DeNiro Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Having toughness is not limited to having an enforcer. I have a question for you, do you think Marchand does this if the tables are reversed? Say Sedin plays for the Bruins and Marchand plays for the Canucks. Does Marchand do this when he knows Lucic, Chara, Thornton, et all are on the other team? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEh53OWz0jU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrimeMinisterBure Posted February 15, 2013 Author Share Posted February 15, 2013 For those that love Vandy so much, have you guys seen his fights? Correct me if I'm wrong but from what I've seen, he's not actually a good fighter. Most of the clips where he fights tough guys, he actually loses His strength or positive is that he always shows up to fight but I wouldnt count on him to win fights to pump up the crowd or instill fear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHL rocks Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Yes, because that's his role. Just like it's Burrows and Lapierre's role. If he's not doing that, he's not doing his job, and his coach probably won't play him as much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 So, in your opinion Alberts is a better D-man than Vandermeer because all other aspects of Vandermeers game aside from fighting are average or below average. Exactly what aspects of Alberts game are any better? Other than hitting, which Vandermeer is also quite good at, Alberts is only average or below at everything else, including the fighting which you've already admitted that Vandermeer can do. So, why do you think that he's better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drop Em Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Half of those were probably wrestling matches. And I would imagine not many of them were players sticking up for teammates. I bet actual fights were much less than 19. That's 5 fights every round. I bet if you list the actual fights, the majority of them were in one or two series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferlands_Head Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 HAHA, just because Brian Burke says he requires something of a team or that he's going to get it out of his players doesn't mean it's going to happen -- you should know that about him, because everyone else does. The Leafs were never tough under Burke as GM, but they are getting there now, and look what's happening: it's throwing other teams off their game and the Leafs are winning more consistently than they have in years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuck_trevor16 Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Funny, I don't recall Burrows or Lappy doing that to David Krejci. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UFCanuck Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Point of thread: OP wants attention and likes to argue. Achieved. Gillis is an extremely SMART and decisive GM. He traded for Max Lapierre in our cup run and Manny went down. We wouldn't have got to the finals without Lappy or Higgins, Brilliant trades. Also the Kassian trade just keeps looking better and better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuck_trevor16 Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Point of thread: OP wants attention and likes to argue. Achieved. Gillis is an extremely SMART and decisive GM. He traded for Max Lapierre in our cup run and Manny went down. We wouldn't have got to the finals without Lappy or Higgins, Brilliant trades. Also the Kassian trade just keeps looking better and better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferlands_Head Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 ?? We are talking about fighters on top opposing teams... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Half of those were probably wrestling matches? They are listed as fights, so I'm not going to get into a debate about the quality of fights that they were. Sorry but most wrestling matches are given roughing or double roughing penalties and not fighting majors. If two guys drop the gloves and there's any punches thrown then it's a fight, and yes an actual fight. YOU said less than half a dozen fights in last years playoffs and I proved you wrong. Now it matters what rounds the fights were in, how many were in each series and the quality of the fight? You said less than half a dozen and asked somebody to give you an answer, I so did so, proving you wrong...............Just quit while you're behind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drop Em Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Cause as slow as Alberts is, Vandermeer is even slower. And he is horrible at reading plays. People undervalue Alberts ability to just step in after not playing for long periods of time. Sure he's not the best defensively, but he can hit hard and clear guys out from the net. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Really? And you know that Alberts is faster how, from watching them on tv? And are you talking about straight ahead speed? Because Alberts has some of the worst lateral movement in the league and Vandermeer looks like Brett Hedican in comparison. As for reading plays, Alberts isn't exactly Dennis Potvin in that regard either. He can hit hard and clear the front of the net but those are two things that Vandermeer is also good at. Vandermeer is also much more of an offensive contributor than what Alberts can ever think of being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rypien37 Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 He's improved his fighting skills i'll give him that...but he wouldn't bring any value to our team. Look at the playoffs in 2011, he can't even take a regular shift and he sure as hell wouldn't deter anybody from throwing cheap shots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rypien37 Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 how are you able to post? your profile don't "exist" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drop Em Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Umm, well we're in a thread about debating the importance of an enforcer. So differentiating actual fights, and fights where players just take their gloves off and push each other around, is pretty important. We have players that will take off the gloves and wrestle. If we want players that will actually chuck the knuckles, then there's a difference. This is from last years playoffs. Burrows fights Kopitar. It's hardly a fight, and Burrows is not an enforcer for it. If people want an enforcer to send a message, those kind of fights happen alot less often. They're more Often fights like this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drop Em Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Hmm I wonder why Alberts is making 1.2 million and Vandermeer had to beg for a 600k two-way contract. The fact that 29 teams had a chance to grab him and didn't, should say something. These are general managers, whose job is to judge talent. Seriously use some logic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Ok, you go watch all 19 fights and then use your power of interpretation on what you consider a quality fight. But that wasn't your original question until you were proven wrong. Again, you asked how many fights there were in the playoffs last year, saying that there would be less than half a dozen and you were wrong. Now you want to argue the quality of fight along with your other excuses you listed. If you want to do that, then I also know there are times where guys drop the gloves and throw a few punches and only get double roughing penalties too but I'm not about to go watch every playoff game from last year to see how many times it happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 It's all about timing that's why. If Alberts had only signed a one yeard deal before the new CBA was signed, it's quite likely that he'd find himself in the same boat as Vandermeer and many others. Also, Vandermeer said that he had one way contract offers offered to him but he wanted to win a cup and he liked the guys on the Canucks that he was working out with, so he was willing to take the two way contract from Vancouver. Also, Vandermeer has signed a 3 year 6.9 million contract in the past which is one year longer and 4.4 million dollars more than what Alberts has ever signed for. So, if it all about the money, then Vandermeer has signed a more lucrative contract than what Alberts could ever dream of. Logic? You mean the same logic that you use to argue your fight in the playoffs comments....um no thanks, I'll pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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