Miss Korea Bob.Loblaw Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 Im aware of the occupy movement, but there is an extreme amount of ambiguity about what exactly they are trying to accomplish. What are their proposed solutions to the problem? Any course of action which can be taken to "fix" this problem? I have tried to find a list of demands, or any sort of outline in regards to their goals and objectives and have been unable to find anything. All I get is that corporations are evil, and 1% of people are the devil, etc etc etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truculence Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 Im aware of the occupy movement, but there is an extreme amount of ambiguity about what exactly they are trying to accomplish. What are their proposed solutions to the problem? Any course of action which can be taken to "fix" this problem? I have tried to find a list of demands, or any sort of outline in regards to their goals and objectives and have been unable to find anything. All I get is that corporations are evil, and 1% of people are the devil, etc etc etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malHOEtra Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 A list of OV's demands, as of November 5 - keep in mind this is a working draft, according to OV: http://www.ctvbc.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20111104/bc_occupy_vancouver_demands_111104/20111104?hub=BritishColumbiaHome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malHOEtra Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 Also, would it have no been beneficial to try to come up with a game plan before starting the whole "Occupy Wall Street" event? If you actually have a plan going into this protest, would it not make people able to give more support, and speed up the process? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truculence Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 Thanks for the link. Question, I notice that 2 of the requests are closing down NAFTA, as well as increasing minimum wage. Would that not lead to a higher cost of living and an increase in unemployement? I understand the desire to provide everyone with a living wage, but it seems flawed to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inane Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 According to Tamara Taggart's twitter... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Korea Bob.Loblaw Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 Thanks for the link. Question, I notice that 2 of the requests are closing down NAFTA, as well as increasing minimum wage. Would that not lead to a higher cost of living and an increase in unemployement? I understand the desire to provide everyone with a living wage, but it seems flawed to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malHOEtra Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 Still not sure if the net result of NAFTA was beneficial to Canada. Many believe that economies should be as local as possible for a variety of reasons. Your minimum wage assumption is a right-wing ideological fallacy. Australia's minimum wage is currently $15.51 and their unemployment rate is 5.2%. That's just one example. Pro-corporate cheap-labour conservatives love to push their propaganda on this issue because the last thing they want is an egalitarian society where there's no one to exploit for profit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wetcoaster Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 There was an arrest today as a protester tried to occupy the middle of an intersection at Georgia and Howe. Meanwhile the on-site inspections and clean-up continues with tarps and some tents being removed. With temperatures forecast to drop to as low as -8 on Friday and Saturday that may curtail some of the campers. An Angus Reid poll shows only 29% of respondents have a favourable impression of OV. Man arrested as officials enforce clean-up at Occupy Vancouver site Police arrested a defiant man near Occupy Vancouver's art gallery encampment this morning while police, fire officials and city workers circulated the camp enforcing a mass clean-up of the site. A group of about two dozen city staff, police and fire officials circulated Occupy Vancouver's encampment Tuesday, pulling down several tents and taking the most forceful approach so far in ridding the site of safety hazards. The cleanup came on the same day as the forced removal of the New York camp where the Occupy movement began, and coincided with eviction notices served to occupiers in Calgary and Toronto. During the Vancouver cleanup, a protester decided to sit down in the middle of the intersection of Georgia and Howe streets, police said. Officers arrested the man for breach of peace, Vancouver Police spokesman Lindsey Houghton said in an email, noting that the arrest marks the first of the occupation. Houghton expected the man to be released at some point on Tuesday, and said it appears he is taking part in the movement, but it's not clear if he's a permanent resident of the camp. Breach of peace isn't a criminal charge, Houghton noted, adding that criminal charges have not been laid related to any activity yet at Occupy Vancouver. At around 10 a.m. on Tuesday authorities moved into the camp, inspecting the tents and measuring space between them with a three-foot stick. The arrest came while crews hauled away several tarps, stray wooden pallets that were used as tent stands, and about a dozen unoccupied tents, all of which have been deemed a hazard by fire officials. "These were tents that belong to people," said occupier Maxim Winther. "A lot of personal belongings are gone, a lot of