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David Booth Hunts Goat


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#181 bert_ja

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 12:02 PM

Vegetarian, probably. What's disturbing is that there's more plants on the IUCN Red LIst than there are animals. So...technically he's doing more damage to the environment eating plants than Booth is in trophy hunting animals.


You do realize that many plants on that list are lost due to clear cuts, some of which areas are used to raise animals for poultry. Vegetarians don't really eat 'exotic' plants. Plants which can be used for medicinal or other important purposes are not really a part of a vegetarian's staple diet.
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#182 Jester@wraiths.ca

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 12:22 PM

Not eating non human animals does not logically entail eating human animals (we are animals too right). That is like saying because I don't eat apples which are fruit, then I must eat oranges which are fruit. I could not eat both, which is entirely possible. In other words, cannibalism simply doesn't follow, and for the record I don't eat humans.......sometimes.


You made the point to specify that you don't eat NON-human animals. To make the point you think you made, you should have said that you don't eat animals which would include human and non-human, but you didn't. While I wouldn't believe you ate humans because of what you said, your statement was still flawed based on what you think you were trying to say. A vegetarian, when describing what they eat would say "I don't eat meat", not "I don't eat beef" and then expect everyone else to know that they also don't et chicken, etc.

You made a poorly worded statement, simply admitting the obvious would have been a better route than over-defending the mistake to try and make it seem like everyone else is wrong...
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#183 Snake Doctor

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 12:41 PM

Well at least we know where the Harvest Dinner came from. :lol:
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#184 WeatherWise

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 12:50 PM

It seems the topic of discussion has become: "Does SILLY GOOSE eat humans?"

Logically, he may not eat animals at all. The statement, I believe, only excludes him from eating all other animals except humans, though he never indicated in the OP that he eats meat. I don't think it would infer that he eats all other kinds of meat except non-human meat.

It's still quite amusing, though, and Jester@wraiths.ca has a point. People who do not eat meat would not say what SILLY GOOSE said, as it leaves open the possibility that he eats humans. To be specific enough to deny eating all animals except humans is very different from saying he does not eat meat. People who just want to say they're vegeterans would not say this. From a psychological point of view, there would be a reason for him to say this and mean what he says.

Unless he's either insane, a cannibal, or just trying to be clever and failing, he likely just misspoke. As he is denying having misspoken, though, he must be one of the former three. In the real world, people use certain expressions and avoid others.

Edited by WeatherWise, 15 October 2012 - 01:19 PM.

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#185 WHL rocks

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 01:15 PM

Hunting and eating good

Hunting and twitter not good


Pretty much sums it up right here.
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#186 Pistachios

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 01:40 PM

You made the point to specify that you don't eat NON-human animals.


which doesn't necessarily imply (look up what a necessary condition is) I eat human beings. That point has already been made by me so it doesn't need any further clarification. Your insistence on the issue only shows that you are trying to make an argument out of nothing (which demonstrates a lack of reasoning on your part as well). In turn, you've been added to my wall of shame.

/end discussion on this

Edited by SILLY GOOSE, 15 October 2012 - 01:41 PM.

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#187 Gumballthechewy

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 01:56 PM

Unless he's either insane, a cannibal, or just trying to be clever and failing


Maybe he's a closet cannibal?

It's ok, Vancouver is a very open city, I'm sure you won't be the victim of any hate crimes.

Edited by Gumballthechewy, 15 October 2012 - 01:57 PM.

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#188 WeatherWise

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 01:57 PM

which doesn't necessarily imply (look up what a necessary condition is) I eat human beings. That point has already been made by me so it doesn't need any further clarification. Your insistence on the issue only shows that you are trying to make an argument out of nothing (which demonstrates a lack of reasoning on your part as well). In turn, you've been added to my wall of shame.

/end discussion on this


While true, sane people do not say such things in human discussion unless they struggle with the English language and misspeak at times, are arrogant and flamboyant, or are trying hard to be clever and witty. You clam you didn't misspeak, so you look quite ridiculous. Yes, your statement supports what you've argued, but a large portion of our language is comprised of colloquialisms, idioms, and terms to describe the world; to be so precise and to not just say "I'm a vegetarian" looks rather stupid.

