Ray_Cathode

No problem - happens all the time. I'm sure there are more advanced stats out there than some of the people on this site know about, but that I do not (there are some very clever buggers on this site), but here is one I do know of (poor grammar there) ... of which I know: https://theahl.com/stats/player-stats/390/61?playertype=skater&position=skaters&rookie=no&sort=points&statstype=expanded&page=1&league=4

I like Horvat on the draw. Of course, it depends on how you plan face-off strategy... whether you play to win or intentionally lose the draw. Many teams plan to lose the draw and anticipate losing and establishing puck recovery pressure as soon as the puck is dropped. A lot of drawn pucks end up on the wall or force the defender to the wall for recovery. Penalty killers like to play inside the team with the advantage. Pinning a defender against the wall and recovering the puck can enhance the man advantage by trapping one of the four defenders against the wall with the fore-checker closer to the net than the defender.

Even in the midst of our injury ridden massive on the road slump last year, the players kept working hard till the dead end of every game. That says a lot about both the players and the coach... except for Loui.

Love the comment about Podkolzin's 'Mitts being the size of ... (a piece of 8 x 11 inch paper)' - hilarious.

You did not read the specific context of what I was responding to. I was responding to a post that claimed that -1 per game was not a bad +/- for a first line defenceman. It is bad, it is terrible. The post I responded to was generic, not specific to Juolevi. I have no problem waiting to see how Juolevi turns out. But I am unwilling to pronounce that his initial showing was wonderful as many have claimed - it wasn't. He was strong gong forward, good on the PP, but awful when defending. I had seen him play in the World Juniors and some of his games in Finland and read reports of those games - what I was watching in Utica was an entirely different player than I had seen in those other venues. My speculation was that he was perhaps hurt because he was repeatedly being walked on his left side and seemed to labor on his pivots - that had not happened in the OHL junior, the Finnish league, nor at the world junior. Look, I want Olli to turn out, but I'm not willing to fool myself with regard to his AHL performance to date. Read that? TO DATE.

You did not read the comment I was addressing. I didn't say Juolevi was minus 1 per game. The person I was responding to claimed that being minus 1 per game was not bad for a number one defenceman playing x many minutes per game against the top line. I disputed that by demonstrating what that claim would mean over the course of a season - so no, neither am I ignorant of statistics - you maybe should go back to school and study reading. No, Juolevi was not - one per game (again, something I never claimed), but he was minus 4 in his last four games. And again, in my post I included that he may have already been suffering a knee injury (though I have found no data that establishes that as a fact - it was only conjecture on my part). "That tiny negative sample was largely produced during his first couple of weeks of adjusting to a new team in a new league (with a nagging knee injury), which no sentient person would believe accurately represents his playing ability." Since you seem to want to be picky, it was a month - and with the worst (-4 in his last four games) at the end - and since you didn't include any facts amongst your conjectures, I'll give you the data source here: https://theahl.com/stats/player/7416/61/olli-juolevi

Being -1 per game extended to 82 games is -82. -82 for any defenceman is absolutely terrible. Three defensive pairings like that would be a total disaster. I think you should just say something else.

They weren’t all cruddy, As has been pointed out above - there were plenty of significant pluses on that team. Juolevi and Chatfield were a pairing and they were awful. Granted Olli was a rookie, but so was Jasek (he only played 6 Games the previous year), and Jasek and Gaudette were very good. Look, I wish Olli had played better, I wish all of our signings worked out, but no matter how hard I wish and want, reality is not listening - Olli was not good last year. Hopefully it was because he was hurt, but wishin’ an’ hopin’ an’ beggin’ an’ prayin’ won’t help. Facts are facts.

I watched those 18 games. Juolevi was terrible defensively - he was one of the reasons the team was so bad. He was walked constantly and looked like he couldn’t pivot to the left. Maybe he was carrying his injury from the beginning of the year, but if that was truly indicative of the best he had to offer, he has a lot of development that remains to be done. He did not look anything like the player in the World Juniors, and nothing like the player that played in the Finnish league - so I’m supposing that health may have been an issue.