tarps that were keeping people dry are gone. It seems like they're using these bylaws and they're using firemen to slowly dismantle us, which is highly political." Since late last week, tightly clustered tents and sprawling tarps have disappeared — for the most part — around the site. Clutter has been one of the primary concerns for health inspectors at the camp, said Angelo Kouris, manager of health protection at Vancouver Coastal Health. Sanitation and food service at the camp gets inspected "usually every other day," he said, adding that occupiers have been responding to requests reasonably well. "We try to maintain the same [inspector] so [occupiers] have a face they can recognize," he said. Depending on the circumstances, the health authority wouldn't step in and close the camp unless something like an outbreak of communicable disease erupted, he said. If a large-scale raid took place in Vancouver, "there's a lot of people who would have nowhere to go," said John Hall, a cognitive science student at Simon Fraser University. As many as one-quarter of occupiers are homeless residents who rely on services provided at the camp, he said. "They're part of the community now." He said he hoped the city would take a different approach than authorities in New York. Vancouver Mayor Gregor Robertson said Monday the city will continue to apply constant and careful pressure to the protesters to get them to leave. "As we've said before, the encampment cannot stay. We have to work that out without there being violence and conflict on the site and we have many tools and we are looking for more tools from the [b.C.] Supreme Court to end it safely." The court hearing into whether the city can force the closure of the camp resumes today. An online public opinion poll by Angus Reid shows that only 29 per cent of respondents in Vancouver have a favourable opinion of Occupy Vancouver, with 64 per cent holding an unfavourable opinion. The poll of 402 adult residents of Vancouver showed that 39 per cent want the city to set a deadline for Occupy Vancouver protesters to leave the plaza of the Vancouver Art Gallery. Another 36 per cent support the city taking legal action to remove the encampment. Only 15 per cent support letting the protest continue indefinitely. The poll was conducted Nov. 9-10 and has a margin of error of +/- 4.9%.- http://www.vancouversun.com/business/arrested+officials+enforce+clean+Occupy+Vancouver+site/5708493/story.html#ixzz1dqqBmLVy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Common sense Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 So is occupy Canada/USA affiliated, or are they looking for different outcomes? Also, in regards to Australia, are they not one of the most expensive countries to live in? I could be wrong on that one, but I have heard a few times now the cost of everything in Australia is more than in Canada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wetcoaster Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 The City of Vancouver is back in court tomorrow trying to get an injunction to remove the tents from the OV protest site. The B.C. Supreme Court is expected to rule Wednesday on the City of Vancouver’s bid for an injunction to clear tents from the Occupy Vancouver site at the Vancouver Art Gallery, one month after protesters set up camp. Meanwhile, Vancouver firefighters and city staff, overseen by Vancouver police officers, again inspected the site Tuesday for fire hazards, clearing out tents and the belongings of some dwellers. Fire Chief John McKearney said an earlier court safety order gave firefighters authority to ensure there was no combustible materials on site, that there was one metre between sleeping tents and that all tarps over sleeping tents were removed. “The judge’s order is all tarpaulins or tarps are gone,” he said. “The tarpaulins or tarps get in the way, they cover the tents, they’re an extra fire load.” McKearney expected 90 per cent of the site would be in compliance with the court’s order after the firefighters finished their inspection Tuesday. One tent-dweller returned to his tent between the art gallery and Howe Street, to where the encampment has spread, after firefighters had inspected the area, to find his tent and his belongings gone. “Our discussions with our city manager is that we are doing everything we can to make this site safe,” said McKearney. Jay Peachy, a member of the movement’s media committee, said the protest will continue even if the tents are removed, via the Internet and on site at the service tents and on the stage, which he said the city has approved for the site. But he opposed removing the tents. “Sure, people don’t like tents, but we don’t like seeing homeless people on the streets,” said Peachy, who didn’t sleep full-time at the encampment. Police arrested a protester, who sat in the middle of the intersection of Georgia and Howe streets, for breach of the peace. He was released a few hours later without being charged. http://www.theprovince.com/news/Injunction+oust+Occupy+Vancouver+could+come+Wednesday/5716085/story.html#ixzz1dqt4Nv7z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s_man422 Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 Looks the guy who was yelling "your a piece of *&#%" in some womans face who was attending that dinner that had bush speaking, what a clown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canucks_dynasty Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 OccupyVancouver should have just stuck with ONE idea that the 99% can get behind. And that would be for the 1% to pay reasonable taxes and close any tax loopholes. I don't know what would be reasonable but somthing that Canada can get more $$ but not enough to dissuade business/rich people from operating/residing in Canada (they need to make a profit too). Once the $$ is gained...then perhaps there would be more spending in much needed social programs. Or reduce overall deficit. Or improve Healthcare (now that's something that really needs fixing). Even the original OccupyVancouver organizers have said it's no longer what it started out to be. Good idea...bad execution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLumme Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 A list of OV's demands, as of November 5 - keep in mind this is a working draft, according to OV: http://www.ctvbc.ctv...ishColumbiaHome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustJokinen! Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 There are a wide variety of concerns among the protestors. The movement itself wants to be an example of democracy and inclusion. Just because there is no simple singular banner to group everyone under does not invalidate it. There's a great deal of discussion about what to do about the problems. Of course, if you're one of the privileged, sheltered, or those resigned to their fate as a pawn, then you're not really interested in even acknowledging that there's any kind of problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wetcoaster Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 Here is what occurred in court during the injunction hearing. Counsel for the OV protesters siought a further adjournment and that was denied by B.C. Supreme Court Associate Chief Justice Anne MacKenzie. The hearing has now re-convened after the lunch break. Dozens of supporters of the Occupy Vancouver protest turned up this morning at the court hearing of the city's injunction application. The city's lawyer argued that an interim injunction should be granted to shut down the tent city in front of the Vancouver Art Gallery. The city's position is that the Occupy Vancouver encampment, which began Oct. 15, is a breach of city bylaws preventing erecting structures on city property. The tent city protest against corporate greed and other issues has generated a heated public debate and has become an issue in the civic election. Suzanne Anton, who is running for Vancouver mayor for the Non-Partisan Association party, has repeatedly criticized the handling of the matter by Vancouver Mayor Gregor Robertson. Lawyers representing some of the Occupy Vancouver protesters had asked today for a short adjournment of the hearing to allow more time to prepare. Lawyer Jason Gratl told the judge that he didn't receive a new volume of affidavits from the city until 6 p.m. last night. But B.C. Supreme Court Associate Chief Justice Anne MacKenzie decided the case will proceed, starting with the argument of city lawyer Ben Parkin. Gratl also asked the court to allow him to argue an application to cross-examine three witnesses involved in the city's affidavits, but the judge said that application should be heard after the city's application for an interim injunction. Gratl argued against granting the city's injunction application, saying it would violate the protesters' rights to freedom of expression. "It would not be fitting in these circumstances to rely on a constitutionally suspect bylaw," he argued. "The structures themselves have expressive content," Gratl added. "They are political structures." Gratl is representing one of the protesters, Sean O'Flynn-Magee, who was originally served by the fire department to comply with fire and safety regulations by removing large tarps over tents. The hearing will resume at 2 p.m. Two of the protesters attending Wednesday court hearing were Matthew Kvikstad, 25, and Jordon Malcolm, 18, who have been living at Occupy Vancouver since it began Oct. 15. Malcolm said if the injunction is granted and police try to remove them, protesters plan to use non-violence resistance and will lock arms. "I'm willing to take a beating for human rights for me and everyone at the camp," he said outside court. Meanwhile, Robertson said Wednesday he wants the tent city at Occupy Vancouver gone by Grey Cup weekend, Nov. 27. But he said the city isn't going to issue an ultimatum, especially since it wants to resolve the protest peacefully. In an interview with The Province's editorial board Robertson sounded forceful, wanting to have the camp gone by Grey Cup weekend. "I want to see [the encampment] gone before the Grey Cup weekend," he said. But in a subsequent statement to The Vancouver Sun, he was less strident, instead saying the injunction is an important tool in moving the protesters along. ""We want an injunction from the B.C. Supreme Court as an additional tool to remove the tent city. People have the right to protest but the tent city needs to go. The City has serious concerns with the safety of the tent city," he said in the statement. "Obviously we'd like it resolved by the Grey Cup weekend but we're not going to issue ultimatums, that hasn't worked in other cities. We're going to keep increasing pressure to remove the tents and the injunction will be a much stronger tool to do that. The consequences for defying an injunction are more severe and as a result we're in a better position to end the tent city while avoiding a violent confrontation." The Occupy movement's tent cities sprang up in 2,000 cities after the first one, known as Occupy Wall Street, sprang up in New York A number have cities, including New York and Toronto, have recently decided to shut down the encampments. Justice MacKenzie adjourned the City of Vancouver's injunction application from last week to allow protesters time to consult legal counsel. But the judge did order that the Occupy Vancouver camp to comply with