inane

So you want more roads and more transit. How do you pay for that? And do you really think providing more roads will make roads faster in the LONG TERM?

I don't get you...do you disagree that we need more transit? Do you not think there's a problem with driving? Are you content with the current system?

What?

I don't know the numbers collected through taxes and the amount of that that is put back into transportation infrastructure. Neither of us do so there's no point arguing about that. I do think you're underestimating those costs however and I didn't even list them all. 20 years ago no one was talking about the health impacts of driving other than direct pollution costs. Now there's obesity and a myriad of other health issues, who knows what else we're not even thinking about adding to that cost. And I never said some of those things wouldn't apply to transit, but as you point out, it would be less.

Again, do you refute any of the points I made other than noise pollution? If you disagree with me and think none of those things I listed cost anything say it.

Why should health care be taken out? Suspect all you want, but we don't know.

http://www.commutesolutions.org/TCODBro.pdf as a follow up to the true cost calculator

You still haven't answered my question. Do you think anything on my list is free? I can make up figures, would that make you answer the question? edit: here. http://www.commutesolutions.org/calc.htm Now I didn't make that, so don't go yelling at me about the numbers. It's based in California, so that makes a difference as well.

carpool?

I'm sorry, I don't have all those exact figures in front of me. I know in your mind that makes my entire argument baseless, so be it. Even nitro agrees with me on this one though

I'm suggesting policies to get more people into alternative modes of transportation thus freeing up space of the road for people that NEED to drive. It's not some devious/socialist plan, it's pretty straight forward stuff.

Source? Which items on my list do you think I'm making up? Which items on my list are free or are not worsened by automobiles? This is the thing with you engineers. If you can't assign a direct monetary value to it (health costs, time costs, noise pollution costs, etc...) it doesn't count. Too bad the real world doesn't work like that.

Well when we becomes a grown up city and have fare gates, then it won't be a problem.

i'm not anti-car. i appreciate that there needs to be cars on the road. i'm anti this notion that driving is a right. i'm anti people who CHOOSE to drive when they have alternatives (especially those that choose to drive and then complain about congestion...) but I do appreciate that currently, transit is not up to snuff, so people drive. this is why collecting more money from those who do drive and investing in transit is a good idea.

I think their goal is to get more money AND get people onto transit. The transit they will build with that money they collect. Pretty straight forward stuff... my load?

It's been free in that the cost you pay to drive your car comes in no way close to the actual cost to everyone of driving that car. It's been a free ride in that you don't take into consideration: air pollution noise pollution water pollution inefficient land use parking costs accidents road maintenance waste disposal time wasted in traffic health impacts social costs all the costs associated with acquiring, processing, refining, transporting and delivering gas/oil etc etc etc

makes sense.

Beaten this horse enough yet?

Look at all that cheap bathroom tile everywhere. Boooooooooorrrrrrrrriiiiiiiiinnnnnnnnnngggggggg.

What is with those cheap, expo 86 style seats? They look so brutal!

http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/ind...ail_from_g.html High-speed hydrogen rail?

They should run light rail or some form call it what you will up the arbutus corridor from the 'demonstration' line from science world to granville island. some of the politicians like that idea, it should run from stanley park, through gastown/science world/granville island up to kerrisdale. newton is getting bus only lanes from city center in a few years with the capacity to expand to light rail.

None of you actually think I was serious about Stanley Park do you?

How about Stanley Park? There are some in NYC who think Central Park would make a great airport. http://manhattanairport.org/

It made perfect sense back in the day when yvr employees needed a place to live and the airport was still relatively small. You know what's a stupid place to build a town? Richmond. Contrary to the LRSP, they've developed and densified the whole area--one significant shaker and they sink. Money talks! Logic walks.