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Morality vs Pragmatism


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Poll: Morality vs Pragmatism (34 member(s) have cast votes)

Scenario 1

  1. Save the person you love most and let 1,000 people die. (25 votes [73.53%])

    Percentage of vote: 73.53%

  2. Save the 1,000 strangers, and let the person you love most die. (9 votes [26.47%])

    Percentage of vote: 26.47%

Scenario 2

  1. Save the 19,000 in Rogers Arena and let the nuke in Tokyo detonate. (11 votes [32.35%])

    Percentage of vote: 32.35%

  2. Save Tokyo by destroying RA and killing the 19,000 inside. (23 votes [67.65%])

    Percentage of vote: 67.65%

Vote Guests cannot vote

#31 Newsflash

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 10:01 PM

If you could go back in time, would you murder Hitler's mom before he was born?


I would rather kick his dad in the nuts really, really hard.
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Buddy I called this EXACT situtation on here two years ago and was flamed, so I guess I have a bit of hockey knowledge, not to mention the 4 years I played in the OHL idiot.


The conspiracy theories that used to be against Lateralus:
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#32 Bitter Melon

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 10:05 PM

If you could go back in time, would you murder Hitler's mom before he was born?


Nope. Due to the butterfly effect.

Edited by CAPSLOCK, 23 September 2012 - 10:06 PM.

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#33 nucklehead

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 10:21 PM

If I could go back in time I'd murder Messiers mom.
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#34 Dazzle

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 10:25 PM

If I could go back in time I'd murder Messiers mom.


Opinions aside about the guy, this is one very douchey post.
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Posted Image --> THANKS EGATTI.

I have to say Dazzle's was the coolest. ROTFLOL


#35 Bob.Loblaw

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 10:30 PM


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Hockey_Crazy is a god. But I still got dibs on Yuna.

#36 Watermelons

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 10:49 PM

Can you clarify what you mean by "1000 strangers".

1) Will these strangers that could be killed all be in the same area? Or would they be scattered around the world.

2) By stranger, you mean that these will NOT be random people, but COMPLETE strangers. Just wanted to clarify because if it was random people (which is not what you said) then it could easily end up being your own family members, friends, or other loved ones.

3) Will these strangers be in any way related to you? (Eg. Friends friend) Or will their deaths not really have any effects on your life because you don't know them and no one around you will be mourning for these deaths?


Because I find it pointless to save your loved one, if other people you love will end up dying.
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#37 Donky

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 10:49 PM

If you could go back in time, would you murder Hitler's mom before he was born?


I would never go back in time to before my own birth.

Scenario 1 is easy. A thousand strangers die all the time in this world and I don't blink an eye. I will take my children over a billion strangers.

Scenario 2 is easy as well. I blow up Roger's Arena to save millions more in Tokyo. HOWEVER, having said that, if we change the city to one less palatable to myself I take the opportunity to change the world.
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“When facism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross.”-Sinclair Lewis

A human being is a part of a whole, called by us _universe_, a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feelings as something separated from the rest... a kind of optical delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty."-Albert Einstein

#38 Jägermeister

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 11:10 PM

Are the Canucks in Rogers Arena at the time?
Things like this matter.
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#39 Hume

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 11:12 PM

Scenario 1: That really depends. Am I only limited to people for the loved one? I love my one cat a million times more than my other cat, friends and family combined. If it's a choice between him and 1000 people he would win every time. If it was a choice between him and everyone and everything else I love he would still win and it wouldn't even be close. If I really am limited to a person then I would have to seriously consider saving the 1000 instead.

Scenario 2: I would have to take out Roger's Arena to save Tokyo.


you would save your cat instead of a thousand people. jesus christ, that's disturbing.
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i've no idea what i am talking about! you'll go to hell for what your dirty mind is thiiiiiiiiiiiiiinkin'.
(i'm trapped in this body and can't get out.) how come i end up where i started?.
REASONABLE AND SENSIBLE.

#40 Watermelons

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Posted 24 September 2012 - 12:08 AM

you would save your cat instead of a thousand people. jesus christ, that's disturbing.


Although I am not the poster, I disagree with your post.

I say this because as pet owners, we treat our pets as if they were our own kids - who in their right mind wouldn't save their kids if they were in danger? Sure, most people might think that a human life is more important than an animals life, but I find this situation unique.

Thousands of people die everyday and most of us don't even blink an eye. However, it would be a difficult situation to sacrifice someone who has been with you for many years and someone you love very well (in the posters case, it is his cat).

I believe that we should respect the poster's decision to protect his cat. We don't know what they have gone through in life and why the cat is so special to him/her. That being said, I also respect your opinion.

Edited by monkeydluffy, 24 September 2012 - 12:10 AM.

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#41 :D

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Posted 24 September 2012 - 12:16 AM

I'd push the button to kill 1000 strangers it would save my dog. Real talk.
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#42 Bitter Melon

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Posted 24 September 2012 - 12:22 AM

Although I am not the poster, I disagree with your post.