fire and safety regulations after a young women tragically died in a tent from a drug overdose. Earlier, another man survived a drug overdose after he was taken to hospital. http://www.vancouversun.com/business/Occupy+Vancouver+protesters+occupy+courtroom+city+injunction+application/5720725/story.html#ixzz1duSTOF1I An application for an injunction to remove the tent city protest site on the lawn of the Vancouver Art Gallery got under way Wednesday. After several applications by Occupy Vancouver to adjourn the hearing were dismissed by the judge, the case resumed with submissions regarding the correct legal test for the injunction. Ben Parkin, a lawyer for the city, argued that the test was an “extremely simple” one — whether a city land bylaw had been breached and whether there were any exceptional circumstances to stop an injunction. “There’s no dispute that people have erected structures and tents. That constitutes a breach of the land bylaw and is a trespass.” Parkin told B.C. Supreme Court Associate Chief Justice Anne MacKenzie that there were no exceptional circumstances in the case where, for example, the defendants have attempted to comply with the law but have been unable to do so. He said it was in the public interest to remove the protest site that has been in place since Oct. 15. Jason Gratl, a lawyer for one of the Occupy Vancouver protesters, argued that the city was relying on a “constitutionally suspect” bylaw and therefore could not rely on the presumption the bylaw was in the public interest. He said there was “ample evidence” that half of the protesters on the site were homeless and have nowhere to go. And he said there was insufficient shelter beds in the city and that there were safety and security issues at the shelters that exist. “It would not be fitting to rely on a constitutionally suspect bylaw, to overlook those adverse consequences.” Earlier, Gratl had asked the judge for more time to review some new affidavits filed by the city but the judge declined to do so. The judge also dismissed an application by a second Occupy Vancouver lawyer for a “brief delay” in the proceedings. Three days have been set aside for the injunction hearing. The courtroom was packed Wednesday with several dozen protesters. Last week the judge ordered that the protesters comply with the city fire bylaw after reports of violations. The protesters were ordered to remove all tarp enclosures or put up overhead tarps as canopies to provide full visibility and appropriate egress and access. Unoccupied tents were ordered to be removed, as well as open flames and propane or other fuel sources on site. http://www.theprovince.com/news/Court+case+continues+challenge+Occupy+protesters/5721259/story.html#ixzz1duTVz400 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeGillis58 Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 Mi-Jung Lee is beautiful! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FeStealth Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 Still not sure if the net result of NAFTA was beneficial to Canada. Many believe that economies should be as local as possible for a variety of reasons. Your minimum wage assumption is a right-wing ideological fallacy. Australia's minimum wage is currently $15.51 and their unemployment rate is 5.2%. That's just one example. Pro-corporate cheap-labour conservatives love to push their propaganda on this issue because the last thing they want is an egalitarian society where there's no one to exploit for profit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grapefruits Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Anyone else starting to think that these protestors will try to incite some kind of riot after the Grey Cup? Gregor needs to grow a set and get rid of these people asap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wetcoaster Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Here is the case that the City is making to the court hearing the injunction application. A strong smell of marijuana has been wafting through the Vancouver Art Gallery since Occupy Vancouver set up camp on its grounds on Oct. 15, a judge was told Wednesday. The odour was one of the reasons cited by city lawyer Ben Parkin for the need for an interim injunction to shut down the tent city, which is part of a global protest against corporate greed. He also told the court that dirty plates and food scraps left on the public plaza by protesters has attracted rats, and protesters have damaged turf and plants on the gallery grounds. The city applied for an injunction last week to remove the encampment but the judge adjourned the matter until Wednesday to allow protesters time to seek legal counsel. The judge, however, ordered protesters to comply with fire and safety regulations after a young woman died of a drug overdose. The city’s lawyer told the court that the protesters have been slow to comply with fire safety regulations, requiring firefighters to spend hundreds of hours to monitor the site and enforce regulations. “The site is not 100 per cent in compliance even now,” Parkin said. It has required a 24-hour fire watch and has hampered the fire department from performing other duties, he added. Parkin said city staff have ordered protesters, both orally and in writing, to remove tents and structures, but the requests have been largely ignored. As well, there are other groups wanting to use the public plaza during the period leading up to Christmas, Parkin said. http://www.vancouversun.com/business/Smell+wafting+through+gallery+cited+reason+shut+down+Occupy+Vancouver/5720725/story.html#ixzz1dwiMM1QD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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