theo5789

I just don't see any of those guys making a huge difference even over what we have currently and they will come at a higher cost than what we have. Lee would certainly add more size, but we have seen the likes of Ladd, Neal, etc simply fizzle after a big contract and Lee doesn't really jump out as being all too different. I rather just given Leivo an extended look in the top 6 in this case as a cheaper option and less term. Obviously Lee is currently the better player, but cost to value here doesn't sit well with me. Dzingel is a smaller speedy guy who I think has the most bust potential. He's like Spooner for me. Again Dzingel is currently better, but it comes down to cost and anything above 4 million a season doesn't appeal to me. Both him and Lee don't provide the defensive side of the game if they aren't producing (at least LE does). Connolly is intriguing as he should come in as the cheapest option with least term, but I would classify him more as another middle 6 guy vs top 6 talent and we have plenty of those already. Connolly has had his injury history as well and only played his first full season this year at age 27. I think if he takes like a 3 year deal at no more than 2.5 million, then sure, but then we would still have to unload a similar role player to fit him in. Stone would've been in the Panarin/EK group which I would've loved for sure as well. This group makes a difference despite their hefty price tag. The next group is really more of the same that we've been through and we are slowly having an influx of youth plus current players that just make them seem like more expensive replacements.

Yeah I haven't been following the conversation. Just commented on that post. Of course ideally it would be great to have guys that have size, speed and skill all on one package all the time. Unfortunately it doesn't play out that way. We just have to draft whoever we believe will be the best player in the long run (albeit a difficult task). I agree our current defense will certainly not be a final product by the time we are competing in the playoffs, but every year some team wins a Cup and other teams emulate that team, so you never know if our group just happens to click at the right time. Hutton has decent size, just doesn't play with a lot of edge, but I feel like he can handle himself if things get physical. Stecher and Biega are the types that play above their weight and just seem to bounce back if they get knocked down and aren't afraid to throw their weight around either. Hughes' skating is what's going to seperate him from the Western forwards. We do need someone to help clear the crease and maybe that is Woo or even Tryamkin if he comes back. Juolevi isn't small, but likely doesn't play a physical game. Rathbone doesn't seem to back down either. If we sign guys like Edler and Schenn, they certainly balance out some of the size lost as well in the short term. IMO to revamp the defense, we simply need to find some top pairing D (looking at you EK) to be able to bring down the minutes of the rest of the group and I'd feel much more confident even with the personnel we have today without any other changes, but that's easier said than done.

That could be interpreted as simply looking for players for the top 6 forwards or top 4 dmen and not necessarily the top end UFAs. I, however, think it'll be a mistake to sign the non top end guys at like 6-7 million a year for 6 or whatever years. It's the highest risk region and the rewards are not generally that high (50ish point forwards or 20-30 point dmen basically).

The 2nd tier is where more of the mistakes will come from. Most years, this 2nd tier, would be what's best out there. Personally I would rather stay out of the 2nd tier (unless it's a bargain deal) and just keep moving forward with what we have if the premier players are gone. Sign some depth maybe on RD, but our forward group is already overloaded as it is and that 2nd tier isn't going to move the needle for their cost.

IMO, the ability to process the game/read plays/slow the game down is how I define hockey IQ. I'm not sure it's something that can be taught, but natural instincts could be developed with enough repetition. With the expectation for players to make the jump sooner than later, it doesn't give a lot of time for those with low IQ to catch up. With that said, I'm a firm believer of Virtanen because of the tools he has, but I can see why Green is developing him the way he is in giving him more of a defined role and making him into a usable NHL player first and hopefully having the rest of the game click in eventually. Basically Green has bought him more time to grow. If the scouting is true that Broberg is more like Virtanen, then he might have to head down the same path. However as a dman, it is much harder to to do this with more minutes expected, so you would need a solid d-core that can buy him that time (shelter) to develop at the NHL or he will have to put in his time at the AHL level (likely 2-4 years). I'm not for or against Broberg, but hopefully he is indeed the BPA (which doesn't mean who makes the NHL the fastest) at our pick if we do take him.

This just says to me that we need to get more edge to the team rather than size. There are plenty of big guys that do not play to their size at the NHL level also. Guys with edge can be found in the later rounds (Bieksa was a 5th round pick). We need to look for high end (top 6 forward/top 4 dman potential) with our first rounder regardless of size (obviously if you can add the best guy available who happens to be a guy with size and edge, then it'll be perfect). Woo may be our next Bieksa though.

