R3aL Posted June 7, 2013 Author Share Posted June 7, 2013 I don't think it's fair to compare Kesler to Datsyuk. Kesler is way out of his league. He is a second string player behind the Sedins, doesn't produce that much 5 on 5 and relies on playing the PP with the twins to rack up points. Datsyuk does everything Kesler does defensively and is miles better offensively and also has the hardware to back it up. I don't get the hype for Kesler. Sure he won a Selke 2 years ago, but Brad Richards won a Stanley cup and Conn Smythe (both of which are more valuable than a selke) in 2004 and I doubt anyone would trade a top 5 pick for him. I think if this were the 2011 offseason we could get 2 future superstar players for Kesler, but in the NHL it only takes a season or 2 for a players' value to drop significantly. 1 bad or a couple injury plagued seasons will cause that players' stock value to drop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuretoMogilny Posted June 7, 2013 Share Posted June 7, 2013 I just hate when others post proposals on my proposal page, and you have a lot of names misspelt, I dont really care just saying. I am pretty sure if top draft selections make the jump to the NHL right away their cap hits are above 3 mill, isnt that why Seguin Hall Yakupov etc have cap hits above 3 million? So I am almost certain Jones and Mackinnon if we had both would have a hit of 3.5 and Valeris would be slightly less but surely over 1. and you have gordon or steckel and booth out of the line up for depth, thats 5 plus million in depth.. thats a lot to not be dressed. And we have Sestitto signed as well, I clock in your lineup at 66-68 million thats not even including a depth defencmen. Jones and MAckinnon will not have 1 mill cap hits. I dont think they would have done that? The first 5 picks in this draft are like gold, Kesler has only one 40 goal season, he has never even been a PPG player, yes he has intangibles, yes he plays hard, yes hes good in the draw, yes he can play PP and PK, but for a player who has never dominated 5 on 5 consistently, yes he won a selke, but we dont know how long he can keep up his current level of play, I dont see him getting any better than he has shown? It may be the perfect time to trade him as he performed well in a very short stint in our playoffs. Not gonna blast Kesler, cause I love the guy, maybe he just needs better linemates, but the Sedins arent leaving, Kassian isnt leaving, I think its time for a new player to play with the sedins, I dont really want burrows on our second with Kesler or they are too similar to a third line. And I am not saying I want Erat at all, but Erats a guy who is very undervalued himself, hes put up 50ish pt seasons consistently on a team that is DEF first, and wasnt surrounded with much talent or even in a system to flourish, for all we know he could be a 70-80 pt guy in Wash next year. If Valeri busts I will be very shocked as well, I think he is a safer pick than people think. And I am not saying I want to trade Kesler and our first for just their first I said there would be something coming back our way I am just not sure what. And it would take a slight over payment to acquire a pick for a player with potential compared to Ovechkin and Malkin with a playing style similar to Rick Nash, whos mentally and psychically ready to jump into the NHL, and has said he plans to not just play in the NHL next year but impact it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CALGARY! Posted June 7, 2013 Share Posted June 7, 2013 I don't think teams with a top 5 pick are going to be trading down picks by more then 2-3 nu,beers max. Unless an a prospect and current blue chip roster player plus 1st goes back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuretoMogilny Posted June 7, 2013 Share Posted June 7, 2013 I don't think teams with a top 5 pick are going to be trading down picks by more then 2-3 nu,beers max. Unless an a prospect and current blue chip roster player plus 1st goes back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R3aL Posted June 7, 2013 Author Share Posted June 7, 2013 I don't think teams with a top 5 pick are going to be trading down picks by more then 2-3 nu,beers max. Unless an a prospect and current blue chip roster player plus 1st goes back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R3aL Posted June 7, 2013 Author Share Posted June 7, 2013 Is it normal CDC etiquette to propose a proposal on someone elses? Why didnt you just make your own topic, for your own little proposal, and shared your opinions on your proposal there.. And if you wanted to comment on my proposal done so in here,, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted June 7, 2013 Share Posted June 7, 2013 I don't think it's fair to compare Kesler to Datsyuk. Kesler is way out of his league. He is a second string player behind the Sedins, doesn't produce that much 5 on 5 and relies on playing the PP with the twins to rack up points. Datsyuk does everything Kesler does defensively and is miles better offensively and also has the hardware to back it up. I don't get the hype for Kesler. Sure he won a Selke 2 years ago, but Brad Richards won a Stanley cup and Conn Smythe (both of which are more valuable than a selke) in 2004 and I doubt anyone would trade a top 5 pick for him. I think if this were the 2011 offseason we could get 2 future superstar players for Kesler, but in the NHL it only takes a season or 2 for a players' value to drop significantly. 1 bad or a couple injury plagued seasons will cause that players' stock value to drop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R3aL Posted June 7, 2013 Author Share Posted June 7, 2013 So you chose to read and respond to half the comment? I said a Kesler in a good healthy year as a reference I also said a Datsyuk on the decline. Brad Richards at 28/29 for a top 5? I am actually sure some kind of trade like that occurred or at least he was thrown stupid $$ to go play in dallas Look again I am not going to argue that. But Keslers best year is comparable to a healthy Datsyuks best year. I am not saying Kesler is better than Datsyuk, I am saying if people heard that Datsyuk was available they'd get hard and make a pitch. If they attempted to trade Keselr after the SCF run they'd have gotten a massive return as well. Kesler's a top 10 in the league without question when healthy regardless of how he gets his points. Nobody sniffed that Gretzky got more PP time or empty net goals than anyone else in the league did they? no they cared because he was effective. Same as Kesler. they don't care how he gets his points or shuts down players as long as he's healthy and does just that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 Well if Kesler is a Canucks next year I will be happy as ever, as long as he is healthy, stays healthy and plays like he did from 09-11. And if thats the case he needs someone who can set him up on his wing, and the sedins need an Elite Winger. My proposal wasnt suppose to be a bash Kesler thread or anything like that, it was just an idea, And I still think my final roster is a huge improvement even while losing Kesler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R3aL Posted June 8, 2013 Author Share Posted June 8, 2013 I agree any trade should be made if the return is there. However I disagree about the sedins. 