Can We Start Cutting Vey A Little Slack?

[Positive Canuck]

Vey,Edler,Vrbata,Burr,Weber + Prust = Commanders of Team Tank.  

 

[manicdonkey]

I personally don't think it's an issue of Vey not being NHL calibre. The issue is that he's not a center on a championship level team. 

Which line would you have him on for a Canucks team in the Stanley Cup finals? 1st? 2nd? 3rd? (Bo, Jared, and Brandon say hi). Once you get past those I guess he could be 4th line center, but that seems like a poor fit. Wouldn't you rather that player be someone in the mold of Gaunce?

To be a TRULY competitive team, not just a middling 14th overall pick type team, we need to surpass Vey's level at center. Ideally we'd come up with one more top 3 center depending on where Bo and Jared end up when they show their true ceiling in a couple years. All of this assuming Henrik has retired. If not then we already have 4 centers better than Vey (in 2 years when McCann is comfortably playing his game).

I just don't see Vey being on a championship team other than as a 13th man who can slot in for injuries down the middle. I'm assuming Vey lovers and haters both want to see Vancouver become a championship team, right? 

 

[Ronning4center]

Nope....

I mean yeah....but no....

[RUPERTKBD]

3 minutes ago, manicdonkey said:

I personally don't think it's an issue of Vey not being NHL calibre. The issue is that he's not a center on a championship level team. 

Which is fine seeing as the Canucks are not a Championship calibre team.

In answer to the OP's question: Some of us started cutting Vey some slack quite a while ago.

[Yukoncanuck87]

Vey has shown to be a class act so far not many players would take a demotion like he did n earn his way back on the roster n be all humble about it like he has. He's earned some slack for sure people. 

[Yukoncanuck87]

2 minutes ago, RUPERTKBD said:

Which is fine seeing as the Canucks are not a Championship calibre team.

In answer to the OP's question: Some of us started cutting Vey some slack quite a while ago.

I agree n most gave him slack when he was called up he's been NHL caliber since then. 

[manicdonkey]

2 minutes ago, RUPERTKBD said:

Which is fine seeing as the Canucks are not a Championship calibre team.

In answer to the OP's question: Some of us started cutting Vey some slack quite a while ago.

I agree. To me it's more about where we're going than where we are now though. I think he's a reasonable player, just not a long term solution. All my thoughts are aimed at becoming a championship contending team which would mean replacing middling players like Vey as soon as possible with guys who are or will develop into that calibre of player. 

If we don't have said players, by all means, play Vey until his nuts fall off. 

[Stormriders]

I just posted this in another thread, not knowing this one was started  I will start by agreeing with those of you who say that Vey is an improved player over last year, and now battles harder and seems more involved.  But all this Vey love for 'some' improvement on here seems a little over the top, when you look at what he has actually accomplished, and the title of this thread proves it.  Remember his mentor clearly said, 'this is the get it done league, not the try league' or something close to that.  And Vey has not been getting it done, despite again being gifted extra TOI time and powerplay time, and now in the last two games he is killing penalties.

He has a total of 1 goal and 5 assists in 16 games, and only two of those assists are 1st, and one of those is an empty net goal.  That's a yearly pace for about 30 points and only 5 goals, all with a lot of PP time and big minutes.  So why has he been getting all these minutes, sometimes more than our better players, and all this PP time.  To me it's last year all over again, being gifted ice and PP time.

For those of you that will say he earned it, maybe you want to look at his stats.  When he was called up, [yes it was a call up because of injuries], he was getting about 12 minutes a night, no PP or PK which is about right.  In those first 3 games, he had no shots on goals, no points, and for that, in his 4th game, he is suddenly 'gifted' 16 minutes and big PP times?  Why, how did he earn or deserve it?  By 5 games, he had one 2nd assist, no goals and 1 shot.  This goes along and after 8 games he has a total of 0 goals, 2 secondary assists and 3 shots.

