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#211 Jägermeister

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Posted 01 January 2013 - 05:32 PM

Workers do not get to consent to be exposed to a workplace hazard that can be abated or reduced.

There are hazardous workplaces but they are subject to regulation to abate or reduce hazards as much as possible - banning smoking and reducing exposure to secondhand smoke is one such regulation.


Again, I know this, I was just making reference to the fact that I find that odd that they cannot consent to such things.
I'm not questioning the legality of the issue, I am more questioning the purpose behind such laws.

Edited by Jägermeister, 01 January 2013 - 05:33 PM.

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#212 Wetcoaster

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Posted 01 January 2013 - 05:34 PM

Support to the position that the smoking laws in this country are COMPLETELY out of hand? You're damn right I am. "Odd" is a matter of perception, second of all.

Seems reasonable to whatever jurisdiction that is responsible for enacting and enforcing the particular laws that you are kvetching about seems to be in line with what the US Surgeon General has found to be a serious health hazard as set out in The Health Consequences of Involuntary Exposure to Tobacco Smoke: A Report of the Surgeon General. U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, National Center for Chronic Disease Prevention and Health Promotion, Office on Smoking and Health, 2006.
http://www.surgeonge...moke/index.html

It also seems reasonable to me and the City of Vancouver and Province of BC who have adopted the conclusions of the above-noted report.
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#213 Scott Hartnell's Mane

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Posted 01 January 2013 - 05:35 PM

Seems reasonable to whatever jurisdiction that is responsible for enacting and enforcing the particular laws that you are kvetching about seems to be in line with what the US Surgeon General has found to be a serious health hazard as set out in The Health Consequences of Involuntary Exposure to Tobacco Smoke: A Report of the Surgeon General. U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, National Center for Chronic Disease Prevention and Health Promotion, Office on Smoking and Health, 2006.
http://www.surgeonge...moke/index.html

It also seems reasonable to me and the City of Vancouver and Province of BC who have adopted the conclusions of the above-noted report.


For the last time,...I'm NOT in Vancouver or BC...so your tired, rote, nonsense has nothing at all to do with me...get that through your thick skull.
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View PostScott Hartnell, on 11 June 2013 - 02:11 PM, said:

Well I tell you what Heretic..if Tim Tebow becomes Terry Bradshaw I will shave off all my hair, convert to Christianity, go into the ministry and become a preacher.

#214 Wetcoaster

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Posted 01 January 2013 - 05:35 PM

Again, I know this, I was just making reference to the fact that I find that odd that they cannot consent to such things.
I'm not questioning the legality of the issue, I am more questioning the purpose behind such laws.

You cannot consent to an occupational health hazard that can be regulated or abated. That is the governing principle of occupational health and safety laws.
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To err is human - but to really screw up you need a computer.

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#215 Wetcoaster

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Posted 01 January 2013 - 05:38 PM

For the last time,...I'm NOT in Vancouver or BC...so your tired, rote, nonsense has nothing at all to do with me...get that through your thick skull.

I am fully aware that you claim to not be not in Canada but we are speaking about smoking regulation in general and since you allegedly live in the US, the US Surgeon General's report would be applicable, eh?

And I have provided information and cites that apply. Unlike yourself.
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To err is human - but to really screw up you need a computer.

Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done and why. Then do it.

Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati

Illegitimi non carborundum.

Never try to teach a pig to sing - it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

#216 lowest common denominator

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Posted 01 January 2013 - 10:40 PM

Butt out. First of all, Mr No attention to detail...it wasn't ME who "allegedly" broke the law...second of all this dick has been giving us crap since we were 14...he used to be the resource officer at our high school and got caught with a bottle of whiskey in his office. I wouldn't urinate on him if he were on fire...




Man you sound like a caricature of Tommy Chong in a cheech n chong movie, where he plays a caricature of a pot head. That makes you a double caricature.

I normally wouldn't care to respond but you are advocating for second hand cigarette smoke.

So you have some kind of Barney Fife character who seems to have alot of power and influence over your life while you are grooving and puffing the chiba eh? Sounds rough. Fight the power bro'. Righteous

Edited by scottiecanuck, 01 January 2013 - 10:44 PM.

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#217 Scott Hartnell's Mane

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Posted 01 January 2013 - 10:51 PM

Man you sound like a caricature of Tommy Chong in a cheech n chong movie, where he plays a caricature of a pot head. That makes you a double caricature.

I normally wouldn't care to respond but you are advocating for second hand cigarette smoke.

