"Locked on Kings" discuss Canucks

[Warhippy]

18 hours ago, mll said:

 

Getzalf was so slow and was even given games off to rest.  Deslauriers brought intimidation but otherwise he was not worth regular shifts in Minnesota.  Rakell and Lindholm were not playing all that well.  Klingberg is going to be motivated and he was still one of the best transition players in the league.   Strome and Vatrano know that Anaheim is in a rebuild.  More speed should help their young players take a step.  Anaheim started really hot and then fell off - I see them better than what they showed at the end of the season.

 

Calgary seems better structured vs an overloaded top-line last season and their D-corps is better.  Backlund will likely drop to C3.  They should be stronger in moving the puck with Weegar over Gudbranson.  

 

Doughty and Edler both missed over 40 games.  It's their young Ds that held the fort.  Quick is in his last year.  Kopitar and Arvidsson only have 2 years left.  LAK has one of the better structures for a rebuilding team.  A strong pipeline and vets that can teach them the ropes/shelter them without being tied to those vets long term other than Doughty.

 

SJS is stuck but could be more taxing to play.  Grier added grit - says they were too soft.  NYR was a defensive mess under Quinn.

 

Vegas is the unknown without Lehner.   Still feels like the division has improved overall unlike the Central.  

 

As of January 1st the western conference standings looked like this.

 

I am unsure why people say that the Ducks got so much worse when in fact they got deeper and lost a few disposable pieces the most notable of which being Getzlaf, who; as stated was slow and prone to taking very bad penalties

 

It was not until mid February due to injuries and covid related exposures that the Ducks really started falling out of the standings.  As of Feb 1st the Ducks were in fact 2nd in the division with 55 points or 6th in the west.  It was the end of February with injuries piling up that the Ducks made the motion to start trading those essential pieces after Getzlaf announced he was done at seasons end.

 

With LA getting deeper and adding Fiala.  With the Flames moving sideways.  The Oilers still being the Oilers with arguably a better goaltender (that they'll burn out) and the knowledge that the Ducks in fact added depth speed and more youth; I fail to see how and why people continue to repeat that the ducks will somehow be a bottom feeder in the divisions.

 

I'd in fact argue that the Canucks/Knights and ducks will be part of a 4 way run for the 8th and final playoff spot 

 

I entirely agree with your assessment as it stands.

 

 

 

 

[King Heffy]

On 8/23/2022 at 8:40 AM, 70seven said:

I know our D corpse is thin, but it’s not light years away from EDM, and we have better goaltending.

 

Our D is light years away from Edmonton, who have zero actual NHLers over Nurse.  We have RHD who will be healthy scratches who are better than any of the pylons the Oilers can throw out there.  Hughes, OEL, and Myers are all better than Nurse and don't have the character issues of that gutless coward.  Nurse would make our 3rd pairing, but the rest of the Edmonton blueline. would struggle to get icetime in Abbotsford.

 

Edmonton's D this year is in the running for the worst all-time in the history of the league.

Edited August 26, 2022 by King Heffy

[Warhippy]

14 hours ago, King Heffy said:

Our D is light years away from Edmonton, who have zero actual NHLers over Nurse.  We have RHD who will be healthy scratches who are better than any of the pylons the Oilers can throw out there.  Hughes, OEL, and Myers are all better than Nurse and don't have the character issues of that gutless coward.  Nurse would make our 3rd pairing, but the rest of the Edmonton blueline. would struggle to get icetime in Abbotsford.

 

Edmonton's D this year is in the running for the worst all-time in the history of the league.

If Broberg and Bouchard take even half a step forward they're gonna be absolute beasts on the blue line.  They may not have Hughes but they're balanced enough.

 

Calling them as one of the worst in league history is just laughable.  

 

we had 2 defensemen over the 20 point mark.  They had 5.

 

Defensively they outplayed our defense in regards to metrics like +/- and break outs or even strength goals scored against.

 

Your hate constantly makes you make these weird statements man, but aside from Hughes, Schenn and maybe OEL their defense is light years ahead of us in terms of scoring and defensive game 

Edited August 26, 2022 by Warhippy

[Nucker 67]

6 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

If Broberg and Bouchard take even half a step forward they're gonna be absolute beasts on the blue line.  They may not have Hughes but they're balanced enough.

 

Calling them as one of the worst in league history is just laughable.  

 

we had 2 defensemen over the 20 point mark.  They had 5.

 

Defensively they outplayed our defense in regards to metrics like +/- and break outs or even strength goals scored against.

