cyoung Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 1 hour ago, Warhippy said: I have to say this Apparently there IS a chance we take Liljegren at #5 I know people will be pissed if this happens. But...there is also a chance we finish in the top 5 lottery position next year as well, meaning a shot at Dahlin In 3 drafts Juolevi Liljegren Dahlin Supplemented by Canadian born defensemen in the later rounds leaving the canucks with potentially the most stacked defense in the league in 5 to 7 years but also cementing our lack of forwards meaning we draft top 5-10 in 209 and 2020 People will be angry and frustrated which is certain. But if we're drafting forwards in 2019 and 2020 as potential lottery picks again they stand a high chance of joining the team within the same year or 1 year later. Why is this important. Should we actually do the unthinkable and draft a D this year, and possibly should we draft a D next year. We're 2-3 years from all 3 of OJ, this and next years picks making the league, meaning we'd have NHL ready D from the last few drafts joining the same time as future forwards do. Timeline fits, JB is an evil genius and the Canucks will be bad until 2020 with top 10 picks, top 15 in 2021 and playoffs by 2021/2022 5 years people hang on. Oh and no I am not drinking, but am also not seriously worried about this or the next few drafts unless we see Rasmussen lumbering up the steps at 5 I just don't see them stacking D like that, they will develop better as a team with talent at all positions. But it does seem interesting having all three of them haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 3 minutes ago, J.R. said: Even re-signing a couple of Sharp(35), Hemsky(33), Hudler(33) (or replacing them with UFA's), they're going to need top 6 help in the next couple years with Spezza(33) and Benn(27) also not getting any younger. They either trade it for immediate help or draft a forward IMO. They've got decent young D. They'd also be wise to trade for another D ahead of the ED to improve on their top 4. I was hoping that would be us/Tanev before the lottery. Not sure we're as much of a fit now though. With Ritchie, Faksa, Guryanov and Matej working out so well I think they've some very fine pieces moving forward. And still being able to supplement via trade or free agency. Seguin will be their 1st line center for the next decade, Spezza 2nd 3rd line center for a few more seasons, Faksa is on his way as well. I just don't see their pressing need to draft a center right now and won't be shocked if they do in fact grab a D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 Just now, cyoung said: I just don't see them stacking D like that, they will develop better as a team with talent at all positions. But it does seem interesting having all three of them haha Well JB did say a play making center or a puck moving D Makar/Liljegren fit that bill And should we suck again next year and win the 1st overall, Dahlin is leading the pack and I cannot pick a team that would draft a 1st line winger over a cannot miss 1st pairing D (Svechnikov/Dahlin) It's all hypothetical but.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 5 minutes ago, Warhippy said: With Ritchie, Faksa, Guryanov and Matej working out so well I think they've some very fine pieces moving forward. And still being able to supplement via trade or free agency. Seguin will be their 1st line center for the next decade, Spezza 2nd 3rd line center for a few more seasons, Faksa is on his way as well. I just don't see their pressing need to draft a center right now and won't be shocked if they do in fact grab a D Who says it has to be a centre? They could take a W or one of the C can easily move to W. Mittelstadt or Vilardi would both be excellent wingers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honky Cat Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 1 hour ago, Warhippy said: I have to say this Apparently there IS a chance we take Liljegren at #5 I know people will be pissed if this happens. But...there is also a chance we finish in the top 5 lottery position next year as well, meaning a shot at Dahlin In 3 drafts Juolevi Liljegren Dahlin Supplemented by Canadian born defensemen in the later rounds leaving the canucks with potentially the most stacked defense in the league in 5 to 7 years but also cementing our lack of forwards meaning we draft top 5-10 in 209 and 2020 People will be angry and frustrated which is certain. But if we're drafting forwards in 2019 and 2020 as potential lottery picks again they stand a high chance of joining the team within the same year or 1 year later. Why is this important. Should we actually do the unthinkable and draft a D this year, and possibly should we draft a D next year. We're 2-3 years from all 3 of OJ, this and next years picks making the league, meaning we'd have NHL ready D from the last few drafts joining the same time as future forwards do. Timeline fits, JB is an evil genius and the Canucks will be bad until 2020 with top 10 picks, top 15 in 2021 and playoffs by 2021/2022 5 years people hang on. Oh and no I am not drinking, but am also not seriously worried about this or the next few drafts unless we see Rasmussen lumbering up the steps at 5 People would most definitely be pissed at this..Liljegren has dropped quite a bit in the rankings and most certainly would not be a wise choice at 5....You go BPA all the way,picking that high....I wouldn't be opposed to getting him,but Benning should trade down the pick first... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 4 minutes ago, J.R. said: Who says it has to be a centre? They could take a W or one of the C can easily move to W. Mittelstadt or Vilardi would both be excellent wingers. Which is why I pointed out that Dallas heavily scouted Tippett and Tolvanen pre lottery. Mittlestadt by some accounts is looking like a Winger, center hybrid at the NHL level and wouldn't be a bad choice either for Dallas Just now, Honky Cat said: People would most definitely be pissed at this..Liljegren has dropped quite a bit in the rankings and most certainly would not be a wise choice at 5....You go BPA all the way,picking that high....I wouldn't be opposed to getting him,but Benning should trade down the pick first... At 5, Hèiskanèn/Liljegren/Vilardi/Glass/Necas can all be argued to be the BPA is the issue. That's the joy of this draft. And let's be honest here. We could ahve won the lottery and people would still be pissed with whatever JB does 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 1 minute ago, Warhippy said: Which is why I pointed out that Dallas heavily scouted Tippett and Tolvanen pre lottery. Mittlestadt by some accounts is looking like a Winger, center hybrid at the NHL level and wouldn't be a bad choice either for Dallas At 5, Hèiskanèn/Liljegren/Vilardi/Glass/Necas can all be argued to be the BPA is the issue. That's the joy of this draft. And let's be honest here. We could ahve won the lottery and people would still be pissed with whatever JB does Get 1st, Benning takes Hischier. CDC: "Why didn't we take Patrick?!!?!?!!!! " 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 5 minutes ago, Honky Cat said: People would most definitely be pissed at this..Liljegren has dropped quite a bit in the rankings and most certainly would not be a wise choice at 5....You go BPA all the way,picking that high....I wouldn't be opposed to getting him,but Benning should trade down the pick first... I think he has dropped with the media, I'm betting most teams understand the mono factor and still have him pencilled into the top 5-7. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he is taken before #5 or if JB takes him at #5. This is a kid who was a challenger for 1st overall in September and who plays in the SHL, against men, I don't see him sliding very far. Gradin will have a good read on him, I'm sure. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForsbergTheGreat Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 2 minutes ago, Warhippy said: With Ritchie, Faksa, Guryanov and Matej working out so well I think they've some very fine pieces moving forward. And still being able to supplement via trade or free agency. I'm assuming you're meaning Gurianov and stransky who arn't doing that good. Stransky is their Greiner, and Gurianov has been somewhat of a disappointment for a 13 overall, especially considering 10 of the 12 player drafted immediately after: Zboril, DeBrusk, Barzal, Boeser, Konecny, Connor, Chabot, Svechnikov, Eriksson-Ek, White. The stars top prospect outside of Honka, is Lindell, who they believe will be a top pairing shutdown D. Faska, Shore, and Ritchie had decent years this year, but it's hard to peg them as top 6 players yet. 2 minutes ago, Warhippy said: Seguin will be their 1st line center for the next decade, Spezza 2nd 3rd line center for a few more seasons, Faksa is on his way as well. I just don't see their pressing need to draft a center right now and won't be shocked if they do in fact grab a D They don't have a "pressing" need for center, but none of the picks (centers and D) are making NHL impacts in the next 2 seasons, Picking a D makes just as little sense since he wouldn't be NHL ready for at least another 2 likely 3-4 seasons. Could they pick a D at 3? Possibly but it would only be because they believe he's the BPA. If this pick had anything to do with a pressing need they would be trading it for immediate impact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honky Cat Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 Just now, stawns said: I think he has dropped with the media, I'm betting most teams understand the mono factor and still have him pencilled into the top 5-7. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he is taken before #5 or if JB takes him at #5. This is a kid who was a challenger for 1st overall in September and who plays in the SHL, against men, I don't see him sliding very far. Gradin will have a good read on him, I'm sure. I have read scouting reports from scouts in the field...Obviously,he's gifted with physical skills,but his mental side appears to be the issue..His play was not good even after the mono,but hey..that's why the Canucks have scouts..they see them more than me.. As far as the Canucks go..I believe their plan is to get a 1C..and there are quite a few centers to pick from (but how many are projected to be a legit 1C..?)..If there isn't one available at 5,they will pick what they believe to be a top pairing Dman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 Just now, Honky Cat said: I have read scouting reports from scouts in the field...Obviously,he's gifted with physical skills,but his mental side appears to be the issue..His play was not good even after the mono,but hey..that's why the Canucks have scouts..they see them more than me.. As far as the Canucks go..I believe their plan is to get a 1C..and there are quite a few centers to pick from (but how many are projected to be a legit 1C..?)..If there isn't one available at 5,they will pick what they believe to be a top pairing Dman. Ive had mono, it can often be up to a year before you're back to normal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 11 minutes ago, ForsbergTheGreat said: I'm assuming you're meaning Gurianov and stransky who arn't doing that good. Stransky is their Greiner, and Gurianov has been somewhat of a disappointment for a 13 overall, especially considering 10 of the 12 player drafted immediately after: Zboril, DeBrusk, Barzal, Boeser, Konecny, Connor, Chabot, Svechnikov, Eriksson-Ek, White. The stars top prospect outside of Honka, is Lindell, who they believe will be a top pairing shutdown D. Faska, Shore, and Ritchie had decent years this year, but it's hard to peg them as top 6 players yet. They don't have a "pressing" need for center, but none of the picks (centers and D) are making NHL impacts in the next 2 seasons, Picking a D makes just as little sense since he wouldn't be NHL ready for at least another 2 likely 3-4 seasons. Could they pick a D at 3? Possibly but it would only be because they believe he's the BPA. If this pick had anything to do with a pressing need they would be trading it for immediate impact. OK So, they wouldn't pick a defenseman or winger why? Just curious if you've an opinion on this. I am just saying to not be surprised if they trade the pick or draft a non center Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 17 minutes ago, stawns said: I think he has dropped with the media, I'm betting most teams understand the mono factor and still have him pencilled into the top 5-7. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he is taken before #5 or if JB takes him at #5. This is a kid who was a challenger for 1st overall in September and who plays in the SHL, against men, I don't see him sliding very far. Gradin will have a good read on him, I'm sure. I want so badly to get another 6-15 pick and take the best D available after selecting a C at 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Honky Cat Posted May 2, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted May 2, 2017 From Grant McCagg from McKeens prospects...."As the season has gone on several things have stood out in regards to Swedish defence prospect Timothy Liljegren. There is no question that he is a natural, smooth skater, and that first and foremost is why scouts were so high on him going into the season. He also has good puck skills, and is able to dangle at the U18 level and without question he is one of the more skilled players in this draft. What is disconcerting to me and many in the scouting community is his vision, sense, shot and decision-making, and they really lead me to wonder just how much offensive upside he will bring at the NHL level. I have a hard time envisioning him ever being a double digits goal scorer as he simply does not have the shot or instinct to find the open lanes to shoot at the opportune time. He takes wrist shots the majority of the time…I’m not sure how effective his slapshot is as it’s rarely utilized…and his shot lacks heavy velocity with rare exceptions Equally as troubling are his passing skills in the offensive zone in particular…his overwhelming tendency is to shoot…the quicker the better. He rarely finds the best shooting location however…especially on the powerplay. If one wonders why Swedish U-18 coaches have stopped using him on the first powerplay in the past two tournaments…you have your answer, because he’s not creating offence with either his shot or his passes. Yesterday in one 40-second sequence versus Belarus Liljegren attempted six shots on goal, four which were blocked and two that were at least a foot wide. He has been one of the most frequent shooters in the tournament so far with 16 SOG, but that’s because he is ALWAYS looking to shoot even though his shot is often far from dangerous. I have no doubt that he leads all players in attempted shots in this tournament, almost all of them wrist shots from