Elias Pettersson Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 (edited) 44 minutes ago, BigTramFan said: Capfriendly showing $34m cap space in 2024/25 with 11 players signed. There will probably be some major moves prior to 2024/25 like moving out Garland or Boeser. But if no major moves, assuming we added Raty, Hirose, Juulsen to the roster (total $2.4m), then it looks something like this with 14 players signed (8 unsigned players in brackets) and $31.6m in cap space: Kuzmenko - (Pettersson) - Mikheyev Hoglander - Miller - Boeser (Podkolzin) - Raty - Garland (Aman) - (Blueger) - (Joshua) Di Giuseppe Hughes - (1RD) Soucy - (Hronek) Hirose - (3RD) Brisebois - Juulsen Demko - (Silovs) We have $31.6m to sign these guys: Pettersson - $11m Hronek - $7m 1RD - Stop gap UFA? $4m available - maybe one of Cole/Roy/Tanev/DeMelo/Hakanpaa Blueger - $2.5m Podkolzin - $1.5m Aman - $1.5m Joshua - $1.5m Silovs - $1.5m 3RD - maybe Woo/Johansson/McWard? $1m That's about right, but I doubt we are paying Blueger, Aman and Silvos those numbers. Aman and Silvos aren't getting over $1 million, they may both play mostly in the AHL this year. Blueger would be a 4C at this point, so I doubt we give him a raise, we can always find someone for cheaper to play 4C. So I think we would still have $3 million to play with to help the defence. I'm still not convinced we are going to use Soucy in the top 4 on a regular basis. We may go after a guy like Brenden Dillon or even Nikita Zadorov to help on the left side. Also, most people don't want to hear this, but there is always the possibility that Myers comes back on a new 1 year deal to help the 3rd pairing. At $1.5-2 million Myers actually isn't a bad option to have on the 3rd pairing. Let's see what he does this year in a reduced role. Hirose Johansson 3rd pairing just doesn't do it for me, especially if we are trying to be competitive in the playoffs. I'd rather have Myers and his big body on the 3rd pairing in the playoffs then Hirose or Johansson. I'd like to see our defence look like this in 2024-2025 so we got a shot not only to make the playoffs but actually do some damage as well and win a round or two... Hughes Lyubushkin Zadorov Hronek Soucy Myers Now that is a big and nasty defence that Tocchet would love to have going up against Edmonton and Vegas. Lyubushkin and Zadorov are both UFA's next summer. Lyubushkin would be the perfect short term partner for Hughes while Willander is developing and can move down to the 3rd pairing when Willander is ready to play with Hughes. I'd even be willing to give him a 3-4 year deal at $3 million per, he will only be 30 next summer. Zadorov will be 29 and has been able to log almost 19 minutes last year in Calgary and even scored 14 goals last year. We could sign him up to a 4x4 deal. Zadorov would be a great partner for Hronek IMO. And having Zadorov / Lyubushkin as your top pairing killing penalties would be exactly what we need. Those two are both nasty pieces of business on the PK... Edited July 24, 2023 by Elias Pettersson 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastCoastNucks Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 33 minutes ago, BigTramFan said: Capfriendly showing $34m cap space in 2024/25 with 11 players signed. There will probably be some major moves prior to 2024/25 like moving out Garland or Boeser. But if no major moves, assuming we added Raty, Hirose, Juulsen to the roster (total $2.4m), then it looks something like this with 14 players signed (8 unsigned players in brackets) and $31.6m in cap space: Kuzmenko - (Pettersson) - Mikheyev Hoglander - Miller - Boeser (Podkolzin) - Raty - Garland (Aman) - (Blueger) - (Joshua) Di Giuseppe Hughes - (1RD) Soucy - (Hronek) Hirose - (3RD) Brisebois - Juulsen Demko - (Silovs) We have $31.6m to sign these guys: Pettersson - $11m Hronek - $7m 1RD - Stop gap UFA? $4m available - maybe one of Cole/Roy/Tanev/DeMelo/Hakanpaa Blueger - $2.5m Podkolzin - $1.5m Aman - $1.5m Joshua - $1.5m Silovs - $1.5m 3RD - maybe Woo/Johansson/McWard? $1m Problem is we need to start plans for cap space after that too, like Kuz, Hogz, Juulsen, Raty, while at the same time the Cap hit on OEL goes up from 2mil to 4 mil. Sure it looks like we can pay Petey what you want to pay... but we just barely all agreed on JT Miller on 8 mil per year on a 100 point season.... And Jack Hughes just had over 100 points, 2 years younger and signed for 8 x 8. I want to keep Petey as we all do but the deal needs to make sense. We didnt even make the playoffs, and our cap hit for this year is 3rd highest, the Knights even have lower cap than us. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 3 minutes ago, EastCoastNucks said: Problem is we need to start plans for cap space after that too, like Kuz, Hogz, Juulsen, Raty, while at the same time the Cap hit on OEL goes up from 2mil to 4 mil. Sure it looks like we can pay Petey what you want to pay... but we just barely all agreed on JT Miller on 8 mil per year on a 100 point season.... And Jack Hughes just had over 100 points, 2 years younger and signed for 8 x 8. I want to keep Petey as we all do but the deal needs to make sense. We didnt even make the playoffs, and our cap hit for this year is 3rd highest, the Knights even have lower cap than us. Jack Hughes is only on his 2nd contract and took the long-term deal. Petey didn't do that, he took a 3-year bridge and now is looking to sign long term. He's already established himself as a 100-point elite defensive centre. When Hughes signed his contract he only had 56 points. same thing happened with Tage Thompson. He took a long term deal when he got 68 points and now he is almost a 100 point player as well. Timing is everything. There is no way Petey signs less than $11 million on an 8-year deal. Zero chance actually... