Dazzle
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Posts posted by Dazzle
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5 hours ago, Alflives said:
Yzerboy passed on Hughes and traded away his best D man (who is only 25). Those are two massive mistakes. He had to hold a press conference at the end of this last season explaining g his poor judgement. He went so far as to say the mistakes are on him. Yzerboy got the boot from TBay for doing a middling job and the same will happen soon in Detroit.
That's objectively wrong.
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4 hours ago, Master Mind said:
You don't trade a core piece to help the tank. Hronek was considered expendable. No team would consider a 25 yr old 1D expendable. Hence why it's easy to deduce from that alone that he isn't that good. Then watching him play for years in Detroit, it's apparent he is not a 1D. Maybe he can be better with us than with DET, but still not a 1D. I think he's much closer to a #4D.
I was meaning that Hronek could be kept and they can still tank. I've listened to Button's thoughts on this, and I don't agree. EP and QH wouldn't want out because we chose not to overpay for Hronek at the deadline in a lost season. We paid too high of a price, at the worst time.
Fully agree. We should NOT have been paying premium prices for a luxury item while being a bottom feeding team.
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5 hours ago, IBatch said:
Dude, Hronek was playing ahead of Seider in Detroit's depth chart. Trading him (although he was injured his last game), helped with their tank as well, so improved their own pick. That was the strategy. IF say Zadina was like EP, no way would he have weakened his right side like that. The trade made sense for both sides. Also Button said, and agree with him 100% on this, had we not made the trade, given how bad our D is, might as well trade EP and QHs as well, and didn't bring up that they both don't want to stick around for a rebuild either.
Will absolutely take Buttons word over my own, or any CDCer I don't actually know credentials for. Button is a scout. And a good one. His lists are regularly better than what we drafted lol. Should have just gone with his BPA. Listen to his comments about the trade. He said it made zero sense for us to not make this trade, and that it was a great trade. Also suggest maybe investing some time into the odds of the first round, and maybe later rounds working out. Of course you can't get a gem without a lottery ticket. If you're into a rip it all apart sort of thing, will you could be right. But i for one, at least want to see what another GM can do to finish things up with this core. Before throwing away a couple future HHOFers.
So my question is, why couldn't this new management tank like Detroit did? We ended up paying draft picks for their ability to tank better?
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I don't know what the standards are to classify Green as an "above average NHL coach". He produced a worse win rate than Willie Desjardins, who almost everyone here will agree had terrible rosters to work with (sans his first year)
I don't know what world we live in where losing record would make them seem like a good coach. They have almost identical stats to each other. Desjardins had one good season. Green's last year had the best roster. They are both mediocre coaches.
Willie Desjardins
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37 minutes ago, canuck73_3 said:
They have rebuilt faster and better than Vancouver has under two regimes. Are Canuck fans really in a position to mock him or them at this point?
They also got a 1st overall, so let's not ignore that either. Also had a 2nd overall.
Their rebuilds were not strictly because of these two players, because they could've ended up like Edmonton. -
Just now, DrJockitch said:
He played the same structure that Vegas just won the cup with. Vegas was just suited better to that style.
The team stank, was that partially coaching sure but the crap Benning gave him to work with year after year was terrible.
I get accused of being biased when I say a crappy player is a crappy player but everyone craps all over TG, then they crap all over the second winningest coach in NHL history because he couldn't get the country club to play hard and then Tocchet comes in and they start to break up the country club because that crappy team was not built to win.
He coached the team assembled by a man who will go down as one of the worse GMs in league history. But must be all his fault.
It's because the team needs accountability. Tocchet actually keeps people in line. Green, on the other hand, played favourites.
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12 minutes ago, DrJockitch said:
Maybe it had more to do with the crappy teams the idiot GM gave him to work with.
We crap all over anyone that leaves but he never had much to work with.
There is a reason we are working so hard to tear apart the team JB built.
Alway easy to blame the coach and people always think they know more than the coach (they don't).
Here's the thing. Benning gave him something like 6 seasons of employment. During this time, Green has not had a winning record, whether this is the AHL or the NHL. Green has also had input on all the players on his lineups. You cannot absolve Green of that. Green's style of coaching is not proven whatsoever.
