Jump to content

Welcome to canucks.com Vancouver Canucks homepage

Photo
- - - - -

Some perspective to put it all in context

Discussion

  • Please log in to reply
9 replies to this topic

#1 shadowgoon

shadowgoon

    Comets Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 688 posts
  • Joined: 03-January 10

Posted 04 May 2013 - 08:07 AM

Last nights overtime loss was far from the fault of goaltending; Luongo stood on his head on MULTIPLE occasions. The loss in fact has a direct correlation to poor coaching decisions made by Alain Vigneault. The Sedins don't defend on PK's, so why would he deem it appropriate to have them on the ice for a 6 on 5 in the last minute of the game?

I am a lot less optimistic going into the Shark tank down 2-0 in the series, given that SJ has made sure we receive a proper thrashing this season every time we've played there, the outlook does not appear favorable.

For the time that Gillis & Co have been here, along with Vigneault, all we've managed to do is go on one epic cup run, and cultivate/rejuvenate a very good regular season team, completely incapable of succeeding in the playoffs.

There's an identity crisis happening, though it seems to be evolving into what the Canucks should be: a gritty hard nosed in your face blue collar team, but it will never fully get there until the Sedins are no longer the face of this franchise.

Before you jump down my throat, I'm not saying that this indictment should read as "Trade the Sedins", what I'm saying is until the Sedins retire the torch shall never be fully passed along.

The only saving grace in my opinion, is the Sedins' desire to retire from the NHL and finish their playing careers while they still have elite level talent left in the tank, with them being 32 and their contract expiring upon the conclusion of next season, it is my hope that they re-sign for 1-2 years.

Time enough to bridge the gap during a retool on the fly and with a change in management and coaching to win the Cup with this current core. The focus however has to shift from the Sedins as our primary threat, Kesler I believe has returned to the elite road after a two year sojourn through purgatory and should be the next captain of the Canucks; indeed the NEW identity moving forward.

I am so thankful that we've been graced with the Sedins for their entire careers to date, in fact I'm thankful as a fan having grown up to see Stan Smyl, Richard Brodeur, Harold Snepts, Petri Skriko and their brothers in arms in the twilight's of their careers; only to move on to see Trevor Linden, Pavel Bure, Kirk McLean and Alexander Mogilny pick up the torch.

I have suffered through the darkest days of the franchise to be rewarded with the WCE, like a phoenix rising from the ashes to provide without a doubt the most dominant stretch of play in Canucks history; the graceful transition from WCE into the Sedin era the past decade and change has been, how shall I say, medicating.

It's lulled me into a state of acceptance where it's great to see the team succeeding in general but leaves me feeling empty when it matters most. I see this team slowly evolving if you will back into the spirit of the 80's club, albeit with much more skill.

The Sedins will not fetch a return for this club, they will indeed retire as Canucks as they should, my only hope is that they do so as the first players to win the Stanley cup as so many before them, themselves included have failed to do so despite coming so very close.

Let's be fortunate with what we have and where the team is at right now, let's battle through this adversity in the here and now, knowing that the future is not insecure.

Go Canucks Go.
  • 1

#2 kassian's lost tooth

kassian's lost tooth

    Comets Prospect

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 189 posts
  • Joined: 19-July 12

Posted 04 May 2013 - 08:16 AM

Wow. Well put.
  • 0

#3 CB007

CB007

    Canucks First-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,661 posts
  • Joined: 23-October 03

Posted 04 May 2013 - 08:41 AM

We were 2 inches from scoring the empty netter and winning game 2.....

Yes the Sedins need to play better, yes our D needs to get bigger in the off season, yes we need to get away from this advanced stats mentality, but all is not lost.
  • 2
Posted Image

#4 literaphile

literaphile

    Comets Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 532 posts
  • Joined: 25-March 06

Posted 04 May 2013 - 08:53 AM

Hansen missed an empty net and the Canucks gave up a bad 2-on-1. And yet you blame the loss on the coach?
  • 0

#5 shadowgoon

shadowgoon

    Comets Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 688 posts
  • Joined: 03-January 10

Posted 04 May 2013 - 08:53 AM

We were 2 inches from scoring the empty netter and winning game 2.....

Yes the Sedins need to play better, yes our D needs to get bigger in the off season, yes we need to get away from this advanced stats mentality, but all is not lost.


That's missing the point here though. Yes, 2 inches and the series would have been tied, but it would have masked the problems inherently present.