So you have some kind of Barney Fife character who seems to have alot of power and influence over your life while you are grooving and puffing the chiba eh? Sounds rough. Fight the power bro'. Righteous


What I'm advocating for is fairness when it comes to dealing with these petty instances like the one my friend and I experienced. Second hand smoke is not something I advocate. I want the non-smokers to grant a little leeway when it comes to smoking cigarettes outdoors, seeing as how they've successfully removed the smoke from indoors...they cannot have it both ways...Don't want it inside, in a restaurant, in a bar...fine...but when it comes to the outdoors? They really need to stop being so snivelly about it. Middle ground would be nice on this issue...
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View PostScott Hartnell, on 11 June 2013 - 02:11 PM, said:

Well I tell you what Heretic..if Tim Tebow becomes Terry Bradshaw I will shave off all my hair, convert to Christianity, go into the ministry and become a preacher.

#218 Buddhas Hand

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Posted 01 January 2013 - 11:03 PM

Seems reasonable to whatever jurisdiction that is responsible for enacting and enforcing the particular laws that you are kvetching about seems to be in line with what the US Surgeon General has found to be a serious health hazard as set out in The Health Consequences of Involuntary Exposure to Tobacco Smoke: A Report of the Surgeon General. U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, National Center for Chronic Disease Prevention and Health Promotion, Office on Smoking and Health, 2006.
http://www.surgeonge...moke/index.html

It also seems reasonable to me and the City of Vancouver and Province of BC who have adopted the conclusions of the above-noted report.


I wish we could introduce laws that would stop me from having , Involuntary exposure to stupidity .

This is very detrimental to my health , and raises my stress levels.
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#219 Wetcoaster

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Posted 01 January 2013 - 11:04 PM

What I'm advocating for is fairness when it comes to dealing with these petty instances like the one my friend and I experienced. Second hand smoke is not something I advocate. I want the non-smokers to grant a little leeway when it comes to smoking cigarettes outdoors, seeing as how they've successfully removed the smoke from indoors...they cannot have it both ways...Don't want it inside, in a restaurant, in a bar...fine...but when it comes to the outdoors? They really need to stop being so snivelly about it. Middle ground would be nice on this issue...

Fairness??? Not with the potential for harm from secondhand smoke even from the briefest exposure.

Why would any sane person risk any exposure to second hand smoke outdoors or indoors based upon the findings of the US Surgeon General in the 2006 report ~ The Health Consequences of Involuntary Exposure to Tobacco Smoke: A Report of the Surgeon General, U.S. Department of Health and Human Services.

Secondhand smoke is composed of sidestream smoke (the smoke released from the burning end of a cigarette) and exhaled mainstream smoke (the smoke exhaled by the smoker). Because sidestream smoke is generated at lower temperatures and under different conditions than mainstream smoke, it contains higher concentrations of many of the toxins found in inhaled cigarette smoke.

The U.S. Surgeon General has concluded that breathing even a little secondhand smoke poses a risk to your health. Scientific evidence indicates that there is no risk-free level of exposure to secondhand smoke. Breathing even a little secondhand smoke can be harmful to your health. Secondhand smoke is a known human carcinogen and contains more than 50 chemicals that can cause cancer. Concentrations of many cancer-causing and toxic chemicals are potentially higher in secondhand smoke than in the smoke inhaled by smokers.

Breathing secondhand smoke for even a short time can have immediate adverse effects on the cardiovascular system, interfering with the normal functioning of the heart, blood, and vascular systems in ways that increase the risk of heart attack.


Secondhand smoke causes acute respiratory effects as it contains many chemicals that can quickly irritate and damage the lining of the airways and even brief exposure can trigger respiratory symptoms, including cough, phlegm, wheezing, and breathlessness. Brief exposure to secondhand smoke can trigger an asthma attack in children with asthma and persons who already have asthma or other respiratory conditions are at especially high risk for being affected by secondhand smoke, and should take special precautions to avoid secondhand smoke exposure.
http://www.surgeonge...moke/index.html

There is no "leeway" available in respect of secondhand smoke nor should there be.

Edited by Wetcoaster, 01 January 2013 - 11:05 PM.

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#220 Scott Hartnell's Mane

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Posted 01 January 2013 - 11:05 PM

*
POPULAR

Fairness??? Not with the potential for harm from secondhand smoke even from the briefest exposure.

Why would any sane person risk any exposure to second hand smoke outdoors or indoors based upon the findings of the US Surgeon General in the 2006 report ~ The Health Consequences of Involuntary Exposure to Tobacco Smoke: A Report of the Surgeon General, U.S. Department of Health and Human Services.