 

Your hate constantly makes you make these weird statements man, but aside from Hughes, Schenn and maybe OEL their defense is light years ahead of us in terms of scoring and defensive game 

I'd love to have Bouchard on the Canucks. A 6'3" RD who's only 22. He amassed 43 points last year and would've been 2nd in D scoring if he played for the Nucks.

 

I think the trash talk about him is based on jealousy. The Canucks don't have a RDman like this, and need one badly.

[DSVII]

14 hours ago, King Heffy said:

Our D is light years away from Edmonton, who have zero actual NHLers over Nurse.  We have RHD who will be healthy scratches who are better than any of the pylons the Oilers can throw out there.  Hughes, OEL, and Myers are all better than Nurse and don't have the character issues of that gutless coward.  Nurse would make our 3rd pairing, but the rest of the Edmonton blueline. would struggle to get icetime in Abbotsford.

 

Edmonton's D this year is in the running for the worst all-time in the history of the league.

our RHD (plus the healthy scratches)

 

Myers

Schenn

Noah Juulsen

Jet Woo / Philip Johansson 

 

Their RHD

 

Barrie

Codi Ceci

Evan Bouchard

 

 

Wouldn't exactly call that lightyears apart. Plus they've been much better at generating offense at the blueline than we were. 

 

Hating the Oilers is a privilege every Canucks fan should rightfully enjoy, but evaluating rosters as hockey fans we need to be grounded in some sort of reality here. Edmonton had one of the more effective bluelines last year at generating offense, much better than us. Sure we were better defensively but the gap isn't light years.

 

Edited August 26, 2022 by DSVII

[King Heffy]

1 minute ago, DSVII said:

our RHD (plus the healthy scratches)

 

Myers

Schenn

Noah Juulsen

Jet Woo / Philip Johansson 

 

Their RHD

 

Barrie

Codi Ceci

Evan Bouchard

 

 

Wouldn't exactly call that lightyears apart. Plus they've been much better at generating offense at the blueline than we were. 

 

Hating the Oilers is a privilege every Canucks fan should rightfully enjoy, but evaluating rosters as hockey fans we need to be grounded in some sort of reality here. Edmonton had one of the more effective bluelines last year at generating offense, much better than us. Sure we were better defensively but the gap isn't light years.

 

Not a single one of their right D are capable of playing even remotely acceptable D.    Woo is a better player than any of their AHL trash.  I don't care how many points they put up, their defence is simply not good enough for the NHL.

[King Heffy]

8 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

I'd love to have Bouchard on the Canucks. A 6'3" RD who's only 22. He amassed 43 points last year and would've been 2nd in D scoring if he played for the Nucks.

 

I think the trash talk about him is based on jealousy. The Canucks don't have a RDman like this, and need one badly.

Bouchard is soft, slow, stupid, and selfish.  He disgraced his country with his atrocious play in his own zone at the WJHC and he hasn't gotten any better since.  A defenceman who can't play defence simply is not welcome here.

[Warhippy]

15 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

Bouchard is soft, slow, stupid, and selfish.  He disgraced his country with his atrocious play in his own zone at the WJHC and he hasn't gotten any better since.  A defenceman who can't play defence simply is not welcome here.

Right?  Just like a goal scorer who can't score goals is a disgrace and the team that picked him should be relegated and ohhh....

 

 

[King Heffy]

4 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

Right?  Just like a goal scorer who can't score goals is a disgrace and the team that picked him should be relegated and ohhh....

 

 

He'd proven himself to be able to score.  There is nothing to suggest that Bouchard is capable of playing defence or even wants to learn.

[Warhippy]

27 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

Not a single one of their right D are capable of playing even remotely acceptable D.    Woo is a better player than any of their AHL trash.  I don't care how many points they put up, their defence is simply not good enough for the NHL.

Hmmmm

 

See, here's the thing.

 

If the Oilers defence is so bad, but by every metric our defence was essentially worse (barring Hughes) then.....what are you saying?

 

 

[Warhippy]

13 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

He'd proven himself to be able to score.  There is nothing to suggest that Bouchard is capable of playing defence or even wants to learn.

So all of a sudden the world juniors doesn't matter?

 

Evan Bouchard in his first full year has been a better RHD than all but 2 RHD in Canucks history.  You can pick any single RHD having a career year in Canucks history and Bouchard is better than all but 2 of them and he was 21 when he did it.

 

Keeping in mind, he has only played one full year.