That's just how the English language is. Sometimes it's easier just to be clear and concise than to present a contrived logical statement riddled with ambiguities. A lot of people here are amused by what you said not because it's wrong, but because it's a particularly dumb statement that isn't generally used by those familiar with the English language, and because it leaves open many unintended possibilities.

It's just more natural to say you're a vegetarian than to post you "don't eat non-human animals." Your point is made much more apparent, and it doesn't seem as awkward. When discussing in English, it's better to use clear language than to discuss using double-negatives and being ambiguous. When writing, your objective should be to have readers understand your point and to not be distracted by your use of language.

Your choice of words clearly took away from the quality of your post. Needless to say, you didn't get your point across to most readers.

Edited by WeatherWise, 15 October 2012 - 02:23 PM.

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#189 vavoom

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:14 PM

This is pathetic, IMHO, the OP is coming off as more of a douche than Booth.

Booth hunted legally and eats his kill.  He enjoys this and is sharing with other people who would enjoy it too.  I think this falls under the category of "None of your business".  It is quite narcissistic for you to think that he publishes these pics specifically to annoy you.

OP basically says:
1) I have a masters degree in this, so my opinion is the only one that matters "ethically speaking"
2) All you people who eat "non-human animals" are unethical.
3) If you don't interpret my comments as I intend them to mean, you are dumb.

Seriously, anyone who has taken moral philosophy at a basic level will tell you that no moral issue is truely black and white.  If it appears so, then it really is your own sense of ethics that is clouding the issue.  Stop trying to impose your ethics on others.

Edited by vavoom, 15 October 2012 - 02:15 PM.

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#190 Dragonfruits

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:21 PM

he is hunting for food not for trophy like others have said you spend 6-8 weeks training for this type of hunt so its not some sort of walk in the park like many have said

as for the pictures don't look at them if you see a booth hunting thread pop up you can damn well assume there will be a picture of his kill its what he does

oh crazy thing to say again but maybe just maybe it will get the point across to all you stubborn people

he hunts for food not trophy end of story so stop pulling assumptions out of the air about what he does with his kills
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#191 Dogbyte

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:46 PM

No one said it was ok. You are presupposing that it is. That's called begging the question.



First, human biology does not dictate that we must eat meat. If that were the case, vegans would perish. Further, many high performance athletes are switching to vegan diets for improved health and recovery.

Second, plants are not sentient. They do not experience complex emotions or desires like we do. More importantly, they do not experience pain.

Third, eating plants isn't destroying the environment as near as badly as factory farming non human animals is. You need to do some basic fact checking.


I also question vegans when it comes to eating plants. Where do you draw the line. If you are going to be all holier than thou then perhaps the plant has a right to live too. Like some people say that eating fish is alright because they have less feeling than other animals. Who cares about sentiment really? Obviously not animals that savagely eat each other, why we should we care?
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#192 Gumballthechewy

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:53 PM

I eat meat because my body is designed to eat meat.

Seems like a good enough reason to me...

Edited by Gumballthechewy, 15 October 2012 - 02:53 PM.

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#193 Baggins

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:54 PM

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Well, it wasn't killed in B.C. it was killed in Alberta, though they don't allow it either, in case you were wondering.

In any case the means of hunting doesn't negate the argument from immorality when a hunter kills an animal more for enjoyment rather than a need for sustenance and survival.

And if there are so many natural reasons for the low population rate already, ie) avalanches, forest fires, falling, etc....then killing them for the purpose of enjoyment, thus further reducing their numbers seems like an illogical reason, let alone an immoral reason to do so further.

I respect your opinion and you as a person, and have for quite some time, but this is one area I part in disagreement. Trophy hunting is more about feeding one's ego than it is about feeding their bellies. And goat-hunting seems like it's a blood-sport for the rich who can't seem to find other less murderous ways to find their jollies and fill their archaic bloodlust. He should go climb a mountain if he's looking for extreme thrills and a rush. Takes more courage imo to conquer a mountain than it does to conquer a goat.


