Gollumpus Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 Dave Nonis was fired because of the 2007-08 collapse, which WOULD NOT HAVE HAPPENED if he had acquired Brad Richards, which he could have, at a cost of Kesler + Edler + Schneider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NucksBruins Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 Was there anything else coming back to Vancouver in this deal, other than Richards? Holy overpayment. regards, G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollumpus Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 He has done it once, but he has played TWO seasons. TWO. It's rare that a guy will score 34 in his rookie season, and just wilt into a fringe NHLer. It's pretty difficult to fake your way to 34 goals in the NHL. And BTW, if 174 games is too small a sample size to evaluate someone's talent, you must be VERY concerned about the 6 year, $4.6M per contract that we have to Jason Garrison, because he's 3 years older than Grabner, and has played 190 games. How do you feel about that deal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollumpus Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Um, yeah, except that to get out of it he had to take David Booth's terrible contract on. But seriously, Marco Sturm. What the hell was the logic? Maybe the most senseless Canuck FA signing in history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollumpus Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 I have been thinking over the whole protective goon thing and, unless that goon is on the ice to prevent the hit, Keith still makes that hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of the ES Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Marc Savard didn't get run? Nathan Horton got put out of the Final and the Bruins answered by winning the series. When has a star player been injured as an answer for another star player being injured? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of the ES Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Not much sense having a policeman taking up bench space and playing only 5 minutes a game on the off chance that someone goons your star players. And what does the team do when that does happen? Do you try and organize it so that the policeman is out there more often, thereby affecting your team's offensive and defensive play? Or do you just have your policeman goon the first guy on the other team he can lay his hands on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollumpus Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Yes he does. Because the other teams knows that if someone is to cheap shot a guy on their team, they're going to get their asses kicked. Maybe not them, but someone. A star player. An eye for an eye. Frankly, nobody on our team has the balls, at this point. But do you think Gino would've let a team get away with someone doing that to Pavel? Not bloody likely. That's why it's teams like us that get cheap-shotted, and not the Boston's, or the Anaheim's, the Calgary's, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of the ES Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 The first thing would be that our team gets extra penalty time because refs like to do that kind of thing to keep games under control. If it's a tight game, the Canucks have probably just lost it, assuming they still had any chance left after the cheap shot to our player. The second thing that happens is that, after the game our goon is suspended for several games by the NHL, leaving the team vulnerable to additional cheapshots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollumpus Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Just him being there makes a difference. I'll again point to Gino/Pavel as proof. In addition, when was the WCE at their best? Right, we had this guy named Donald Brashear on the team. Having a guy like this makes the small, skilled guys better. They play with more confidence, because there's a DETERRENT. Brashear would've smashed someone's face in if they did that to Naslund - the opponents knew this, which is why they didn't do it. Ever. Simple, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollumpus Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Who cares about extra penalty time? It's a regular season game. Who cares if we lose? We don't need another President's Trophy, that's for sure. And what we really don't need is other team's taking liberties with our star players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuck nit Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Hmm, back in the day the the WCE also had a guy named Bertuzzi on the line. He is kind of bigger than Burrows, who the Sedins have to work with in that capacity. Whether Brashear was on the team or not, there was a big body on the WCE line who could do the policeman work. Having Brashear helped, sure, but Bertuzzi was by far more of a deterrent, because he was out there, sorry, BECAUSE HE WAS OUT THERE. Odjick played a number of shifts with Bure, and that helped Bure's game a lot. Pavel still got his knees taken out. The biggest thing that has to change here is in how the team reacts, which is a philosophy which the coaching staff sets. If the coach has a "turn the other cheek, and we'll score on the power play, and if you don't I'll sit you down" philosophy, as has been apparent these last couple of years, then having a goon means nothing. So I'm wondering, do you want to go back to the old Flyers "Broadstreet Bullies" days? As I've mentioned, I like the idea of an improved team toughness, with more size. Which leads me to.... Kassian is the obvious answer. You may, or may not like his potential, but I'm in favour of it and I like it as part of the direction the team is taking in this area. He has skill, size and he can skate. The only thing he really needs is experience. Booth was a good size addition, and he's