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*Official* CBA Negotiations and Lockout Thread


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#4171 Boudrias

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 03:25 PM

I think the problem might be that the owners only offered to increase their "make whole" IF players agreed to a 10-year CBA which for some reason they don't want. That, to be honest, is a mystery to me. It's not like they ever get better for the players, so having a longer one seems like it would be in the players' interest. Still, it's a jerk move on the NHL's part to agree to "make whole" only part of the signed contracts (while still calling it "make whole"), putting some of it in pensions instead of lump payments and making it contingent on another unrelated factor.

But D-Money makes an excellent point. Maybe the players do believe they'll be able to get a better deal in a few years, especially if they have to agree to things like a term and variance contract limit to get this deal done. I'd love to know how long they want the CBA to be. IF the players want one around the same length of the last one they could be fighting over just a few years here, in which case it seems a little dumb for the NHL to be dragging their feet for an extra-long CBA anyway. Instead of asking for a longer CBA they could just try behaving like business-minded adults who don't just lockout players every time the old one expires instead of trying to work out a fair deal.

A 10 year CBA with a mutual option to end it in 8 years. I believe the PA wanted a 5 year deal. Agreed on the make whole which IMO has to be 100% of the signed contract. Should be a way they could take that outside the new CBA and force the franchises to make good.

"It's not like it ever gets better for the players". I would suggest the players did very well under the old CBA. When it was signed it was the end of the world for the players. AT the end they were splitting $1.88 billion. I'm not suggesting the owners did that on purpose.
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#4172 DeNiro

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 03:25 PM

These "grown men" need to stop acting like a bunch of babies, and stop getting so emotional when they don't agree. Both sides want whats best for themselves, but they have to find a common ground based on giving and taking.

I was afraid that the buddy buddy feeling would wear off as soon as they start talking about the numbers again.

Lets just hope that cooler heads prevail, and they realize that they're too close to give up now.
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#4173 playboi19

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 03:27 PM

Knew this was going to happen, it's so predictable. It's been the same thing for 3 months, but at least they actually made some progress before losing their sh*t this time.

Deal will ultimately get done, the players will get their money either way. The Owners will find loopholes again and the players will get paid.

Hopefully the next high isn't followed by a low and this rollercoster ride is over.
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#4174 Mauii

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:22 PM

Owners = 50/50 HRR
Players = Existing contracts honored in full; bottom line owners offered it, now honor it...to not do so is just poor business practice; they'd probably have to make this up in the first 2-3 years in HRR share; unless another formula was proposed and i missed it
CBA = 7 years with option to extend and amend year to year...maybe won't have to have lockouts with room for tweaking before things get out of hand...give time to clean up extended contracts and get a sense of the state of the new CBA without being stuck to it for 10 years. The NHL should know better when they sign lengthy contracts.
Contract Length = 6 years seems reasonable for average hockey career, unlimited contract lengths gets out of control and tends to exceed the realm of the CBA and into unknown territory; 5% variance seems uneccessary with a 6 year limit, you can't really circumvent the cap with a 6 year contract, 15 years yes...6 years no

That's my proposal

Edited by Mauii, 06 December 2012 - 05:07 PM.

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#4175 -Vintage Canuck-

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:24 PM

@FriedgeHNIC
Fehr/players to meet media approx 630 ET
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#4176 poetica

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:27 PM

ESPN_Burnside

NHLPA executive director Donald Fehr and assorted players will meet with media shortly. Can you say Kaboom?


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#4177 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:30 PM

This is it.

This is the end.
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#4178 Lui's Knob

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:30 PM

Afraid Fehr just intentionally stalled a December start to a shortened season. Been dragging his heels thinking there's more to offer and by doing so is asking for mediators to return. Will shoot down past 2 days as "corporate banter" and do his best Alan Alda impersonation. This guy is a __________. Owners are done with him and will cancel the season in January.
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#4179 -Vintage Canuck-

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:32 PM

@DarrenDreger
PA made presentation today. Say time is now to make a deal. Say addressed league concerns.
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#4180 Shift-4

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:32 PM

So glad I never got sucked into the optimism.
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#4181 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:33 PM

Here is the deal.

50/50 split. Keep the salary cap at 70 mil or 64 mil ...........(or lower it immediately to 50% and have 'make whole' provisions which is the same thing )....... until the contracts on upper spending teams deflates to 50% then carry on.

