[Proposal] Canucks-Islanders

[Ruthervin]

I made a thread on the main board that was more theoretical in nature (ie why the Canucks should strongly consider moving Pettersson instead of Horvat, but I’ll make a more direct trade proposal here:

 

To Canucks:  Dobson and Pageau

 

To Islanders:  Pettersson and Schenn

 

Kuzmenko-Miller-Mikheyev

Hoglander-Horvat-Boeser

Pearson-Pageau-Garland 

Joshua-Aman-Lazar

 

Hughes-Dobson

OEL-Bear

Stillman-Myers (or Burroughs)

 

Demko

Martin

 

Eventually, in the future,

 

1) The Canucks move one of Boeser or Garland for cap space

2) We re-up both Horvat and Kuzmenko

3) We either let Myers walk to free agency or use a sweetener to get rid of him in the summer.

4) Podkolzin takes Garland’s or Podkolzin’s spot on the roster.

Other notes:

 

1) Pageau becomes our top PK center and takes on the tough defensive match ups to which Miller and Horvat take on more offensive deployments.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Nucker 67]

I think the Canucks could do better?  Besides, it's out there that Pettersson is the only untouchable. 

 

 

[Ruthervin]

7 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

I think the Canucks could do better?  Besides, it's out there that Pettersson is the only untouchable. 

 

 

Would love it if that was the case.  If you don’t mind me asking, who would you have in mind?  I can’t see someone like Moritz Seider nor Miro Heiskanen being available.  
 

Trust me - I would absolutely prefer to see Horvat or Miller get moved for a young elite RD as it’s center piece if it was possible but I can’t see it happening.  Nucks already tried that with Miller this past Summer.

 

Horvat might get you a sniff of Dante Fabbro’s underpants, but a guy like Fabbro (or someone of his calibre) wouldn’t truly address our biggest need……our biggest need being an elite two way RD that can help elevate Hughes to the top pairing and be a legitimate elite top pairing in the league.

 

You’re right that Alvin has stated that Petey is untouchable but he’s literally our only bargaining chip that would enable us to fix our deep structural flaw as a team.

Edited December 19, 2022 by Ruthervin

[-Vintage Canuck-]

 

Note: Tags are mandatory only in the Trades, Rumours, Signings forum and in the Proposals and Armchair GM'ing forum.

[Ruthervin]

Just now, -Vintage Canuck- said:

 

Note: Tags are mandatory only in the Trades, Rumours, Signings forum and in the Proposals and Armchair GM'ing forum.

My sincere apologies.  Will remember next time.

[Ruthervin]

Imagine if we had drafted McAvoy instead of Juolevi eh?  :facepalm:

[Alflives]

Just now, Ruthervin said:

Imagine if we had drafted McAvoy instead of Juolevi eh?  :facepalm:

Tkatchuk was the obvious choice in that spot.  As was Nylander instead of Jake.  Benning harped on drafting character.  And both Jake and OJ lacked the strength of character needed to do what it took off the ice to be at their best on the ice.  

[Ruthervin]

2 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Tkatchuk was the obvious choice in that spot.  As was Nylander instead of Jake.  Benning harped on drafting character.  And both Jake and OJ lacked the strength of character needed to do what it took off the ice to be at their best on the ice.  

Yep you nailed it.  To add insult to injury, we actually made a very good pick with our next Anaheim pick (McCann) and then ended up shipping him out for that useless turd Gudbranson!  
 

ps - I probably shouldn’t admit this but I preferred Pierre Luc Dubois to Tkachuk.  I would have picked PLD had he been there at #5.  I also preferred Heiskanen to Makar a year later (felt MH was the next Lidstrom while I saw Makar being a better version of Barrie but still flawed).

Edited December 20, 2022 by Ruthervin

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, Ruthervin said:

Yep you nailed it.  To add insult to injury, we actually made a very good pick with our next Anaheim pick (McCann) and then ended up shipping him out for that useless turd Gudbranson!  
 

ps - I probably shouldn’t admit this but I preferred Pierre Luc Dubois to Tkachuk.  I would have picked PLD had he been there at #5.  I also preferred Heiskanen to Makar a year later (felt MH was the next Lidstrom while I saw Makar being a better version of Barrie but still flawed).