To trade Sutter you need a buyer, has he done enough to garner an offer? Sutter has missed 71 of his cast 164 games, and only has 15 goals and 17 assists TOTAL over his last TWO seasons at a cap hit of 4,375,000. I don’t see a long line of buyers. The reason for moving Sutter is to get the cap space to sign Goldobin (in the first place) AFTER signing Boeser - that will most likely take 9 mil and we only have about 5. Ferland, Pearson, and Miller are not untalented guys - they bring skill and some edge - Goldie has shown no history or f scoring at their pace, never mind the physical presence and defensive awareness of these vets. I like Goldie, every shift is an adventure on both sides of the puck, sadly for Goldie... he is an adventure on both sides of the puck.

One problem for Louie is that we have players that are much better in the top line spots that he desires. But the real problem is Loui, and here is why: 2014-2015 GP 81 Hits 29 with Boston 2015-2016 GP 82 Hits 22 with Boston 2016-2017 GP 65 Hits 11 2017-2018 GP 50 Hits 7 2018-2019 GP 81 Hits 3 It's not about the hitting exactly, Loui was never much for contact, it is about his increasing general level of disengagement - and that is what fans see. He doesn't pry pucks loose, he lets others do it. He doesn't go to scoring areas, he lets others do it. He avoids contact, he lets other, less entitled guys do it. Penalty killing is mostly about positioning, and Loui is a smart guy,; he knows where to be and when. Penalty killing is not about running around the ice initiating contact for most players, it is about discipline - and PK is a very happy circumstance for Loui - he doesn't have to chase and he doesn't have to initiate contact - that has become his game. The thing that falls out of that, is that he doesn't create loose pucks, he doesn't get to scoring areas, and he sure as heck doesn't earn his 6 mil per. A simple glance at the stat line above shows that when Loui got his big contract, he mostly retired to non-contact, oldtimer's league hockey. Unfortunately for the Canucks, they play in a full contact league.

Yeah... but... if Sutter is traded or bought out, that might mean a third line centred by Miller (he plays centre, too, and is a pretty good one at that). If Miller centres and either of Leivo, Virtanen, or Gaudette (he also plays wing) are on RW - that might leave a spot for Goldobin on LW (at least until Roussel is healthy again) - on what could be a third pretty good offensive line. Now, in half of our games we really don't get to dictate the line changes (when we are away from home), and both Pettersson and Horvat have shown they can also play in their own end - that might leave us in a situation where we don't HAVE to line match for purely defensive reasons - not bad having three lines that can attack AND defend.

What is the lesson to players if Louie is sent to Utica - if you sign a big contract, earn it. I see no problem sending out that message, the only players that might bother are ones that have no intention of performing for their money - who the heck would want them anyway.

Sutter will have to have a career year to attract a first with a strong draft expected. Better wrap his bubble wrap in foam and a level 99 force field and couple dozen crucifixes.

You haven’t seen all kinds of criticism of Benning over this contract? Maybe we occupy different universes. Pretty sure I have seen a ton spread around this site and in the local media.

I think a Horvat as a winger would be a waste, just like when we started Kesler out on the wing, and for the same reason (at least we had the excuse that Kesler was learning the pro game). We have a surplus of young, developing, potentially strong wingers, beginning with Podkolzin and Hoglander (both of whom may become something special). My opinion of Horvat has grown year by year. I originally saw him as a guy that could develop into a strong three C, but Horvat just kept getting better in every aspect of his game. I’m pretty sure that Petey and Sutter going down hurt him last year, along with an insane schedule, and cost him a few points and getting to 30 goals. Having a couple of very good wingers this year (maybe a healthy Baertschi), but perhaps two of Pearson, Miller, Ferland, or Leivo for a whole season can help get him to the next level - what Kesler gave us at 2C at his best. If Pettersson is a legit number 1, and one of Miller, Gaudette, a healthy Sutter, or, down the road, Madden, can give us a strong 3C - we may be looking at 2011 redux, but with players early in their careers. I also really like the developing mix on this team, Ferland, Miller, Roussel, Beagle, Motte are character guys that will serve as great models for Virtanen, and maybe down the road, MacEwan, Gadjovich and Keppen. We also have a couple of pretty talented racehorses in Jasek and Lockwood. In a couple of years, Podkolzin and Hoglander, and yikes - quite the collection of forwards. Not to mention an improving Lind and Karlsson.

