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      Forum-specific Rules   07/11/2017

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-Vintage Canuck-

[Rumour] Hurricanes open to dealing everybody but Sebastian Aho

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5 hours ago, Steven Stamkos said:

I don’t think Hanifin makes that team. 

We talking Hanifin making the 13/14 Preds? Cause Ekholm had 9 points that season. MDZ was a deadline pick up? Doesn’t have to contend with him. Klein played 47 games, had like 3 points. Pretty confident he could crack that squad.

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Posted (edited)
13 hours ago, N7Nucks said:

We talking Hanifin making the 13/14 Preds? Cause Ekholm had 9 points that season. MDZ was a deadline pick up? Doesn’t have to contend with him. Klein played 47 games, had like 3 points. Pretty confident he could crack that squad.

MDZ was traded for Klein that year and Ekholm was a returning young player. 

 

 The Canes should have let Hanifin play college one year or signed him and let him play in the AHL a season. Any Canes fan will tell you that too. There’s no doubt Hanifin is good, he can move the puck up the ice incredibly good has good vision and a good skater. Going into the draft Hanifin was supposed to be this great two way defenceman who can play great in his own zone and neutral zone. The knock on him was it was unsure how he would play offensively. I feel like if Hanifin spent one more year developing his defensive game would be much better than it is now. 

 

Seth Jones went into the draft going in as a possible #1 Overall pick that shouldn’t have slipped past #3. He could dominate all 3 zones of the ice and was a for sure lock to play in the NHL the same year. It’s not that I’m undervaluing Hanifin it’s just that’s how good Jones was at the time he was drafted. Even when Jones was traded he was trusted way more in his own zone than Hanifin. They’re not the same player. O

 

I understand Hanifin is young still young, good and a player that fits what we need. His ceiling has seemed to regressed since then and I don’t see the reason to trade our 7th overall + for a player who we could draft with a similar skill set. As of right now we’re a bottom 6 team again next year with or without Hanifin. But it’s not worth the risk and assets to get him. 

 

Think about this, in a 2013 redraft where would Jones go? Now where would Hanifin go in a redraft?

Edited by Steven Stamkos

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Just now, Steven Stamkos said:

MDZ was traded for Klein that year and Ekholm was a returning young player. 

 

 The Canes should have let Hanifin play college one year or signed him and let him play in the AHL a season. Any Canes fan will tell you that too. There’s no doubt Hanifin is good, he can move the puck up the ice incredibly good has good vision and good. Going into the draft Hanifin was supposed to be this great two way defenceman who can play great in his own zone and neutral zone. The knock on him was it was unsure how he would play offensively. I feel like if Hanifin spent one more year developing his defensive game would be much better than it is now. 

 

Seth Jones went into the draft going in as a possible #1 Overall pick that shouldn’t have slipped past #3. He could dominate all 3 zones of the ice and was a for sure lock to play in the NHL the same year. It’s not that I’m undervaluing Hanifin it’s just that’s how good Jones was at the time he was drafted. Even when Jones was traded he was trusted way more in his own zone than Hanifin. They’re not the same player. O

 

I understand Hanifin is young still young, good and a player that fits what we need. His ceiling has seemed to regressed since then and I don’t see the reason to trade our 7th overall + for a player who we could draft with a similar skill set. As of right now we’re a bottom 6 team again next year with or without Hanifin. But it’s not worth the risk and assets to get him. 

 

Think about this, in a 2013 redraft where would Jones go? Now where would Hanifin go in a redraft?

To be fair you are comparing current Jones to current Hanifin. I mean, for all we know in 2 years Hanifin is a 50+ point guy himself just like Jones. That's what I am trying to get across, 21 year old Jones compared to 21 year old Hanifin. Jones is 2 years older. Of course he is better right now. Slightly better at 21 as well, but not enough that Hanifin's value should be noticeably different than Jones. Jones at 21 wasn't leagues ahead of where Hanifin is now at 21.

