone... I don't know was just wanting other opinions.. And all seem valid
Also offside if they result in a goal like we have seen before could be challenged.. Maybe make it only review able after a goal and maybe one icing can be challenged that way it could be used like a time out and if you challenge and are wrong you lose you time out..... I don't know I would like to see something.

Edited by surtur, 25 February 2013 - 11:12 AM.

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#12 poetica

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 12:18 PM

I think allowing challenges for all calls would slow the game too much, especially since a few coaches would challenge every freaking call just because they could. That being said, I do think the NHL should move towards a system similar to the NFL that gives each coach a limited number of review requests per game. I don't think there should be a penalty if the call stands, but I do think there should be a possible penalty if a team requests a review just to waste time. Obviously it would be at the discretion of the refs and almost never used, I just don't want to see a team requesting a review of an obvious call just to break up the other team's momentum.

I would also like to see all goals/non-goals be reviewable, particularly as it relates to possible goalie interference which is currently not reviewable (I assume because they think it would delay the game too frequently, but if that's the case the refs need to get better at making the right calls at least most of the time.)

I would still not allow reviews on icing or off-side calls though. That actually would slow the game unnecessarily, and really what's the point? Once the play is stopped, the damage is done. Say a few curse words and move on (and pray you don't get a Kass unsportsmanlike call from a sensitive ref.)

Edited by poetica, 25 February 2013 - 12:19 PM.

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#13 Zamboni_14

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 12:25 PM

I think high sticking could be challenged, how many times have we seen a call where the player was never even touched (*cough* Patrick Kane *cough*) or cant remember who it was but they lifted the other players stick into their own face (wish i coild remember who that was). I think the over the glass dely of game could be challenged as well

But you're right about the other points icing and offsides being challenged.


I think you are thinking of when the Wild's PMB got the high sticking call when the player lifted the stick into his own face. The sad thing about that... it was actually reviewed by Shanny, and PMB was given a suspension for it as well.

the "over the glass" is probably the best call that could be challenged (since play would stop anyways for the puck going out of play.)
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#14 Riviera82

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 12:46 PM

The only solution I can think of, and it would only reduce the officials idiocy by half, is to eliminate half of the officials from the game. 1 referee and 1 linesman.
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#15 poetica

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 01:53 PM

The only solution I can think of, and it would only reduce the officials idiocy by half, is to eliminate half of the officials from the game. 1 referee and 1 linesman.


Or it would just mean there isn't a single ref who knows what they're doing in even more games.
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#16 surtur

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 04:18 PM

I don't know maybe have Offsides reviewable if they result in a goal but only on that rush/ possession of the puck in that zone? I believe it was Nashville that had that happen and ended up losing the game by one point cant remember but if they could have video review the play that was an obvious offside that was missed it could only do more good then harm.
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#17 ba;;isticsports

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 05:03 PM

as the titles says why have they not tried to address the horrible inconsistencies with the refs.
imo the teams need more ability to challenge the calls made by the refs during a game.
i think the NHLPA should not allow re alinement of the teams until something is addressed with the reffing in the league.
not just the Canucks but all teams need to be able to challenge without being penalized or fined .
what would you do to correct the bad officiating in the league to make it more fair.

I would think it would be more an Owners fight, with the players supporting them
Unfortunately, I think they both know its better for the league in general,if games are managed to a point,so all teams appear even and no team never lappears to have a chance of winning a game



The only solution I can think of, and it would only reduce the officials idiocy by half, is to eliminate half of the officials from the game. 1 referee and 1 linesman.


I suggested removing 1 ref from the ice (free up ice space) and have a ref in the sky (box)
Now the players cant look to see if hes being watched to cheapshot someone etc
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#18 Zamboni_14

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 12:34 AM

I suggested removing 1 ref from the ice (free up ice space) and have a ref in the sky (box)
Now the players cant look to see if hes being watched to cheapshot someone etc


this idea I like! The question would then be how to make the call from the box? Do they radio down to the ref on the ice (like some coaches do to QBs in the NFL.) Do they have a light that comes on above the team getting a penalty and the ref stops play.
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#19 La Mauviette75

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 12:55 AM

I suggested removing 1 ref from the ice (free up ice space) and have a ref in the sky (box)
Now the players cant look to see if hes being watched to cheapshot someone etc


i think it may be a little far to call penalties from up there. i got to sit in the upper upper concourse at a game once, and it's really pretty far. no way you can see if someone actually high-sticked someone or if the guy just snapped his head back with no contact.

on the other hand, i would like to see the linesmen move off the ice. wrong calls most often have less of an impact, and linesmen take up too much space and screw up break outs.

only issue though, is that brawls often require 4 people getting involved in separating the teams. i feel like AHL games sometimes get out of hand because someone is getting pummeled while the other three refs have their hands tied.
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#20 bhawks21

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 01:03 AM

the only problem I see about challenging some of the calls is what to do after.

Off-sides; ok your team is called off-sides, so you throw the flag and it's proven to be correct. The only thing the refs can do is move the face-off into the offensive zone at that point.

icing; your team sent the puck down the ice and your player touched it first (but the ref blew it dead.) you challenge successfully, and the only thing that can be done is move the face-off into the offensive zone.

goals are already reviewed, so that's not going to change anything (unless you say that the only time they get reviewed is if the coach challenges the goal/no goal call.)


