aGENT Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 3 minutes ago, Isam said: Hes not worth 4.5 million though. Too me hes good third pairing guy worth maybe around 2.5 to 3 million 3rd pairing guys don't play 18+ minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isam Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 Been some good arguments from both sides in the last bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isam Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 2nd pairing guys can score more then 15 points on aseason to season basis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Isam said: 4.5 million is bigger cap hit then vlasic or ekholm. I have no idea how Polie got Ekholm for $3.75m. It's freaking larceny. But you can't cherry pick 1 (ridiculously low) outlier as a 'comparable'. Vlasik's contract was signed 5 years of inflation ago. 18 minutes ago, Isam said: 2nd pairing guys can score more then 15 points on aseason to season basis Not if that's not their job/what they're paid to do. I bet his presence in a lineup allows other players to put up (keeps opposition from putting up as well) 15+ points they otherwise wouldn't have because of the space he creates, and harder minutes he plays so they don't have to. Offense by proxy. Edited November 30, 2017 by aGENT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goal:thecup Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 16 minutes ago, Isam said: Hes not worth 4.5 million though. Too me hes good third pairing guy worth maybe around 2.5 to 3 million There is not a GM in the league that would even consider insulting Guddy with that offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isam Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 3 minutes ago, aGENT said: I have no idea how Polie got Ekholm for $3.75m. It's freaking larceny. But you can't cherry pick 1 (ridiculously low) outlier as a 'comparable'. Vlasik's contract was signed 5 years of inflation ago. Not if that's not their job/what they're paid to do. I bet his presence in a lineup allows other players to put up 15+ points they otherwise wouldn't have because of the space he creates, and harder minutes he plays so they don't have to. Offense by proxy. Meh. Its opinion. 19 minutes ago, aGENT said: I have no idea how Polie got Ekholm for $3.75m. It's freaking larceny. But you can't cherry pick 1 (ridiculously low) outlier as a 'comparable'. Vlasik's contract was signed 5 years of inflation ago. Not if that's not their job/what they're paid to do. I bet his presence in a lineup allows other players to put up 15+ points they otherwise wouldn't have because of the space he creates, and harder minutes he plays so they don't have to. Offense by proxy. I did look at other examples. It seams a good second pairing needs to produce 20 plus points too along with the solid d. I'm also trying to see your guys' side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isam Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 And the ekholm deal is insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 3 minutes ago, Isam said: I did look at other examples. It seams a good second pairing needs to produce 20 plus points too along with the solid d. I'm also trying to see your guys' side. So Chris Tanev is a borderline 2nd/3rd pairing D? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isam Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 Is erik gudbranson worth as much money as tanev? We can do this all day and wont agree. Ill watch for the things you guys say he does once he comes back. Anyways im done the debate for the next while. It was fun and i learned something. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Isam said: Is erik gudbranson worth as much money as tanev? We can do this all day and wont agree. Ill watch for the things you guys say he does once he comes back. Anyways im done the debate for the next while. It was fun and i learned something. Cheers Taking inflation in to account and plus physicality but minus lesser overall ability... probably right in the same ball park. Besides, that wasn't my point. You stated: 21 minutes ago, Isam said: I did look at other examples. It seams a good second pairing needs to produce 20 plus points too along with the solid d. I'm also trying to see your guys' side. Tanev only puts up 15-20 normally, yet most consider him a #2D. So what is it? Do you think Tanev is a #2D or a borderline #5/#6 D according to your above 'requirements'? Edited November 30, 2017 by aGENT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isam Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 16 minutes ago, aGENT said: Taking inflation in to account and plus physicality but minus lesser overall ability... probably right in the same ball park. Besides, that wasn't my point. You stated: Tanev only puts up 15-20 normally, yet most consider him a #2D. So what is it? Do you think Tanev is a #2D or a borderline #5/#6 D according to your above 'requirements'? He's a good second pairing defenseman on good teams. I never said he was third pairing. You brought that up, not me. Now heres a question for you name a player thats similar to guddy who gets that type of money that is in 4-4.5 million range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isam Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 You can name hamonic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isam Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 Ill give you that 4.8 mill in real money. Hits and fights. But he is having down year in offense and he doesnt have the dzone stats as guddy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 (edited) Hamonic would be one. Boychuk makes $6m and is similar'ish too but is also 8 years older. And again, you said a good 2nd pair puts up 20+ points. Given Tanev struggles to put up that, I'd assume by your logic that makes him a borderline 2nd/3rd pair. You posted that, not me. Edited November 30, 2017 by aGENT 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smithers joe Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 i guess we can diss all our players, but gudbranson gives our defense, something it doesn't have. there may be better d-men for less money, but we don't have them right now. you can talk stats all you want but i'll take guddy until someone better comes along. we have all our players until better players come along. it is how you build your team. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 21 minutes ago, Isam said: You can name hamonic. I don’t think Guddy gets the snot knocked out of him by the likes of Mantha, like Hamonic did. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isam Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 2 minutes ago, aGENT said: Hamonic would be one. Boychuk makes $6m and is similar'ish too but is also 8 years older. And again, you said a good 2nd pair puts up 20+ points. Given Tanev struggles to put up that, I'd assume by your logic that makes him a borderline 2nd/3rd pair. You posted that, not me. Adjust his point totals hes a good second pair on a good team like tampa. The problem with ranev is hes injury prone. Boychuk is not a really a good comparable. You like to use dzone starts as a basis for showing that guddy isnt sheltered. Past couple of years hes had alot ozone starts. I can give you larsson or greene i guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isam Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 4 minutes ago, Alflives said: I don’t think Guddy gets the snot knocked out of him by the likes of Mantha, like Hamonic did. Dont kid youself alf . Hamonic is tough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeneedLumme Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 2 hours ago, Goal:thecup said: Please don't ever post anything like this again. Last time we got 10 pages of crap. Yeah, I think it's something like saying "Beetlejuice". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isam Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 6 minutes ago, smithers joe said: i guess we can diss all our players, but gudbranson gives our defense, something it doesn't have. there may be better d-men for less money, but we don't have them right now. you can talk stats all you want but i'll take guddy until someone better comes along. we have all our players until better players come along. it is how you build your team. You're right. I actually wanted to leave this argument alone. I havent seen a player defended this much since sandlak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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