 

I'd argue that the 2015 draft as being deeper than the 2013 draft, as far as the first round goes. In my opinion anyway. 2015 draft has McEichel, Werenski, Provorov, Rantanen, Marner, Barzal, Boeser as a few early contenders for stardom. 2013 has MacKinnon, Seth Jones, Monahan, Barkov and Bo Horvat as their top guys from the first round. They are more developed than the 2015 draft class too so it's hard to compare right now and that's impressive in of itself for the strength of the 2015 draft to be pretty close to 2013 with less development under their belts.

 

And again, I am absolutely not on the acquire Hanifin train. I am just saying they'll likely want a similar return as Jones. Not saying he is on Jones level or that he'll become Jones or anything. But that'll roughly be the asking price. A Hanifin trade involving us will not be secondary pieces. It'll involve one of Demko, Pettersson, Bo, Boeser as the primary pieces going back. Even the biggest haters of Hanifin on their board realize he still has massive potential, one even mentioned giving up on a 21 year old top 5 drafted D-man that later became a HOF d-man. Potential is everything, he can play in the NHL at 21 and has massive potential. Those guys don't go for 3rd liners and backup goalies.

 

Long story short, I have a hard time believing the price for a Hanifin is a 25 year old 3rd liner, a 28 year old backup and a 10ish overall pick. I fully reserve the right to be wrong though. Maybe he gets traded and it's for exactly that kind of package. That'll likely be a very happy fanbase getting someone with that much potential and all it cost them was a guy 3 years behind in development and 2 guys that can be easily replaced in free agency.

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Posted (edited)
20 hours ago, N7Nucks said:

To be fair you are comparing current Jones to current Hanifin. I mean, for all we know in 2 years Hanifin is a 50+ point guy himself just like Jones. That's what I am trying to get across, 21 year old Jones compared to 21 year old Hanifin. Jones is 2 years older. Of course he is better right now. Slightly better at 21 as well, but not enough that Hanifin's value should be noticeably different than Jones. Jones at 21 wasn't leagues ahead of where Hanifin is now at 21.

 

I'd argue that the 2015 draft as being deeper than the 2013 draft, as far as the first round goes. In my opinion anyway. 2015 draft has McEichel, Werenski, Provorov, Rantanen, Marner, Barzal, Boeser as a few early contenders for stardom. 2013 has MacKinnon, Seth Jones, Monahan, Barkov and Bo Horvat as their top guys from the first round. They are more developed than the 2015 draft class too so it's hard to compare right now and that's impressive in of itself for the strength of the 2015 draft to be pretty close to 2013 with less development under their belts.

 

And again, I am absolutely not on the acquire Hanifin train. I am just saying they'll likely want a similar return as Jones. Not saying he is on Jones level or that he'll become Jones or anything. But that'll roughly be the asking price. A Hanifin trade involving us will not be secondary pieces. It'll involve one of Demko, Pettersson, Bo, Boeser as the primary pieces going back. Even the biggest haters of Hanifin on their board realize he still has massive potential, one even mentioned giving up on a 21 year old top 5 drafted D-man that later became a HOF d-man. Potential is everything, he can play in the NHL at 21 and has massive potential. Those guys don't go for 3rd liners and backup goalies.

 

Long story short, I have a hard time believing the price for a Hanifin is a 25 year old 3rd liner, a 28 year old backup and a 10ish overall pick. I fully reserve the right to be wrong though. Maybe he gets traded and it's for exactly that kind of package. That'll likely be a very happy fanbase getting someone with that much potential and all it cost them was a guy 3 years behind in development and 2 guys that can be easily replaced in free agency.

You’re right forsure on them wanting to do a similar swap, they desperately need a forward. I just feel like Nashville’s Defence was so good by the time he got traded that Jones wasn’t getting the ice time he deserved and his numbers reflected on it. He stepped into Columbus and doubled his point production in the same amount of games. Also I don’t think Hanifin gets a 23 year old big two way center coming off a 71 point season and also had 26 points in 38 games the year he was traded. 

 

Edit: I’m not going to argue about the drafts.. Probably the two best draft classes after 2003 in the last 20 years. 2008 was good too.

 

Edited by Steven Stamkos

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