Bagging on the negatives wasn't the point of my thread, it was to illustrate that despite every peak we hit, there seems to be an equal rebound. The current team is nearing it's due date for an engine overhaul, but with timely oil changes and proper maintenance there is some life left yet in this ride.
  • 0

#6 debluvscanucks

debluvscanucks

    Canucks Hall-of-Famer

  • Super Moderators
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 23,582 posts
  • Joined: 19-February 08

Posted 04 May 2013 - 08:58 AM

We were 2 inches from scoring the empty netter and winning game 2.....

Yes the Sedins need to play better, yes our D needs to get bigger in the off season, yes we need to get away from this advanced stats mentality, but all is not lost.


Ah, sigh, thank you for being here....

The "identity crisis" spoken about here is actually the team having to transition away from where the game was supposed to be headed. Personally, I like the old school hit 'em hard hockey but, after the Bertuzzi and other incidents, the league freaked out and went "we have to change things (to cover our asses)" but didn't really mean it or follow through with any consistency. They gave lip service and have, to some degree, made some adjustments but that wasn't evenly applied. Some teams got away with physical play, others had to watch their step. I, for one, love the whistles in the pockets way of doing playoffs, but they pick and choose. Not saying it's been why we've lost, just why the team has had to change how they've played. The past dictated that they were tentative and unsure, and it's carried over to some degree. Kes abandoned it all last night and said "screw it, we're taking this...if I go down, it's swinging".

This isn't a whine about the refs response, more that the Sedins have HAD to play differently. Teams did figure them out and started to really target them....now, in the ideal league that did protect their players, it would have been addressed. But it wasn't and they've been mugged, mauled and jumped in the past and have learned to fight back (yes, they have - did you see Hank's hit near the end of the game last night?). So I just see them having to play a different game...obviously, a gameplan that's worked against the Canucks. They've had to watch their backs and give some back. People used to whine they're soft....now they're whining that they don't play well enough. It's all about balance.

They've had to sacrifice one for the other to some degree. Not their fault, just the way the game has gone. They're still A+ in my books.
  • 1

Posted Image


#7 shadowgoon

shadowgoon

    Comets Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 688 posts
  • Joined: 03-January 10

Posted 04 May 2013 - 08:59 AM

Hansen missed an empty net and the Canucks gave up a bad 2-on-1. And yet you blame the loss on the coach?


The coaches decisions ultimately affected the outcome of the game. His decisions to put the personnel on the ice at the times he chose. Sedins are not really that good defensively, and the entire game were being overwhelmed by the opposition... so AV puts them on the ice in the final minute.

Edler has been shaky for awhile now, making ill advised pinches at bluelines, missing pucks etc.... directly led to the 2 on 1.

If I'm the coach and I recognize these things, the same as anyone with two pairs of eyes has the potential to recognize them, and don't make the adjustments necessary to improve the odds of success, then inherently the loss is on me.

Yes it's up to the players to perform and make the plays, but it's up to the coach to make the decisions to put the right players in the right situations to maximize strengths and reduce weaknesses.

If I was AV, I would have ridden the pairings of Hamhuis-Corrado, Garrison-Bieksa and Edler-Alberts with the weight of the playing time given to the top pairing, and the least amount to Edler.

I would have also ridden the hell out of Kesler, he was on fire. He's the most rested of any Canuck this season and was essentially Thor's hammer out there.
  • 0

#8 erkayloomeh

erkayloomeh

    Comets Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 841 posts
  • Joined: 13-August 11

Posted 04 May 2013 - 09:03 AM

Good post OP.
I wonder if we can trade luongo, Edler, Ballard and unload booth and raymond we can come up with a firstline winger who is deadly, Maybe with that winger and kesler the sedins would be better suited for second line duty. At least competiton would be created for first line minutes.
  • 0
GOD BE PRAISED

#9 aqua59

aqua59

    Canucks Regular

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,818 posts
  • Joined: 16-January 08

Posted 04 May 2013 - 10:24 AM

Last nights overtime loss was far from the fault of goaltending; Luongo stood on his head on MULTIPLE occasions. The loss in fact has a direct correlation to poor coaching decisions made by Alain Vigneault. The Sedins don't defend on PK's, so why would he deem it appropriate to have them on the ice for a 6 on 5 in the last minute of the game?

I am a lot less optimistic going into the Shark tank down 2-0 in the series, given that SJ has made sure we receive a proper thrashing this season every time we've played there, the outlook does not appear favorable.

For the time that Gillis & Co have been here, along with Vigneault, all we've managed to do is go on one epic cup run, and cultivate/rejuvenate a very good regular season team, completely incapable of succeeding in the playoffs.