Man as hunted throughout time.

Goats are not endangered nor are they even on the watch list. They are limited entry as they are not as abundant as deer. Hunting serves several purposes. One is population control. This is where you have it backwards. You're not actually saving goats by not hunting them. Without population control yje winter food supply disappears faster and more will be expiring from starvation. Starvation is currently the goats biggest enemy. If the population grows too much even more will expire as food becomes too scarce earlier. For example: If there's 100 and only food for 50 the entire 100 could wind up starving to death. Culling ensures longer availability of food and a greater chance for a herd to survive the winter. Then of course the money generated from hunting pays for conservation. What areas are available to hunt are decided by population. You cannot legally hunt where and what you please. An area open to hunting this year may well be closed the following year if the winter survival was too low. This population control actually helps the overall survival of each species in each hunting zone.

Btw, Booth had to conquer the mountain before conquering the goat. I did hunt for several years. It has nothing to do with ego as far as I'm concerned. Nor did I do it out of need for meat. I couild buy meat. I do have a love for elk and moose meat. Tough to find at the local Save On. I always thought of hunting as being out hiking and camping with friends. Bagging something was a bonus that put meat in the freezer. Hunting is an experience. There's far more to the experience than simply shooting an animal.

Now I've never bothered with taking trophies from hunting myself. My older brother has though. He has a whitetail buck, a six point elk, and a longhorn sheep on his rec room wall. Plus a sheepskin rug (from that longhorn) along with a bearskin rug. Each of those trophies represent a memory for him. And I can guarantee you none of the meat went to waste. Every time I see that elk on his wall it reminds of that week I spent in the woods in the rockies with my three older brothers. It's a good memory and the only week long vacation we've all done together as adults.

I haven't hunted for 20 years now. But I did enjoy it. I do think you have to experience hunting to truly understand it.

I do have to ask: is it of higher morality to raise an animal in confinement only to be shipped off to the slaughter house or to head out into the woods, put in the effort of actually hunting, and kill an animal that spent it's life roaming free? Do either live a happy life? I don't know. Perhaps our livestock are simply too stupid to realize they're food until that final terror filled moment while those out in the wild spend their entire life trying to avoid being food. Whether a cow, a pig, or a deer or elk, they're all part of the food chain and have been since the beginning of time. Which is why I don't really see it as a question of morality myself. It's simply the nature of the world. Virtually everything in this world is hunted by something else.

I see those that eat meat but are opposed to hunting as head in the sand hypocrites. At least the hunter experiences the ugly side of where the meat came from. The non-hunter simply buys his packaged steak and roast without having to look into the cows eyes as he's killed. He doesn't have to gut and skin the cow. Nope. It's all clean and tidy. They don't have to think about how that meat made it to that package in the store. It's just food. At least the hunter goes through the entire process. My experience was a greater respect for the animals. And that's really difficult to explain having gone through the entire process.

As I said before, I have no problem with hunting as long as it's done legally. There's far more to it than simply killing an animal.
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#194 Sharpshooter

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:17 PM

he is hunting for food not for trophy like others have said you spend 6-8 weeks training for this type of hunt so its not some sort of walk in the park like many have said

as for the pictures don't look at them if you see a booth hunting thread pop up you can damn well assume there will be a picture of his kill its what he does

oh crazy thing to say again but maybe just maybe it will get the point across to all you stubborn people

he hunts for food not trophy end of story so stop pulling assumptions out of the air about what he does with his kills



ahem...

“There’s only one trophy in the world harder to get than this… And I’m getting that next,” said Booth


Care to reconsider? Or will you be the stubborn one now?
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#195 Baggins

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:25 PM

If I bagged a goat that big I'd post the pictures up too, I have no issues with him posting the pictures.

Never been hunting, and quite frankly, I doubt I ever will. I don't have it in me to kill a creature.
That being said, I couldn't care less about people who do go hunting, it's well within their rights, and if they enjoy it than so be it.
It would be nice to know whether he intends on using the meat or hide for something though.
Hope to see Booth out of the forest and on the ice soon.