This^To many subjective calls in hockey. Challenges wont change much. Calls even themselves out and largely do not affect the outcome of a season. Focusing on refs instead of how your team can play better and exploit their opponent is a waste of time and just makes you look bad. Bad calls happen in all sports. The nhl refs largely do a good job for how fast the game is and more often then not get calls correct.

Edited by bhawks21, 26 February 2013 - 01:08 AM.

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#21 Gumballthechewy

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 12:56 PM

I'd hate to see the game slowed down any more by increased examination of plays in the middle of a game. Bad/missed calls go both ways over the course of a season. It all evens out, within a small margin of error. Besides, I like screaming at the TV when the refs make a horrible call/non-call (in my expert armchair opinion). It gets me fired up and makes me love watching the game even more. :)


Yeah, in a weird kinda way I like it too, but not when it's a blown call like the one on Kassian for "running" Howard, calls like that need to be able to be challenged.
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#22 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 02:00 PM

Yeah, in a weird kinda way I like it too, but not when it's a blown call like the one on Kassian for "running" Howard, calls like that need to be able to be challenged.


Interestingly enough, that was one of the plays discussed by the TSN panel, when the subject of coaches' challenges was brought up. They also mentioned the Mason Raymond disallowed goal against the Stars. (They agreed that the goal should have counted, BTW)
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#23 Kassian's Face

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 02:07 PM

Or the NHL could just fire the incompetent refs and hire new blood.
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#24 poetica

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 02:18 PM

....and train them properly.
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#25 surtur

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 05:09 PM

Or the NHL could just fire the incompetent refs and hire new blood.

Or maybe, and this one is for the foil cap wearing bunch....
maybe they need them to be so inconsistent and unpredictable so when it come time for them to manage a game like say closer to playoffs or in the playoffs they can just say that is how the refs are.. they are never perfect. see regular season exibit A.
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#26 c-a-n-u-c-k-s

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 03:52 AM

I think allowing challenges for all calls would slow the game too much, especially since a few coaches would challenge every freaking call just because they could. That being said, I do think the NHL should move towards a system similar to the NFL that gives each coach a limited number of review requests per game. I don't think there should be a penalty if the call stands, but I do think there should be a possible penalty if a team requests a review just to waste time. Obviously it would be at the discretion of the refs and almost never used, I just don't want to see a team requesting a review of an obvious call just to break up the other team's momentum.

I would also like to see all goals/non-goals be reviewable, particularly as it relates to possible goalie interference which is currently not reviewable (I assume because they think it would delay the game too frequently, but if that's the case the refs need to get better at making the right calls at least most of the time.)

I would still not allow reviews on icing or off-side calls though. That actually would slow the game unnecessarily, and really what's the point? Once the play is stopped, the damage is done. Say a few curse words and move on (and pray you don't get a Kass unsportsmanlike call from a sensitive ref.)

not even close, there would be a limited amount allowed per game. like 1 or 2 or maybe like tennis you retain your challenge if you win it.

Edited by c-a-n-u-c-k-s, 27 February 2013 - 03:52 AM.

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#27 c-a-n-u-c-k-s

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 03:55 AM

Or the NHL could just fire the incompetent refs and hire new blood.

The refs are doing it for the NHL under order. Not specific orders... but game management stuff... hence the ridiculous inconsistencies. Penalties are now given in the context of managing games for optimal (according to nhl) marketing or something. It is nothing less than a ruination of the game.
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#28 KING ALBERTS

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 06:33 PM

a challenge wouldn't do anything about missed calls... and to be honest i shudder to think of an NHL coach throwing a little red towel on the ice to get video review on a penalty call. if anything, if any sort of 'challenge' were considered, i think it should be unlimited challenges per game....

and if the call was the correct one, 2 minutes for delay of game.
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#29 Edlerberry

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Posted 28 February 2013 - 09:31 AM

Watching a slow puck go across the line and bounce out with the ref saying NO GOAL the other night... The puck was clear of obstructions, was not moving tremendously fast, and the ref was waiting behind the net with a clean view down. If that ref can't make the right call in that situation, how is he expected to make any call at a reasonable distance at game speed?
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#30 ba;;isticsports

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 11:11 PM

i think it may be a little far to call penalties from up there. i got to sit in the upper upper concourse at a game once, and it's really pretty far. no way you can see if someone actually high-sticked someone or if the guy just snapped his head back with no contact.

on the other hand, i would like to see the linesmen move off the ice. wrong calls most often have less of an impact, and linesmen take up too much space and screw up break outs.

only issue though, is that brawls often require 4 people getting involved in separating the teams. i feel like AHL games sometimes get out of hand because someone is getting pummeled while the other three refs have their hands tied.


The Broadcasters seem to catch the play and players names- put them with them ? or right under jumbotrons :)
Maybe keep the 2 refs on the ice and have linesmen at redlines (off ice), like Tennis judges as an alternate way of freeing up ice space
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