He played two games last fall and played better each shift. In the last half of the second game, he looked like he was born to play in the NHL. The shifts he had with Hughes were sublime - he and Hughes with the Pettersson line played like they had been born to play with each other. He was very dependable in his own end and made strong, useful outlet passes, he was strong enough to skate the puck out of trouble, very aware of where his teammates were, but mostly, when he played with our best offensive players he was on the same wavelength. Lots of players generate huge numbers in junior or college, but when they get to the NHL they just don’t seem to think on the same wavelength. From the little we saw of Rafferty last year, he seems to think an NHL game. NHL players think at another level. You may remember that when Tanev came up, after his first game his teammates already recognized that he played an NHL game. From what I’ve seen of Rafferty, in admittedly short exposure, in my humble opinion, he looks that same way. I remember when other defence prospects came up in the past few years, only Sautner looked comfortable that quickly (and that was only in his defensive game). Even Larsen, that had a strong game in Sweden and later in Russia, just did not fit. In the small NHL rink, being pressured by the smartest, strongest, fastest players in the world, the thing that matters is how quickly you process the game - and again, in my opinion, it is that that separates the fair from the good and the good from the great. I think Rafferty has a pro game. But, like I said, just a short exposure that could well prove to be wrong - but what I saw I liked.

By the rookie criteria stated, Demko and Hughes are still prospects, it is possible for either or both to disappointed pre-seasons and be demoted to get their games back together: 1. Hughes 2. Podkolzin 3. Demko 4. Juolevi 5. Rafferty 6. Hoglander 7. Woo 8. Rathbone 9. Madden 10. Dipietro Honorable mentions: MacEwan Jasek Lockwood Sautner Brisebois Lind Tevis Gadjovich Keppen Karlsson Eliot In praise of Benning, and after following the Canucks since 1970, I have never seen the Canucks so rich in prospects who could conceivably play games for this team. That’s 49 years. And that is with quality young players already in the lineup - Boeser, Pettersson, Gaudette, Horvat (24), and Virtanen (22). The window for this team may be very broad. And Tryamkin waiting in the wings who could be a significant addition.

If Benning can get Loui squared away by some means and recover that cap space, after Boeser, he’ll have room for one eighth of a ton of Russian D that fills your average doorway.

Not everything works out on the ice, nor everything off it. Some drafts are duds but Tryamkin isn’t one of them (I’m referring to another thread there) and neither is Juolevi, yet. He was just starting to look like he’d adjusted to the AHL when he got hurt - so we will have to wait on him. I’m not referring to you, but some people here don’t have the patience of a gnat on speed.

He is one half of the contract, it’s one half his fault.

I get that: 2017-8 Brock Boeser - rookie of the year finalist 2018-9 Elias Pettersson - rookie of the year 2019-20 Quinn Hughes - rookie of the year 2020-21 Nils Hoglander - rookie of the year finalist 2021-22 Vasili Podkolzin - rookie of the year 2022 Canucks sip champagne from Lord Stanley’s hockey holy grail!

Is there not a league below this for Loui? Maybe the Chibougimau Horseflies? No such team? Perfect.

I was worried about Demko/Markstrom, but there are going to be lots of goalies exposed - we will continue to have lots of prospects, so we may be able to retain them by surrendering a prospect in addition to our exposed player (considering our possible future depth, that player may also be desirable) so our goalies may be let alone. And that may not be an issue if DiPietro or one of our goalie prospects pans out.

I am very high on Rathbone, and intrigued from what Rafferty showed us in the last half of his second game. If Juolevi pans out we might be able to maintain a relatively inexpensive defence for several years. And Tryamkin could be a year away. Woo and Podkolzin two years away. We will get to live through interesting times. More depth, JB, more depth so that we can turn over older guys for younger, less expensive players.