 

You keep making these ridiculous statements, and they're never anywhere near grounded in reality.  You make Alf look credible in these moments.

 

Just for fun, here's some players first few years in the league.  I'd say they started poorly but (aside from one so far) turned out quite well.  By your metric, you'd have kicked them to the curb though because "they can't play defense" 

 

I'd say they all (but one so far) turned out pretty well.  Can you guess who they all are?  Keep in mind Bouchard had a statistically better first year than all of these players.  

 

 

Edited August 26, 2022 by Warhippy

[Warhippy]

36 minutes ago, DSVII said:

our RHD (plus the healthy scratches)

 

Myers

Schenn

Noah Juulsen

Jet Woo / Philip Johansson 

 

Their RHD

 

Barrie

Codi Ceci

Evan Bouchard

 

 

Wouldn't exactly call that lightyears apart. Plus they've been much better at generating offense at the blueline than we were. 

 

Hating the Oilers is a privilege every Canucks fan should rightfully enjoy, but evaluating rosters as hockey fans we need to be grounded in some sort of reality here. Edmonton had one of the more effective bluelines last year at generating offense, much better than us. Sure we were better defensively but the gap isn't light years.

 

When you look at Barrie and Ceci and wish your RHD had that kind of skill we're in trouble lol

[King Heffy]

3 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

So all of a sudden the world juniors doesn't matter?

 

Evan Bouchard in his first full year has been a better RHD than all but 2 RHD in Canucks history.  You can pick any single RHD having a career year in Canucks history and Bouchard is better than all but 2 of them and he was 21 when he did it.

 

You keep making these ridiculous statements, and they're never anywhere near grounded in reality.  You make Alf look credible in these moments.

So you consider playing like complete trash in one's own zone to be acceptable?  Bouchard may be putting up points, but he's complete liability out there.  At least Lekkerimaki earned his spot on the team; Bouchard was floating all through camp and then chose to not even attempt to play any defence.  Let's see how our blueline does with a full year without Baumgartner before declaring it to be comparable to Edmonton's dumpster fire.

 

Bouchard makes Pouliot look like a shutdown guy in comparison.  There's no excuse for letting a guy that bad in his own zone play a single shift at the NHL level.

 

[Warhippy]

8 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

So you consider playing like complete trash in one's own zone to be acceptable?  Bouchard may be putting up points, but he's complete liability out there.  At least Lekkerimaki earned his spot on the team; Bouchard was floating all through camp and then chose to not even attempt to play any defence.  Let's see how our blueline does with a full year without Baumgartner before declaring it to be comparable to Edmonton's dumpster fire.

 

Bouchard makes Pouliot look like a shutdown guy in comparison.  There's no excuse for letting a guy that bad in his own zone play a single shift at the NHL level.

 

I see.  So again, we're moving the goal posts to suit our arguments.  

 

In the 2018/2019 WJC for Canada Bouchard entered the team having a season in Jr's where he net 87 points, was a very solid player defensively and still managed to put up 3 points in 5 games on a very very sub par team Canada.

 

Meanwhile our Canucks drafted Tournament stalwarts Schroeder, Hodgson, Rodin, Kron, Vaic and Skriko.  They all had great tournaments and....

 

Your hate for the kid is insane.  But since you didn't get my add on via edit to the post you responded to; I will post it again.  

 

Just for fun, here's some players first few years in the league.  I'd say they started poorly but (aside from one so far) turned out quite well.  By your metric, you'd have kicked them to the curb though because "they can't play defense" 

 

I'd say they all (but one so far) turned out pretty well.  Can you guess who they all are?  Keep in mind Bouchard had a statistically better first year than all of these players.  But you still claim he's utter trash and doesn't belong in the league

 

 

Edited August 26, 2022 by Warhippy

[DSVII]

1 hour ago, King Heffy said:

Not a single one of their right D are capable of playing even remotely acceptable D.    Woo is a better player than any of their AHL trash.  I don't care how many points they put up, their defence is simply not good enough for the NHL.

The NHL coaches clearly disagree with you, even our AHL coach is playing Woo as a forward. I want him to succeed too but it's not trending in the right direction.

 

The points they put up was enough to get them to the conference finals with Mike Freaking Smith in net. It absolutely is good enough to play in the NHL and in fact underlines how massively our own D is underperforming when we have OEL, Hughes, Rathbone in our D core but ranked 18th in goals scored from the blue line 5v5 compared to Edmonton in the top 10.

