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2013 World Junior Ice Hockey Championships


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#2281 Jai604

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 04:56 AM

Watching Ryan Murphy skate the puck up the ice only to fire a worthless, weak shot from far out and then subsequently leaving his D-partner out to dry all tournament was painful.

Sure looked like leaving Corrado off was a mistake.

The mystery for me, is why the coach continued to play Murphy in such key situations when clearly he wasn't producing offensively and he was a defensive liability every time he was on the ice.

Goalies got hung out to dry.
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#2282 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 04:56 AM

Um, BC plays on 200x85 ice aka NHL ice. Get your facts straight

And you seem to be underestimating the strength of NCAA players, basically men and Johnny seem to be doing fine.

By your standards Schroeder won't make the NHL either, sorry to break it to ya bud


Honestly I have no issue with Gaudreau but I think JS has a better chance than Johnny Hockey.

Comparing where Schroeder was at the age Gaudreau currently is, he was stronger and better defensively, if Gaudreau can follow along those lines he can make it too but he isn't a sure thing, niether is JS but I would give the edge to JS.
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#2283 sedated

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 04:58 AM

The coach of Canada is his coach on the team he plays on. He played favourites. Think of it like AV and Rome, or Raymond.

Every time Murphy fracked up, which was often, the coach just gave him more and more time. It seemed like he was out there for 40 minutes. And he didn't earn it at all. The whole tournament he has sucked. And he kept getting played.. over.. and over.
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#2284 Baercheese

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:01 AM

Honestly I have no issue with Gaudreau but I think JS has a better chance than Johnny Hockey.

Comparing where Schroeder was at the age Gaudreau currently is, he was stronger and better defensively, if Gaudreau can follow along those lines he can make it too but he isn't a sure thing, niether is JS but I would give the edge to JS.

Gaudreau plays PK and PP minutes for BC under legendary coach Jerry York. Hard to imagine him not being good defensively if he plays on his PK, but that's just me.
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3499h5x.jpg
Johnny Gaudreau>any Casucks

Edler, Markstrom, Hansen, 2nd round pick 2014 to Islanders for Ryan Strome, 5th overall pick 2014

This is fairly even as well.

 


#2285 DeNiro

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:04 AM

Um, BC plays on 200x85 ice aka NHL ice. Get your facts straight

And you seem to be underestimating the strength of NCAA players, basically men and Johnny seem to be doing fine.

By your standards Schroeder won't make the NHL either, sorry to break it to ya bud


Half of the league plays on rinks bigger than the standard NHL sized rinks. They don't only play at home you know ;) My facts are fine.

He's doing fine, but not great. A small player needs to be great to make it over a bigger player. It's just the way it goes.

Schroeder has a better skill set than Gaudreau and he's got about 20 pounds of muscle on him. The odds are stacked against Schroeder too, but I think he's definitely got a better chance than a one dimensional player like Gaudreau.

Edited by DeNiro, 03 January 2013 - 05:05 AM.

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#2286 spliced

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:05 AM

This score almost flatters Canada. The goal they got shouldn't even have counted.

Scheifele, Huberdeau and Strome are just brutal if the aren't producing offence. Sadly I think Nuge sort of covered for their poor play. Those guys do so little else on the ice that they need to be scoring to justify all the ice time they are getting. Granted the depth players could have buried a goal or two more than they did.

Hamilton was a total disappointment.
Subban was probably the wrong choice but he wasn't terrible.
MacKinnon wasn't to good but he also didn't get much of a shot. I would have like to see him get a shot with Nuge.

I didn't like the line combos at all. The top 2 lines were so soft. It's fine to try and see if it works, but once you see it wasn't working they needed to switch it up. I would have like to have seen Mackinnon, Camara or Jenner play with Nuge and keep Ritchie with Strome. Scheifele and Huberdeau got more ice time then they deserved and Rattie didn't fit in with the scoring lines.

The defence seemed to be missing that number one guy. I think if Hamilton was as good as people expected the Defence would have been fine.

It's funny but the lockout may have actually hurt this team in the long run. They wouldn't have had the talent but they probably would have been a harder working more physical team and that may have gotten them father then this. One thing is for sure, this was no dream team.
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#2287 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:06 AM

Gaudreau plays PK and PP minutes for BC under legendary coach Jerry York. Hard to imagine him not being good defensively if he plays on his PK, but that's just me.


Schroeder was on the top PK unit for the US in the WJ, correct me if I am wrong but I don't think Gaudreau was on the PK all that often in this tourney.

Don't get me wrong, I have no issue's with Gaudreau but he isn't a sure thing, and Schroeder has alot more of the tools it takes for small players to succeed than Gaudreau does.

He is better down low, better defensively, is stronger, stronger on his skates and otherwise, and I think he is faster too, offensively they are a bit different but the same IMO in there own ways, but the other areas do favour Schroeder.