I don't think the Canucks should, nor will Boeser's side want to go for a 8 year deal. For the Canuck side, we will be banking on Boeser improving, which he might indeed, but 8 million a season for an RFA will put us in a position where our cap on players will rise faster than we can keep up. I get that 8 million a year would mean buying UFA years, but we don't know what type of player he will be by that time. What we do know so far is that he has yet to play a full season and currently averages at about 67 points a season. It's good, but not great. So I can't see the Canucks wanting to commit that much term yet (I think EP will be a different story). As for Boeser, I think he would like to prove himself more before committing to a long term deal. I think he will bank on himself for a bigger payout later on. He could want to just take the money and run, but it will have to be a deal that will be enticing for the Canucks to commit to. I know times have changed, but I feel like 8-10 million dollar players should be PPG guys at least especially considering there were like 30 players to do so this past season. Anything above that needs to be a special player that can do more beyond putting up points (or be well above PPG). I rather see if Boeser even gets to this point first before committing that kind of money. I think I would offer a 6x4 deal which keeps him as an RFA by the end of the deal. If Boeser wants us to buy all the RFA years now so he's UFA by the end of it, then 6.5x5 is what I would go for (I'm assuming 5 years takes him to UFA). We have Bo at 5.5 as a comparison and while Boeser is out-producing him offensively so far, Bo provides far more. Personally I think 8 million a year is what I would offer for his next contract after whatever he gets this time around and that's assuming if all goes well in staying healthy and upping his production further.

Well one might think they should be having these discussions behind closed doors rather than in the public and loud enough to be heard by the public while supposedly wearing official Canuck gear to boot. Unless they want to be heard and want it "leaked" so the message is passed on early to whichever target to maybe think about it ahead of time. Or maybe it was just a couple of dudes trying to pass off as official Canuck staffers. But yes I'd be surprised if all GMs didn't kick the tires on players like Panarin and EK even just to see what the market is for future reference. Hopefully the calls aren't quick ones as the addition of Panarin or EK will be huge.

Book it now, we are signing Panarin, EK and Bobrovsky

They have cap space to match anything that isn't unreasonable. If it's unreasonable for them to match, then it likely means a deal that isn't worth what Bennett provides. He's no longer 18 years old.

Chevy traded last year's 1st for a rental (Stastny) and looking like it will happen again this year (Hayes) unless they open up cap room to re-sign him meaning potentially losing more assets to make room of offloading some decent talent. To be clear I'm not criticizing these moves as it was an attempt to make a playoff push and that's just the way things go sometimes. But while Chevy has certainly made some good moves indeed, he's also made some moves that some of this fanbase would criticize to no end if his name was Benning. The only problem with dealing for Trouba is if there's a bidding war and if he even wants to play here long term. There's not a whole lot of leverage for Chevy to work with as it's looking like he doesn't want to stay in Winnipeg and they don't have to room to hang on to him cap-wise.

Add in the fact that simply because he's capable of playing 30 mins a night, he doesn't have to every night. He will likely average closer to 25 mins a night which means less pressure to find those elusive RD to take on minutes and we can actually look at budget guys like Schenn who are fine in more minimal minutes in the bottom pairing or even to give a young guy like Woo more sheltered minutes to start. It opens up way more options in the deployment, but the key thing is having someone in the upper level to bring down the minutes of the rest to more reasonable levels which hopefully prevent more injuries and put the rest in a position to play to their strengths.

How much do you think Lee is going to command? I'm thinking at least a 6x6 because any less then the Isles would pay him that for sure. Lee had a drop off in production without Tavares dropping over 10 points and went from a 40 goal guy to a 28 goal guy. Sure he has size and plays physical, but if people think Nelson is overpaid with his new deal, then Lee will look overpaid IMO given that Nelson plays center instead of wing and Nelson has upper his game while Lee took a step back. IMO, Lee will be much closer to the LE UFA class, where all those big power forwards flopped after getting their big deals. I'm not surprised that the Isles locked up Nelson first before their current captain.

The thing is that the big UFA signings have not been of the superstar quality. This is because superstars rarely make it to UFA status. The equivalent this year of the "big UFA signing" would be someone like Myers and I would agree with you here in that his cost to value term will likely backfire. The equivalent to EK hitting UFA is more along the lines of someone like John Tavares. Now while Toronto has kinda shot themselves in the foot cap-wise, Tavares has produced and lived up to expectations so far with 88 points in a full season and the other cap woes have been due to other factors moreso than Tavares himself (eg Nylander's horrible deal, signing Marleau which was a decent idea but that was before Tavares, the Zaitsev deal after one good season, etc). Being 29 isn't a major concern as the max contract is 7 years and playing until 36 at at still a high level doesn't seem far fetched to me. I understand the injury concerns and it's the only thing that does bother me, but someone like Giordano had a torn harmstring and torn bicep before. He was down and out for many games between the ages of 27-31, but has been playing full seasons after that and has even become a Norris candidate at age 35. The last couple of seasons EK hasn't seemed to be completely healthy and is still putting up 70 point seasons. I would like to take an approach that will get him back to full health or close to it for the 1st season and can you imagine the damage he could do at that point? Why do you think teams are willing to pay him as much as he's likely going to get? Because he's a premier player in the league. It's not going to be so much a team simply overpaying the best UFA on the market. He could very well be worth the 11 million a year even if he was re-signing back with his team and not even hitting UFA.