It’s crazy how many picks and prospects we traded for more established NHL players in let’s hope to “win now” moves.  

[nuckin_futz]

You lost me at sniffing Fabbro's underpants.

[Phil_314]

Presuming that the other later moves are achievable (re: moving Boeser/ Garland/ Myers), I'd support this move.  As much as Petey is our MVP and only untouchable, young, cost controlled RHD are hard to come by.  I could see the Islanders needing to add a bit since I'm not sure Pageau is better than Schenn to make this trade's value even (probably besides the UFA status as the only consideration) but really this is a pretty even move.  We get the help needed at RHD and defensively, and Petey could definitely snipe for them (Islanders aren't scoring all that much), either on Barzal's wing or centering his own line (and Schenn would be a replacement of sorts at RHD).

Edited December 20, 2022 by Phil_314

[higgyfan]

1 hour ago, Ruthervin said:

Trust me - I would absolutely prefer to see Horvat or Miller get moved for a young elite RD as it’s center piece if it was possible but I can’t see it happening.  Nucks already tried that with Miller this past Summer.

Can you get a link about that?  Every thing I've read indicates that they wanted to sign JT all along -never really

shopped him.

 

1 hour ago, Ruthervin said:

Horvat might get you a sniff of Dante Fabbro’s underpants, but a guy like Fabbro (or someone of his calibre) wouldn’t truly address our biggest need……our biggest need being an elite two way RD that can help elevate Hughes to the top pairing and be a legitimate elite top pairing in the league.

 

Horvat for Fabbro?  Really?  Bo is the calibre player in that pair; not even close.

 

I think they sniffed around Bear instead and it smelt much better

[eeeeergh]

15 minutes ago, higgyfan said:

Can you get a link about that?  Every thing I've read indicates that they wanted to sign JT all along -never really

shopped him.

 

Horvat for Fabbro?  Really?  Bo is the calibre player in that pair; not even close.

 

I think they sniffed around Bear instead and it smelt much better

[Nucker 67]

3 hours ago, Ruthervin said:

Would love it if that was the case.  If you don’t mind me asking, who would you have in mind?  I can’t see someone like Moritz Seider nor Miro Heiskanen being available.  
 

Trust me - I would absolutely prefer to see Horvat or Miller get moved for a young elite RD as it’s center piece if it was possible but I can’t see it happening.  Nucks already tried that with Miller this past Summer.

 

Horvat might get you a sniff of Dante Fabbro’s underpants, but a guy like Fabbro (or someone of his calibre) wouldn’t truly address our biggest need……our biggest need being an elite two way RD that can help elevate Hughes to the top pairing and be a legitimate elite top pairing in the league.

 

You’re right that Alvin has stated that Petey is untouchable but he’s literally our only bargaining chip that would enable us to fix our deep structural flaw as a team.

It would be great to get Dobson, but it might suck more to lose Petey.  I don;t know who else they could target. Sergachev?

 

Just for fun - If they reeeeeeaaallly want him: (the money sort of works)

 

to NJ - (LD) Hughes and (LW) Pearson (50% for 1.5 years)

to VAN - (RD) Nemec, (LD) Graves, (RW/LW) Bratt, 2nd (2023)  

 

Kuzmenko - Pettersson - Bratt

Hoglander - Miller - Mikheyev

 

OEL - Schenn

Graves - Bear

Stillman/Dermott - Myers (could still be upgraded)

 

One day:  Pettersson2 - Nemec ?

 

Edited December 20, 2022 by NUCKER67

[Ruthervin]

1 hour ago, higgyfan said:

Can you get a link about that?  Every thing I've read indicates that they wanted to sign JT all along -never really

shopped him.

 

Horvat for Fabbro?  Really?  Bo is the calibre player in that pair; not even close.

 

I think they sniffed around Bear instead and it smelt much better

I think initially, the Canuck wanted to sign Miller from the get go but then realized that they were very far apart on term and money.  At the draft, there were numerous rumors about the Canucks and Islanders but then Lou Lamorello backed out of the deal due to leaks (I believe LL was offering 13th OA and another player).  When LL was asked about the deal by the media, he said something like “ask Vancouver.”