Then Etem joins the team and immediately in that game he plays over 16 minutes and has almost 3 minutes of PP time, [ps  no points and no shots on goals].  Since then it has been the same story big minutes & PP, and during this time many people are saying how much better Vey is this year and what great chemistry he and Etem have.  Did you know that since Etem came to the Canucks, in 8 games Etem as 0 goals and one assist?  Now I actually like a lot of things about Etem, but again, what has he produced, yet he is getting about 15 minutes a night.  He was a healthy scratch for NYR for many games.  

And people say say how Vey has improved the play of Burrows & Etem, but both those players combine since Etem has joined the team have a total of 3 points in 8 games.  Some nights they might have looked ok, but they aren't producing.

Yes Vey appears a better player this year than last, but he still can't translate that into what really matters and that is points.  Just looking at the 'get it done' he isn't and hasn't been getting it done, but like last year, it appears Willy is doing everything he can in gifting him more than he has earn.  In what world should Vey be getting the same or more minutes than Bo and Sven, and some nights more PP time?

Last night I thought Jake was a lot more dangerous than Vey and he got 8 minutes [not suggesting he should be getting 15/16, just a better balance].  Vey is in his 5th year as a pro, 25 in July and should be showing more signs of getting it done.

[RUPERTKBD]

1 minute ago, manicdonkey said:

I agree. To me it's more about where we're going than where we are now though. I think he's a reasonable player, just not a long term solution. All my thoughts are aimed at becoming a championship contending team which would mean replacing middling players like Vey as soon as possible with guys who are or will develop into that calibre of player. 

If we don't have said players, by all means, play Vey until his nuts fall off. 

I don't disagree with your assessment. However, I think contender status is much further away than many Canuck fans do. A guy like Vey can play out his contract and be long gone before the Canucks once again challenge for the Cup. That being the case, it makes perfect sense to me that people should "cut him some slack" as the OP put it.

[cuporbust]

1 hour ago, gameburn said:

How about we cut Virtanen some slack?  He has been effective -- given the limited ice time WD seems to think is appropriate for young players -- Vey is the one who needs Utica.  In Utica Vey might develop the strong-on-the-puck Defense first game he is going to need if he has any chance of making it in the NHL.  Time off to train? Arguably better for Vey than Virtanen.  Virtanen needs ice time, Vey needs something other than that.  Virtanen is getting a bit better every game: more shots, better passes, slightly better defensive game. 

Vey is 24 and has played 217 games in the AHL already. That's almost 3 full AHL seasons. If he's not ready for the NHL by now he will probably never be. 

[RUPERTKBD]

2 minutes ago, cuporbust said:

Vey is 24 and has played 217 games in the AHL already. If he's not ready for the NHL by now he will probably never be. 

Who says he's not ready for the NHL?

[Yukoncanuck87]

Veys a sophomore like Horvat people lol his full potential you prob won't see for 2-3 more years 

there's still a tonne of time to become elite for him.

[cuporbust]

Just now, RUPERTKBD said:

Who says he's not ready for the NHL?

The guy I quoted 

[RUPERTKBD]

1 minute ago, cuporbust said:

The guy I quoted 

Ah. So, nobody of any consequence then....

[cuporbust]

Just now, RUPERTKBD said:

Ah. So, nobody of any consequence then....

Exactly 

[RUPERTKBD]

2 minutes ago, Yukoncanuck87 said:

Veys a sophomore like Horvat people lol his full potential you prob won't see for 2-3 more years 

there's still a tonne of time to become elite for him.

I agree that he has time to improve his game, but I don't think he'll ever approach "elite" status.

But that's okay. It puts him in a group of about 500 other NHL players.

[RUPERTKBD]

9 minutes ago, Stormriders said:

I just posted this in another thread, not knowing this one was started  I will start by agreeing with those of you who say that Vey is an improved player over last year, and now battles harder and seems more involved.  But all this Vey love for 'some' improvement on here seems a little over the top, when you look at what he has actually accomplished, and the title of this thread proves it.  Remember his mentor clearly said, 'this is the get it done league, not the try league' or something close to that.  And Vey has not been getting it done, despite again being gifted extra TOI time and powerplay time, and now in the last two games he is killing penalties.