70-100 pt players, consistent, reliable have never had a top line talent to play with. @ 6.1 / year they are already at a great value, than consider next year they will sign for less to stay Canucks and improve our team! They will retire Canucks and Hank will be our franchise leading scorer for a long time, both their numbers will be retired as well! Keep them get them a winger patch up our bottom six reinvent our second line and fix te goalie controversy and we are a squad that means business! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuxfanabroad Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 Endless speculation/debate on player individual value & return. Opinion probably varies on player values between gm's & owners, like we see here. Why get bogged down splitting hairs? ~BIG SUGGESTIONS~ -Go younger. It's hard to hate young players, before their reputations have been established. So league-wide, people tend to root for young upstarts, like Edm, Clb & NYI. -Saying this because, media, league & reffs seem to have it in for a few of our key guys. Even if they spend off-seasons doing charity work in Africa, they'll probably never see decent officiating again, in Canuck colours. They'll continue to be called cheap, divers & whiners in the press. If we can get decent return, Burr, Laps, & Kesler would probably have better careers on US teams... -We're a couple seasons from turning into Calgary, but many of our vets still have good value today; therefore, MG should move quickly to transform into a younger generation with size & speed. Even consider dealing the twins & BOTH 'tenders, if the return is phenomenal. -Older teams market memories; whilst young teams sell hope & future. It's time to move on & prepare for a new, tougher division. We've had a great run, but this core needs changing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tangelos Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 So you chose to read and respond to half the comment? I said a Kesler in a good healthy year as a reference I also said a Datsyuk on the decline. Brad Richards at 28/29 for a top 5? I am actually sure some kind of trade like that occurred or at least he was thrown stupid $$ to go play in dallas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 Okay well to answer your hypothetical question, Datsyuk has never had a "mediocre" season so I can't say. All I can say is a good Kesler season is still not nearly as good as a good Datsyuk season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R3aL Posted June 8, 2013 Author Share Posted June 8, 2013 Don't know how my proposal ever turned into this.... Still wanna hear some others opinions on y lineup! And the difference between datsyuk and Kesler is, u put datsyuk on any team in the NHL and his numbers would consistently be up there no matter what or who he played with. Keslers best seasons offensive output I believe was his peak o physical health and couldn't have happened without our wicked team and PP. I don't think u can say the same about Kesler tht he could put up consistent near 90 pt seasons on every team in NHl, not even that just PPG player . Please no moreeeee. On Kesler or his value or datsyuk unless its to my proposal! No one out there who would love this lineup? It seriously excites me thinking about it , I know I will prolly be let down tho this summer lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RK7Teen Posted June 8, 2013 Share Posted June 8, 2013 3 way trade Pitt/Van/Tor To Pitts Luongo kesler Kadri To Tor Fluery To Van: Malkin 1st round pick (toronto) Franson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R3aL Posted June 8, 2013 Author Share Posted June 8, 2013 Thanks for coming out today Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tangelos Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Kesler won a Selke had a near 90 point season. Datsyuks won a few Selkes had near 90 point seasons. You cannot argue that. If Kesler consistently played like that or had the ability to....Keslers best season is comparable to Datsyuks end of story Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 correction: Kesler had a near 80 point season. Jonathan Cheechoo's best season is also comparable to Datsyuk's best what's your point? And the major difference between the two is that Kesler needs good players around him to produce (Sedins on powerplay) and Datsyuk can play with anyone and still produce all star numbers. and just so I know you're not crazy, hypothetically you would trade Kesler straight up for Datsyuk right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tangelos Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Based on simply age no I wouldn't. I would think for age the trade across for either player would be comparable. Once again, the amount of time and money we fans put into this is nothing compared to management and owners. Just because we want to say one thing doesn't mean an owner or manager is going to agree. I could say Datsyuk should fetch more, but if an owner wants a 1b or 2a center for distance Kesler is indeed more valuable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Don't know how my proposal ever turned into this.... Still wanna hear some others opinions on y lineup! And the difference between datsyuk and Kesler is, u put datsyuk on any team in the NHL and his numbers would consistently be up there no matter what or who he played with. Keslers best seasons offensive output I believe was his peak o physical health and couldn't have happened without our wicked team and PP. I don't think u can say the same about Kesler tht he could put up consistent near 90 pt seasons on every team in NHl, not even that just PPG player . Please no moreeeee. On Kesler or his value or datsyuk unless its to my proposal! No one out there who would love this lineup? It seriously excites me thinking about it , I know I will prolly be let down tho this summer lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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