 

 

Edited August 26, 2022 by DSVII

[Warhippy]

2 minutes ago, DSVII said:

The NHL coaches clearly disagree with you, even our AHL coach is playing Woo as a forward. I want him to succeed too but it's not trending in the right direction.

 

The points they put up was enough to get them to the conference finals with Mike Freaking Smith in net. It absolutely is good enough to play in the NHL and in fact underlines how massively our own D is underperforming when we have OEL, Hughes, Rathbone in our D core but ranked 18th in goals scored from the blue line 5v5 compared to Edmonton in the top 10.

 

 

I say again, it's a damning thing when you look at a blueline with an RHD consisting of Barrie and Ceci and think I'd like some of that

[4petesake]

14 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

I see.  So again, we're moving the goal posts to suit our arguments.  

 

In the 2018/2019 WJC for Canada Bouchard entered the team having a season in Jr's where he net 87 points, was a very solid player defensively and still managed to put up 3 points in 5 games on a very very sub par team Canada.

 

Your hate for the kid is insane.  But since you didn't get my add on via edit to the post you responded to; I will post it again.  

 

Just for fun, here's some players first few years in the league.  I'd say they started poorly but (aside from one so far) turned out quite well.  By your metric, you'd have kicked them to the curb though because "they can't play defense" 

 

I'd say they all (but one so far) turned out pretty well.  Can you guess who they all are?  Keep in mind Bouchard had a statistically better first year than all of these players.  But you still claim he's utter trash and doesn't belong in the league

 

 

Fair point but Brent Burns and Shea Weber were the only two that played on good teams in their first few years. Hedman, Chara and Dahlin stats reflect the p!$$ poor teams they played for. 
 

Bouchard might not be as bad as Heff makes out but he definitely ain’t no Burns or Weber.

[King Heffy]

7 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

I see.  So again, we're moving the goal posts to suit our arguments.  

 

In the 2018/2019 WJC for Canada Bouchard entered the team having a season in Jr's where he net 87 points, was a very solid player defensively and still managed to put up 3 points in 5 games on a very very sub par team Canada.

 

Meanwhile our Canucks drafted Tournament stalwarts Schroeder, Hodgson, Rodin, Kron, Vaic and Skriko.  They all had great tournaments and....

 

Your hate for the kid is insane.  But since you didn't get my add on via edit to the post you responded to; I will post it again.  

 

Just for fun, here's some players first few years in the league.  I'd say they started poorly but (aside from one so far) turned out quite well.  By your metric, you'd have kicked them to the curb though because "they can't play defense" 

 

I'd say they all (but one so far) turned out pretty well.  Can you guess who they all are?  Keep in mind Bouchard had a statistically better first year than all of these players.  But you still claim he's utter trash and doesn't belong in the league

 

 

I've seen Bouchard play at every level throughout his career.  He played on a stacked Knights team and was a defensive liability there, and he hasn't gotten better since.  The  eye test is by far the best means to evaluate defencemen, and Bouchard has been worse than useless.  Points are not an appropriate metric to use as an excuse for a defenceman who has demonstrated a complete inability to play any defence.  I'm very grateful that we will get to play against the pylon frequently going forward.

[Warhippy]

5 minutes ago, 4petesake said:

Fair point but Brent Burns and Shea Weber were the only two that played on good teams in their first few years. Hedman, Chara and Dahlin stats reflect the p!$$ poor teams they played for. 
 

Bouchard might not be as bad as Heff makes out but he definitely ain’t no Burns or Weber.

In their first years, Burns and Weber were not Burns and Weber.  

 

Bouchard has had statistically better years then either of them (keeping in mind Burns was in fact a forward first in the league before transitioning to D)

 

[Warhippy]

5 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

I've seen Bouchard play at every level throughout his career.  He played on a stacked Knights team and was a defensive liability there, and he hasn't gotten better since.  The  eye test is by far the best means to evaluate defencemen, and Bouchard has been worse than useless.  Points are not an appropriate metric to use as an excuse for a defenceman who has demonstrated a complete inability to play any defence.  I'm very grateful that we will get to play against the pylon frequently going forward.

We're not speaking of points.  You're changing the argument and moving the goal posts.

 

Stat for stat, by any metric period Bouchard in his first year has been better than all but 2 of our RHD in team history at any point in time in their careers.  Bouchard would immediately become our 2nd best defenseman behind Hughes.  

 

You make these statements and that's fine, I also recall your statements about harming McDavid as well during the playoffs this past year.  It's your thing, none of it is grounded in any sort of reality other than what you create.