For your (Flames fans) sake hopefully he can over come these things and work hard at it like Schroeder did and continues too, but I wouldn't treat it like he is a sure thing.
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#2288 Baercheese

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:08 AM

Half of the league plays on rinks bigger than the standard NHL sized rinks. They don't only play at home you know ;) My facts are fine.

He's doing fine, but not great. A small player needs to be great to make it over a bigger player. It's just the way it goes.

Schroeder has a better skill set than Gaudreau and he's got about 20 pounds of muscle on him. The odds are stacked against Schroeder too, but I think he's definitely got a better chance than a one dimensional player like Gaudreau.

Not sure how 23 pts in 14 games as a sophomore isn't "great", but I'm sure the mighty Schroeder was dazzling in his sophomore year right?

Like I said above, Gaudreau plays PK for BC under York too. I think he's alright defensively.
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3499h5x.jpg
Johnny Gaudreau>any Casucks

Edler, Markstrom, Hansen, 2nd round pick 2014 to Islanders for Ryan Strome, 5th overall pick 2014

This is fairly even as well.

 


#2289 Baercheese

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:12 AM

Schroeder was on the top PK unit for the US in the WJ, correct me if I am wrong but I don't think Gaudreau was on the PK all that often in this tourney.

Don't get me wrong, I have no issue's with Gaudreau but he isn't a sure thing, and Schroeder has alot more of the tools it takes for small players to succeed than Gaudreau does.

He is better down low, better defensively, is stronger, stronger on his skates and otherwise, and I think he is faster too, offensively they are a bit different but the same IMO in there own ways, but the other areas do favour Schroeder.

For your (Flames fans) sake hopefully he can over come these things and work hard at it like Schroeder did and continues too, but I wouldn't treat it like he is a sure thing.

He wasn't because Trocheck, Biggs, Bardreau, and Hartman are all better than him in that department. Doesn't mean he's bad defensively by default.

We shall see when he turns pro next year

I'm not saying he's a sure thing, but seems like pro scout DeNiro thinks he's nothing but a sack of shjt

Edited by Sven Baertschi, 03 January 2013 - 05:14 AM.

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3499h5x.jpg
Johnny Gaudreau>any Casucks

Edler, Markstrom, Hansen, 2nd round pick 2014 to Islanders for Ryan Strome, 5th overall pick 2014

This is fairly even as well.

 


#2290 Scottish⑦Canuck

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:13 AM

A bit surprising, but Canada always seems to have a tendency to underestimate their opponents so it's not a major shock.
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#2291 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:16 AM

He wasn't because Trocheck, Biggs, Bardreau, and Hartman are all better than him in that department. Doesn't mean he's bad defensively by default.

We shall see when he turns pro next year

I'm not saying he's a sure thing, but seems like pro scout DeNiro thinks he's nothing but a sack of shjt


Yeah I'm just saying Schroeder was futher ahead in that department, Maybe Gaudreau isn't terrible defensively but I don't think it is as much as strength as it was with JS. (Not that he was a shutdown center either but still)

And yes we shall see forsure, it will be interesting to see how he handles it and adapts to it as apposed to how JS handled it and adapted to it.
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#2292 unknown33429

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:16 AM

Not sure how 23 pts in 14 games as a sophomore isn't "great", but I'm sure the mighty Schroeder was dazzling in his sophomore year right?

Like I said above, Gaudreau plays PK for BC under York too. I think he's alright defensively.


He's definitely talented. Although, I doubt that even Schroeder can succeed in the NHL. Neither of them have a great chance since the game is becoming/became slower. Anything can happen though, he could be the next Martin St. Louis.
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Are you CRAZY??? Trade Green for ONE first round pick?? He's restricted after this season.... He WILL get an offer sheet for 7-8 million from a number of teams regardless if he plays another minute for us or not. That offer sheet would be worth 4 first round draft choices.


Some fans overrate their players, and then there is this guy.

#2293 Canuck or Die

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:18 AM

Canucks curse


No prospects on Canada in the past 4 years = no gold


LOL, wasn't Shroeder on the US 2010 squad when the US won gold then, too? Canucks helping out the 'Murricans too, I guess. :lol:
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#2294 DeNiro

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:18 AM

Not sure how 23 pts in 14 games as a sophomore isn't "great", but I'm sure the mighty Schroeder was dazzling in his sophomore year right?

Like I said above, Gaudreau plays PK for BC under York too. I think he's alright defensively.


Schroeder lead his team in points in both years in college. And was named assistant Captain. I'd say he did pretty good.

He's playing in the AHL now anyways, so what he did in college doesn't mean much. He's showing now that he can play against men, and go toe to toe with other teams top prospects.
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#2295 VoiceOfReason_

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:19 AM

The problem is the team has to many "locks" even before camp starts. Funny, most of the D locks were terrible.