a fairly physical player. Kesler is still a pretty phyical guy. Guys like Volpatti can do policeman work. It's that the team is getting bigger than they have been over the last couple of years, and they are still pretty good for team talent. regards, G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuck nit Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Deterrance is workable only if it is on the ice at the same time as the other guy's goon. There has to be a change in how the team is permitted to react by the coaching staff. I don't like the idea of the one note, goon. I would like to see an improvement over a large part of the team, where they get bigger, tougher, more physical, and able to stand up for themselves if needed. As I've mentioned earlier, Kassian is a move in that direction. Size, strength, skating ability, offensive upside, and he can defend himself and his team mates. There's a number of guys now on the team who have pretty size. They aren't fighters/goons, but they have the ability to stand up for themselves. The team has also drafted bigger this past year, which I see as an improvement. It could still get better, but I don't see it as being as bad as some make it out to be. regards, G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollumpus Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Yes,now that Daniel has suffered a head injury and concussion who do the Sedins have opening up ice for them? Nobody.The same old story that has been going on for four years now. If Daniel is taken out with another severe concussion and he decides to retire that 'beat them on the PP' philosophy is a dream of a GM that did not take care of his superstar,even after having four years to address it. Gump.Burrows is not instilling fear into anybody.Sorry,you fail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollumpus Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 The coach puts out the players that the GM has given him. It is not about 'goon deterrence',Gump.It is not about Harvard educated guys with God as their saviour. It is about guys with character,finding those guys with character and weeding out the guys that won't back up your mates. Kassian denotes a move in the right direction,four years too late and two years shy of doing anything to help the Sedins or Kes now. THere has been nothing done to protect the Sedins or Kes and his wingers.Nothing in four ,long years-and counting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuck nit Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Too little too late,chum. Window is closing shut now. Management has had four and now five off seasons to fortify lines one and two-you know,the lines out there for most of the games that have the star players that score? Where are the additions to lines one and two that make them tougher,Gump? Don't give me the Booth answer again,please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tortorella's Rant Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 He has done it once, but he has played TWO seasons. TWO. It's rare that a guy will score 34 in his rookie season, and just wilt into a fringe NHLer. It's pretty difficult to fake your way to 34 goals in the NHL. And BTW, if 174 games is too small a sample size to evaluate someone's talent, you must be VERY concerned about the 6 year, $4.6M per contract that we have to Jason Garrison, because he's 3 years older than Grabner, and has played 190 games. How do you feel about that deal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of the ES Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 And if it was in a playoff game? Game one, their goon takes liberties with one of your star players, not enough to warrant more than a minor. Your goon is not on the ice, just as Brashear wasn't normally on the ice with the top-6. What do you have your goon do? Do you have your goon start a fight on the next play? Do you have him goon one of their star players? Do you care more about the penalty time in this circumstance? And what if your guy gets tossed, in the first period? Deterrance is workable only if it is on the ice at the same time as the other guy's goon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiredatwork Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 However, chum, what you said about Burrows was my point. One of the reasons the WCE worked as well as it did was because of Bertuzzi being on the ice with Naslund and Morrison. Brashear was only a deterrence if the other team put out their goon. One of the reasons the Sedin line has problems is because the role of Bertuzzi is filled by Burrows, as indicated in the above quote.. This is not a knock on Burrows, it's merely a fact that he isn't a 6' 3", 230 lb player. I'm saying that the "we'll beat them with the power play" worked in the regular season, but it failed in the playoffs. I was making the point that Burrows is not the physical presence of Bertuzzi. regards, G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanucksCouchCoach Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Nope. No reason to feel sorry for him. He's doing a good job. Can't say that I really miss Pyatt, Glass, Wellwood, Torres, CoHo(who only had 30 good games in Van), Rome, Salo(seeing him on IR really helped the team), and the many more plug players he's let go. Ehroff now we miss him but the price was to high. As for the 4+ mil to contracts to ex-Florida players Ballard, Booth, Garrison I can live with them. 2 out of 3 ain't bad who knows. Ballard could stay out of Coach V's dog house without Rome around. Loungo. He's a bargin at a 5.something cap hit and needs a return on his investment. GOOD patience. He could still be in Van when Burke gets fired from Leafs. Only thing left to do is drink a Granville Island Lager and wait for Doan to sign. Peace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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