Quit being gullible, you are the problem with this team.

[Madwolf]

I'm a fan of teams all across North America, and I can tell you the fan base not being one big happy family isn't some problem regulated to the Canucks. Every fan base is divided about something or the other. This is the social media age, everyone has a theory, and an answer as to how "x" team could be managed better, drafting better, and just playing better. Doesn't matter what sport it is.

Like it or not the people you disagree with are part of this fan base and they help make it great, just like you. If you can't handle someone elses opinion you might want to recheck your baggage at the door.

[Swanny]

So, the fans are responsible for this team not winning a championship (and not making the playoffs this year, getting swept in the first round last year and out in 5 in the first round the year before) and all because a few dozen fans (compared to likely over a million supporters in the province and 100s of thousands in Vancouver) post some criticism/trade-demands of Ryan Kesler! Wow! Are you like, 12 years old?

The way you got it figured, the Canucks management make decisions about team personnel, and NHL players and their agents make career decisions worth millions of dollars based on what us geeky hockey-obsessed fans do on a Canucks forum. Do you seriously believe that Kesler stays or goes because of what is or isn't said on this forum? Do ya think that two years ago, Mike Gillis decided to replace Luongo with Schneider because of a thread right here? Then decided to trade Luongo, then decided not to trade Luongo, then didn't want Schneider anymore and showed him the door and was sweet on Luongo again, because of a thread right here? Then decided he wasn't sweet on Luongo either and replaced him with Lack and then traded Luongo for a bag of pucks, all because of a thread right here on Canucks Community Forum? And that Gillis fired Vigneault, hired Tortorella, then got fired himself, along with Tortorella, all because of some trolls doing the bidding of "eastern media" (I hope I don't need to get into the specifics of what right-wing conspiracy nuts usually mean by this euphamism)?

Do you really believe that Vancouver fans are the only ones who call out underperforming players, poor management decisions and coaches who can't motivate their team? Do you think Oilers fans and Maple Leaf fans aren't frustrated. Have you read the TSN comments after the Leafs late season collapse. Some of those harsh words on TSN.ca were from Leafs fans, who btw have supported an endless parade of crappy teams, paid the highest ticket prices in the league and still haven't been to a cup final in over 40 years. Maybe the Leafs should blame the "eastern media" too. Ooooh, its all just a big conspiracy, oooooh!

[Gross-Misconduct]

I hate when people hate different opinions then I do. It's killing this team. It's our fault we traded Schneider, our fault Luongo's contract got pooped on in the last CBA, our fault Hamhuis and Raymond got injured in the finals, our fault management f***ed things up with Bure, our fault management brought in Messier, our fault Bertuzzi punched Moore. I can go on.

People want Kes gone, it's not wrong. It's how they feel. Opinions are everywhere. Get use to it.

How dare you?!?!

Seriously though, the OP is a little lost on this one. Problem is, he has supporters that believe everything you just said.

[Nino]

How dare you?!?!

Seriously though, the OP is a little lost on this one. Problem is, he has supporters that believe everything you just said.

Lol, he and his one or two supporters checked out when there acid high came down.

[Mr.DirtyDangles]

Lol, he and his one or two supporters checked out when there acid high came down.

I may not entirely agree with the OP, but I admire his intent even if it came across harsh. As others have stated it is all a matter of opinion. What bugs me is the constant bitch fest when someones jimmies get rustled because they cannot fathom a different view point. It is pretty thick headed in here at times as I am sure you can agree.

Is a little unity to much to ask ?

[Papayas]

NEEDED CLARIFICATION: I'm not against trading Kesler or people wanting to trade Kesler, but don't make up reasons or listen to baseless rumours as to why he should be traded, or that he wants to be traded, that's counter-productive!

As a former mod I ask the mods to give me some leeway here as this needs to be said.

When you ask what is wrong with this team, look at yourself first.

I've been reading the Kesler thread and I can't fathom why people are making up rumours to somehow justify trading him. I don't know personally whether that is the best move or not for this team, that's up to Jim Benning and Trevor Linden.