To political.
To much NHL influence.
Worry about things like amount of sunshine and not on ice chemistry or product.

Basically we're a stuck up country and have forgotten the basics of winning.

Being a high pick doesn't mean you're a winner. Tangibles.
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#2296 Baercheese

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:21 AM

Schroeder lead his team in points in both years in college. And was named assistant Captain. I'd say he did pretty good.

He's playing in the AHL now anyways, so what he did in college doesn't mean much. He's showing now that he can play against men, and go toe to toe with other teams top prospects.

You've got to be the biggest hypocrite.

Downplays Gaudreau's impressive stats saying small players benefit from playing international ice in the NCAA, comes back saying Schroeder led his team in scoring and it was "pretty good"

I'm done
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3499h5x.jpg
Johnny Gaudreau>any Casucks

Edler, Markstrom, Hansen, 2nd round pick 2014 to Islanders for Ryan Strome, 5th overall pick 2014

This is fairly even as well.

 


#2297 Canuck Surfer

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:22 AM

In goal its like arguing whether Lou let us down in the final. Well the team got outplayed, but we all know teams rally around their goalie when he saves their bacon a few times!.

The real truth is the team was flat. If guys win a spot playing their press clippings and hearing scouts espouse their size and athleticism instead of hustling, outhitting, outworking and earning your spot in camp and prelim games??? it's logical there will be games where those same players get outplayed in the tourney. Ryan Murphy got walked around by Goudreau embarassingly for a goal tonight, and was never effective. Reinhart did not play well all tourney, and Subban himself was hot and cold.

I put this on Sprott; there was no accountability to make guys earn their role and ice time. Where was the fore check and the pressure we saw that caused Jones to cough it up for 2 goals in the earlier game? Instead the US defence was allowed to walk out of their end and join the rush. The game plan was allowed to go walkabouts here, nobody got their feet moving!

For a team this stacked, a bronze (if that) isn't going to look so pretty.

I'll say it again about the goaltending, yes Subban had a great game vs Russia, yes the first 2 goals tonight were impossible to stop, but the kid hasn't looked all that sharp all tourny. 3 GA from Germany, 3 GA from Slovakia, losing to U of A and Finland, these should have given the coach a better indication of what kind of goaltending Subban offers. Binnington on the otherhand was solid in the pre-tourny games, and made a series of big saves to keep the team in it tonight. I hope Binnington gets the start for the bronze game.


Edited by Canuck Surfer, 03 January 2013 - 05:40 AM.

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#2298 DeNiro

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:23 AM

He wasn't because Trocheck, Biggs, Bardreau, and Hartman are all better than him in that department. Doesn't mean he's bad defensively by default.

We shall see when he turns pro next year

I'm not saying he's a sure thing, but seems like pro scout DeNiro thinks he's nothing but a sack of shjt


Yea, because I said he's a sack of sh*t...

I'm just giving you a dose of reality since you're coming on a canucks forum and bragging about a flames prospect.
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#2299 Baercheese

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:26 AM

Yea, because I said he's a sack of sh*t...

I'm just giving you a dose of reality since you're coming on a canucks forum and bragging about a flames prospect.

A reality based on your own biased opinion.

Ok there chief
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3499h5x.jpg
Johnny Gaudreau>any Casucks

Edler, Markstrom, Hansen, 2nd round pick 2014 to Islanders for Ryan Strome, 5th overall pick 2014

This is fairly even as well.

 


#2300 DeNiro

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:28 AM

You've got to be the biggest hypocrite.

Downplays Gaudreau's impressive stats saying small players benefit from playing international ice in the NCAA, comes back saying Schroeder led his team in scoring and it was "pretty good"

I'm done


And you must have missed the part where I said that he's playing in the AHL against men right now. The AHL has regular sized ice surfaces. So any issue that he would have adjusting to it, are not apparent.

I never said anything about his stats. They're pretty good actually. All I have been saying is he's gonna have a tough time making it at the next level. So going around bragging about him is kind of premature.
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#2301 DeNiro

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:32 AM

A reality based on your own biased opinion.

Ok there chief


So my "opinion" about smaller players being less likely to make the NHL is biased?

Ok there chief. Go get a list of how many players there are under 5'10" in the NHL, and how many smaller prospects there are putting up great numbers in the minors. That should give you an idea of the likelihood of him making it.

Sorry if the truth hurts. Maybe you shouldn't brag about flames prospects on a Canucks board.
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#2302 vv2

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:37 AM

So my "opinion" about smaller players being less likely to make the NHL is biased?

Ok there chief. Go get a list of how many players there are under 5'10" in the NHL, and how many smaller prospects there are putting up great numbers in the minors. That should give you an idea of the likelihood of him making it.

