[Signing Proposal] A realistic way of signing Travis Hamonic without a trade

[mll]

2 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said:

you have 2 extra players why do you need a recall only need a recall if player goes on LTIR otherwise just play with a 21 player roster till injured player is back

It's well possible that several players are unavailable at the same time.  It's unlikely that a team will use only 22 players over a season.  They need recall flexibility.

[Arrow 1983]

Just now, mll said:

It's well possible that several players are unavailable at the same time.  It's unlikely that a team will use only 22 players over a season.  They need recall flexibility.

You are absolutely right but this is a different conversation

You are asking in a way what a taxi squad should look like

 

IMO a 6 player squad should have 2 forwards  3 defensemen and a goalie

first why 3 defensemen well because if a team really needs to a defenseman can much easier play forth line winger then a forward play defense for a regular shift.

 

Second a team needs players that have no Bonuses as you have pointed out that issue and players with small cap hits they are easier to recall 

 

Rathbone And Juolevi have bonusses so they need one that has no bonusses on defense

Hoglander has Bonusses therefore they need one forward with no bonusses 

 

That's if they go with Rathbone Juolevi ands Hoglander

[Arrow 1983]

9 minutes ago, mll said:

It's well possible that several players are unavailable at the same time.  It's unlikely that a team will use only 22 players over a season.  They need recall flexibility.

This can happen at 22 or a 23 man roster in this case as the past has taught us the team puts someone on LTIR

 

you can still go with a 20 man roster if they need or if a third person gets injured place a player on LTIR

[mll]

1 minute ago, Arrow 1983 said:

This can happen at 22 or a 23 man roster in this case as the past has taught us the team puts someone on LTIR

 

you can still go with a 20 man roster if they need or if a third person gets injured place a player on LTIR

Can't just put someone on LTIR if they are unavailable for a few days.  LTIR is minimum 10 games or 24 days out.   Quarantine for a positive test is probably 14 days.  

[Arrow 1983]

1 minute ago, mll said:

Can't just put someone on LTIR if they are unavailable for a few days.  LTIR is minimum 10 games or 24 days out.   Quarantine for a positive test is probably 14 days.  

If you have a 23 man roster and 4 players get injured but not long term what happens

[Drakrami]

If they were going to waive Ericsson, they would have done it ages ago. How years of floating has he brought to the team? They probably had some agreement when he was signed. 

 

Same with if he was tradeable. 

 

While adding Hoffman or Hamonic is going to bring us very close to being a contender, I dont see it happening when we are currently already over the cap. 

Edited December 20, 2020 by Drakrami

[lmm]

42 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said:

If you have a 23 man roster and 4 players get injured but not long term what happens

this is why you want some cap flexability

 

if you have $700K to spare and say, Horvat, Pettersson, Myers and Hughes get the flu for 2 games

you play your 3 black aces and bring up Sautner to replace Hughes

you might not win those games but you are good long term

If you had to LITR one of those guys for 10 games or go over cap, you are hooped for 8 more games

 

same problem but in reverse, what if Ferland comes back?

[Arrow 1983]

2 minutes ago, lmm said:

this is why you want some cap flexability

 

if you have $700K to spare and say, Horvat, Pettersson, Myers and Hughes get the flu for 2 games

you play your 3 black aces and bring up Sautner to replace Hughes

you might not win those games but you are good long term

If you had to LITR one of those guys for 10 games or go over cap, you are hooped for 8 more games

 

same problem but in reverse, what if Ferland comes back?

of course if Benning had an thought that Ferland was coming back then he wouldn't do this and my post is completely under the assumption that Ferland is out for the season.

 

You didn't answer the question if you have a 23 player roster and 4 get injured but not long term what happens and the team is at the top of the cap like about half the teams in the league are. What happens

 

here is a hint it is in the CBA under emergency call up

 

cause guess what lawyers think of everything. Because GMs tend to push all the limits

 

[lmm]

3 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said:

of course if Benning had an thought that Ferland was coming back then he wouldn't do this and my post is completely under the assumption that Ferland is out for the season.

 

You didn't answer the question if you have a 23 player roster and 4 get injured but not long term what happens and the team is at the top of the cap like about half the teams in the league are. What happens

 

here is a hint it is in the CBA under emergency call up

 

cause guess what lawyers think of everything. Because GMs tend to push all the limits

 

so, your question was retorical?

you are good, maybe I 'll hire you for my next divorce

 

care to post that bit of the cba?

 

 

[Arrow 1983]

8 minutes ago, lmm said:

this is why you want some cap flexability

 

if you have $700K to spare and say, Horvat, Pettersson, Myers and Hughes get the flu for 2 games

you play your 3 black aces and bring up Sautner to replace Hughes

you might not win those games but you are good long term

If you had to LITR one of those guys for 10 games or go over cap, you are hooped for 8 more games

 

same problem but in reverse, what if Ferland comes back?

all this is just hypotheticals it is an argument made because you really have got no clue what you are talking about but want to win the argument. We have a term in Latin we use in law it is reductio ad absurdum 

[Arrow 1983]

1 minute ago, lmm said:

so, your question was retorical?

you are good, maybe I 'll hire you for my next divorce

 

care to post that bit of the cba?