Secondhand smoke is composed of sidestream smoke (the smoke released from the burning end of a cigarette) and exhaled mainstream smoke (the smoke exhaled by the smoker). Because sidestream smoke is generated at lower temperatures and under different conditions than mainstream smoke, it contains higher concentrations of many of the toxins found in inhaled cigarette smoke.


The U.S. Surgeon General has concluded that breathing even a little secondhand smoke poses a risk to your health. Scientific evidence indicates that there is no risk-free level of exposure to secondhand smoke. Breathing even a little secondhand smoke can be harmful to your health. Secondhand smoke is a known human carcinogen and contains more than 50 chemicals that can cause cancer. Concentrations of many cancer-causing and toxic chemicals are potentially higher in secondhand smoke than in the smoke inhaled by smokers.

Breathing secondhand smoke for even a short time can have immediate adverse effects on the cardiovascular system, interfering with the normal functioning of the heart, blood, and vascular systems in ways that increase the risk of heart attack.


Secondhand smoke causes acute respiratory effects as it contains many chemicals that can quickly irritate and damage the lining of the airways and
even brief exposure can trigger respiratory symptoms, including cough, phlegm, wheezing, and breathlessness. Brief exposure to secondhand smoke can trigger an asthma attack in children with asthma and persons who already have asthma or other respiratory conditions are at especially high risk for being affected by secondhand smoke, and should take special precautions to avoid secondhand smoke exposure.
http://www.surgeonge...moke/index.html

There is no "leeway" available in respect of secondhand smoke nor should there be.


Dude I wasn't talking to you, be quiet.
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View PostScott Hartnell, on 11 June 2013 - 02:11 PM, said:

Well I tell you what Heretic..if Tim Tebow becomes Terry Bradshaw I will shave off all my hair, convert to Christianity, go into the ministry and become a preacher.

#221 Wetcoaster

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Posted 01 January 2013 - 11:06 PM

DP

Edited by Wetcoaster, 01 January 2013 - 11:07 PM.

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#222 Wetcoaster

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Posted 01 January 2013 - 11:06 PM

Dude I wasn't talking to you, be quiet.

I am talking to you.
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To err is human - but to really screw up you need a computer.

Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done and why. Then do it.

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Never try to teach a pig to sing - it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

#223 Salmonberries

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 01:34 AM

Harrumph!

Humbug!!

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#224 Salmonberries

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 02:09 AM

For the last time,...I'm NOT in Vancouver or BC...so your tired, rote, nonsense has nothing at all to do with me...get that through your thick skull.

Consider yourself fortunate.
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#225 lowest common denominator

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 09:03 AM

Smokers just don't understand the effect even the smallest amount of second hand smoke has on someone who doesn't smoke, especially if they have an allergy to it. I'm talking about immediate and long term effects.

Add to that it is a destructive habit with zero benefits and I don't have any patience for it. 20 years ago, it was more acceptable, but so was drinking and driving. Allthe info is out there now for people to make an intelligent and informed decision so if you still choose cigarettes, then I say you are feeble minded.

If you choose to smoke, gfy, but getting alll self righteous and playing the victim is quite pathetic when you are ignorantly exposing others to your stupidity against their will.
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#226 lowest common denominator

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 09:05 AM

I wish we could introduce laws that would stop me from having , Involuntary exposure to stupidity .

This is very detrimental to my health , and raises my stress levels.


I think you are going to need to ween yourself off the cdc if that is the case!
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#227 Bertuzzi Babe

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 09:29 AM

Smokers just don't understand the effect even the smallest amount of second hand smoke has on someone who doesn't smoke, especially if they have an allergy to it. I'm talking about immediate and long term effects.

Add to that it is a destructive habit with zero benefits and I don't have any patience for it. 20 years ago, it was more acceptable, but so was drinking and driving. Allthe info is out there now for people to make an intelligent and informed decision so if you still choose cigarettes, then I say you are feeble minded.

If you choose to smoke, gfy, but getting alll self righteous and playing the victim is quite pathetic when you are ignorantly exposing others to your stupidity against their will.


Er-mah-gard........ :picard:


The next time I step outside at 10 PM and catch a whiff of cigarette smoke from my 79 year old neighbour's cancer stick as she smokes on the patio in her own back yard, I'll be sure to rush right over to the fence and start castigating her with my self-righteous views on smoking. <_<

Who the hell am I, and who the hell are you, to tell anyone who is obeying the current regulations about where to smoke that they cannot smoke there? If I'm smoking and I'm the only person at the bus stop til the self-righteous anti-smoker shows up, then why should I have to be the one to move? If I chose to smoke in my own back yard and the smoke drifts across the property line, what gives a non-smoking neighbour the right to bitch me out and take me to task? Hell. barbecue smoke has carcinogens in it, does my neighbour now have the right to bitch me out about the smoke drifting over the fence?

