A Game Of Thrones: To the point of the TV show, no spoilers beyond that

[ckamo]

The nights of the watch usually burn the bodies of their dead, right? Wouldn't that eliminate the possibility of a Jon Snow resurrection, at least into his own body? He could come back as his direwolf, but so what? The man looks to be dead for good.

About to discuss fan theory, so I'm gonna tag it just in case...

If the R + L = J theory is correct, Jon's got Targaryen blood in him. Maybe this (or Melisandre) will use the fire to bring him back. Remember Dany wasn't harmed by fire at all.

[SabreFan1]

I won't be surprised if season 6 finale is Jon Snow's resurrection.

That would be interesting.

[Hugor Hill]

About to discuss fan theory, so I'm gonna tag it just in case...

If the R + L = J theory is correct, Jon's got Targaryen blood in him. Maybe this (or Melisandre) will use the fire to bring him back. Remember Dany wasn't harmed by fire at all.

Nah. Jon's hand was burned when he killed that wight in Commander Mormont's quarter in season 1.

Viserys was burned to death by gold. Again, there goes that theory

Edited June 16, 2015 by Hugor Hill

[DeNiro]

I've got two theories.

Either he'll be brought back by the white walkers and become an undead soldier.

Or some sort of black magic will bring him back.

I'm willing to bet he'll be back one way or another though.

[Hugor Hill]

I've got two theories.

Either he'll be brought back by the white walkers and become an undead soldier.

Or some sort of black magic will bring him back.

I'm willing to bet he'll be back one way or another though.

Like the article I quoted last page, if they don't bring back Jon Snow in one form or another, it will be a big mistake. He is not Robb, or Ned, or Oberyn.

[Tre Mac]

Stannis death reminded of the governor's death in TWD. Wasnt concrete until after that shows break. It would be utterly ridiculous if he didnt die.

[Beluga Whale]

Jon Sow is not done yet folks. He's the son of Rheagar and Lyanna and he's the song of ice and fire. He will lead the fight against the Others when winter comes and I'm certain Melisandre will resurrect him at some point in the future.

Honestly I'm kind of disappointed with this episode. They tried putting in way too many huge moments in a 1 hour episode and certain things didn't feel as impacting as I was expecting. Also seems like they're just harming "good guys" over and over for shock value now. For example Shireen did not need to be burned alive, that was too far and unnecessary considering Stannis' fate.

Dorne was a joke. Not happy with how Stannis went down either. Everything else in the last episode was decent. The walk of shame was especially well done.

So did Balon Greyjoy wins the War of the Five Kings? Lol

What is dead may never die?

Despite my cynicism, not a bad season and it's still the best show on TV.

Edited June 16, 2015 by Beluga Whale

[JohnLocke]

Screw this show.

It's not even funny anymore.... I'm gonna stop watching until they resurrect Jon Snow.

If they don't, then good riddance.

Every other storyline in is disappointing and boring as dicks.

[Shaft]

Yes, very disappointing.

[Baka]

I do not get the Melisandre theory with Jon Snow.

Melisandre has never brought anyone back from the dead and in the one case we saw it only Thoros could do it for Beric. If anything she only looks like a fool now who mislead Stannis trying to recreate a prophesy with fake acts and realized how &^@#ed they were and retreated first chance she got. Unless she is playing an act or Stannis is still alive and will rise up to take winterfell (possible as off screen deaths are often misleads) she just seems like a weak mislead woman who defied the gods and got rekt. But even when she seemed powerful she still wasn't ever doing feats like that.

Plus the whole concept of reviving so many people seems very dragonball Z and kind of boring. Even in this show though when it has been done no one seems to have came back the same. From the wights to stoneheart they didn't seem to come back much like the same people they were. Beric was the only one somewhat similar but had thoros their to handle things as soon as he died.

And even if Jon was revived what would be the point? The watch already turned on him why go through that arc just to have them accept him now and land at the same place? Or is he going to ditch them and single handedly handle the Walkers?

To me he is dead and he is best dead. To me it would just seem cheesy to have him revived and come save the world.

But that is just me. I do feel the show in general has slipped greatly and have come to realize even as far as books go GOT is topped by many others in the fantasy genre so who knows.

[inane]

Lol. You're like one of those people who isn't quite intelligent enough to get what everyone else is talking about, yet you enter the conversation and act like your standing on superior ground.

You are acting like I've stated this is ruining my life, or at the very least, that I am actually upset. You are simply misrepresenting what I have said to try and make yourself look better. Instead of using a cliche argument, if you bothered to read what I've said, you'd actually see that I have taken responsibility for my actions. I am aware of the risk, and have made a decision that the risk is worth it. That, however, doesn't prohibit me from being allowed to call out other people.

Instead of me telling you to take responsibility for your own actions, maybe you should take responsibility for trying to understand what other people are saying before responding to them.