The thing is, when rumour mongers from other fanbases spread their lies in an attempt to create dissent between the Canucks fanbase and team itself, it somehow works. I can't think of any other sports franchise in North America where this occurs except maybe the Yankees. The difference is they actually win championships.

I honestly don't know what to say, our fanbase is the laughing stock of the NHL and the Kesler thread just proves it. You are all mindless lemmings doing the bidding of eastern media types who want nothing more than to see our team fail, you are part of the problem, and you don't even realize it. It's happened so many times before with players on this team. I'm 33 years old so I know a thing or two about the BS that happens with this team, quit being played like a fiddle because it's shamefully pathetic.

Support the team and it's players, and if they do end up leaving don't trash them on the way out. I'm deeply disappointed with the lack of courtesy towards this team on our boards. Yeah they had a bad year, try being a fan in the 80's or late 90s, you're spoiled little children who don't know any better, but there is hope. Support the Canucks, the players who we have, because who is going to want to play for us, if all we ever do is turn on them?

as much as I agree with you mostly, you need a crazed fan base like this in order to charge one of the most expensive ticket price in the league. It's a double edge sword...

This is what humanity is like... Not that everyone is like that, but the most vocal people in a place like the forum are usually the most idiotic ones and there is nothing you can do about it.

[ocnucksfan]

Why are Leafs fans laughable? They will have a horrible team and still sell out every game. No other team in sports can keep up with that.

And say what you want about Bruins fans but they support that team well. That is what being a fan is about. They aren't obligated to be nice to Nux fans.

Boston fans are funny because unless they're old time hockey fans in excess of 40 years old they don't know crap about hockey. They scream the second they get a penalty as if Boston plays a perfect game every night and cry for a penalty the second the other team hits one of their players as if were playing some 2 hand touch type of hockey.

As for Toronto fans, I don't know, never met one.

[tribaljohn]

NEEDED CLARIFICATION: I'm not against trading Kesler or people wanting to trade Kesler, but don't make up reasons or listen to baseless rumours as to why he should be traded, or that he wants to be traded, that's counter-productive!

As a former mod I ask the mods to give me some leeway here as this needs to be said.

When you ask what is wrong with this team, look at yourself first.

I've been reading the Kesler thread and I can't fathom why people are making up rumours to somehow justify trading him. I don't know personally whether that is the best move or not for this team, that's up to Jim Benning and Trevor Linden.

The thing is, when rumour mongers from other fanbases spread their lies in an attempt to create dissent between the Canucks fanbase and team itself, it somehow works. I can't think of any other sports franchise in North America where this occurs except maybe the Yankees. The difference is they actually win championships.

I honestly don't know what to say, our fanbase is the laughing stock of the NHL and the Kesler thread just proves it. You are all mindless lemmings doing the bidding of eastern media types who want nothing more than to see our team fail, you are part of the problem, and you don't even realize it. It's happened so many times before with players on this team. I'm 33 years old so I know a thing or two about the BS that happens with this team, quit being played like a fiddle because it's shamefully pathetic.

Support the team and it's players, and if they do end up leaving don't trash them on the way out. I'm deeply disappointed with the lack of courtesy towards this team on our boards. Yeah they had a bad year, try being a fan in the 80's or late 90s, you're spoiled little children who don't know any better, but there is hope. Support the Canucks, the players who we have, because who is going to want to play for us, if all we ever do is turn on them?

The fan base follows the classic group think model - wanting to be part of a group is more important to them than risking being wrong by thinking for themselves.

I cheer for every single Canuck even when other fans chase them out of town, they are (former Canuck players) are all Canucks forever.

Good post op

[oldnews]

If Kesler stays, he's going to have a hell of a season with an improved lineup /support around him.

If he is dealt, he's going to command one hell of a return for the team.

Kesler is a marquis talent signed to great terms - he is a huge part of the future regardless of which way he decides to go.

Screw the rumour-mongers and screw the Eastern media. TL, GMJB and RK will make this a win win for both sides.

[Tearloch7]

You know what. I think I'll play patient and see what Benning does with this team. That's what will be best long-term for the blood-pressure. This team is going to take a lot of fixin' and it's going to take a while until we see results. In the meantime whaddaya say you n' I pull up a coupla chairs and watch the bandwagoners froth themselves into a frenzy and dive off the bandwagon. Eh?