If he's going to sign for 7-8 million, he might as well sign in Tampa where he will have less taxes to pay and be on a better contending team at the moment. But the schedule is a valid concern.

Canes and Avs have also had the luxury of winning top 3 picks. That won't be happening for us, so might as well try a different avenue. Our owner is willing to spend to build a winner and we have a fanbase that seems willing to pay top dollar to see a winning team, so owners will have their investments returned quickly. I don't blame you for being conservative, but our previous signings have not been of the high calibre type. Injuries will always be a concern even amongst our own drafted players anyway (see Boeser and EP), but all it'll take is some luck and if everyone is healthy going into the playoffs, we are that much more dangerous with someone like EK. I'm not even that concerned about the Luongo situation. I highly doubt he will burn us like that and just hit LTIR until his contract is done like many others have done or even "mutually agree" to terminate the contract and just take on a role in management so he still gets paid.

Pietrangelo is an excellent player indeed, but he's one of those step below guys for me. He's only really topped out at under 55 points. He's more physical and has different elements to his game, but I wouldn't put him quite so high. He will be 31 I believe if and when he does hit UFA as well, so buying 7 years of him as a UFA (taking him to 38) could still be as much of a risk as taking EK at 7 years until he's 36. But yes how could I forget Larsson. Edmonton will surely give him McDavid dollars before he hits UFA though.

If he's willing (many players want to play and make a difference for their team if they can), and if the team can afford to do so, then I'm certainly up for that idea if it keeps him fresh. We don't need to be #1 in the regular season as we saw this year, we just need to make the playoffs and make sure EK is healthy when we get there. EK on one leg is a warrior in the playoffs, I can only wonder what a healthy EK can do.

How many of those guys are Karlsson level? How many will actually hit UFA? How many will be traded before UFA and sign with their new team? It's is very unlikely that the top guys here will even hit UFA. EK has really only gotten to this point because of his situation in Ottawa otherwise he may have very well just stayed there long term. Another example is someone like Tavares where if NYI had done something much earlier to make try to be a real team, then he would've stayed there. It's not often the big fish hit the market that easily. Of that list, Seth Jones and John Klingberg are really the only guys closest to EK level. The rest are certainly a step or two or even more below.

Well I think he could be sheltered a bit so he doesn't get overworked. But him taking on 20-22 minutes instead of his normal 24-25 will do wonders for the rest of our defense as it should put the rest of the defense in more normal minutes and maybe have less injuries themselves. As EK gets healthier from taking on lesser minutes, he can gradually up his minutes and especially during the playoffs assuming we would get back there with a player of his calibre. This takes some pressure off Hughes to carry the offensive workload at such a young age, but also will give him opportunities to run the show if EK does go down or needs some maintenance time. So EK will surely need to be "maintained", but it's only to try to get him back on track health-wise so he can return to his normal play which will be well worth the dollars.

The link you added has no indication that we were the only Canadian team he was willing to waive to be traded to. It was only speculation that we were kicking the tires to see if there would be a fit. For all we know, he may have told us "no thanks" already. With that said, I would certainly see if he's interested as he's still a 70 point dman and can play 25+ minutes needed. He put up 16 points in 19 games in the playoffs despite not looking the healthiest either, so he's clearly a playoff warrior when we get back there in the future and is tough as nails playing through it. I get the injury concern and I do have doubts about that too, but where else can we find such a quality player for nothing more than cap and roster space? At worst in the future he becomes LTIR fodder and finds an island, gets bought out, gets traded (with a sweetener) to a team that wants to get to the cap floor (but I assume he will have trade clauses), or he may even decide to retire and saves us the trouble. There are other options that will bring either a lesser player (albeit maybe younger and healthier), but those will cost other assets that we could also use to further other team. If we are dipping into FA this year, I would like to see us after a big fish like Karlsson or Panarin rather than the moderate expensive guys that have higher flop potential than the surefire superstars.

We'll see how effective he really is. His first season as assistant coach in Florida, they had the 18th best PP. So was the sudden surge due to improvements in his system or maybe more to do with the addition of Hoffman who half his points this year was on the PP? Also Newell Brown had one of the best PPs in the NHL at one point as well and clearly it doesn't matter as much now. I think Quinn Hughes will improve our PP more so than bringing in a new PP coach.

I didn't claim he was a 40 point guy because of the new system. I said that he's in a system where it's more defensive where even someone like Barzal had a 20+ point drop off and yet Nelson has upped his point totals (50+). He has been trusted by his coach to play "1st line minutes" averaging just under 19 mins a night. He didn't take any clauses for discount value and they are buying UFA years and they haven't been a team that really attracts players so they overpaid a bit. So let's say his "market value" is 5 million a season as a "2nd line point producer" then this is well within reason of a contract extension with the hopes that he at least maintains this previous seasons production.

And?

It's not just necessarily about importance, but there are factors involved where a UFA can sign anywhere they would like while an RFA doesn't have that luxury. I understand not low balling a RFA, but at the same time, they shouldn't be getting UFA market value.