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What can AV even do with this team?


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#121 wallstreetamigo

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 04:05 PM

At this point, Komisarek for Ballard wouldn't even be the worst move.


I would do it.....at least Komisarek is RH and plays the right side. Plus he is big and physical. Just what the Canucks could use.....and what AV wants.

Although D is not exactly what Toronto needs at this point.

Edited by wallstreetamigo, 14 March 2013 - 04:06 PM.


#122 theminister

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 04:06 PM

They didn't even rest Bieksa, coming off of an injury , to play LA. They sat Ballard in favour of Alberts and Bieksa got pushed too far and re-injured himself. It's absolutely brutal personnel management.


I want to highlight this part of my previous post.

If it happens again tonight.......

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#123 wallstreetamigo

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 04:19 PM

I want to highlight this part of my previous post.

If it happens again tonight.......


I certainly hope this does not happen a second time........if it does though I think that raises some questions about Av and Gillis as well. They have all this depth so there is no need at all to rush a guy with a groin injury.....

Didn't Bieksa sort of hint last time that he was not 100% but AV said he looked fine and sure enough he was in the lineup?

Edited by wallstreetamigo, 14 March 2013 - 04:20 PM.


#124 Guest_Gumballthechewy_*

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 04:26 PM

Well, it's just that you've done such an amazing job of hiding it up until now...


I am pretty amazing.

#125 Baggins

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 02:50 AM

And I really get sick of people thinking it is enough of an accomplishment to not change things that are quite obviously not working anymore. The PT is fine. But if you turn around and play like crap in the playoffs, what was the point of winning it? So you have something to be proud of when you lose?

I never said winning the cup was easy. Just like I think the injury excuse is pretty pathetic too. Sure getting injuries has an impact. But like with most AV supporters, it comes down to excuses and sitting on past achievements. A coach who makes a difference would have had all 23 guys and more confident, feeling like they were important to the team, and ready to play when the injuries inevitably came calling. AV instead chose to rely on what was left of his regulars.

And please, Luongo is the only reason the SCF even made it to 7 games. Without him it would have been a sweep for Boston. But let's blame his bad games and injuries solely for the loss. AV also got badly outcoached by someone who is not as stubborn......simple as that.

Unlike the actual AV haters, I have never said he is a bad coach. I just think he is a bad coach for this team after this long when things are going the way they are. There really is a difference there.

I also never said the Canucks even had a chance last year. They didn't. And they won the President's Trophy without playing well enough to really deserve to if you ask me. FALSE SENSE OF SECURITY. But the fact that they thought they had a chance with the deficiencies they had - much the same as they think they are playing well now when they are not - should really concern us. How many more chances will this team have to win a cup? Looks like none at this point unless there are changes.


I didn't realize game 7 of the scf is playing like crap. I don't even think they played like crap against LA. But with no secondary scoring and our top goal scorer out goaltending was the only way we would beat LA. We had to match Quick. Lou was not very good and Schneider gave us a chance.


Lou was bipolar against Boston. He played like a Vezina goalie for three games, had one ok game, and stunk in three games. But then the guy at the other end played like a Vezina goalie for seven games.

Hamhuis out/groin
Edler played/two broken fingers
Ehrhoff played/shoulder
Bieksa played/ bruised acl
Rome suspended
Henrik played/back
Kesler played/shoulder & groin
Raymond out/back
Samuelsson out/sports hernia
Higgins played/broken foot
Malhotra played/eye

Try and out coach any team with a bipolar goalie and that list of injuries. Never mind out coaching a very good team with a hot Vezina goalie, a very good defense and virtually no injuries. We got to game seven because of Lou. But Lou was the only way we'd win that series. Unfortunately he was very good and very bad. I've said it many times, it was the number of key injuries that did us in. But Lou still wasn't good enough.

Tell me coach, how do you out coach the guy with a Vezina goalie, a Norris d-man, and a physical team that is basically healthy when you have that many injuries to deal with? I'd love to hear the game plan. Waive the magic wand maybe?

Edited by Baggins, 15 March 2013 - 02:53 AM.

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#126 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 06:11 AM

Rup, it's getting past the point of ridiculous now. It's not about getting a chance for Alberts and Barker to cycle in and get some starts.

