The Official Transit Thread

[inane]

I would have had a higher mix but really all the board has to do is determine if it makes business sense and would be acceptable to the community. It's not like they don't have a bunch of planners and engineers working below them to give them ideas and formulate the plans. Just like any city goverment.

Really, how is that differenct from the mayor and councils of pretty much any city in the lower mainland? I would be shocked and amazed to see someone who has proffesional planning or engineering on council, but I regulary see them putting their two cent in on how planning and engineering projects for their city and the region as a whole should be done. A good example would be burnaby, they sure like to talk like their experts in the subject.....

As another example of the control of beaurocrats, lets use the city of Vancouver. Now, it's pretty much an official policy now for a good twenty years that no project that improves single occupancy vehicle capacity should be initiated (decrease is fine though). Are you telling me that over a twenty year span, including mayors like Gordon Cambell who is willing to spend billions on a major highway upgrade, nobody has said something to staff about all the traffic jams? I sure know a lot of people that have!

The only real difference is that the ideas for regional plans go through a board that determines the tax policy ideas to impletement the idea fully before presenting the idea to the council of mayors, who will still have oversight. Worst case I suppose is they could be overriden by the provincial goverment, which last I checked is just as elected as they are.

Two points.

First, mayors and councils are still accountable to the public. This board is not. That's a big difference.

Second, if what you're saying is correct--that the board, like mayors and councils, just basically does whatever bureaucrats come up with--why bother having this expensive board?

[ronthecivil]

Two points.

First, mayors and councils are still accountable to the public. This board is not. That's a big difference.

Second, if what you're saying is correct--that the board, like mayors and councils, just basically does whatever bureaucrats come up with--why bother having this expensive board?

Well, the board has to listen to the council of mayors and ultimately the province. For example, they can't arbitrarily raise taxes or undertake a major project without said approval. We will find out one way or the other how that works as they have been grumbling about needing more money, and the acid test to see which one of is right will be coming shortly, so let's just agree to disagree on this and see what happens.

The board will determine if the business case for a project is supportable, and most importantly, something that is out of the realm of engineers and planners (though they might provide input as to the transit implication of these policies), determine how these projects and the entire system will be funded. Basically I would see them as akin to the beaurocrats that come up with provincial or municipal goverments. Once the whole package of what is planned and how to pay for it is determined, it then moves on to the council or mayors to yea or nea it, or provide feedback. For example, they could say the tax package will be unacceptable to voters, scale it down. If the mayor of burnaby wins everyone to his side and gets everyone to vote no on no matter what they propose, with input like disolve the board and put us in charge, then the province will yea or nea it after ninety days of stonewalling, should that occur. But the provincial goverment is still an elected body, and they will bare the political brunt of what they decide (which in this case would include excluding the mayors wishes, but I don't think my doomsday scenario is all that likely.) I could see a scenario where they do like the projects but don't like the taxes and say something like don't ask us for money, ask the province, were tapped, where they could get a win win scenario politically where they get their cake but the province has to take the political brunt to do so. As I pointed out in the first paragraph, I will happily bet you a case of beer that you will see a ton of political oversight, and some or many politicians being held responsible one way or the other with what happens.

[kurtzfan]

[Common sense]

How misleading.

I thought she would actually address transit issues pertaining to Metro Vancouver, and how she would re-vamp Translink.

Instead, she goes off into her anti-Campbell drivel, while IGNORING ANY mention of transit, save 25 seconds of generic NDP talk (more buses now).

She's right on one thing, though: 8 years is enough. Time for a better NDP leader to step up.

[MikeGillis58]

How misleading.

I thought she would actually address transit issues pertaining to Metro Vancouver, and how she would re-vamp Translink.

Instead, she goes off into her anti-Campbell drivel, while IGNORING ANY mention of transit, save 25 seconds of generic NDP talk (more buses now).

She's right on one thing, though: 8 years is enough. Time for a better NDP leader to step up.

Although I'm not supportive of Gordon Campbell, I don't want Carole James to become premier. She's annoying and would make an incompetent leader. Both the Liberals and NDP should have new faces.

[MikeGillis58]

A major treat today:

Renovated New Westminster SkyTrain Station Renovation rendering - platform level, showing integration with the adjacent Plaza 88 development/new shopping centre.

Hey nitronuts. Since the Plaza 88 is located few meters west of the current New Westminster Station, are they going to build a new New Westminster Station at Plaza 88 and bulldoze the old Station?

[nitronuts]

^ no, the existing station is being renovated.

[BuckyHermit]

Although I'm not supportive of Gordon Campbell, I don't want Carole James to become premier. She's annoying and would make an incompetent leader. Both the Liberals and NDP should have new faces.