Neither do I. We know Booth hunts and posts photos to his twitter account. If you don't like hunting don't follow his twitter account. It's very simple really.
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#196 mbal23

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:39 PM

ahem...



Care to reconsider? Or will you be the stubborn one now?


Trophy doesn't mean he won't eat it. It could just means it was an achievement for him and he worked for it. You can't assume things you have no knowlegede of or a part of. And anyways goat is delicious.
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#197 Sharpshooter

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:46 PM

Trophy doesn't mean he won't eat it. It could just means it was an achievement for him and he worked for it. You can't assume things you have no knowlegede of or a part of. And anyways goat is delicious.


Please don't be so naive. He didn't wait who knows how long and pay who knows how much in order to go trekking into the Rocky mountains because he had a hankering for goat meat. He did it for the trophy of killing a mountain goat, much like he has done for all the other animals he's killed. The fact that he may or may not have eaten its meat post-kill has no bearing in what drove him to kill it in the first place.
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#198 Sharpshooter

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:01 PM

Man as hunted throughout time.

Goats are not endangered nor are they even on the watch list. They are limited entry as they are not as abundant as deer. Hunting serves several purposes. One is population control. This is where you have it backwards. You're not actually saving goats by not hunting them. Without population control yje winter food supply disappears faster and more will be expiring from starvation. Starvation is currently the goats biggest enemy. If the population grows too much even more will expire as food becomes too scarce earlier. For example: If there's 100 and only food for 50 the entire 100 could wind up starving to death. Culling ensures longer availability of food and a greater chance for a herd to survive the winter. Then of course the money generated from hunting pays for conservation. What areas are available to hunt are decided by population. You cannot legally hunt where and what you please. An area open to hunting this year may well be closed the following year if the winter survival was too low. This population control actually helps the overall survival of each species in each hunting zone.

Btw, Booth had to conquer the mountain before conquering the goat. I did hunt for several years. It has nothing to do with ego as far as I'm concerned. Nor did I do it out of need for meat. I couild buy meat. I do have a love for elk and moose meat. Tough to find at the local Save On. I always thought of hunting as being out hiking and camping with friends. Bagging something was a bonus that put meat in the freezer. Hunting is an experience. There's far more to the experience than simply shooting an animal.

Now I've never bothered with taking trophies from hunting myself. My older brother has though. He has a whitetail buck, a six point elk, and a longhorn sheep on his rec room wall. Plus a sheepskin rug (from that longhorn) along with a bearskin rug. Each of those trophies represent a memory for him. And I can guarantee you none of the meat went to waste. Every time I see that elk on his wall it reminds of that week I spent in the woods in the rockies with my three older brothers. It's a good memory and the only week long vacation we've all done together as adults.

I haven't hunted for 20 years now. But I did enjoy it. I do think you have to experience hunting to truly understand it.

I do have to ask: is it of higher morality to raise an animal in confinement only to be shipped off to the slaughter house or to head out into the woods, put in the effort of actually hunting, and kill an animal that spent it's life roaming free? Do either live a happy life? I don't know. Perhaps our livestock are simply too stupid to realize they're food until that final terror filled moment while those out in the wild spend their entire life trying to avoid being food. Whether a cow, a pig, or a deer or elk, they're all part of the food chain and have been since the beginning of time. Which is why I don't really see it as a question of morality myself. It's simply the nature of the world. Virtually everything in this world is hunted by something else.

I see those that eat meat but are opposed to hunting as head in the sand hypocrites. At least the hunter experiences the ugly side of where the meat came from. The non-hunter simply buys his packaged steak and roast without having to look into the cows eyes as he's killed. He doesn't have to gut and skin the cow. Nope. It's all clean and tidy. They don't have to think about how that meat made it to that package in the store. It's just food. At least the hunter goes through the entire process. My experience was a greater respect for the animals. And that's really difficult to explain having gone through the entire process.

