The "I would like to see Torts stay for at least one more year" thread.

[Cold Hard Truth]

Resorting to derisive generalizations ("delusional fan boys")

Delusional fanboys wont decide Torts fate, the players exit interviews will.

If Torts is despised by the players like you suggest than he will be fired today or tomorrow,

If not then it will be up to the new GM to decide if he goes into next season with Fonzarella.

I like his honesty and intensity, its something desperately needed with this club.

Did Torts make mistakes his first year ? absolutely and some bad ones but we cant fire a coach every year while guys on the first line are out there family skating wasting prime minutes.

They need to show 3-4 veterans the door before they fire another coach.

[Cold Hard Truth]

The Canucks need to be careful not to follow Edmonton's footsteps and fire one coach every year and finally realize it's not a coaching issue. The team has been on a decline since 2011 and the core has stayed roughly the same. The coach is not the issue at the moment. They need to trade a couple core guys away and bring in more young talent. I thought a few young guys have developed well under Torts like Tanev and Kassian

Exactly.

i think they need to blow 3-4 vets out the door.

Torts is not the problem, Vigneault was not the problem.

[DarthNinja]

smart canucks fans realize the core is stale and needs some changes.

smart canucks fans also realize that tortorella is a horrible coach who will never again have nhl success, exacerbated all of the teams existing problems while creating a bounty of new ones, and should have been fired 4 days ago.

So Canucks fans realize the same thing as the coach openly declared just days ago...except the Canucks fans who realize it are "smart" while the coach who declared it is "terrible"?

When did you realize that Torts will never again have success in the league...was it not even two years ago in 2012 that he coached the NYR to 2nd best overall in the league, conference finals and was a Jack Adams finalist?

But you mean after that right...

[oldnews]

Resorting to derisive generalizations ("delusional fan boys") that do not accurately portray those of us that want Torts fired, and trite expressions ("broken record") that sound more like a description of your own repetitive and ingenuous posts than anything else, is confirmation that what you "been saying" is not worth reading.

The decision at present is whether to keep or fire Torts not AV.

Torts proved himself unable to treat the players with respect, especially in public on the bench during the games, and Linden will do well to remember the last time (Keenan and Messier) the team was treated like that.

[Linden can hardly forget it. Keenan told Trev to, "Shut the %$&%^ up", took the "C" off his jersey and gave it to Messier (who also took #11 which was a retired number), and traded Linden away. (Even though this was a good trade for the team, it was not what our captain wanted I am sure).

Torts also admitted he did not know anything about the other teams and did not care to spend the time to learn; well Anaheim sure did the teaching for him whether he liked it or not.

There are only 30 head coaching positions in the NHL; there is no way that flying off the handle all the time in public and abstinence from proper research keeps him in serious contention or ahead of the hundreds of candidates for the job.

Precisely.

Deflecting 'reality' towards the roster or GM doesn't qualify the job that Tortorella himself did. I'm still waiting for someone to try to maintain that Tortorella did a good job this year. Ironically, all there are is excuses regarding the core and roster, something he himself encouraged and inspired with his comments. Firing shots at the depth, core or GM doesn't change Tortorella's own performance this year.

Why should Linden bother to go out and improve the roster for a coach that is oblivious to his personnel?

And the other point you raise is extremely valid. The whole 'I don't know about the Rangers...I haven't paid any attention to them...I'm out west....' thing is annoying. Who doesn't pay attention to the tendencies, strengths and weaknesses of their next opponent? Even amateurs do. They were about to play the GD Rangers that very night! That comes across as either exceptionally arrogant or amateur.

[Jagorim Jarg]

Hey let's hire a really limp noodle as the coach, a tiny little guy with a little voice, a very politically correct guy who only makes correct comments and never takes any responsibility for his actions! I'm tired of Torts and his honesty already what this team needs is a damn liar, let's get this done people! We haven't made the playyofs in one years! Torts is embarrassing and shameful and I'm so pompous that I think his actions reflect on me somehow so I want him gone extra bad, how dare he tarnish our golden egg of a reputation! The window is still open but if I have to put up with an enthusiastic coach for one more year I'm calling it quits as a Canucks fan, your temper temper is melting my iced latte mochachino!

[Tearloch7]

Hey let's hire a really limp noodle as the coach, a tiny little guy with a little voice, a very politically correct guy who only makes correct comments and never takes any responsibility for his actions! I'm tired of Torts and his honesty already what this team needs is a damn liar, let's get this done people! We haven't made the playyofs in one years! Torts is embarrassing and shameful and I'm so pompous that I think his actions reflect on me somehow so I want him gone extra bad, how dare he tarnish our golden egg of a reputation! The window is still open but if I have to put up with an enthusiastic coach for one more year I'm calling it quits as a Canucks fan, your temper temper is melting my iced latte mochachino!

You, Sir, are 'all over like a mad woman's poo'. as they used to say.

[oldnews]

All I hear is a bunch of excuses, deflections and apologism on behalf of Tortorella - the irony here is calling other people fanboys.