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I don't get it. What do they see in this guy?
It really begs the question: how many coaches just keep getting recycled?
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45 minutes ago, VancouverHabitant said:
My biggest issue with the NHL is that they have done everything possible to make it less violent then it was before.
Now players are buddy-buddy with the opposition, regular hits are being called a penalty at an alarming rate, and the part that annoys me the most is the fact that they don't show replays of big hits or fights.
Speaking of replays, they have cut down on replays of even big saves and nice dangles. They are trying to squeeze in every last bit of advertising and in the process have made the TV product much worst.
Imagine if NFL cut down their replays to a minimum?
Your reasoning behind this is disturbing.
Is being less violent a bad thing? I agree that the reffing is dog shit, especially in the playoffs, but violence (bad hits) need to be curbed. Violent offenders need bigger punishment.If you think you need big hits and fights to get excited in the game, you are living in the past. I prefer a little bit of everything. Skill, good reffing, decent fights. I don't want f**king boarding or blindshot hits. I want solid, clean hits, ideally without any injury.
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There is a thing as someone being right, but not for the right reasons.
NHL marketing could be improved, but the marketing of this sport is very different than UFC. Whatever White thinks of UFC is not going to be appropriate for NHL.
So White is right that the NHL could use more work on marketing, but White is not the person to be talking about it. He clearly doesn't know everything. They're completely different sports catering to different audiences.
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17 hours ago, nuckin_futz said:
We've all heard of teams buying out their mistakes.
Is there another instance of a team buying out a mistake they traded for?
Keith Ballard - Gillis
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1 minute ago, Elias Pettersson said:
I told you all months ago that OEL would get bought out. Nobody believed me except @Alflives
Why do you think Allvin wasn’t worried about cap space? I knew this was going to happen so we didn’t have to give up futures to dump salary.
This is an incredibly short sighted move, from management that clearly doesn't know what they're doing. The trading of Hronek was an unnecessary luxury, giving up a 1st and a 2nd for an impending RFA that they have no space for.
So buying OEL was their solution? For f**k's sake.
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10 minutes ago, Provost said:
So reporting that we are buying out OEL… sweet.
Gotta make sure we do more of that long term pain stuff to incrementally help our chances of being a fringe playoff team over the next couple years.
Ridiculous situation. This team is going to be unwatchable for the next little bit, due to mismanagement of this team. This buyout could've been waited. The Hronek trade could've waited.
Honestly, just sell the team already. That's how I feel about this now.
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1 minute ago, Iron Man said:
Let this be a cautionary tale for any management before they make desperation trades.
The Hronek one was a desperation trade. Obviously this new management didn't take any notes.
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3 minutes ago, HKSR said:
What the hell??? This is a really short sighted move. Feels about the same as when Benning traded for OEL/Garland in the first place. Really about ready to just give up watching this team and this sport. First the expansion VGK cup win, and now this...
This management shoots itself in the foot all the time, even if OEL wasn't their trade. They didn't have to do this move, but their lack of patience is going to hurt us long term.
I'm so sad to see this PA version of Canuck hockey. -
1 minute ago, King Heffy said:
And they chose to handicap the team for a decade instead of making an intelligent decision. Anyone qualified to work in hockey ops would understand that this is by far the stupidest thing that a GM can possibly do. They thought about it and still chose to destroy the future of the franchise. Even Keenan caused less damage than the idiots currently running the franchise.
Yeah, I'm honestly done watching this team until these clowns get out of office. They are awful managers.
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Just now, D.B Cooper said:What about the last years moves make you think they are going to do anything close to a rebuild?
They traded away a 1 and 2 pick in an unreal draft.
They just screwed the future for cap space today.
There is no rebuild coming.
Only more mediocrityI disagree with you heavily in the past, but I can't stop agreeing with you at all.
People are fooling themselves if they think this team (management) learned anything from Benning's time. Benning made plenty of mistakes. Now this management has not learned anything about mistakes, but makes even more of them.
The throwing away of 1st and 2nd round picks was like Gillis, except we are NOT a competing playoff team. Gillis did it because he needed the team to keep going.
This is just crap management.