 

 

sure give me a minute

 

[lmm]

9 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said:

all this is just hypotheticals it is an argument made because you really have got no clue what you are talking about but want to win the argument. We have a term in Latin we use in law it is reductio ad absurdum 

I thought you were in this for fun?

Now you are getting all name cally just like Provost

 

I am not out to win an argument, I am questionong the logic of the arguments givien.

 

See Provost getting all weird? That is because I ask questions that they can't answer, so they reverts to name calling or insult

 

Try to stay away from name calling and insult even if its in Latin  iarfay noughesay?

 

Edited December 20, 2020 by lmm

[Arrow 1983]

4 minutes ago, lmm said:

so, your question was retorical?

you are good, maybe I 'll hire you for my next divorce

 

care to post that bit of the cba?

 

 

16.4 Active Roster Size; Playing Roster. (a) There shall be a maximum of twenty-three (23) Players on each Club's Active Roster at any one time, provided, however, that, on the date of each season's Trade Deadline, a Club's Active Roster may be increased to any number of Players the Club, in its discretion, so determines, subject to Article 50.

 

(b) Clubs are not permitted to Loan Players where the result of such Loan(s) would reduce the Club's Active Roster below eighteen (18) skaters and two (2) goaltenders. However, Clubs will not be required to Recall Players to maintain the minimum eighteen (18) skaters and two (2) goaltenders on days which they do not play an NHL Game, provided that the deficiency below those thresholds is a result of an injury that has caused the removal of such disabled Player from the Active Roster.

 

(c) Except in case of emergency, there shall be no reduction of the required minimum Playing Rosters of the Clubs, below eighteen (18) skaters and two (2) goaltenders.

 

16.13 Goaltender Exemption. (a) In the event a Club's goaltender becomes unavailable due to incapacitating injury, illness or League suspension such that the Club may not have two (2) goaltenders on its Playing Roster and the Club is at the Active Roster limit, the Club shall be permitted to exceed the Active Roster limit for purposes of adding a goaltender to its Active Roster ("Replacement Goaltender") to replace the unavailable goaltender in accordance with this Section 16.13 ("Goaltender Exemption").

 

Emergency Recall.

(i) A Player on Loan to a club of any league affiliated with the League may be Recalled from such Loan under emergency conditions at any time for the duration of the emergency only following which he must be returned promptly to the club from which he was Recalled.

(ii) Emergency conditions shall be established when the playing strength of the Loaning Club, by reason of incapacitating injury or illness or by League suspension to its Players is reduced below the level of two (2) goalkeepers, six (6) defensemen and twelve (12) forwards. Proof of the existence of the emergency conditions including the incapacity shall be furnished to the Commissioner of the League upon request made by him.

(iii) For the purpose of establishing the existence of emergency conditions at any time, to support the Recall of a Player for participation in any Playoff Game, it shall be deemed that the Player(s) on Loan following 3:00 p.m. New York time of the fortieth (40th) day immediately preceding the last day of the Regular Season are continuing on Loan for the remainder of the season notwithstanding that the Loaned club(s) may have been eliminated from further play for the season. (n) Following the conclusion of the Regular Season, no Player may be Recalled from Loan to a club of any league affiliated with the NHL, except that: (i) a Club may exercise an unlimited number of additional regular Recalls, provided that it may have no more than three (3) Players on its Active Roster who were Recalled by way of regular Recall after the Trade Deadline. However, if a Club has Recalled four (4) Players pursuant to Section 13.12(l) above, such Club will instead be permitted to retain those four (4) Players on its Active Roster following the conclusion of the Regular Season. (ii) Players may be Recalled under Article 13.12(m). (iii) Players may be Recalled upon completion of the regular sea

 

 

 

[Arrow 1983]

20 minutes ago, lmm said:

so, your question was retorical?

you are good, maybe I 'll hire you for my next divorce

 

care to post that bit of the cba?

 

 

Understanding Emergency Recall vs Regular Recall - Pension Plan Puppets

 

and an article to explain it

[Arrow 1983]

17 minutes ago, lmm said:

I thought you were in this for fun?

Now you are getting all name cally just like Provost

 

I am not out to win an argument, I am questionong the logic of the arguments givien.

 

See Provost getting all weird? That is because I ask questions that they can't answer, so they reverts to name calling or insult

 

Try to stay away from name calling and insult even if its in Latin  iarfay noughesay?