Can anyone elaborate on what a good job he did this year?

[Jagorim Jarg]

</Sarcasm> .. On what a good job the entire organization did this year? All the answers tie together and to shoulder the blame entirely on Torts is absurd.

-I thought he gave the top guys the chance to have career years, and they failed to run with it.

-All teams suffer from injuries. Torts used what he had, and what was a problem to begin with, depth, was exposed when he had no choice but to overplay the top guys just to have a chance to win.

-We had the best penalty kill for a considerable chunk of the season.

-How many times did you see our D let guys have free range in front of the net? Does Torts have to hold their hands out there? He admitted he wasn't hammering them hard enough, and he's probably right.

-He's forced some guys to look at what they are. maybe they don't like the answer they gave themselves but it's time to step up, and the guys who didn't respond to the gut check need to go.

You need to have the ability to look at what you are. I think Torts does it better than others.

I'm not ging to agree with every single thing he does. I find it hard to believe that he would have assaulted Hartley with anything other than words up close, some of the things he says are clearly meant for the media. Sometimes he will take a bait and for that reason he's the most entertaining guy in the post game scrum. If you want to hear a guy say the same thing 82 freaking times just watch a recording of AV. When he says he doesn't care about the other team in an off the cuff statement to the media it doesn't mean the staff hasn't looked at the teams at all and are seat of the pants-ing it completely. Give these guys some credit, there is a reason they are in the NHL and making money.

You don't know what's said behind closed doors. What we see on camera and hear on the radio is only a sliver of these personalities and to make any judgement is pointless, but from what I saw, if you're thinking fire torts, then you can finish off by letting go of no less than half the team by the same logic.

[Cold Hard Truth]

Hey let's hire a really limp noodle as the coach, a tiny little guy with a little voice, a very politically correct guy who only makes correct comments and never takes any responsibility for his actions! I'm tired of Torts and his honesty already what this team needs is a damn liar, let's get this done people! We haven't made the playyofs in one years! Torts is embarrassing and shameful and I'm so pompous that I think his actions reflect on me somehow so I want him gone extra bad, how dare he tarnish our golden egg of a reputation! The window is still open but if I have to put up with an enthusiastic coach for one more year I'm calling it quits as a Canucks fan, your temper temper is melting my iced latte mochachino!

Heaven forbid a coach care enough about his players to fight for them.

Time to give Torts the Bertuzzi, Rypien and Bitz treatment,

thats right, if you fight for the Canucks we trade your a**.

What we need is 4 lines of Mason Raymond and Daniel Sedin, that will take us far in the playoffs.

[aGENT]

His systems ask a lot of the players physically, everybody has to play a complete 200 foot game and he tried right from training camp to get them to the level of fitness that was required of it. Problem is, the best players on this team are not 25 years old any more and they are not up to the task.

Weren't the Sedins (the oldest players on the team FWIW) two of the very few players to actually pass his pre-season fitness testing? Wasn't Kesler's playing ~25 minutes a night an endorsement of Tort's faith he could play those minutes/that style.

Your statement is having trouble holding water...

[Fred65]

If Linden sticks with Tortorella and there is a repeat of this season past, then Linden is percieved to be stupid to have allowed this to happen. Every indication is Tortorella will not play the up tempo game that Linden wants and has stated is his wish, too many insiders have stated Tortorella is a black and white sort of coach...there's only one way to play and that's his boring style. It's my belief that season ticket sales will not pick up until fans can believe their will be entertainement next season. I understand there has only been a 60% renewal of Season tickets.....and if Linden doesn't succeed who will the Aqualinis pull out the hat next time.

I'm thinking Torts is loading the dogs into the van as we speak

[Cold Hard Truth]

Weren't the Sedins (the oldest players on the team FWIW) two of the very few players to actually pass his pre-season fitness testing? Wasn't Kesler's playing ~25 minutes a night an endorsement of Tort's faith he could play those minutes/that style.

Your statement is having trouble holding water...

the blame torts crowd is grasping at straws ,

its not AV, its not Torts , its the players.

3 years now this team has been downward trending and we haven't made any serious trades besides getting absolutely fleeced for Schneider, but hey, lets just keep blaming the coaches and fire them every year.

[aGENT]

the blame torts crowd is grasping at straws ,

its not AV, its not Torts , its the players.

3 years now this team has been downward trending and we haven't made any serious trades besides getting absolutely fleeced for Schneider, but hey, lets just keep blaming the coaches and fire them every year.

I'm not sure why you have such difficulty with this concept but have you considered that it's all three?

The players need a youth injection, AV's message had grown stale, Torts did a largely poor job. All three needed/need addressing and Torts IMO has shown very little reason to believe he's "part of the solution".

[Tearloch7]

Great perspective, Jagorim .. your 'sarcastic rant' was too much for me too follow, but I agree wholeheartedly in what you say. In this age of instant gratification, some folks are so blinded by the destination that they fail to see the road directly ahead, and thus they hit every damned pothole on the way, and often miss the signposts too.