I say this because as pet owners, we treat our pets as if they were our own kids - who in their right mind wouldn't save their kids if they were in danger? Sure, most people might think that a human life is more important than an animals life, but I find this situation unique.

Thousands of people die everyday and most of us don't even blink an eye. However, it would be a difficult situation to sacrifice someone who has been with you for many years and someone you love very well (in the posters case, it is his cat).

I believe that we should respect the poster's decision to protect his cat. We don't know what they have gone through in life and why the cat is so special to him/her. That being said, I also respect your opinion.


I'd push the button to kill 1000 strangers it would save my dog. Real talk.

Exactly. There isn't a creature on Earth who will love you as much as your dog, but I bet most of those people you saved wouldn't even give you the time of day.

Edited by CAPSLOCK, 24 September 2012 - 12:23 AM.

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#43 Donky

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Posted 24 September 2012 - 12:42 AM

I'd push the button to kill 1000 strangers it would save my dog. Real talk.


It would really depend on the strangers and their ages and ethical standards.

Personally I couldn't blow up a high school to save my dog, but I might be inclined to blow up a jail.
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“When facism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross.”-Sinclair Lewis

A human being is a part of a whole, called by us _universe_, a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feelings as something separated from the rest... a kind of optical delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty."-Albert Einstein

#44 NightHawkSniper

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Posted 24 September 2012 - 01:12 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1LH0E_rzb2w


Had a good laugh at this as well.


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#45 Hume

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Posted 24 September 2012 - 01:24 AM

Although I am not the poster, I disagree with your post.

I say this because as pet owners, we treat our pets as if they were our own kids - who in their right mind wouldn't save their kids if they were in danger? Sure, most people might think that a human life is more important than an animals life, but I find this situation unique.

Thousands of people die everyday and most of us don't even blink an eye. However, it would be a difficult situation to sacrifice someone who has been with you for many years and someone you love very well (in the posters case, it is his cat).

I believe that we should respect the poster's decision to protect his cat. We don't know what they have gone through in life and why the cat is so special to him/her. That being said, I also respect your opinion.


how many people do you know that would be devastated if you were killed? for myself probably around a hundred. probably somewhere in that ballpark for most people. so boom, that's now 100 000 people being negatively impacted instead of ONE house pet which probably has 5-10 years left in its life anyway, and who's death would make you and maybe a couple other people pretty sad for a while. that is selfish on a level that it confuses me to think about.

Edited by Hume, 24 September 2012 - 01:26 AM.

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i've no idea what i am talking about! you'll go to hell for what your dirty mind is thiiiiiiiiiiiiiinkin'.
(i'm trapped in this body and can't get out.) how come i end up where i started?.
REASONABLE AND SENSIBLE.

#46 Jägermeister

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Posted 24 September 2012 - 01:35 AM

Although I am not the poster, I disagree with your post.

I say this because as pet owners, we treat our pets as if they were our own kids - who in their right mind wouldn't save their kids if they were in danger? Sure, most people might think that a human life is more important than an animals life, but I find this situation unique.

Thousands of people die everyday and most of us don't even blink an eye. However, it would be a difficult situation to sacrifice someone who has been with you for many years and someone you love very well (in the posters case, it is his cat).

I believe that we should respect the poster's decision to protect his cat. We don't know what they have gone through in life and why the cat is so special to him/her. That being said, I also respect your opinion.


I think the real question is, would you kill yourself to save your pets life?
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#47 Dellins

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Posted 24 September 2012 - 03:26 AM

1. Yes I'd save the person I love.

2. As it is worded now, I voted to let Tokyo go boom while keeping RA's 19,000 alive. If instead of destroying RA, killing all inside, the choice was to let them die or let Tokyo die... then I would have picked saving Tokyo.




And ftr, I'd choose my pets over strangers as well.
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#48 Watermelons

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Posted 24 September 2012 - 09:18 PM

how many people do you know that would be devastated if you were killed? for myself probably around a hundred. probably somewhere in that ballpark for most people. so boom, that's now 100 000 people being negatively impacted instead of ONE house pet which probably has 5-10 years left in its life anyway, and who's death would make you and maybe a couple other people pretty sad for a while. that is selfish on a level that it confuses me to think about.


What you said is true. However, you say that the pet that will be saved may only have 5-10 years left. However, how do you know that the random stranger that is going to be saved doesn't have a deadly illness? What if they get hit by a car? What if there is a huge earthquake? Want me to go on about stuff that could result in them dying before 5-10 years pass?

Not to mention the unconditional love that an animal will give its owner. As mentioned above by CAPSLOCK, some of the people you saved might not even give a cr@p about you. Would you rather save someone/something that truly cares for you and loves you no matter what happens to you or would you rather save a group of people you don't know, and might never meet in your life?