 

Upon realizing that the Canucks were even further apart with Horvat, they signed Miller.  
 

As far as Bo goes, I agree with you that he’s worth more than Fabbro, but my ultimate point is that Horvat won’t fetch you an elite young top pairing two way RS defenseman (which is our biggest need).  The only guy that will get you said piece is Pettersson unfortunately.  
 

Guys like Fabbro, Severson, Carlo, Zub, etc., would be decent adds, but they aren’t top pairing elite defensemen. Putting Hughes or OEL with any of those RD’s would still make for a relatively weak top pairing.

 

Hughes isn’t a #1 dman unfortunately. He’s the type of guy that can make a good top pairing great IF he’s paired with the right guy, but Hughes by himself cannot carry a top pairing (in the manner that guys like Chara and Keith could at their peaks).  

Edited December 20, 2022 by Ruthervin

[Ruthervin]

2 hours ago, nuckin_futz said:

You lost me at sniffing Fabbro's underpants.

one man's trash is another man's treasure.  

Edited December 20, 2022 by Ruthervin

[Monteeun]

5 hours ago, Alflives said:

Tkatchuk was the obvious choice in that spot.  As was Nylander instead of Jake.  Benning harped on drafting character.  And both Jake and OJ lacked the strength of character needed to do what it took off the ice to be at their best on the ice.  

Oj was a fine pick at the time. Not exciting but safe. Jake....yea.... :(

[higgyfan]

22 hours ago, Ruthervin said:

I think initially, the Canuck wanted to sign Miller from the get go but then realized that they were very far apart on term and money.  At the draft, there were numerous rumors about the Canucks and Islanders but then Lou Lamorello backed out of the deal due to leaks (I believe LL was offering 13th OA and another player).  When LL was asked about the deal by the media, he said something like “ask Vancouver.”

There's no evidence to support that it was Miller the Islanders wanted or one of the other players, nor do

we know what was offered.

 

22 hours ago, Ruthervin said:

Upon realizing that the Canucks were even further apart with Horvat, they signed Miller. 

 

They were only far apart with Horvat because they used the 'tactic' to undervalue him by offering

him RNH $.  I guess Bo proved them wrong.  Regardless, a lot of the pundits believe that it was

always going to be JT signed.

 

22 hours ago, Ruthervin said:

As far as Bo goes, I agree with you that he’s worth more than Fabbro, but my ultimate point is that Horvat won’t fetch you an elite young top pairing two way RS defenseman (which is our biggest need).  The only guy that will get you said piece is Pettersson unfortunately.  
 

Guys like Fabbro, Severson, Carlo, Zub, etc., would be decent adds, but they aren’t top pairing elite defensemen. Putting Hughes or OEL with any of those RD’s would still make for a relatively weak top pairing.

Fabbro isn't in that group; Nashville has openly tried to trade him.  I agree that Bo doesn't get an elite young RD,

but he probably could fetch an older dman that is a tweener 1-2 pairing.  Teams have done this before, by making

sure their 2-3rd pairings are very good in their roles. Ideally, they will acquire a high pick in the draft and they

select a really significant RD prospect.  The other guys can hold the fort until the drafted player can make the

team. 

 

22 hours ago, Ruthervin said:

Hughes isn’t a #1 dman unfortunately. He’s the type of guy that can make a good top pairing great IF he’s paired with the right guy, but Hughes by himself cannot carry a top pairing (in the manner that guys like Chara and Keith could at their peaks).  

I don't think that Quinn really needs the typical 1st pairing partner.  He needs a very good defensive partner

with size, speed and very good hockey IQ.  Somewhat like Tanev, but younger and healthier.

 

It's going to take some time to make the necessary changes with this team.  I don't expect to see a lot of trades

before TDL (besides Bo and Schenn), but there will likely be some action in the off season; whether it be

trades, buy out or just letting a player walk.

 

 

[Ruthervin]

18 minutes ago, higgyfan said:

 

 

I don't think that Quinn really needs the typical 1st pairing partner.  He needs a very good defensive partner

with size, speed and very good hockey IQ.  Somewhat like Tanev, but younger and healthier.

 

 

 

 

May I suggest Noah Dobson?  :-p