There's an identity crisis happening, though it seems to be evolving into what the Canucks should be: a gritty hard nosed in your face blue collar team, but it will never fully get there until the Sedins are no longer the face of this franchise.

Before you jump down my throat, I'm not saying that this indictment should read as "Trade the Sedins", what I'm saying is until the Sedins retire the torch shall never be fully passed along.

The only saving grace in my opinion, is the Sedins' desire to retire from the NHL and finish their playing careers while they still have elite level talent left in the tank, with them being 32 and their contract expiring upon the conclusion of next season, it is my hope that they re-sign for 1-2 years.

Time enough to bridge the gap during a retool on the fly and with a change in management and coaching to win the Cup with this current core. The focus however has to shift from the Sedins as our primary threat, Kesler I believe has returned to the elite road after a two year sojourn through purgatory and should be the next captain of the Canucks; indeed the NEW identity moving forward.

I am so thankful that we've been graced with the Sedins for their entire careers to date, in fact I'm thankful as a fan having grown up to see Stan Smyl, Richard Brodeur, Harold Snepts, Petri Skriko and their brothers in arms in the twilight's of their careers; only to move on to see Trevor Linden, Pavel Bure, Kirk McLean and Alexander Mogilny pick up the torch.

I have suffered through the darkest days of the franchise to be rewarded with the WCE, like a phoenix rising from the ashes to provide without a doubt the most dominant stretch of play in Canucks history; the graceful transition from WCE into the Sedin era the past decade and change has been, how shall I say, medicating.

It's lulled me into a state of acceptance where it's great to see the team succeeding in general but leaves me feeling empty when it matters most. I see this team slowly evolving if you will back into the spirit of the 80's club, albeit with much more skill.

The Sedins will not fetch a return for this club, they will indeed retire as Canucks as they should, my only hope is that they do so as the first players to win the Stanley cup as so many before them, themselves included have failed to do so despite coming so very close.

Let's be fortunate with what we have and where the team is at right now, let's battle through this adversity in the here and now, knowing that the future is not insecure.

Go Canucks Go.

The Sedins are now second liners again. You're right there's an identity crisis.
  • 0

#10 aqua59

aqua59

    Canucks Regular

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,818 posts
  • Joined: 16-January 08

Posted 04 May 2013 - 10:26 AM

Ah, sigh, thank you for being here....

The "identity crisis" spoken about here is actually the team having to transition away from where the game was supposed to be headed. Personally, I like the old school hit 'em hard hockey but, after the Bertuzzi and other incidents, the league freaked out and went "we have change things (to cover our asses)" but didn't really mean it or follow through with any consistency. They gave lip service and have, to some degree, made some adjustments but that wasn't evenly applied. Some teams got away with physical play, others had to watch their step. I, for one, love the whistles in the pockets way of doing playoffs, but they pick and choose. Not saying it's been why we've lost, just why the team has had to change how they've played. The past dictated that they were tentative and unsure, and it's carried over to some degree. Kes abandoned it all last night and said "screw it, we're taking this...if I go down, it's swinging".

This isn't a whine about the refs response, more that the Sedins have HAD to play differently. Teams did figure them out and started to really target them....now, in the ideal league that did protect their players, it would have been addressed. But it wasn't and they've been mugged, mauled and jumped in the past and have learned to fight back (yes, they have - did you see Hank's hit near the end of the game last night?). So I just see them having to play a different game...obviously, a gameplan that's worked against the Canucks. They've had to watch their backs and give some back. People used to whine they're soft....now they're whining that they don't play well enough. It's all about balance.

They've had to sacrifice one for the other to some degree. Not their fault, just the way the game has gone. They're still A+ in my books.

Sedins are second liners again. They are too slow. I think they peaked on speed performance when they faced the Bruins for the Cup 2 years ago.
  • 0





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

Canucks.com is the official Web site of The Vancouver Canucks. The Vancouver Canucks and Canucks.com are trademarks of The Vancouver Canucks Limited Partnership.  NHL and the word mark and image of the Stanley Cup are registered trademarks and the NHL Shield and NHL Conference logos are trademarks of the National Hockey League. All NHL logos and marks and NHL team logos and marks as well as all other proprietary materials depicted herein are the property of the NHL and the respective NHL teams and may not be reproduced without the prior written consent of NHL Enterprises, L.P.  Copyright © 2009 The Vancouver Canucks Limited Partnership and the National Hockey League.  All Rights Reserved.