Whatever.Not me who was spoiling this. You want to have things spoiler free, live in a bubble. Otherwise deal.

[soshified]

I do not get the Melisandre theory with Jon Snow.

Melisandre has never brought anyone back from the dead and in the one case we saw it only Thoros could do it for Beric. If anything she only looks like a fool now who mislead Stannis trying to recreate a prophesy with fake acts and realized how fracked they were and retreated first chance she got. Unless she is playing an act or Stannis is still alive and will rise up to take winterfell (possible as off screen deaths are often misleads) she just seems like a weak mislead woman who defied the gods and got rekt. But even when she seemed powerful she still wasn't ever doing feats like that.

Plus the whole concept of reviving so many people seems very dragonball Z and kind of boring. Even in this show though when it has been done no one seems to have came back the same. From the wights to stoneheart they didn't seem to come back much like the same people they were. Beric was the only one somewhat similar but had thoros their to handle things as soon as he died.

And even if Jon was revived what would be the point? The watch already turned on him why go through that arc just to have them accept him now and land at the same place? Or is he going to ditch them and single handedly handle the Walkers?

To me he is dead and he is best dead. To me it would just seem cheesy to have him revived and come save the world.

But that is just me. I do feel the show in general has slipped greatly and have come to realize even as far as books go GOT is topped by many others in the fantasy genre so who knows.

If Jon Snow is revived, he is Azor Ahai, the prince that was promised. That's the point.

To have him completely dead while building up his story for so long is bad writing. What's the point of Mel seeing something in Snow, or keeping his mother a secret? Jon Snow isn't Ned.

IMO, having him dead and coming back to life is the best scenerio for him since that's the only way his oath to the Night's Watch will be broken.

[Baka]

If Jon Snow is revived, he is Azor Ahai, the prince that was promised. That's the point.

To have him completely dead while building up his story for so long is bad writing. What's the point of Mel seeing something in Snow, or keeping his mother a secret? Jon Snow isn't Ned.

IMO, having him dead and coming back to life is the best scenerio for him since that's the only way his oath to the Night's Watch will be broken.

The story and universe is very deep full of lots of lore and stories even in places irrelevant to the story line and beyond the current shown map. But even if you were to take the Azor theory as destiny and unstoppable fact Jon isn't even the most fitting character for it, Dany is.

I also see why the pieces could align for Jon but how is confirming that theory good writing? It would just confirm he is Azor and then give you a drama free storyline where you know he is going to win because destiny says so.

As far as Mel goes like I said I still don't see why everyone is head over heals for her. Unless she was playing Stannis from day 1 to get to Jon (not utterly impossible she once gave a very cryptic quote about a sheep and its awareness of the blade under its throat, I forget the exact quote) then Mel misguided the entire time and showed how pointless her views are by backing Stannis as Azor.

As far as killing Snow at this point it goes along entirely with the story. A story that has established that anyone can die, fail, or disappear no matter how much development they have or how long they have been on the show. At this point it seems silly to think more big characters wont be dying next season and the one after.

Of course I could be wrong and Snow may get revived I certainly dont write the story but to me the story is better off leaving him dead and not raising him like some unstoppable Jesus who is going to save the world and fill a prophesy.

[Hugor Hill]

Here is another interesting article:

http://www.ew.com/article/2015/06/14/game-thrones-jon-snow-really-dead

It says Jon Snow is certainly dead, as the show runners want to make sure they show it explicitly without doubt, as with Ned's death. This means that Stannis is probably still alive as THAT execution scene was totally ambiguous,

[RUPERTKBD]

I do not get the Melisandre theory with Jon Snow.

Melisandre has never brought anyone back from the dead and in the one case we saw it only Thoros could do it for Beric. If anything she only looks like a fool now who mislead Stannis trying to recreate a prophesy with fake acts and realized how fracked they were and retreated first chance she got. Unless she is playing an act or Stannis is still alive and will rise up to take winterfell (possible as off screen deaths are often misleads) she just seems like a weak mislead woman who defied the gods and got rekt. But even when she seemed powerful she still wasn't ever doing feats like that.

Plus the whole concept of reviving so many people seems very dragonball Z and kind of boring. Even in this show though when it has been done no one seems to have came back the same. From the wights to stoneheart they didn't seem to come back much like the same people they were. Beric was the only one somewhat similar but had thoros their to handle things as soon as he died.

And even if Jon was revived what would be the point? The watch already turned on him why go through that arc just to have them accept him now and land at the same place? Or is he going to ditch them and single handedly handle the Walkers?

To me he is dead and he is best dead. To me it would just seem cheesy to have him revived and come save the world.

But that is just me. I do feel the show in general has slipped greatly and have come to realize even as far as books go GOT is topped by many others in the fantasy genre so who knows.

My theory is that Red Mel realized that she had been mistaken about Stannis in that scene in episode nine where we see her staring into the flames and then turning away looking stunned.

