*Buzzsaw*
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Posts posted by *Buzzsaw*
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4 minutes ago, Outsiders said:
If Horvat doesn't get over 8-8.5 he's looking for he's walking to UFA status
Maybe... but lets see what Lou pays... and remember... Bo would have signed for less here... he didn't want to move, didn't want to give up his Captaincy... said he thought he'd be a Canuck for his entire career.
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6 minutes ago, jyu said:
This thread is fun.
on one hand, we have people unhappy that we traded Bo even though it was 100% certain that he was walking to UFA.
and on the other hand, we have people who were dreaming for a home run return that are disappointed about top-12 protection of all things and 1.25 mil of retained cap.
then we have realists who accept the trade for what it is but are angry that others are angry about the trade.
nice sunny day here at CDC for sure.
Bo was 100% walking to UFA because Management scr*wed the pooch by mismanaging the CAP.
This didn't have to happen.
Sound fiscal management and we keep Bo and still can sign Kuz and later Pettersson.
Management had to bite the bullet and get rid of Boeser instead of signing him... even if they got nothing.
And they needed to avoid being greedy and avoid signing Mikheyev. Would have been better for the team to pick up a decent D for less $ instead.
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6 minutes ago, KyGuy123 said:
Am we wanted to change the culture of the team. They obviously know what is going on behind closed doors and if Horvat wanted to be greedy we did that. We are in a rebuild and signing him for $8.5x8 wasn’t in the cards. We got a haul of rebuilding pieces that will help us win when we are ready
Where do you get 8.5 X 8?
Where was that figure mentioned by Rutherford?
Lets see what Lamorello pays.
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11 minutes ago, Kenny Blankenship said:
You’re living in fantasy land if you think Horvat is a consistent 50 goal scorer within that Isles lineup hahaha
Bo has 30 games to score 15-19 goals... at his current pace, his chances are good.
Barzal has been desperate for a PP linemate who can put goals in the net... the potential for them to partner is very good.
NYI is in the bottom 1/3 of the league in goals scored.
They are 2nd worst in the league in PP percentage.
Lamorello identified this as a key deficiency, he went out and got a goal scorer.
NYI will definitely see a bigger output in goals scored with Horvat on the team and the PP
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1 minute ago, KyGuy123 said:
We just traded Horvat so we could sign Pettersson.
No, you are unclear on the concept.
We traded Horvat BECAUSE we signed Boeser and Mikheyev.
We could have afforded both Pettersson and Horvat if we avoided signing the two above.
Pettersson signing is good till Spring 2024... plenty of time to adjust the roster.
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The only thing that can save this trade is if somehow the pick is lottery eligible and it moves up.
I.e. management is saved by pure dumb luck.
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Here's my prediction for the results of this trade:
- Bo Horvat will sign an extension with NYI for a reasonable price... Canucks fans will be surprised how cheap.
- Bo will score close to or more than 50 goals in total for the season after being placed on the NYI #1 PP unit... he will do the same the next 2 years.
- NYI will make the playoffs... and the Canucks will have a pick not eligible for the lottery and one which will not give them much of a return.
- Anthony Beauvillier will play on the 3rd line in Vancouver... will continue as a serviceable but uninspiring forward.
- Aatu Raty will play in the AHL for the next few years... will end up as a 3rd line center for the Canucks for a few years.
Trade will go down in Canuck's history as the second worst after the Cam Neely fiasco.
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Pettersson.
But I doubt they name a Captain this year... because Rutherford will be trading half the team.
Pettersson, Miller and OEL will be Alternates.
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Not at this point.
From his dealings with Boudreau seems to be dishonest and two-faced.
Who knows what he manages to do with the team's roster... so far not impressed with Horvat trade... although jury's out until the pick is done and till Raty has a chance to show his stuff.
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Have to agree with this report.
Bunch of arrogant know it alls come in from the East and first thing start issuing opinions about who should be coach, meanwhile going behind existing coach's back.
Then they fail to provide the changes to the roster the coach needed to improve performance... in the form of defensive upgrades.
Then they blame him for failures and negotiate the signing of a new coach in plain sight... while the existing coach is still on the bench.
Completely toxic... very few decent coaches in the NHL would want to come into this environment.
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3 minutes ago, CanuckRookieFan said:
Horvat is a 60 point player, perpetually at that. Keep in mind that Bo will hover around 30 goal/30 assist mark forever that is his true value.
AB at 25 is a few years younger and at a 50% cheaper cap rate for about 50% less points. The key here is while the points production is 50% less, so is the cap so its fair.
Think about it, you have to be a smart fan with a keen analytical mind set to understand how valuable this trade truly is.Funny that you say that... and all the experts say 'Best Player wins Trade'...
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1 minute ago, lmm said:
what,
you don't think we trade that 13-18 for a 6-7 defenseman with potential to play top 2 in Van?
Canucks don't need a 6-7 D... we have 5-6-7 D's coming out our ears.
OEL can play as a 5-6-7, Myers can play as a 5-6-7, Bear can play as a 5-6-7. If Schenn is still here, he can play 5-6-7.
Canucks need #2, #3, #4 D's to complement Hughes at #1.... preferably with size and mobility.
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1 minute ago, N7Nucks said:
I know reading is tough for you, but I never called you a crybaby. I called your post a "crybaby post." Maybe ask an adult to read it to you next time.
Its clear you don't understand english or grammar bozo.... or the use of the possessive... even if you are not smart enough to use an ' ...now you call me a child... ho hum... just an example of your ignorance.
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Just now, DeNiro said:
So we didn’t even gain cap space.