I don't think YOU get it. I'm allergic to the odiferous leavings of your shower gel from your morning shower, does that give me the right to bitch at you in the elevator or as you walk in front of me down the sidewalk or stand beside me at the bus stop? Hell no, it doesn't. I either hold my breath or remove myself from your proximity.

Fine, you don't have any patience for the habit of smoking........personally, perhaps, I have no patience for your nervous habit of drumming your fingers on the table.......it serves no purpose, it can be damaging to people's hearing.........yeah, see how ridiculous that sounds?

Now don't go playing 'the victim' on us.......drumming those fingers as you furiously attempt to come up with some other derogatory remark to direct against the 'feeble-minded'.

Edited by Bertuzzi Babe, 02 January 2013 - 09:36 AM.

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#228 lowest common denominator

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 09:43 AM

Drumming fingers on the table is alot like second hand smoke. As is shower gel. The parallels are obvious.

Smoking is dumb on so many levels, but it is your choice.

I remember a poster in high school. It had pictures of nine different animals, a chicken, a monkey, a horse, a dog and so on. Each animal had a lit cigarette hanging out of it's mouth/beak and the quote at the bottom said "It looks just as stupid when you do it" Priceless

I don't go around picking fights with smokers, I avoid them when possible. But if someone is gonna get on here and start saying things like "We should be able to smoke in bars etc" or "Non smokers stay inside, smokers get the outside", I'm gonna call 'em on it.
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#229 Scott Hartnell's Mane

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 10:20 AM

Smokers just don't understand the effect even the smallest amount of second hand smoke has on someone who doesn't smoke, especially if they have an allergy to it. I'm talking about immediate and long term effects.

Add to that it is a destructive habit with zero benefits and I don't have any patience for it. 20 years ago, it was more acceptable, but so was drinking and driving. Allthe info is out there now for people to make an intelligent and informed decision so if you still choose cigarettes, then I say you are feeble minded.

If you choose to smoke, gfy, but getting alll self righteous and playing the victim is quite pathetic when you are ignorantly exposing others to your stupidity against their will.


Let me introduce you to a new skill...it's called Reading Comprehension. I've stated...over and over again...that it wasn't me who was smoking...so stifle. You know what's really pathetic? people who haven't the slightest clue of the details surrounding a situation and inanely throwing in their two cents, making a judgment call, telling someone they are playing the victim while suffering from diarrhea of the mouth...that's what's pathetic.

Edited by Munchie Marauder, 02 January 2013 - 10:21 AM.

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View PostScott Hartnell, on 11 June 2013 - 02:11 PM, said:

Well I tell you what Heretic..if Tim Tebow becomes Terry Bradshaw I will shave off all my hair, convert to Christianity, go into the ministry and become a preacher.

#230 Scott Hartnell's Mane

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 10:32 AM

Er-mah-gard........ :picard:


The next time I step outside at 10 PM and catch a whiff of cigarette smoke from my 79 year old neighbour's cancer stick as she smokes on the patio in her own back yard, I'll be sure to rush right over to the fence and start castigating her with my self-righteous views on smoking. <_<

Who the hell am I, and who the hell are you, to tell anyone who is obeying the current regulations about where to smoke that they cannot smoke there? If I'm smoking and I'm the only person at the bus stop til the self-righteous anti-smoker shows up, then why should I have to be the one to move? If I chose to smoke in my own back yard and the smoke drifts across the property line, what gives a non-smoking neighbour the right to bitch me out and take me to task? Hell. barbecue smoke has carcinogens in it, does my neighbour now have the right to bitch me out about the smoke drifting over the fence?

I don't think YOU get it. I'm allergic to the odiferous leavings of your shower gel from your morning shower, does that give me the right to bitch at you in the elevator or as you walk in front of me down the sidewalk or stand beside me at the bus stop? Hell no, it doesn't. I either hold my breath or remove myself from your proximity.

Fine, you don't have any patience for the habit of smoking........personally, perhaps, I have no patience for your nervous habit of drumming your fingers on the table.......it serves no purpose, it can be damaging to people's hearing.........yeah, see how ridiculous that sounds?

Now don't go playing 'the victim' on us.......drumming those fingers as you furiously attempt to come up with some other derogatory remark to direct against the 'feeble-minded'.