This was just before Ramsay's green berets managed to start fires all over the encampment. (I think Mel saw this coming as well, but let it happen in the hope that it would make Stannis desperate enough to burn Shireen)

She then gave Stannis the song and dance about "seeing Bolton banners burning", knowing that it would spur him on, likely to his death and she herself turned back for the Wall and the real AA.

So IMO, she was playing Stannis at the end, but truly believed he was the chosen one, up until episode 9 of this season.

[RUPERTKBD]

Here is another interesting article:

http://www.ew.com/article/2015/06/14/game-thrones-jon-snow-really-dead

It says Jon Snow is certainly dead, as the show runners want to make sure they show it explicitly without doubt, as with Ned's death. This means that Stannis is probably still alive as THAT execution scene was totally ambiguous,

I speculated with a couple of friends about the Stannis "execution" scene and how we don't know with absolute certainty that he's dead.

One idea that we batted around was Sansa and Theon walking into the wood at the exact moment she was starting to swing Oathkeeper. It certainly would have given her pause, and anything could happen after that. Remember Stannis' line, "Go ahead, do your duty."

What is Brienne's "duty" exactly? Certainly not to kill Stannis. (although it is her ambition) Brienne's "duty" is to rescue and protect Sansa. (and Arya) Certainly that would take precedent in the mind of the Maid of Tarth.

[AbbyNucksFan]

I speculated with a couple of friends about the Stannis "execution" scene and how we don't know with absolute certainty that he's dead.

One idea that we batted around was Sansa and Theon walking into the wood at the exact moment she was starting to swing Oathkeeper. It certainly would have given her pause, and anything could happen after that. Remember Stannis' line, "Go ahead, do your duty."

What is Brienne's "duty" exactly? Certainly not to kill Stannis. (although it is her ambition) Brienne's "duty" is to rescue and protect Sansa. (and Arya) Certainly that would take precedent in the mind of the Maid of Tarth.

except how would Stannis know that? so why would he say it?

[Hugor Hill]

I speculated with a couple of friends about the Stannis "execution" scene and how we don't know with absolute certainty that he's dead.

One idea that we batted around was Sansa and Theon walking into the wood at the exact moment she was starting to swing Oathkeeper. It certainly would have given her pause, and anything could happen after that. Remember Stannis' line, "Go ahead, do your duty."

What is Brienne's "duty" exactly? Certainly not to kill Stannis. (although it is her ambition) Brienne's "duty" is to rescue and protect Sansa. (and Arya) Certainly that would take precedent in the mind of the Maid of Tarth.

That's exactly my thoughts too. You can see a bit of hesitation on her face as she swung her sword.

except how would Stannis know that? so why would he say it?

Stannis doesn't. He was essentially saying "Kill me", but "duty" meant something different for Brienne. "Vengeance" was the reason she came after Stannis, "duty" is looking after Catelyn's daughters, as Rupert has put it.

Also, she probably realized that Stannis is the only leader in the seven kingdoms who might be genuinely interested in protecting the Stark children for what Ned did for him. Everyone else either wants them dead or are at best using them as pawns.

Edited June 16, 2015 by Hugor Hill

[Hugor Hill]

My theory is that Red Mel realized that she had been mistaken about Stannis in that scene in episode nine where we see her staring into the flames and then turning away looking stunned.

This was just before Ramsay's green berets managed to start fires all over the encampment. (I think Mel saw this coming as well, but let it happen in the hope that it would make Stannis desperate enough to burn Shireen)

She then gave Stannis the song and dance about "seeing Bolton banners burning", knowing that it would spur him on, likely to his death and she herself turned back for the Wall and the real AA.

So IMO, she was playing Stannis at the end, but truly believed he was the chosen one, up until episode 9 of this season.

I think Mel is too simple for scheming. She left only, and as soon as, she realized that Stannis wasn't the one in the finale.

Throughout the first half of the season, she was very much drawn to Jon to a point of creepy ("Are you a virgin?"). I think she internally felt that Jon was the true Azor Ahai but was too fixated with Stannis to realized it. Jon was the one who needed guidance but too bad he is dead.

I'm not sure if Mel will realize it in season 6 or if Jon will get resurrected or warged. But maybe this is part of the morale of the story: the bastard that no one wanted was the true hero but everyone overlooked him and the seven kingdoms will die because of their mistakes.

[Hugor Hill]

I just watched that one-sided battle again... where on earth did the Boltons get all their horses from?? Roose kind of implied a few episodes ago that they can't match Stannis in that category. Then I came to the conclusion that the sellsword companies probably switched sides and went to the Boltons along with all of Stannis' horses.

Betrayals led to the downfall of the good guys throughout the Game of Thrones, and here we go again. Even after Shireen I still considered Stannis as one of the good guys. If he truly is still alive, it will be interesting to see how his character responds to this defeat.