the blueline. Another concern is when he has the puck in the defensive zone he invariably does one of two things..tries to carry it out of the zone or tries to make a two-line stretch pass. It is exceedingly rare to see Liljegren attempt a ten- or 20-foot pass or a dish laterally to his defence partner…and if you think he might ever consider reversing the puck or passing it backwards, you can forget it…his passes are going forward…and so are his rushes. One wonders if he needs to pull an Al Arbor and play with spectacles on….or at the very least convex mirrors on his faceshield, as it sure seems like he lacks peripheral vision. He’s a half decent one-one-one defender thanks to a quick stick and excellent mobility..but when the puck starts getting passed around in his defensive zone he can get out of position and leave opponents open…once again because of his lack of vision and hockey sense. He is not being used by the Swedes on the penalty kill…and for a player who many still project to go in the top ten..if he’s not good/smart enough to play on the first PP or PK against fellow 16, 17 and 18-year-olds, what makes one think he’ll be able to do it at the NHL level? It’s no easy task teaching smarts and vision…they are pretty innate. He’s not a big defender, so you aren’t looking at a player who is going to be a defensive bruiser that clears the front of the net and intimidates opponents. He competes okay, and he should become a reasonable defender one day if he can figure out how to read plays, cover the right opponent, and see the whole ice surface. A whole lot of maybes. So it begs the question…just what will he be at the NHL level? If he doesn’t have the sense/vision//creativity/shot to be a ten-goal scorer or 45-point defenceman, and has enough question marks and lack of size to be a stalwart defender…you likely have a mobile puckhandler who at best might be a number three or four defenceman. That’s not top-ten material, and if you are worried about the mistakes, questionable passing and turnovers…may well not be enough to be a top-15 or even top-20 selection. Liljegren still has a few games to make me change my mind in his upside, but he is quickly running out of time. I’d like nothing more than there to be another candidate for my final top-ten rankings…but after 20 or so disappointing viewings since the summer I’m not holding my breath." 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 6 minutes ago, J.R. said: I want so badly to get another 6-15 pick and take the best D available after selecting a C at 5. Agreed, though at this point, I'm kind of Glass or Liljegren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 (edited) 4 minutes ago, stawns said: Agreed, though at this point, I'm kind of Glass or Liljegren I want Lilj (or Makar, or...) too but I think Heiskanen is the better D and likely goes 1st. Possibly top 5. Glass at 5 and Tanev to ARZ for their 1st for Lilj? Edited May 2, 2017 by J.R. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 1 minute ago, J.R. said: I want Lilj Or Makar, or...) too but I think Heiskanen is the better D and likely goes 1st. Possibly top 5. Glass at 5 and Tanev to ARZ for their 1st for Lilj? Could you imagine? I don't see anyway Arizona trades away their first though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 Just now, stawns said: Could you imagine? I don't see anyway Arizona trades away their first though They do need to start making hay on their rebuild. They're getting in to risky 'never-ending rebuild' territory ans wasting the best years of a guy like OEL if they don't actually start producing soon. Tanev could help solidify that back end as they bring in all those shiny forwards for the next ~5 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 1 minute ago, J.R. said: They do need to start making hay on their rebuild. They're getting in to risky 'never-ending rebuild' territory ans wasting the best years of a guy like OEL if they don't actually start producing soon. Tanev could help solidify that back end as they bring in all those shiny forwards for the next ~5 years. no argument here.......two top 7 picks........they'd have to reserve a spot beside the Quinn statue for JB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReggieBush Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 12 minutes ago, J.R. said: They do need to start making hay on their rebuild. They're getting in to risky 'never-ending rebuild' territory ans wasting the best years of a guy like OEL if they don't actually start producing soon. Tanev could help solidify that back end as they bring in all those shiny forwards for the next ~5 years. 10 minutes ago, stawns said: no argument here.......two top 7 picks........they'd have to reserve a spot beside the Quinn statue for JB I love Tanev, however, I would do this deal in a heartbeat if Makar is available. He and Juolevi would be a dynamite first pair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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