I place the blame for this season on many factors, of which Torts is just one .. I want him here until at least the half way in the season.

Shake up this core and get some enthusiasm back! .. every player within the organization should be assessed, and no-one should be considered 'safe'.

[Cold Hard Truth]

If Linden sticks with Tortorella and there is a repeat of this season past, then Linden is percieved to be stupid to have allowed this to happen. Every indication is Tortorella will not play the up tempo game that Linden wants and has stated is his wish, too many insiders have stated Tortorella is a black and white sort of coach...there's only one way to play and that's his boring style. It's my belief that season ticket sales will not pick up until fans can believe their will be entertainement next season. I understand there has only been a 60% renewal of Season tickets.....and if Linden doesn't succeed who will the Aqualinis pull out the hat next time.

I'm thinking Torts is loading the dogs into the van as we speak

What they need to do is trade 3-4 vets, give Tortorella a chance with a team that isn't the same that got AV fired, give Torts to xmas and see where the team is at ,worse case they get a chance at McDavid andJack Eichel if it all goes to sh*t.

[Goal:thecup]

Delusional fanboys wont decide Torts fate, the players exit interviews will.

If Torts is despised by the players like you suggest than he will be fired today or tomorrow,

If not then it will be up to the new GM to decide if he goes into next season with Fonzarella.

I like his honesty and intensity, its something desperately needed with this club.

Did Torts make mistakes his first year ? absolutely and some bad ones but we cant fire a coach every year while guys on the first line are out there family skating wasting prime minutes.

They need to show 3-4 veterans the door before they fire another coach.

Thanks for proving my points:

1) resorting to derisive generalizations again

2) repeating your posts like a broken record

3) proving you do not know how management works - the players' exit interviews will decide the coach's fate - Linden will use their input along with many other factors

4) proving you do not understand what others are saying - nowhere did I suggest the players despise Torts - I said Torts does not treat the players with respect

5) proving, once again, that you do not know how management works - you do not "show 3-4 veterans the door before you fire another coach" - you fire the coach as soon as his contract allows and your newly-hired GM and the rest of management agree his time is up - and the trade deadline has passed - and those "3-4 veterans" probably have no-trade-clauses.

If you cannot come up with valid points yourself, and cannot even blindly repeat someone else's valid points, at least stop repeating this "cannot fire another coach" nonsense and resorting to calling others names.

Torts had a terrible year and is blaming everyone else for it while trying to hide behind vacuous statements such as, "taking full responsibility" himself.

His mismanagement and megalomania was clearly displayed, it produced these negative results and has now come back to (hopefully) crush any hope he may have to coach our team again.

[aGENT]

the blame torts crowd is grasping at straws ,

And grasping what straws? The other poster made a nonsense comment that was not borne out by facts. I simply stated as such.

Perhaps you should try actually debating points rather than your usual tactics of name calling and deflecting?

[hlinkas wrister]

Weren't the Sedins (the oldest players on the team FWIW) two of the very few players to actually pass his pre-season fitness testing? Wasn't Kesler's playing ~25 minutes a night an endorsement of Tort's faith he could play those minutes/that style.

Your statement is having trouble holding water...

Compare their first half stats to their second half stats. Compare their injury records this year to previous years. Kesler at his age and skill level should and can maintain that pace, but the Sedins couldn't (regardless of their pre-season condition). Its not like he was topping up their ice time with extra power play duty, he had them killing penalties for petes sake.

[Goal:thecup]

I am not blaming Torts for everything.

He did some things well and helped "stiffen" the lineup.

The problem is that the things he did not do well, like insulting the players publicly and not bothering to learn the players, teams, and systems around the Canucks, are unforgiveable.

They are tantamount to dereliction of duty and I do not believe he can change.

I believe he might like to, to save his job, but I do not believe he is capable, nor deserving of an opportunity to change.

So, what I am saying is, wait until we can interview the candidates and hire a new GM, then fire Torts, then improve the roster and the players in the system.

[oldnews]

The team definitely needed the coach to precipitate the kind of divisive thing that resulted from his 'honesty and reality' shared in that presser.

No one around here was realistic until they heard those words, right?

Linden is the new President - he's not tied to Gillis' personnel decisions - he's not stupid - he probably has an exceptionally realistic perception of the core and the depth of the team. Does he need Tortorella lobbying publicly about the lack of depth and the old, stale, trending core? How exactly does that serve the next GM in getting value if in fact they decide to take Tortorella's unsolicited advice?

Thanks for the 'honesty'. No one knew how the Canucks looked in those jeans - they needed Tortorella to come in and say "you're fat." Ironically, it's not the players who decide what to wear. It's the next GM and President who will decide that. I'm sure they'll appreciate that Tortorella shared that with them, "internally" as opposed to in a high profile exit press conference.

Btw, how does the coach look in those jeans?

My personal answer that; like one of the first parts to re-dress in the retool.