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This management is really Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. They make some good moves, like pro scouting picks (Really love Joshua, Hirose and Kuzmenko) that cost little money, similar to how Gillis did things. Then they'd do some wonky thing like trading a 1st and a 2nd for Hronek out of desperation, realize that they don't have money to sign this RFA and then do this buyout to "save money".
This management is unfortunately no better than Benning. We're going to be a very bad team for a long time and we'll no picks to show for it.
This management has no plan, unfortunately.
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On 6/8/2023 at 8:27 AM, Jam126 said:
Quite a few authoritarians in this thread.
Speaks volumes about who upvoted you lol.
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33 minutes ago, IBatch said:
That's one view. Another view, if you watched the games, was Green was trying to install a system, we lost a lot of one goal games. He lost all his PKers. And had a huge personel shift. Funny thing, Bodreau with the same roster, how did he do this year? Can't cancel one just because that's your view. Both Bruce AND Green, had issues with this roster. Both got fired. One actually had a bunch of one goal games lost, going back to more or less the start of his tenure. Which lasted a lot longer than Bruce's. You should listen to what Tochett has to say about Green. Do you like Tochett?
But here's the thing though. Though Tocchet often references Green, his "accountability" in the short term has been much more so than Green. Green had been picking and choosing who to bench. Usually the rookies were the ones to get the so-called tough love. But the problem is that the rest of the roster gets a free pass.
Tocchet is less of an old school coach than Green, oddly enough.
I like Tocchet's style, and contrary to Green, his style is not offensive stifling. I think Tocchet's communication is better than Green's.
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1 minute ago, IBatch said:
Ok. Not going to argue with you. How did his "other coaches" feel? Green barely even coached him. But did give him a chance. Salo was right on the money. And JB should have looked beyond the WJ's and on a loaded London team. Heck draft plus one Bouchard was better.
Bouchard had skating issues (at the beginning) and his stock dropped a bit. Funny how he's able to turn it around. It's almost like there's a cause and effect to these things. The Bouchard you know now was not the same as how Juolevi was viewed at the time by all scouts. There's so much revisionist history given how poorly Juolevi turned out, yet his draft projection was high. Top 10 for sure. Go find another draft report that says Juolevi is not a top 10 pick. People will say Sergachev, but he wasn't top 10.
In short, people are misremembering facts
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5 minutes ago, IBatch said:
Hmm. How's OJ doing now? How did he do in Florida? Green is/was a better coach than JB was a GM.
This might rub people the wrong way, but he took a pretty mediocre at best roster, to more playoff recorded games, then any coach other than AV, Quin and Roger Nielson. And saying that roster was mediocre, is nice.
Green hasn't had a winning record, from start to finish. Boudreau took Green's exact roster after he was fired and took the team on its run. Small sample, but it speaks volumes about Green's consistent inability to make more from the roster, contrary to what you said.
If Green was so great, how did Boudreau do well with a "crap" roster?
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1 minute ago, IBatch said:
Hmm. How's OJ doing now? How did he do in Florida? Green is/was a better coach than JB was a GM.
OJ isn't squarely to be blamed on Green, but we definitely can point out the number of prospects that didn't do so well under Green. OJ's main downfall was his inability to stay healthy.
Green's not a good coach at all, period. You cannot say a losing record coach is a "better" coach. Willie D was a better coach. Bad rosters with a better win percentage. Green has had multiple chances to pick and choose his lineups, and each one was a losing one. Yes, even the bubble team was a losing record one. He did do well in the bubble, but we've seen so little playoff success under Green (and under Benning).
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Just now, NewbieCanuckFan said:
I might be mistaken but I seem to remember him having a number of healthy scratches in the last year of Benning's tenure (as well as being moved up front to play as a forward) in the minors. But I might have my timelines confused (ala Star Trek & the Kelvin timeline
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He was also played as a forward, which caused people to speculate whether Woo was actually a bust defenseman. They didn't take into account the Utica (at the time) had a backlog of defenseman and injuries pushed Woo up front.
I think that development played a small role in his offensive game. It wasn't a bad thing though, in hindsight. Woo looks like he might crack this NHL lineup. We'll see.
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).
Why is no one talking about the missing submarine?
in Off-Topic General
Posted
That's not a great analogy, sorry.