As I said before, I have no problem with hunting as long as it's done legally. There's far more to it than simply killing an animal.


I can appreciate all the warm feelings around the camping and comradeship you felt while out with your brothers. I'm not denying that's important. But tell me, would those memories have been any less special to you had you just gone camping and spent that quality time with your brother(s) and instead of having some poor animal's head on a wall or skin on the floor, you had some great photos or videos to recall your bonding with?

And your cut and paste info above is contradictory. If mountain goats are not in abundance, then why do they require population control? And what did nature do before there were hunters? Did species go extinct in the wildnerness when herd sizes got too big for the availability of food, territory or mates? Come on, that's a weak hunter's argument that's been debunked time after time. Hunters use this excuse in order to legitimize their recreational activity.

When aboriginal people hunted caribou or bison, depending on which area they were in, they didn't do it for 'population control', they did it for necessity and survival, which is why they have a great respect for the animals they hunt. They didn't step on the animals like conquering weekend warriors, like Bravado Booth here did, showing the world how tough and courageous he is with his new trophy.

It's just a bunch of rich guys killing for the enjoyment of killing....that's what it boils down to, and that's why he disgusts me, like all trophy hunters. I'm not trying to devalue the obvious emotional argument you're making about hunting with your brothers, because i respect the bonding process, but i'd bet you that had you all scaled a mountain together, or 'tamed' some wild rapids together, or sailed some vast distance on the open seas together.....you'd all have come away with the same feeling of accomplishment, satisfaction in yourself and as a family, and achievement in doing something that you'd all remember for the rest of your lives.......without needing the carcass of a once living creature adorning your mantle places or floors.

You may feel otherwise.
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#199 Jägermeister

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:09 PM

I'm wondering if any of the people complaining about Booth killing this goat have ever killed a spider or ant before...
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#200 stawns

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:30 PM

I can appreciate all the warm feelings around the camping and comradeship you felt while out with your brothers. I'm not denying that's important. But tell me, would those memories have been any less special to you had you just gone camping and spent that quality time with your brother(s) and instead of having some poor animal's head on a wall or skin on the floor, you had some great photos or videos to recall your bonding with?

And your cut and paste info above is contradictory. If mountain goats are not in abundance, then why do they require population control? And what did nature do before there were hunters? Did species go extinct in the wildnerness when herd sizes got too big for the availability of food, territory or mates? Come on, that's a weak hunter's argument that's been debunked time after time. Hunters use this excuse in order to legitimize their recreational activity.

When aboriginal people hunted caribou or bison, depending on which area they were in, they didn't do it for 'population control', they did it for necessity and survival, which is why they have a great respect for the animals they hunt. They didn't step on the animals like conquering weekend warriors, like Bravado Booth here did, showing the world how tough and courageous he is with his new trophy.

It's just a bunch of rich guys killing for the enjoyment of killing....that's what it boils down to, and that's why he disgusts me, like all trophy hunters. I'm not trying to devalue the obvious emotional argument you're making about hunting with your brothers, because i respect the bonding process, but i'd bet you that had you all scaled a mountain together, or 'tamed' some wild rapids together, or sailed some vast distance on the open seas together.....you'd all have come away with the same feeling of accomplishment, satisfaction in yourself and as a family, and achievement in doing something that you'd all remember for the rest of your lives.......without needing the carcass of a once living creature adorning your mantle places or floors.

You may feel otherwise.


I dare say DB would probably ask you to stay home and collect berries, tan leather and prepare the meals for the men when they get back from hunting

B)

just messing with you.

Edited by stawns, 15 October 2012 - 04:30 PM.

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#201 Sharpshooter

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:37 PM

I'm wondering if any of the people complaining about Booth killing this goat have ever killed a spider or ant before...


I'm wondering if you know the illogic of equating trophy hunting with killing an ant.

Or do you have a trophy room full of ant heads and spider rugs?
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#202 Jägermeister

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:54 PM

I'm wondering if you know the illogic of equating trophy hunting with killing an ant.

Or do you have a trophy room full of ant heads and spider rugs?