Sorry if the truth hurts. Maybe you shouldn't brag about flames prospects on a Canucks board.

You tell him man idk wtf he's doing here bragging about the flames future lol but i guess its just what he does.
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#2303 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:40 AM

Yeah I agree with DeNiro.
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#2304 Baercheese

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:40 AM

So my "opinion" about smaller players being less likely to make the NHL is biased?

Ok there chief. Go get a list of how many players there are under 5'10" in the NHL, and how many smaller prospects there are putting up great numbers in the minors. That should give you an idea of the likelihood of him making it.

Sorry if the truth hurts. Maybe you shouldn't brag about flames prospects on a Canucks board.

MSL
Brian Gionta
Nathan Gerbe
Mike Cammalleri
Danny Briere
Derek Roy
Tyler Ennis
Brad Marchand
Steve Sullivan
David Desharnais


just to name a few

AHL Cam Atkinson, too lazy to look the others up.

Oh and take off your Schroeder colored glasses, by your standards he's not making the NHL either champ.
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3499h5x.jpg
Johnny Gaudreau>any Casucks

Edler, Markstrom, Hansen, 2nd round pick 2014 to Islanders for Ryan Strome, 5th overall pick 2014

This is fairly even as well.

 


#2305 Baercheese

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:46 AM

Gaudreau just scored 7 goals in 3 games.

Good night folks

Edited by Sven Baertschi, 03 January 2013 - 05:46 AM.

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3499h5x.jpg
Johnny Gaudreau>any Casucks

Edler, Markstrom, Hansen, 2nd round pick 2014 to Islanders for Ryan Strome, 5th overall pick 2014

This is fairly even as well.

 


#2306 DeNiro

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:53 AM

MSL
Brian Gionta
Nathan Gerbe
Mike Cammalleri
Danny Briere
Derek Roy
Tyler Ennis
Brad Marchand
Steve Sullivan
David Desharnais


just to name a few

AHL Cam Atkinson, too lazy to look the others up.

Oh and take off your Schroeder colored glasses, by your standards he's not making the NHL either champ.


Okay you've named 10 players out of 700 in the NHL. That's about 1.5% of the league.

And you've only named 4 that have been drafted in the last 10 years. It goes to show what sort of impact smaller players are making in the league today.

I already said that the odds are stacked against him. He's going to have to be way better than any 6'0"+ players to make it.

Edited by DeNiro, 03 January 2013 - 05:56 AM.

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#2307 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:56 AM

Gaudreau just scored 7 goals in 3 games.

Good night folks


Let's be honest, his hattrick against the Czechs was pretty lucky, the puck came to him with an empty net everytime.

And Schroeder is the all time leading scoring in US WJ history.

Edited by Smashian Kassian, 03 January 2013 - 05:56 AM.

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#2308 spliced

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:58 AM

This may have been the worst team Canada in around 10 years or more. In 10 they were one overtime goal away. In 11 they basically had it but they fell asleep and let Russia come back. Last year Murray, a pretty decent player, just happens to have maybe one of the worst games of his life. Canada may have lost this game anyway but at least when they got it going in that game they made things happen. This year if anything Canada got the breaks and they still were significantly outplayed. It's amazing how these guys light it up with their CHL teams but struggle so mightily to score against any of the good teams in this tourney.
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#2309 unknown33429

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 05:58 AM

Okay you've named 10 players out of 700 in the NHL. That's about 1.5% of the league.

And you've only named 3 that have been drafted in the last 10 years. It goes to show what sort of impact smaller players are making in the league today.

I already said that the odds are stacked against him. He's going to have to be way better than any 6'0"+ players to make it.


Sven's got a point. This kid is really good. A smaller player won't likely make it as a 3rd/4th liner, so he has to be in the top 6, which lowers his chances, but I don't think it'll be as hard as you think it'll be for him. He can put on the weight, and be an effective player.
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Are you CRAZY??? Trade Green for ONE first round pick?? He's restricted after this season.... He WILL get an offer sheet for 7-8 million from a number of teams regardless if he plays another minute for us or not. That offer sheet would be worth 4 first round draft choices.


Some fans overrate their players, and then there is this guy.

#2310 DeNiro

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 06:03 AM

Let's be honest, his hattrick against the Czechs was pretty lucky, the puck came to him with an empty net everytime.

And Schroeder is the all time leading scoring in US WJ history.


Don't try and bring this guy down. He's clearly hyped up on this guy. Yet he thinks I'm the one with the rose colored glasses on.

Anton Rodin also had as many points as Neidereiter in the world juniors. Who do you thinks gonna be the better player?

That's why the world juniors have to be taken with a grain of salt. It's easy to hype up prospects here.
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