This is why I was worried about him doing a deal with Lou. Guess JR didn’t teach him that well…
Yep, that means we are paying the same for Beauvillier in CAP as for Horvat.
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10 minutes ago, N7Nucks said:
Dang, this spaz just called me a bozo.
After you called me a crybaby... Bozo
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6 minutes ago, MaxVerstappen33 said:
Feel bad. But he could have stayed for less money
Where do you get the idea Bo was somehow asking for too much?
There has been zero information regarding the offers to Bo.
Bo has been underpaid in every year he has been a Canuck... they were getting excellent value at $5.2 million.
And to suggest somehow he was asking for more than Miller... I don't buy it.
Let's wait and see what he actually signs for on the Island or in free agency.
If he get put on the first unit PP with Barzal and starts filling the net... (which would not be a surprise) he might get a big pay package... but if not, he will probably get less than Miller. And he would have been asking for less than that.. less than market in Vancouver... he didn't want to move... he is the team's captain, he has a young family, Vancouver has been his home.
I think management low balled him in the summer... and Bo said... no thanks, I will put in my best effort this season and come back at the end of the year.... he did and now management has egg all over their faces because he has delivered on his performance.
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22 minutes ago, N7Nucks said:
Because management prioritized Miller over Bo. Management never seemed to like Horvat. Signing Mikheyev is why we're losing Boeser, but it's not why we are losing Horvat. Management was never high on Horvat. Also, I imagine the Kuzmenko re-sign also killed any chances at Horvat. No mention of him in your crybaby post.
Remind me where Barzal was drafted again? Middle of the 1st, huh. We can play this what-if game both ways. It could be as you say, it could also be a 1st line, top 2 D talent. The fact is we weren't keeping Bo, we got some futures. It's better than nothing. And isn't as bad as people claim.
Hey Bozo, Kuzmenko could have been signed, WITH Bo if they didn't acquire Mikheyev...
They signed Kuz on the expectation he would perform as he has done... i.e. top six 20+ goals... Any moron can tell you that means if you want to re-sign him you gotta pay $5 million. Why didn't they make allowance in their CAP planning for Kuz to live up to their expectations??? Meanwhile they had already put down nearly $5 million for Mikheyev on an extended contract... no backing out of that. And they had extended Boeser at a high price... when all his indications were he was trending down in performance.
So where's the room for Bo when he performs as almost every UFA does... and has his best season?
It was a simple case of greed on the part of management... they wanted the whole cake to themselves in thinking they could keep Horvat for peanuts, while signing Boeser, Mikheyev and Kuzmenko... but their little recipe went sour... and instead they lost Horvat when their CAP profile ballooned.
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If the Canucks had received Samual Bolduc instead of Raty I might have been a little more receptive to this deal.
A big 6'4" D who is ranked high in the AHL for D scoring, etc. etc.
This team's major problem remains on the blue line and until management addresses that issue, the team will not fundamentally improve.
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1 minute ago, N7Nucks said:
5-10 months from now it'll look good. It looked good 5-10 seconds after I read it. We weren't keeping Bo, he was a UFA at season's end. We got futures, and a guy that can be off the books after next season. A mid 1st round pick (with the potential to be a lottery pick next year) and Raty for our 9th overall pick 10 years ago is a good return imo.
Why weren't we keeping Bo?????
Because they signed Boeser and Mikheyev.... when they should have known Bo would have a good season before UFA and should have allowed CAP space to re-sign him.
A simple case of poor CAP management.
Raty is a 2nd rounder who has not shown much in the AHL. Beauvillier is a serviceable bottom sixer who is being paid too much. The pick is a mid pack... won't get us any guarateed roster player... most likely we'll see a bottom six forward or third pairing D in 2-3 years.
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8 minutes ago, coryberg said:
Mikheyev was an excellent signing.
Not when you lose Horvat.
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Just now, Iron Man said:
Honestly, I don't get how we get fleeced so often in trades whereas other teams apparently strike gold effortlessly with players who aren't worth half their salt. Nils Lundkvist getting a 1st rounder all by himself? And here we have an over PPG player in his prime on pace for 50 goals who can't even get a non-protected first rounder? That just reeks of a steaming pile of rancid horse sh**. And we didn't even address our biggest need, defence, with our biggest chip. Now I'm not entirely sure what the 2024 draft holds so maybe management is using their foresight (for once).
Its because this management backed themselves into a corner.
They put themselves in a position whereby they HAD to move someone... and every GM in the league knew they were vulnerable.
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I'm gonna say this again.
Management owns this deal.
They made bad decisions in signing Boeser and Mikheyev... which left them with no room for Bo.
Poor CAP management.
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11 minutes ago, DeNiro said:
A D-man?
An actual blue chip prospect and not just the Isles best prospect?
I also would have liked to see us build around another young Canadian kid. No offense to Finnish players but I feel like most of them don’t care about winning a cup.
Exactly.
The team needs young high quality D men... or at minimum a high quality D prospect.
Beauvillier is a small bottom 6 forward. Raty is a potential 2nd line center... but potential is a long way from proven.
The draft pick will not give the Canucks anyone elite... will not do anything for the team unless it and the Canuck's other pick can be traded for a move up.
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Where is the Defense upgrade the team needs?????
Cr*p deal.
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[Trade] Canucks trade Bo Horvat to Islanders for Anthony Beauvillier, Aatu Raty, 2023 1st-round draft pick
in Trades, Rumours, Signings
Posted
Doesn't change the fact Management owns this... they f*cked up their CAP.