 

how come you picked all the starts to get injured all at once

 Horvat Pettersson Myers and Hughes those are the names you mentioned that was absurd possibility, is very low

 

Edited December 20, 2020 by Arrow 1983

[Arrow 1983]

18 minutes ago, lmm said:

I thought you were in this for fun?

Now you are getting all name cally just like Provost

 

I am not out to win an argument, I am questionong the logic of the arguments givien.

 

See Provost getting all weird? That is because I ask questions that they can't answer, so they reverts to name calling or insult

 

Try to stay away from name calling and insult even if its in Latin  iarfay noughesay?

 

and by no means did I call you a name 

I called your argument Absurd

[lmm]

4 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said:

16.4 Active Roster Size; Playing Roster. (a) There shall be a maximum of twenty-three (23) Players on each Club's Active Roster at any one time, provided, however, that, on the date of each season's Trade Deadline, a Club's Active Roster may be increased to any number of Players the Club, in its discretion, so determines, subject to Article 50.

 

(b) Clubs are not permitted to Loan Players where the result of such Loan(s) would reduce the Club's Active Roster below eighteen (18) skaters and two (2) goaltenders. However, Clubs will not be required to Recall Players to maintain the minimum eighteen (18) skaters and two (2) goaltenders on days which they do not play an NHL Game, provided that the deficiency below those thresholds is a result of an injury that has caused the removal of such disabled Player from the Active Roster.

 

(c) Except in case of emergency, there shall be no reduction of the required minimum Playing Rosters of the Clubs, below eighteen (18) skaters and two (2) goaltenders.

 

16.13 Goaltender Exemption. (a) In the event a Club's goaltender becomes unavailable due to incapacitating injury, illness or League suspension such that the Club may not have two (2) goaltenders on its Playing Roster and the Club is at the Active Roster limit, the Club shall be permitted to exceed the Active Roster limit for purposes of adding a goaltender to its Active Roster ("Replacement Goaltender") to replace the unavailable goaltender in accordance with this Section 16.13 ("Goaltender Exemption").

 

Emergency Recall.

(i) A Player on Loan to a club of any league affiliated with the League may be Recalled from such Loan under emergency conditions at any time for the duration of the emergency only following which he must be returned promptly to the club from which he was Recalled.

(ii) Emergency conditions shall be established when the playing strength of the Loaning Club, by reason of incapacitating injury or illness or by League suspension to its Players is reduced below the level of two (2) goalkeepers, six (6) defensemen and twelve (12) forwards. Proof of the existence of the emergency conditions including the incapacity shall be furnished to the Commissioner of the League upon request made by him.

(iii) For the purpose of establishing the existence of emergency conditions at any time, to support the Recall of a Player for participation in any Playoff Game, it shall be deemed that the Player(s) on Loan following 3:00 p.m. New York time of the fortieth (40th) day immediately preceding the last day of the Regular Season are continuing on Loan for the remainder of the season notwithstanding that the Loaned club(s) may have been eliminated from further play for the season. (n) Following the conclusion of the Regular Season, no Player may be Recalled from Loan to a club of any league affiliated with the NHL, except that: (i) a Club may exercise an unlimited number of additional regular Recalls, provided that it may have no more than three (3) Players on its Active Roster who were Recalled by way of regular Recall after the Trade Deadline. However, if a Club has Recalled four (4) Players pursuant to Section 13.12(l) above, such Club will instead be permitted to retain those four (4) Players on its Active Roster following the conclusion of the Regular Season. (ii) Players may be Recalled under Article 13.12(m). (iii) Players may be Recalled upon completion of the regular sea

 

 

 

I think I knew all that

but I thought you were asking about cap

 

that does not cover wwhen teams go over cap without LITR

that is what I thought you meant

 

I'd be intersted on what the current rule is a team was even with the $81.5M cap and needed a player short term

[Arrow 1983]

Just now, lmm said:

I think I knew all that

but I thought you were asking about cap

 

that does not cover wwhen teams go over cap without LITR

that is what I thought you meant

 

I'd be intersted on what the current rule is a team was even with the $81.5M cap and needed a player short term

emergency loan is the only time a team is allowed over the cap but that info will take me a little longer to find I think it is in the illustrations just be patient  

[lmm]

9 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said:

Understanding Emergency Recall vs Regular Recall - Pension Plan Puppets

 

and an article to explain it

that explains waiver eligablity

 

I had a handle on that one too

It pertains to not losing a player to waivers

we had a similar situation recently, (last 2 years)  I can't remember exactly who it was though

[lmm]

13 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said:

how come you picked all the starts to get injured all at once

 Horvat Pettersson Myers and Hughes those are the names you mentioned that was absurd possibility, is very low

 

because it would really be painful to lose  any of those guys for 8 games unnessecarily

and flu could hit a team like that

 

heck if one was LE we'd LITR him for a hangnail

 

and like you said, its all hypthetical, so why not Hypo a worst case

Edited December 20, 2020 by lmm