Holy **** I think I'm in love. :wub:
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View PostScott Hartnell, on 11 June 2013 - 02:11 PM, said:

Well I tell you what Heretic..if Tim Tebow becomes Terry Bradshaw I will shave off all my hair, convert to Christianity, go into the ministry and become a preacher.

#231 Riviera82

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 11:26 AM

What I'm advocating for is fairness when it comes to dealing with these petty instances like the one my friend and I experienced. Second hand smoke is not something I advocate. I want the non-smokers to grant a little leeway when it comes to smoking cigarettes outdoors, seeing as how they've successfully removed the smoke from indoors...they cannot have it both ways...Don't want it inside, in a restaurant, in a bar...fine...but when it comes to the outdoors? They really need to stop being so snivelly about it. Middle ground would be nice on this issue...


We are in full agreement. +1
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#232 Wetcoaster

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 11:29 AM

Let me introduce you to a new skill...it's called Reading Comprehension. I've stated...over and over again...that it wasn't me who was smoking...so stifle. You know what's really pathetic? people who haven't the slightest clue of the details surrounding a situation and inanely throwing in their two cents, making a judgment call, telling someone they are playing the victim while suffering from diarrhea of the mouth...that's what's pathetic.

And yet you constantly refer to this incident and include yourself in it. Why is that?
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To err is human - but to really screw up you need a computer.

Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done and why. Then do it.

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#233 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 11:41 AM

Holy **** I think I'm in love. :wub:


You'll have to get in line Munchie...

BB's got a long list of CDC suitors.
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#234 Salmonberries

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 04:05 PM

Smokers just don't understand the effect even the smallest amount of second hand smoke has on someone who doesn't smoke, especially if they have an allergy to it. I'm talking about immediate and long term effects.

Add to that it is a destructive habit with zero benefits and I don't have any patience for it. 20 years ago, it was more acceptable, but so was drinking and driving. Allthe info is out there now for people to make an intelligent and informed decision so if you still choose cigarettes, then I say you are feeble minded.

If you choose to smoke, gfy, but getting alll self righteous and playing the victim is quite pathetic when you are ignorantly exposing others to your stupidity against their will.

LOL!!!

Choice eh??!!

Yeah right.
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#235 jmfaminoff

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 05:04 PM

You cannot legislate common sense. The perils of smoking are out there, and secondhand smoke is dangerous. The problem is that those who smoke are addicted and they are so pompously arrogant that they could care less about anyone else around them. For people who do not smoke or those that have allergies to it have the right to breath clean air more than a smoker has the right to smoke, especially in places like restaurants, casinos, bars, and hotels. And I would even say in apartment buildings and multifamily dwellings.
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#236 Tearloch7

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 05:42 PM

I pack a pistol .. a water pistol, and I shoot offending cigarettes as is my right as a free thinking, gun-packing Northerner .. smoke near me and pay the price,"sucker" .. B)
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"To Thine Own Self Be True"

 

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#237 Scott Hartnell's Mane

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 06:43 PM

You cannot legislate common sense. The perils of smoking are out there, and secondhand smoke is dangerous. The problem is that those who smoke are addicted and they are so pompously arrogant that they could care less about anyone else around them. For people who do not smoke or those that have allergies to it have the right to breath clean air more than a smoker has the right to smoke, especially in places like restaurants, casinos, bars, and hotels. And I would even say in apartment buildings and multifamily dwellings.


Really...so all of them are pompously arrogant eh...and you know this how? Oh and by the way as has been featured throughout this thread, the non-smokers are just as pompous as the smokers are....in many cases even more so.

Edited by Munchie Marauder, 02 January 2013 - 06:48 PM.

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View PostScott Hartnell, on 11 June 2013 - 02:11 PM, said:

Well I tell you what Heretic..if Tim Tebow becomes Terry Bradshaw I will shave off all my hair, convert to Christianity, go into the ministry and become a preacher.

#238 Salmonberries

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 06:46 PM

The government would end the commercial tobacco industry if they were serious and place the addicts on a prescription tobacco maintenance program with access to education and cessation therapies if their anti-smoking stance was legit. End of cigarette smoking in a generation. It's phony of course, like everything else is that they espouse. They are wedded to that revenue stream.

They'll continue along in their effort to marginalize the addicts socially though. It's good politics.
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#239 ashbury

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 08:05 PM

I'm 19, I'm about to go out for a smoke. Suck it CDC
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#240 Gumballthechewy

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 11:53 PM

I'm 19, I'm about to go out for a smoke. Suck it CDC


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