Only question remaining is .. "Who gets the rocking chair"?

[oldnews]

You know what. I think I'll play patient and see what Benning does with this team. That's what will be best long-term for the blood-pressure. This team is going to take a lot of fixin' and it's going to take a while until we see results. In the meantime whaddaya say you n' I pull up a coupla chairs and watch the bandwagoners froth themselves into a frenzy and dive off the bandwagon. Eh?

I agree with your patience and I agree that the team is in good hands, but I'm not sure I agree that it's as big a project as many people perceive it. I also don't think Benning is simply rose colouring or marketting when he says that he believes this team can be turned around in a hurry. I think he sincerely believes that, and sees a team that can be quite successful with a few vital fixes.

First of all, the coaching - which imo made a whole lot of fatal mistakes last year.

Underestimating the importance of the bottom six was suicide imo - and I think that between the youth in the system, the number of quality depth players in the system (HIggins, Hansen, Richardson, Santo, Matthias...imo a hell of a start), the existing cap space (and favourable salary structure in place), as well as the eye for talented depth that Benning has, I think it's not too optimistic to conceive this team being a mid-range playoff competitor next year. I also think that the top six will not only get a boost from improved depth, but now has a few young guys who could push to command top six minutes as well. Imo a crafty deal, a good draft and a decent signing is within reasonable range.

[TrevorLinden4ever]

Wouldnt wanna trade Kesler, but he might have to be included in a package with the deadbeats to rehaul this team...

[Gross-Misconduct]

Hey, I just heard Kesler's agent contacted Benning and said Kes wants to be moved before the draft.

[babych]

Yeah, that worked out so well with the Leafs and Luongo situation if we're gullible enough to believe Toronto was actually ever interested in acquiring him, or like what I believe is happening now, making s--- up to stir the pot.

If you think Toronto wasn't interested in Luongo then you're clearly delusional. The problem was the asking price.

[canuckster19]

If you think Toronto wasn't interested in Luongo then you're clearly delusional. The problem was the asking price.

Yeah and do you believe the report that Luongo said Florida or bust?

[babych]

That's not the point I was trying to make, I'll wish him the best if he is traded and be fine with it, what I won't do is believe second hand rumours that he doesn't want to be a part of this team, I refuse to take part in rumour mongering that has plagued this team for decades.

Well I tried, the point went above everyone's head... might as well close it. No hope at all.

I better bloody well clarify myself again since people seem to want everything spelled out for them, I have lost faith in the fanbase, not the team.

There is plenty proof in the responses I have got, thank you, you see how easily that worked out for me? I've been a fan of this team so long, I know how the sheep work.

Or maybe I'm just the guy that's finally willing to call out those fans who I and many others believe are detrimental to the well being of the fanbase, if that makes me an evil person, then so be it.

If what I'm doing is bringing people down, good, maybe they'll put two and two together if they're smart enough and realize the irony of it.

The problem is these half truths and outright lies end up gospel here for some reason. I've seen it all before.

If people have a problem with a little tough love, especially on a hockey board, they need to realize there is a whole world out there about to eat them alive.

You don't think I was prepared to get trashed on, I know full well what I'm getting into starting a controversial topic on CDC, if it gets people talking, then I have succeeded.

The narcissism in your posts is truly amazing.

[babych]

Yeah and do you believe the report that Luongo said Florida or bust?

I think it's reasonable to assume that Luongo wanted out and gave a list of teams to Gillis (Florida being one).

[BobSacamano]

This.

As someone who has been a fan longer than most on here have been alive, I would like to think I know something about 'supporting my team' .

Wanting the team to try to make the playoffs every year in a vain attempt to go nowhere is not supporting your team. Its supporting your own entertainment. Gives you something to do. You dont want to be 'bored' because the Canucks are not playing.

29 teams lose the stanley cup each year. I am certain that I can speak for all Canuck nation when I say we know a thing or two about NOT winning the cup. We have been proficient at it for 43 years. Anyone who says they cheer every year for us to win the cup is in willful denial or is outright lying.