He has a total of 1 goal and 5 assists in 16 games, and only two of those assists are 1st, and one of those is an empty net goal.  That's a yearly pace for about 30 points and only 5 goals, all with a lot of PP time and big minutes.  So why has he been getting all these minutes, sometimes more than our better players, and all this PP time.  To me it's last year all over again, being gifted ice and PP time.

For those of you that will say he earned it, maybe you want to look at his stats.  When he was called up, [yes it was a call up because of injuries], he was getting about 12 minutes a night, no PP or PK which is about right.  In those first 3 games, he had no shots on goals, no points, and for that, in his 4th game, he is suddenly 'gifted' 16 minutes and big PP times?  Why, how did he earn or deserve it?  By 5 games, he had one 2nd assist, no goals and 1 shot.  This goes along and after 8 games he has a total of 0 goals, 2 secondary assists and 3 shots.

Then Etem joins the team and immediately in that game he plays over 16 minutes and has almost 3 minutes of PP time, [ps  no points and no shots on goals].  Since then it has been the same story big minutes & PP, and during this time many people are saying how much better Vey is this year and what great chemistry he and Etem have.  Did you know that since Etem came to the Canucks, in 8 games Etem as 0 goals and one assist?  Now I actually like a lot of things about Etem, but again, what has he produced, yet he is getting about 15 minutes a night.  He was a healthy scratch for NYR for many games.  

And people say say how Vey has improved the play of Burrows & Etem, but both those players combine since Etem has joined the team have a total of 3 points in 8 games.  Some nights they might have looked ok, but they aren't producing.

Yes Vey appears a better player this year than last, but he still can't translate that into what really matters and that is points.  Just looking at the 'get it done' he isn't and hasn't been getting it done, but like last year, it appears Willy is doing everything he can in gifting him more than he has earn.  In what world should Vey be getting the same or more minutes than Bo and Sven, and some nights more PP time?

Last night I thought Jake was a lot more dangerous than Vey and he got 8 minutes [not suggesting he should be getting 15/16, just a better balance].  Vey is in his 5th year as a pro, 25 in July and should be showing more signs of getting it done.

Don't look at it as "love", because it's not. It's actually much closer to anti-hate.

Case in point: Many of us disagree with the all too common sentiment that Vey is not an NHL calibre player.

[manicdonkey]

3 minutes ago, RUPERTKBD said:

I don't disagree with your assessment. However, I think contender status is much further away than many Canuck fans do. A guy like Vey can play out his contract and be long gone before the Canucks once again challenge for the Cup. That being the case, it makes perfect sense to me that people should "cut him some slack" as the OP put it.

I agree. I suppose I'm hopeful that we can build faster, but it will be a while.

As early as next year I believe McCann or Gaunce or both will surpass him for his role on the team. Vey's sharing 4th best center on the team with McCann right now and I believe he'll be 5th or 6th best next year. Center is probably our strongest position and should push him out pretty fast even while we're still rebuilding. 

[Yukoncanuck87]

5 minutes ago, manicdonkey said:

I agree. I suppose I'm hopeful that we can build faster, but it will be a while.

As early as next year I believe McCann or Gaunce or both will surpass him for his role on the team. Vey's sharing 4th best center on the team with McCann right now and I believe he'll be 5th or 6th best next year. Center is probably our strongest position and should push him out pretty fast even while we're still rebuilding. 

Except vey can win face offs McCann can't.

[Stormriders]

Just now, RUPERTKBD said:

Don't look at it as "love", because it's not. It's actually much closer to anti-hate.

Case in point: Many of us disagree with the all too common sentiment that Vey is not an NHL calibre player.

I agree and certainly don't have any problem with the call up and his playing, trying to earn a spot on the team.  My objection is about fairness, where he is getting too many minutes in play and PP time that he is not earning.  Many on here think he will soon become an elite player and playing far better than he is.  He is a call-up due to injury that should be getting  12/13 minutes a night, who has yet to prove he can be a regular on the team.