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Analyzing Canucks Forward Group in Benning Era through Hero Charts


5ubmarine

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24 minutes ago, Ojibwa72 said:

We'll see what he does. Gotta do something because what we got doesn't work (Proven by the last few years). I'm all in for the fire sale and rebuild myself.

As long as they keep a few veterens, the Oilers shows what happens with teams who only rely on young talent.

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Just now, smokes said:

As long as they keep a few veterens, the Oilers shows what happens with teams who only rely on young talent.

Yes the Sedins and Hansen are the keepers imo. Even if they slow a bit would make a solid 2nd line for the young ones to model after.

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18 hours ago, 5ubmarine said:

 

You gotta wonder if his old school way of building a team will leave us being not a contender for 3-5 years.

We are in a bit of a hole.

 

i work in an industry that uses a lot of stats... the mode "advanced" the method the more scrutiny the conclusions need, and in this case I think you proved that. Henrik as a 3rd liner? Oy.

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There was this one new chart that came up recently but at the moment it's down for maintenance. They were called WARRIOR Charts, "Weighted and Rigidly Regressed Individual Output Rankings"

 

I saw it a couple of weeks ago and wanted to look more into it, as it was pretty much like a HERO chart but with a bit more stats and measured just for 1 season, so rookies would be on there as well. So you won't get the bonus of Burrows playing with the Sedins and you'll get to see the progression of Horvat and Baertschi this year vs Horvat and Kenins/Hansen last year. And Nick Bonino's (declining) play this year. Quite interesting stuff, and I've been meaning to explore all that magical unicorn advanced stats as well. Good effort though on getting all the HERO charts up for everyone! +1

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5 hours ago, WTG said:

Once the warrior charts are updated and back up it'll be interesting to judge this years players vs their 2013-15 years.

 

Oh yeah BTW Hutton is a absolute god when it comes to WARRIOR charts

 

Uo3x4bP.png

Which is short for Weighted And Rigidly Regressed Individual Output Rankings.

 

So that's good for his development.

O that's awesome, ya I tried to look at the warrior charts last week too but looks like it's been down for a while

I am sure benning uses a special way to scout players but I think this is a great way to scout out potential talent, if Player A is given 4th line icetime, and getting 3rd line primary points and possession stats. Then that just means that there might be room for development, you might want to give this guy a shot with 3rd line minutes and see if he continues to trend upward in terms of production.

 

 

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people may not agree with the stats or your opinion but i thought this was a very interesting read .  thanks for sharing that . 

 

the fact that jagermeister  says your conclusions are utter trash is just plain rude and I imagine he wouldn't say that to your face ..   this board is full of pansies who act tough on their keyboards .

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1 hour ago, Lulover88 said:

people may not agree with the stats or your opinion but i thought this was a very interesting read .  thanks for sharing that . 

 

the fact that jagermeister  says your conclusions are utter trash is just plain rude and I imagine he wouldn't say that to your face ..   this board is full of pansies who act tough on their keyboards .

Haha, I think when I posted this topic I didn't care about if people were on board with me but I value their opinion. If you think I am wrong then say so and have a back up of what you say. And if it's greater than what i say then i go great you da man I believe in you. But if somebody just comes out and goes your comments are trash and that's it. It just shows how much of an effort they want to put in reading and replying to the post. And that's fine with me. 

 

I want to weed out those people as well. It's not really for argument but I value the opinion and discussion both ways. I am happy if you can prove me wrong sort of speak::D. And I can learn something new in the process, win-win for me ::D

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9 hours ago, Alflives said:

Do we need this chart to tell us he's really good?  

Stats like these can really put things into perspective.

 

For example a player may look good and have bad underlying stats. Take Sutter for example. His on ice effectiveness is very much overrated. The underlying numbers suggest that he really isn't that great of a 2 way player. He's comparable to a player like Richardson in that regard.

 

You can use stats in anyway you want really. That's the beauty of stats. You can just disregard them and just ignore them, or you can only use stats to come to a conclusion. Or you can watch a player make remarks about a player and check if what you are seeing is reflected in the stats.

 

For Hutton his on-ice effectiveness is that of a #3 defensemen. While the eye test would basically show us that he is a #4-5 defensmen.

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1 minute ago, WTG said:

Stats like these can really put things into perspective.

 

For example a player may look good and have bad underlying stats. Take Sutter for example. His on ice effectiveness is very much overrated. The underlying numbers suggest that he really isn't that great of a 2 way player. He's comparable to a player like Richardson in that regard.

 

You can use stats in anyway you want really. That's the beauty of stats. You can just disregard them and just ignore them, or you can only use stats to come to a conclusion. Or you can watch a player make remarks about a player and check if what you are seeing is reflected in the stats.

 

For Hutton his on-ice effectiveness is that of a #3 defensemen. While the eye test would basically show us that he is a #4-5 defensmen.

The eye test for this furry bottomed alien confirms Hutton is a top pair guy, and Sutter in a number 2 centre on a Cup team.  

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Just now, Alflives said:

The eye test for this furry bottomed alien confirms Hutton is a top pair guy, and Sutter in a number 2 centre on a Cup team.  

If that is all you need to confirm your opinion that is completely fine. To each their own.

 

But the stats tend to disagree with you.

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On 2/25/2016 at 1:39 PM, higgyfan said:

According to the hero charts, Prust and Higgins should be still on the team.

 

 

These Hero charts are from 2013-15 where higgins was pretty productive. It doesn't include this year where he's had a terrible season.

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Just now, WTG said:

If that is all you need to confirm your opinion that is completely fine. To each their own.

 

But the stats tend to disagree with you.

Hero charts look pretty, and any information added to analyze a player is good.  The eye test should determine his affect on winning.  

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39 minutes ago, WTG said:

Eye test are very biased.

 

Stats eliminate the bias.

 

39 minutes ago, WTG said:

Eye test are very biased.

 

Stats eliminate the bias.

How is the data collected that these charts are created from?  Oh, human eyes, and bias.  I'm not against these advanced stats.  I believe they are a tool for evaluating players, but they don't supersede the eye test.  

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Just now, Alflives said:

 

How is the data collected that these charts are created from?  Oh, human eyes, and bias.  I'm not against these advanced stats.  I believe they are a tool for evaluating players, but they don't supersede the eye test.  

lol what?

 

those charts show no bias.....

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