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastCoastNucks Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 14 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: Jack Hughes is only on his 2nd contract and took the long-term deal. Petey didn't do that, he took a 3-year bridge and now is looking to sign long term. He's already established himself as a 100-point elite defensive centre. When Hughes signed his contract he only had 56 points. same thing happened with Tage Thompson. He took a long term deal when he got 68 points and now he is almost a 100 point player as well. Timing is everything. There is no way Petey signs less than $11 million on an 8-year deal. Zero chance actually... they could work a front loaded contract that pays 12m for the first 4 years (past the worst of the OEL hit) with a cap hit of 8.5 mil over 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ballisticsports. Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 9 hours ago, IBatch said: No that was Bure. Mogilny so far has also done more. He's got the potential. That's different. Let's see how he does. Max? Watch the video AJ put up. So far McDavid has got closest to the max, UFA or otherwise. Aside from Sundin of course (if he signed his deal which even he knew was ridiculous). I've watched every Canuck player since the late 80's and so far Bure and Mogilny are the highest bar. Peca and Kesler were better two way players. Mogilny was no slouch in that regard either. Not all Selke's, Art Ross, Hart and Norris trophies or votes are created equally. EP in the same era ... sorry just don't see it. EP has the potential to pass Bure and Mogilny's, and the Sedins. The latter I think is the most possible. He's got to actually score 60 goals and or rattle off a bunch of 100 plus point seasons to surpass these guys first. Yeah I agree but I am not sure on different era players to different era players are better over each other I think how they dominate over their peers in one era over how a player dominated over his peers in another era is a better stick of reference Like in the McDavid you mention as example, is he better than Gretzky because he is faster with better equipment and training, does he make his teammates better players, does he dominate over his peers more than Gretzky? Man Sports and Players get better evolving and can do more eventually, Gretzky got motivated watching Howe. ,McDavid watching Gretzky? One can make countless comparisons with many arguments, especially inserting one into another era, How much more % were they better than their peers in the same eras I think stands up best? (As they all face the same issues of the same era) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 29 minutes ago, Ballisticsports. said: Yeah I agree but I am not sure on different era players to different era players are better over each other I think how they dominate over their peers in one era over how a player dominated over his peers in another era is a better stick of reference Like in the McDavid you mention as example, is he better than Gretzky because he is faster with better equipment and training, does he make his teammates better players, does he dominate over his peers more than Gretzky? Man Sports and Players get better evolving and can do more eventually, Gretzky got motivated watching Howe. ,McDavid watching Gretzky? One can make countless comparisons with many arguments, especially inserting one into another era, How much more % were they better than their peers in the same eras I think stands up best? (As they all face the same issues of the same era) Gretzky was so dominant that he had the most points in TWO different decades. Yes, TWO. Imagine having more points than anyone else when you are in your second decade of playing hockey, basically in your 30's. Gretzky was the greatest player that ever lived and there will never be another player like him. I'd like to see McDavid dominate the league when he is in his 30's and win a scoring title as well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 1 hour ago, EastCoastNucks said: they could work a front loaded contract that pays 12m for the first 4 years (past the worst of the OEL hit) with a cap hit of 8.5 mil over 8 Why would Petey take a front loaded contract that still pays him only $8.5 million? He'll get close to $12 million regardless even on a full 8 year deal... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastCoastNucks Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 25 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: Why would Petey take a front loaded contract that still pays him only $8.5 million? He'll get close to $12 million regardless even on a full 8 year deal... So he can play on a team that can afford to stock Cup potential team-mates Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 14 minutes ago, EastCoastNucks said: So he can play on a team that can afford to stock Cup potential team-mates No player is taking a $3-4 million per year discount to "help" the team. Also, $11 million is not a problem if the cap is $100 million, which it will be during the time of the 8 year deal. That's only 9% of the cap. Even the Sedins took up more cap space than 9%. In 3-4 years an $11 million cap hit won't mean much if the cap is pushing $100 million. Also, you aren't going to win a Stanley Cup without Petey. He is the most important player on the team and the face of the franchise... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 9 hours ago, Kevin Biestra said: I don't think Pettersson has even really separated himself from Hughes as a talent. Pettersson over Bure and Mogilny is a glaring symptom of recency bias or possibly not having watched the other two in real time. Pettersson could surpass them...anything is possible...but all of his work is yet ahead of him. Ronning was also a pretty remarkable talent...just trapped in the body of a house mouse. I think what he and Bobby Lalonde could have done in the NHL with another six inches and forty pounds would have been incredible. As it was Ronning still wasn't more than a stone's throw from the Hall of Fame. Pavel Bure is currently the greatest player in Vancouver Canucks history. In the next 10 years, we will not be saying that anymore. In 10 years, Elias Pettersson will be the greatest player in Vancouver Canucks history, and he will be the one to lead us to the Stanley Cup victory too... BOOK IT... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N4ZZY Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 Please, Please, Please, Elias sign this contract before the start of the season. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N4ZZY Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 Just now, Elias Pettersson said: Pavel Bure is currently the greatest player in Vancouver Canucks history. In the next 10 years, we will not be saying that anymore. In 10 years, Elias Pettersson will be the greatest player in Vancouver Canucks history, and he will be the one to lead us to the Stanley Cup victory too... BOOK IT... Only if he resigns here. LOL Assuming he does, then yes, I agree. If he’s not, Bure will still be the greatest player in Canucks history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTramFan Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 2 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said: Hughes Lyubushkin Zadorov Hronek Soucy Myers Now that is a big and nasty defence that Tocchet would love to have going up against Edmonton and Vegas. Lyubushkin and Zadorov are both UFA's next summer. Lyubushkin would be the perfect short term partner for Hughes while Willander is developing and can move down to the 3rd pairing when Willander is ready to play with Hughes. I'd even be willing to give him a 3-4 year deal at $3 million per, he will only be 30 next summer. Zadorov will be 29 and has been able to log almost 19 minutes last year in Calgary and even scored 14 goals last year. We could sign him up to a 4x4 deal. Zadorov would be a great partner for Hronek IMO. And having Zadorov / Lyubushkin as your top pairing killing penalties would be exactly what we need. Those two are both nasty pieces of business on the PK... Yeah I didn't really make the post suggesting that would be our best roster for 2024/25. Just showing my working for why resigning Pettersson is affordable. I'm not convinced Lyubushkin can handle the minutes of a 1RD. He has been a 15 min/gp guy his whole career, usually playing 3rd pairing against lesser competition. IMO Soucy is getting paid too much to be a 3rd pairing guy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Korea Bob.Loblaw Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 32 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: No player is taking a $3-4 million per year discount to "help" the team. Also, $11 million is not a problem if the cap is $100 million, which it will be during the time of the 8 year deal. That's only 9% of the cap. Even the Sedins took up more cap space than 9%. In 3-4 years an $11 million cap hit won't mean much if the cap is pushing $100 million. Also, you aren't going to win a Stanley Cup without Petey. He is the most important player on the team and the face of the franchise... Just ignore his opinions. They are so far off the mark he's in his own world 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTramFan Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 2 hours ago, EastCoastNucks said: Problem is we need to start plans for cap space after that too, like Kuz, Hogz, Juulsen, Raty, while at the same time the Cap hit on OEL goes up from 2mil to 4 mil. Sure it looks like we can pay Petey what you want to pay... but we just barely all agreed on JT Miller on 8 mil per year on a 100 point season.... And Jack Hughes just had over 100 points, 2 years younger and signed for 8 x 8. I want to keep Petey as we all do but the deal needs to make sense. We didnt even make the playoffs, and our cap hit for this year is 3rd highest, the Knights even have lower cap than us. In 2025/26 the cap limit goes up by $4.5m. Also Boeser's $6.65m comes off the books. Gives us another $11m to utilise. No doubt we will be relying on our prospects to take a step up. And EP will have already resigned. I think a contract up to $11m x 8 for Pettersson is workable and fair for both sides. We are not going to find a better player than Petey. Most teams are going to be at or near the cap limit for 2023/24. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 17 minutes ago, BigTramFan said: Yeah I didn't really make the post suggesting that would be our best roster for 2024/25. Just showing my working for why resigning Pettersson is affordable. I'm not convinced Lyubushkin can handle the minutes of a 1RD. He has been a 15 min/gp guy his whole career, usually playing 3rd pairing against lesser competition. IMO Soucy is getting paid too much to be a 3rd pairing guy. Luke Schenn is also a 15 minute guy and usually on the 3rd pairing. Playing with Hughes he was able to elevate his game somewhat and increase his minutes. Lyubushkin can do the same. He was up to 18 minutes a night in Arizona. Also, there will be times when Hughes and Hronek are paired together, so that will take minutes away from Lyubushkin. I think we are looking at both Hughes and Hronek getting 25+ minutes a night next season. Tocchet will ride the horses. I agree, Soucy is getting paid too much to be on the 3rd pairing. However, I can't see us going with a Hirose/Johansson 3rd pairing after next season. Doesn't seem like the kind of 3rd pairing Tocchet and Foote would be interested in... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastCoastNucks Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 24 minutes ago, BigTramFan said: In 2025/26 the cap limit goes up by $4.5m. Also Boeser's $6.65m comes off the books. Gives us another $11m to utilise. No doubt we will be relying on our prospects to take a step up. And EP will have already resigned. I think a contract up to $11m x 8 for Pettersson is workable and fair for both sides. We are not going to find a better player than Petey. Most teams are going to be at or near the cap limit for 2023/24. Said Toronto with Matthews and Edmonton with McDavid.... the problem is you need the Boeser's and the Garland's and you just see them falling off the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTramFan Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 14 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: Luke Schenn is also a 15 minute guy and usually on the 3rd pairing. Playing with Hughes he was able to elevate his game somewhat and increase his minutes. Lyubushkin can do the same. He was up to 18 minutes a night in Arizona. Also, there will be times when Hughes and Hronek are paired together, so that will take minutes away from Lyubushkin. I think we are looking at both Hughes and Hronek getting 25+ minutes a night next season. Tocchet will ride the horses. I agree, Soucy is getting paid too much to be on the 3rd pairing. However, I can't see us going with a Hirose/Johansson 3rd pairing after next season. Doesn't seem like the kind of 3rd pairing Tocchet and Foote would be interested in... Maybe Ilya can elevate his game. But Schenn was an exception rather than the rule. I think Soucy has more chance than Ilya of playing top pairing minutes. I would be happy to trade Beauvillier for Lyubushkin this off season. Let's see in 2023/24 if Ilya has the ability to pair with Hughes. And if not, gives us a decent option to replace Myers if he doesn't want to resign for $1.5 - 2.0m. Hirose will be 25 at the start of the 2024/25 season. Johansson will be 24. They might not be the 3rd pairing together but I hope that they will be ready to play in the NHL by then. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 Alf’s empties are chiming. Petey will sign 8 years at 100 million. All bow to Alf’s empties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTramFan Posted July 24, 2023 Share Posted July 24, 2023 4 minutes ago, EastCoastNucks said: Said Toronto with Matthews and Edmonton with McDavid.... the problem is you need the Boeser's and the Garland's and you just see them falling off the books. You don't have to pay your top players what they are worth. The other option is let someone else pay them, and just don't have any top players. In my opinion we can afford one top player. I don't think we need Boeser when we have Kuzmenko, Mikheyev, Garland, Hoglander, Podkolzin, Klimovich, Lekkerimaki, etc. The situations with TOR and EDM are very different. TOR paid 3 players (Matthews, Marner, Tavares) 11.6 + 10.9 + 11 / 81.5 = 41.1% of the cap. If they just stuck to one high paid guy, they could build a decent team with depth. EDM paid McDavid a contract that was 12.5/79.5 = 15.7% of the cap. If we paid Petey 11m then its only 11/87.5 = 12.5% and he is a one off on our team. The only other players pushing for big money are Miller and Hughes, both signed for decent term. 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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