Jester@wraiths.ca Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Since marc Crawford's last year here, when he used the Sedins on a secondary PK unit, and they not only excelled but leaguewide were actually the last pair of forwards on regular PK duty to be on for a PP goal against, I've been against AV's refusal to use them on the PK. A season ago in the playoffs against LA when our PK couldn't kill a penalty to save their souls, he finally put them on the PK, and they turned the series around... but after that, once again he removed them from the PK... The argument is he wants them fresh for offense, but seemingly all around the league, star offensive players are thriving while getting PK duties. Why? All we all year long when there are a bunch of penalties is "The Sedins are cold, have barely seen the ice most of this period, because they don't kill penalties"... Here's a sampling of players who are top 6 and expected to be offensive, but who do kill penalties, and their SH minutes per game. Kovalchuk 1:09 Getzlaf 1:02 Eric Staal 1:26 Parise 1:57 Kopitar 2:14 Perry 1:16 Plekanec 3:13 marleua 1:28 Thornton 1:03 Giroux 2:14 Weiss 1:15 Backes 1:47 Zetterberg 1:04 Eriksson 1:46 Hossa 1:47 Elias 1:46 Ladd 1:32 Callahan 1:48 Ribeiro 0:58 Sharp 1:05 Alfredsson 1:17 Fisher 1:15 Datsyuk 1:13 Henrique 1;47 a rookie for cryin out loud... Semin 1:09 the guy constantly called a defensive liability? Mikko Koivu 1:43 Pominville 2:13 What I'm pointing out is that it seems to work just fine for everyone else, the Sedins are not made of glass... They aren't getting tired, when AV said they were, was one of the few times they actually spoke up and contradicted him... And they are actually effective penalty killers. I'm sure a number of coaches use their stars on the PK specifically so they stay in the game. They aren't going to be worn down because they get a minute on the PK each game, but they will stay "in the game". 1 minute of PK a game won't make them too tired to be offensive threats. Plenty of the regular PK "star" players were in The majority of the top 25 scorers all had regular PK duty... I feel the Sedins are entirely capable and would actually benefit from getting 0:45-1:15 of PK per game, keeping our stars in the flow of the game, and it seems like most other coaches would do so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeslerBEAST Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 why would you have your best offensive players on the penalty kill when you have players that are equally or better defensively take the PK? Also increase the risk of them getting injured by blocking a shot or something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Mind Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Same argument could be said as to why AV keeps them out of the shootout. I agree, the Sedins should get some PK time, it would help their overall game. Funny though how at the end of last season, there were lots of threads about how we shouldn't be using star players like Kesler on the PK. And now we are wanting all of our players to see some PK time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jester@wraiths.ca Posted May 17, 2012 Author Share Posted May 17, 2012 why would you have your best offensive players on the penalty kill when you have players that are equally or better defensively take the PK? Also increase the risk of them getting injured by blocking a shot or something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyBoy44 Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 My question is when the canucks decide to meet up in the penalty box for a game, does it affect the sedins game when they are watching the pk and little even strength or pp time? At these points I would think so and would definitely argue using them somewhere in there to keep their legs moving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Korea Bob.Loblaw Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 why would you have your best offensive players on the penalty kill when you have players that are equally or better defensively take the PK? Also increase the risk of them getting injured by blocking a shot or something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonshinefe Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Hate to admit it, but the Sedins just aren't gritty, fast players. The type of people you need on the PK are people who are going to dive and give their all for the puck, and who can forcheck fast as the opposing team tries to enter the zone and setup. The Sedins just aren't those players, as amazingly awesome as they are. Burrows, Hansen, Kesler, Higgins etc. all have those traits to an extent which is why we use them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jester@wraiths.ca Posted May 17, 2012 Author Share Posted May 17, 2012 Hate to admit it, but the Sedins just aren't gritty, fast players. The type of people you need on the PK are people who are going to dive and give their all for the puck, and who can forcheck fast as the opposing team tries to enter the zone and setup. The Sedins just aren't those players, as amazingly awesome as they are. Burrows, Hansen, Kesler, Higgins etc. all have those traits to an extent which is why we use them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stix Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Yeah, guys like Kovalchuk, Datsyuk, Kopitar, and Semin are well known for being really gritty players... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnsey Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 i do prefer them off the PK. That being said there have been a few games where all we are doing is getting penalities. In those games the Sedins get little ice time for obvious reasons. There are times when i think they should be used, it could help them develop a bit more. Could be worth a try every now and then but not regular duty....at least not yet until they get some practice/tries at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jester@wraiths.ca Posted May 17, 2012 Author Share Posted May 17, 2012 You obviously don't watch playoff hockey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uber_pwnzor Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Yeah, guys like Kovalchuk, Datsyuk, Kopitar, and Semin are well known for being really gritty players... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThaBestPlaceOnEarth Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 They used to kill penalties and they were good at it, it must be something like to keep them fresh and ready and cause we have other guys who are really good on the PK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jester@wraiths.ca Posted May 17, 2012 Author Share Posted May 17, 2012 Go take a look at the 05-06 season. The Sedins both broke 70 points for the first time, and both averaged over 2:10 of penalty killing time per game. They were scored on while PK'ing an average of 14% of the time. That is an 86% effective penalty killing success for the twins. Yes, they will have faced more of the secondary units, but they would do so most of the time now if they were used on the PK again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2009cupchamps Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 One of the many stats that MG follows and now AV does is Zone time starts. Can't remember where I read it, but I recall that the Sedins had the highest goals against on the team when they started in there own zone. So it makes sense that they get majority of the neutral and Offensive zone starts. While Malholtra and Lappierre and Lesser extent Kesler gets the Defensive zone starts. Since almost every SH start is in the Defensive zone it makes sense that they would not be killing penalties. MGGM tries to employ every advantage they can to help win games. This info is given to AV and AV has chosen to use it wisely be limiting there Defensive zone starts. Over the next couple years you will see more teams following this stat and using it the same as the Canucks do in the coming years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canada Hockey Place Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 I agree. At least try it during the regular season. Then at least they could be an option to PK if Kesler get hurt, Malhotra struggles or if they're trying to get a prospect integrated into the line-up. Look at the PK units going into the playoffs. Doesn't anyone else find this excessive? Talk about afraid to lose. Malhotra Hansen Kesler Burrows Pahlsson Higgins Lapierre Raymond ^ If the Sedin's could play even the 4th pairing, less than 1:00/game, Canucks wouldn't need to dress as many PKers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmotamed Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 I think we should let the Sedins to anything & everything... Helps confidence and makes them better all-around players. Let them take shoot-outs, let them kill penalties, heck, let them block some shots too... okay, okay too far on that last one! =P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckelhead70 Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Are you kidding me with this thread? We don't need the Sedin's on the PK. The coaching staff has the PK well under control. 11-12 6th 10-11 1st 09-10 6th 08-09 7th This is one of the last things you need to worry about. Sedins are all about puck control not chasing the puck around with one less player on the ice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sugar baby watermelon Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 We have players that play great on the PK already that kill the penalty just fine right now. Its taking the stupid penalties time and again that leave the Sedins on the bench for too long. If we take consecutive penalties then I'd say use them because they read the plays so well, and that keeps their legs fresh rather than waiting to jump into the play after the pk is over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stix Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Another idea is to perhaps use them as goalies. This way we will always have at least one of them on the ice at all times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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