A goat and a spider are both animals no?
Why hold a goats life as more valuable than that of a spiders?
At least by killing the goat he has a trophy, a spider would just be flushed down the toilet and forgotten about.
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#203 sirwilliam

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:54 PM

I eat meat because my body is designed to eat meat.

Seems like a good enough reason to me...


Well... technically speaking, the human body is optimized for sugars, starches and oils (mmm, french fries!). Meat too, but to a lesser extent. Being omnivores, we ate fruit, berries, grains, etc., and meat when we could get it.

The concept of 'eating meat with every meal' is a modern, Western idea, started in the mid 20th century. Prior to that, you'd get it a few times a week. We certainly don't need it, and especially not with every meal. Even today much of India's 1 billion+ population is vegetarian.
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#204 sirwilliam

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:57 PM

I'm wondering if any of the people complaining about Booth killing this goat have ever killed a spider or ant before...


Heh, we probably wouldn't complain if mountain goats had 300 babies at a time, could be found in every house in every corner of the globe, and tried to drop on your head without warning. :)
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#205 Jägermeister

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 05:00 PM

Heh, we probably wouldn't complain if mountain goats had 300 babies at a time, could be found in every house in every corner of the globe, and tried to drop on your head without warning. :)


Now theres an image I can't get out of my head :mellow:
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#206 sirwilliam

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 05:01 PM

A goat and a spider are both animals no?
Why hold a goats life as more valuable than that of a spiders?
At least by killing the goat he has a trophy, a spider would just be flushed down the toilet and forgotten about.


Practically speaking it's a funny comparison. However, you do illustrate a good point, about how we hold one type of creature in high esteem and treat others like dirt.

Again: XL foods. 4,700... Four thousand, seven hundred... cattle slaughtered every day. That's normal?And that's just one abattoir.

Edited by sirwilliam, 15 October 2012 - 05:02 PM.

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#207 Sharpshooter

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 05:28 PM

A goat and a spider are both animals no?
Why hold a goats life as more valuable than that of a spiders?
At least by killing the goat he has a trophy, a spider would just be flushed down the toilet and forgotten about.


If one kills an ant or a spider for delight or pleasure, just as they would do and receive by killing a mountain goat, then that's equally as immoral behaviour.
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#208 CanuckCup1316

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 05:38 PM

Anthony Del Fiacco@adelfiacco10
I can't believe David Booth killed the Luckdragon. We will never forget you, Falcor


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ROTHFLMAO
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#209 canuktravella

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 05:44 PM

these pics he takes like the bear one and this goat one make me sick is he trying to be a big man on twitter was a loser i hope he pisses off a grizzly one day hope karma kicks his ass
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#210 Jester@wraiths.ca

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 05:47 PM

which doesn't necessarily imply (look up what a necessary condition is) I eat human beings. That point has already been made by me so it doesn't need any further clarification. Your insistence on the issue only shows that you are trying to make an argument out of nothing (which demonstrates a lack of reasoning on your part as well). In turn, you've been added to my wall of shame.

/end discussion on this

which doesn't necessarily imply (look up what a necessary condition is) I eat human beings. That point has already been made by me so it doesn't need any further clarification. Your insistence on the issue only shows that you are trying to make an argument out of nothing (which demonstrates a lack of reasoning on your part as well). In turn, you've been added to my wall of shame.

/end discussion on this


You cling to your need to defend your error quite fervently. The only part of any of the discussion which would be qualified as an argument is your repeated defense of a mistake you made. A bigger person would simply admit they said something which didn't make sense. It is strange to make a statement in the manner that you did. You chose to deliberately specify NON-human animals. I didn't, you did. By doing so, you opened the door to "why would someone say that? it doesn't make sense" lines of thought.

The important thing is that you can't admit a mistake. So while you're not likely a cannibal (though it is also entirely possible you are), you have at least demonstrated narcissistic tendencies (an inability to admit to being wrong is a common sign). I'm just devastated that I've been included in your wall of shame. Gosh, it stings so bad...
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