It's about the fact that the coach hasn't done that with a single one of his other top 5 D all season. The only reason Barker got any games at all was because Bieksa got injured. In a short season like this there's no reason not to give another player a night off in a back-to-back if they seems to be fatigued or struggled the previous game. If AV's only answer to cycling the D is to sit Ballard then he has no more tools in the toolbox.

They didn't even rest Bieksa, coming off of an injury , to play LA. They sat Ballard in favour of Alberts and Bieksa got pushed too far and re-injured himself. It's absolutely brutal personnel management. I can't understand how anyone would defend it, and I can't see a single coach in the NHL doing the same thing under the same circumstances.

If our D is tired for Round 1 this will be the primary cause. Our only rested D will be Barker, Ballard and Alberts. Do you see AV suddenly switching it up and leaning on them if our legs aren't there? I don't and it wouldn't be wise to expect those three to be able to step into the role when they haven't had any minutes doing it all year.

There are a lot of points in this post, but I'll concentrate on the main one (I believe): Scratching Ballard in favor of Alberts.

As I have said, I would like to see Ballard back in the lineup on a regular basis. I see a lot of the same things that you and Wallstreet see. KB4 is the best skater on the Canucks' defense and he plays bigger than he actually is. It's actually a bit of a mystery to me why Alberts started against a not particularly physical team in Nashville.

However, where you guys decide that this sort of decision is "past the point of ridiculous", or as Wallstreet says, makes AV an "Assclown", I take another tack.

I consider myself a knowledgeable hockey person and I think I am able to interpret what I see on the ice as well as anyone on this board, but I also realize that I don't have access to the hours of game film that AV does. I'm not out there at every single practice, seeing which combinations seem to be working best. I don't have the daily player personnel advice of a team of professional hockey people like Mike Gillis, Laurence Gilman, Dave Gagne, Lorne Henning, Darryl Williams, Newell Brown, Stan Smyl and Rick Bowness who make their living in the game of hockey...

I also don't have over 600 NHL games as a head coach under my belt.

So maybe, just maybe, the coaching staff has seen something, either on film or in practice that I haven't seen, or did not notice at game speed. Or maybe my fervent hope that Ballard becomes a regular again, clouds my vision of his possible shortcomings. I'm sure we can all admit that we sometimes see what we want to see....

What I do know is that the Canucks have won their last two games with Alberts in the lineup. I also know that a large percentage of CDC was lambasting AV for sending Schroeder down and bringing up Andrew Ebbett, who like Alberts, is regularly referred to on CDC as a "plug". While I realize that the Canucks benefited from a sub-par game by Rinne, that decision still makes CDC look like what they are: Amateurs.

Finally, I have said all along that I don't agree with everything that AV and the rest of the coaching staff does, but I disagree that they have been "out-coached" in the playoffs. They have been consistently out-goaltended and have not been healthy enough to win. I'd point to Baggins' last couple of posts, as they pretty much echo my thoughts on the last two playoff exits for the Canucks.
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#127 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 06:20 AM

I certainly hope this does not happen a second time........if it does though I think that raises some questions about Av and Gillis as well. They have all this depth so there is no need at all to rush a guy with a groin injury.....

Didn't Bieksa sort of hint last time that he was not 100% but AV said he looked fine and sure enough he was in the lineup?

I don't really understand this. (okay, I do. It's another opportunity to slam Vigneault for something)

When a guy is out with an injury "resting" is exactly what he is doing. Could he have benefited from more rest? Sure he could have, but the decision to return a player to active duty is not made in a vacuum.

If Bieksa says "I'm not ready", that's pretty much the end of it. However, if he pronounces himself ready to go, then it's really up to the team's medical staff to gainsay him. The coaching staff act on the information they receive from those two sources and make their lineup decisions accordingly.

With the benefit of 20/20 hindsight, it's easy to say he was rushed back in the LA game. He also looked awful last night, (although that may have been rust as opposed to lingering injury problems) but the fact is, the defense has looked out of sorts without him in the lineup and the team is naturally going to want their emotional leader back ASAP, especially considering their record without him.

Edited by RUPERTKBD, 15 March 2013 - 06:20 AM.

Orland Kurtenbach and Dennis Kearns had just been torched 8-1 by the Habs, but they still took time to come out to meet us, some fellow BC boys who were playing hockey in Montreal. THAT"S what being a Canuck is!




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