JM_ Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 On 1/2/2019 at 7:21 AM, Russ said: Problem still is if they are done in Alberta where theres no pipeline going through BC, you still have to send it via rail to BC to get shipped which is still carbon heavy and costly. the economics of it work out because you're not shipping 30-40% solvent, its nearly all bitumen. I posted a rail study a few pages back with the numbers. I love the puck idea, solves many issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violator Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 25 minutes ago, Ryan Strome said: So the ones dying off are doing so because of a nonexistent pipeline expansion? Interesting Essentially any boat traffic &^@#s with sea life.An increase in boats any boats is bad for the fish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butters7 Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 11 minutes ago, Violator said: Essentially any boat traffic &^@#s with sea life.An increase in boats any boats is bad for the fish. It seems more like over fishing is the issue. Lack of food and obviously all the fishing boats that go along with it. I’m not saying another boat is not going to hurt the orca population but this expansion proposal is definitely not where the fingers should be pointed. The fishing industry is one of the worst problems in the world. There will always be boat traffic for cargo going across oceans but the fishing industry could sure use some changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chon derry Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 3 minutes ago, Butters7 said: It seems more like over fishing is the issue. Lack of food and obviously all the fishing boats that go along with it. I’m not saying another boat is not going to hurt the orca population but this expansion proposal is definitely not where the fingers should be pointed. The fishing industry is one of the worst problems in the world. There will always be boat traffic for cargo going across oceans but the fishing industry could sure use some changes. absolutely , ,but a little more complex with the sports sector ,native food fish ,Alaskans targeting salmon bound for Canadian rivers....not unlike the forest industrys arugument of sustainability , the tanker traffic increase is viewed not only by the radical fringe but coastal residents that have seen the decline in stocks (forests logged etc) fighting for the very survival of what remains, them already having been through the industrial resource extraction, and learning albeit to late. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violator Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 11 minutes ago, Butters7 said: It seems more like over fishing is the issue. Lack of food and obviously all the fishing boats that go along with it. I’m not saying another boat is not going to hurt the orca population but this expansion proposal is definitely not where the fingers should be pointed. The fishing industry is one of the worst problems in the world. There will always be boat traffic for cargo going across oceans but the fishing industry could sure use some changes. Pipeline expansion and the subusquent expansion of shipping is easy pickings though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Strome Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 1 hour ago, Jimmy McGill said: the economics of it work out because you're not shipping 30-40% solvent, its nearly all bitumen. I posted a rail study a few pages back with the numbers. I love the puck idea, solves many issues. Except environmental issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Strome Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 1 hour ago, Violator said: Essentially any boat traffic &^@#s with sea life.An increase in boats any boats is bad for the fish. But aren't they dying off without the increased traffic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violator Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 2 minutes ago, Ryan Strome said: But aren't they dying off without the increased traffic? Yes this just slows it down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingofsurrey Posted January 4, 2019 Author Share Posted January 4, 2019 3 hours ago, Ryan Strome said: So the ones dying off are doing so because of a nonexistent pipeline expansion? Interesting Not sure you understand the INCREDIBLE importance of the Southern Orca's to BC culture / history / tourism / first nations culture ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Strome Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 1 hour ago, kingofsurrey said: Not sure you understand the INCREDIBLE importance of the Southern Orca's to BC culture / history / tourism / first nations culture ? Just not sure what that article has to do with the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingofsurrey Posted January 4, 2019 Author Share Posted January 4, 2019 56 minutes ago, Ryan Strome said: Just not sure what that article has to do with the thread. Pretty sure the environmental impact of tanker traffic on Orca's will be looked at before KMP expansion goes ahead........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Strome Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 23 minutes ago, kingofsurrey said: Pretty sure the environmental impact of tanker traffic on Orca's will be looked at before KMP expansion goes ahead........ Are they dying off now? Last time I checked there was no pipeline expansion. Shouldn't you and gurn be finding a industry to blame? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingofsurrey Posted January 4, 2019 Author Share Posted January 4, 2019 (edited) 48 minutes ago, Ryan Strome said: Are they dying off now? Last time I checked there was no pipeline expansion. Shouldn't you and gurn be finding a industry to blame? Yes of course. Hopefully fish farm new regs may help though... Perhaps new regs for whale watching tours could be helpful as well..... How do you feel about a seal cull on the west coast ? Do you think that the Orca's will benefit from increased tanker traffic ... maybe they enjoy interacting with large tankers....? Edited January 4, 2019 by kingofsurrey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 17 hours ago, Jimmy McGill said: the economics of it work out because you're not shipping 30-40% solvent, its nearly all bitumen. I posted a rail study a few pages back with the numbers. I love the puck idea, solves many issues. Thats true I forgot it got diluted to move thru the pipelines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 10 hours ago, kingofsurrey said: Yes of course. Hopefully fish farm new regs may help though... Perhaps new regs for whale watching tours could be helpful as well..... How do you feel about a seal cull on the west coast ? Do you think that the Orca's will benefit from increased tanker traffic ... maybe they enjoy interacting with large tankers....? Oh I hope they make fish farms land locked. Go find some industrial land and build a giant pool there. Also seal cull is needed, they are slowly wiping out our salmon runs because of over population. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 17 hours ago, Ryan Strome said: Except environmental issues. different monkey, different circus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Russ said: Thats true I forgot it got diluted to move thru the pipelines. Its also cheaper because you don't need heated rail cars either, so the cost to ramp up rail capacity is also far cheaper. So e.g., what Notely is investing in now in heated car capacity could be nearly doubled if they were moving pucks just on a car to car comparison. I don't know the cost difference between conventional cars and heated cars, but thats also another way to maximize the investment and production volume, but I'm not sure by how much. One bitumen barrel makes 600 pellets. An open-top rail car can carry about 615 barrels worth of heavy crude as pellets, once the polymer is extracted. This compares with the 390 barrels of heavy crude in a tank car, not including the dilutive chemicals. https://www.theglobeandmail.com/business/article-cn-pushes-ahead-with-puck-sized-bitumen-for-rail-transport/ Edited January 4, 2019 by Jimmy McGill 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Strome Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 33 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said: different monkey, different circus. One would think true environmentalists wouldn't support increased rail traffic over a pipeline. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 Just now, Ryan Strome said: One would think true environmentalists wouldn't support increased rail traffic over a pipeline. colour me practical. Sure there will be people that don't like the pucks, but there's a real economic argument for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shift-4 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 let's do the pucks If there is ever a derailment we could have one kick ass hockey tournament! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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