5 year contracts, fewer players exposed to waivers, UFA age up to 28.

I have been writing the same thing for 2 months on this thread.

Either do this or cancel the season. Just make up your bloody minds for chirsts sake.


This already been offered and declined by the PA.
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#4182 250Integra

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:38 PM

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#4183 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:41 PM

@DarrenDreger
PA made presentation today. Say time is now to make a deal. Say addressed league concerns.


Excellent.

This is my deal (on the main issues):

- 50/50 Split HRR here on out and $340 Million In Transition payments ("make whole") to the PA
- UFA stays at 27 years, along with the arbitration stays the same aswell.
- Max contract length for an RFA is 7 years (so you can sign good young players long term, ex. Hall, Skinner, Stamkos exc.)
- Max contract length for a UFA 5 Years.

We seem very close, no reason for these stalling and games, both sides still have to move a bit closer together then it is done.

Edited by Smashian Kassian, 06 December 2012 - 04:41 PM.

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#4184 -Vintage Canuck-

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:45 PM

@TheFourthPeriod
Fehr says NHL offered an 8-yr agreement, with an opt-out for players after year 6
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#4185 Canuck or Die

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:47 PM

God, they better not screw this up.

Edited by Canuck or Die, 06 December 2012 - 04:47 PM.

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#4186 Hobble

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:48 PM

Fehr's counter proposal sounds reasonable.
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#4187 Dirt Nasty

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:49 PM

Its crunch time now for both sides, either grow up, stop acting like children and figure out the best deal possible for both sides that will work, or just cancel the damn season and stop getting everyones hopes up and hopefully they can figure their crap out so we can at least have hockey come next september.
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#4188 poetica

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:49 PM

Real_ESPNLeBrun
Fehr says he believes there's agreement on pension issue


Real_ESPNLeBrun
On player contract length - NHLPA offered 8-year term limit (league wants 5)


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Every single one of them.

Thanks for the memories, Luo! :'(

#4189 -Vintage Canuck-

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:50 PM

God, they better not screw this up.


According to Pierre LeBrun, NHLPA offered 8-year term limit but the league wants 5 years.
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#4190 BCNeil

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:50 PM

@TheFourthPeriod
Fehr says NHL offered an 8-yr agreement, with an opt-out for players after year 6


My understanding is the NHL offered a 10 yr, that either side could opt out year 8.
The NHLPA countered with 8 yrs, with opt out at 6
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#4191 JustJokinen!

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:51 PM

This is all sounding very positive. My apologies to all the negative Nancys here.
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#4192 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:51 PM


TEAM Radio@TEAM1040

Fehr: We believe we have an agreement on dollars. If that's the case, we expect there can be an agreement soon



We've kicked down the biggest door.

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#4193 -Vintage Canuck-

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:53 PM

@ToddCordell
Fehr: if we get a positive response it shouldn't take too long (to reach an agreement)

Appears much closer now than we were several days ago.
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#4194 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:53 PM

TEAM Radio@TEAM1040
Fehr: admits the length of player contracts (PA wants 8, league at 5) is the main stumbling block right now

Wow pretty small main issue IMO.

Edited by Smashian Kassian, 06 December 2012 - 04:54 PM.

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#4195 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:54 PM

I retract my 'This is the end' statement. For now.

But Fehr has been positive before only for Gary to come out and deny anything positive took place.
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#4196 Shift-4

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:55 PM

This is all sounding very positive. My apologies to all the negative Nancys here.


When Bettman says the PA's offer is good or Fehr says the NHL's offer is good then it will sound positive.


Until then...................call me Nancy ::D
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#4197 forever_hope

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:55 PM

^ sounds like a ploy to put the league back into the spotlight again if they don't continue the talks..

If it was really that close then there's no reason that Bettman and owners didn't attend meeting today?..
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#4198 -Vintage Canuck-

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:56 PM

@jessespector
Fehr: “There will be a vote when there’s a proposed agreement.”
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#4199 Hobble

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:56 PM

8 years is reasonable for player contracts, considering they said player contracts as long as 7-8 years cannot have the last years salary less than 25% than the first.

Will help fight those front loaded contracts.
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#4200 JustJokinen!

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 04:58 PM

When Bettman says the PA's offer is good or Fehr says the NHL's offer is good then it will sound positive.


Until then...................call me Nancy ::D


That's a very reasonable offer.
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