I can name 5 years in our history where I really thought we had a legitimate chance to win the cup. The rest was wishful thinking.

Those of us who want to trade players is not for spite. Not for 'turning' on the team. Not fairweather or bandwagon fans. We are doing it because its the best thing for the player and our franchise. Its a win/win.

The player gets to move to a team priming for a cup run. Happens all the time to very high profile players. We get the assets back for that player while they are still in their prime to help rebuild the franchise.

If you care about your team. Honestly care, you are willing to put up with non winning seasons and still find entertainment and joy with the team. I have no problems 'not winning the cup' as long as we are drafting in the top 5 moving towards a restocked team with high end talent.

'Real Fans' are in this for the long run. We are willing to be patient and make small sacrifices in the short term.

Best post I've read in here in a long, long time - well said. +10 (if I could)

[bigbadcanucks]

The fan base follows the classic group think model - wanting to be part of a group is more important to them than risking being wrong by thinking for themselves.

I cheer for every single Canuck even when other fans chase them out of town, they are (former Canuck players) are all Canucks forever.

Good post op

I'm going to have to disagree with your perspective on "group-think" of the Canucks fan base...I'm inclined to believe that the vast majority fall into the collective thinking that they will cheer on their Canuck heroes regardless of how well or poorly the players perform as individuals and as a collective bunch.

The critical thought process is to remove home team biases and look for ways to improve the team for the present and future, given the realities of current circumstances. And that means moving players that the fan base has a sentimental attachment to (i.e., the players you cheer for, no matter what), and rationalizing these ideas with rumors (substantiated or not), speculation, and personal opinions.

And obviously, posters making these critical points aren't going to be popular with everyone (and be accused of being band-wagon fans, anti-Canuck, trolls, or as the OP states, "the problem with the team", etc.)...other than unsubstantiated rumor mongering, what's wrong with expressing a critical point of view? I find 40%-50% of the opinions expressed are well founded and insightful...but according to OP, the vast majority of the fanbase do nothing more than perpetuate the rumors spewed by Eastern media, which, IMO is far from the realities of CDC. Telling the contributors of an open forum to take a hard look at themselves for fear that what gets exchanged here will somehow filter to the players themselves and players outside of Canuck-nation and will result in an inability by the team to attract players is nothing short of fear-mongering, which to me is laughable.

Nice try at grandstanding and being a soap box hero, OP. Failure on both counts, pal.

[Vancanwincup]

NEEDED CLARIFICATION: I'm not against trading Kesler or people wanting to trade Kesler, but don't make up reasons or listen to baseless rumours as to why he should be traded, or that he wants to be traded, that's counter-productive!

As a former mod I ask the mods to give me some leeway here as this needs to be said.

When you ask what is wrong with this team, look at yourself first.

I've been reading the Kesler thread and I can't fathom why people are making up rumours to somehow justify trading him. I don't know personally whether that is the best move or not for this team, that's up to Jim Benning and Trevor Linden.

The thing is, when rumour mongers from other fanbases spread their lies in an attempt to create dissent between the Canucks fanbase and team itself, it somehow works. I can't think of any other sports franchise in North America where this occurs except maybe the Yankees. The difference is they actually win championships.

I honestly don't know what to say, our fanbase is the laughing stock of the NHL and the Kesler thread just proves it. You are all mindless lemmings doing the bidding of eastern media types who want nothing more than to see our team fail, you are part of the problem, and you don't even realize it. It's happened so many times before with players on this team. I'm 33 years old so I know a thing or two about the BS that happens with this team, quit being played like a fiddle because it's shamefully pathetic.

Support the team and it's players, and if they do end up leaving don't trash them on the way out. I'm deeply disappointed with the lack of courtesy towards this team on our boards. Yeah they had a bad year, try being a fan in the 80's or late 90s, you're spoiled little children who don't know any better, but there is hope. Support the Canucks, the players who we have, because who is going to want to play for us, if all we ever do is turn on them?

Wow, here you are burning people for false claims and here you are doing the same.