Then let's cut off their faces and put in new ones. They can do it in Face-Off, so it might be a good idea.

But in all seriousness, the only attractive thing James has said so far is getting rid of the carbon tax. But that's about it. Too much anti-Liberal rhetoric at this point... It's like in South Park -- voting either for a turd sandwich or a giant douche.

[BradMayFan]

Whats the status on the third SeaBus? Still planned to launch by the end of this year?

[nitronuts]

^ this summer i believe. And from summer to December, the two older vessels will go out of service one at a time to be retrofitted. And in time for 2010 Games, all three boats will be in service for 10-minute frequencies.

[Armada]

^ no, the existing station is being renovated.

Does this mean it will be closed down temporarily?

[Galvatron]

The UBC extension of the skytrain will never happen

Not enough density to warrant it. The ridership numbers would be pitifully low. And no one living in the area wants it.

If you support this thing you're officially an eco-nazi

[Buggernut]

The UBC extension of the skytrain will never happen

Not enough density to warrant it. The ridership numbers would be pitifully low. And no one living in the area wants it.

Are you f'ing kidding me???

You know how much traffic goes along Broadway and to/from UBC? Ever been on a 99 B-Line during rush hour?

[Common sense]

The UBC extension of the skytrain will never happen

Not enough density to warrant it. The ridership numbers would be pitifully low. And no one living in the area wants it.

If you support this thing you're officially an eco-nazi

In that case, then every UBC student who takes the 99 into UBC, business owners along Broadway, and all other commuters who rely on the 99 can be called eco-nazis.

And really...what in the blue hell are you smoking? Enough people in the transit debate know that a Skytrain extension into UBC is inevitable, and that NIMBYs can't stop a damn thing.

[Galvatron]

In that case, then every UBC student who takes the 99 into UBC, business owners along Broadway, and all other commuters who rely on the 99 can be called eco-nazis.

And really...what in the blue hell are you smoking? Enough people in the transit debate know that a Skytrain extension into UBC is inevitable, and that NIMBYs can't stop a damn thing.

Businesses along Broadway don't want it.. ever. People that live in the area don't want it. The 99 B Line is more then sufficient. And the majority of transit ridership in the 99 B Line are students. And unfortunately they don't pay taxes. Tax payers aren't going to fork over their money so broke students can get a train right to UBC's front door. It'll never happen

[nitronuts]

Does this mean it will be closed down temporarily?

No, I pretty sure it won't be.

[Buggernut]

Businesses along Broadway don't want it.

Where did you get that outrageous idea? What business wouldn't want a quick and easy transport mode bringing customers and employees near them?

I think whatever apprehension they may have about the project has more to do with construction concerns, as seen in the Cambie Canada Line construction.

[BuckyHermit]

The 99 B Line is more then sufficient.

And Vancouver has the biggest Toronto Maple Leafs fanbase in the world.

[Galvatron]

Where did you get that outrageous idea? What business wouldn't want a quick and easy transport mode bringing customers and employees near them?

I think whatever apprehension they may have about the project has more to do with construction concerns, as seen in the Cambie Canada Line construction.

Yeah one of the reasons they don't want it is because of construction. Doesn't matter what the reason is. The people have spoken. Business owners all along broadway have shown overwhelming support for not building the extension.

No one wants it except broke students

[Common sense]

Businesses along Broadway don't want it.. ever. People that live in the area don't want it. The 99 B Line is more then sufficient. And the majority of transit ridership in the 99 B Line are students. And unfortunately they don't pay taxes. Tax payers aren't going to fork over their money so broke students can get a train right to UBC's front door. It'll never happen

Of course businesses along Broadway don't want it; they say it'll disrupt business like it did with Cambie. Foresight will win on this one; business will boom like it did with the Granville corridor because their businesses are located next to a MAJOR north-south transit corridor now.

The 99 was more than sufficient in its pre-Upass days. today, it's a mess, especially with the fact that it's constantly caught in traffic jams, while Translink advertises the 99 as an "express" route.

I don't know whether the majority of ridership on the 99 are indeed university students, but you're dead wrong when you say they don't pay taxes. They will sooner or later, and with more students working more hours now, they will reach the dollar value where they pay instead of getting money back.

I honestly don't know what's with your sheer ignorance on this issue; there's 40-50 pages on this thread alone that highlights the merits of extending the Skytrain system to UBC (as opposed to the status quo of the 99 or creating at-grade LRT into UBC). My 3 points above is NOTHING compared to the argument for extension. Read up on those, especially on nitro's posts (regurgitated from websites, but they contain substance), and then come back when you actually have some sort of argument.