**For the record, I did not say that it can be justified to save someone/something over 1000 lives of random strangers, but I am just looking at the situation from the opposing point of view.**
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#49 Blömqvist

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Posted 24 September 2012 - 09:31 PM

LOL I"M TAKING A MORAL PHILOSOPHY CLASS RIGHT NOW AND THIS IS WHAT WE DISCUSS.
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#50 nucklehead

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 06:23 AM

Opinions aside about the guy, this is one very douchey post.


Was she more or less innocent than Mrs. Hitler? The greater implication being that there would be a Stanley Cup banner hanging from the rafters today, if not two. And Linden would have never been traded. To be a Messier apologist in any form is offensive from a Canucks fan point of view.
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#51 Dazzle

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 10:11 PM

Was she more or less innocent than Mrs. Hitler? The greater implication being that there would be a Stanley Cup banner hanging from the rafters today, if not two. And Linden would have never been traded. To be a Messier apologist in any form is offensive from a Canucks fan point of view.


You're not seriously comparing Messier to Hitler right?

I 'get' your hatred of Messier: his arrival in a Canuck uniform, the tenure that he had and his departure and its after-effects. I get it. That really doesn't make me a Messier apologist. In fact, if you've noticed, I have never thrown any compliments and probably never will in this thread regarding him. Love how you thrown names my way just because I call you out for behaviour that is beyond childish.

It's just wrong to compare Messier to a well-known mass-murderer, who may not necessarily have killed people (Jewish or not) directly but he called for it and didn't stop it after-the-fact. He is complicit with the murders.

Also... her mom has/had nothing to do with Messier acting like a douche - why does she have to die?

If we were to dig up every crap that you might have done in your life, someone in the world probably will have an (unreasonable) proposal to murder your mom. Would you want that?

What you're calling for is atrocious.
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Posted Image --> THANKS EGATTI.

I have to say Dazzle's was the coolest. ROTFLOL


#52 Dral

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 11:11 PM

How has no one posted a Spock video yet?

Q2 - I'd say blow up RA... but then again, if the question was sacrifice a rodent or blow up Rogers Arena I'd say blow it up. I really hate Rogers. GM place on the other, I'd say say screw Tokoyo.

Q1 - I'd save my loved one, obviously. Has no one here seen The Box? Or the Twilight Zone episode it was based on? Or heard that great riddle from 16 Blocks?

Mos Def - "You're driving in a hurricane and you see three people at a bus stop. One is an old lady and she's sick. One is your best friend and he saved your life. And the third is the lady of your dreams. Now check it out, you only have room for one in your car, which one do you take?"

Willis - "Oh yea, you give the car keys to your best friend and you let him take the old lady to the hospital. You stay at the bus stop with the girl because she's the girl of your dreams, right?"
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#53 nucklehead

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 11:16 PM

nm

Edited by nucklehead, 25 September 2012 - 11:16 PM.

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#54 nucklehead

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 11:17 PM

You're not seriously comparing Messier to Hitler right?

I 'get' your hatred of Messier: his arrival in a Canuck uniform, the tenure that he had and his departure and its after-effects. I get it. That really doesn't make me a Messier apologist. In fact, if you've noticed, I have never thrown any compliments and probably never will in this thread regarding him. Love how you thrown names my way just because I call you out for behaviour that is beyond childish.

It's just wrong to compare Messier to a well-known mass-murderer, who may not necessarily have killed people (Jewish or not) directly but he called for it and didn't stop it after-the-fact. He is complicit with the murders.

Also... her mom has/had nothing to do with Messier acting like a douche - why does she have to die?

If we were to dig up every crap that you might have done in your life, someone in the world probably will have an (unreasonable) proposal to murder your mom. Would you want that?

What you're calling for is atrocious.



Oh for frack sake get a grip and some reading comprehension skills. Who's comparing anything here besides you. Someone suggested going back in time to kill an innocent woman, Mrs. Hitler. I get tired of cliched arguements like "If you could go back in time would you kill Hitlers Mom?" so I throw something out like, as long as I'm going back in time and we all seem OK with killing innocent women, why not make it something interesting and relevant? Geez people lighten up already.Hitlers been done to death,that's all. frack man maybe you should go have yourself a nice big bowl of valium soup and curl up with a good book like on of my personal favorites "Searching for Comedy in a Muslim World.
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#55 Dazzle

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 10:11 PM

Oh for frack sake get a grip and some reading comprehension skills. Who's comparing anything here besides you. Someone suggested going back in time to kill an innocent woman, Mrs. Hitler. I get tired of cliched arguements like "If you could go back in time would you kill Hitlers Mom?" so I throw something out like, as long as I'm going back in time and we all seem OK with killing innocent women, why not make it something interesting and relevant? Geez people lighten up already.Hitlers been done to death,that's all. frack man maybe you should go have yourself a nice big bowl of valium soup and curl up with a good book like on of my personal favorites "Searching for Comedy in a Muslim World.


Sure buddy.
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Posted Image --> THANKS EGATTI.

I have to say Dazzle's was the coolest. ROTFLOL


#56 Sharpshooter

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 10:47 PM

DAN: We were supposed to make the world a better place.


ADRIAN:
Dan, that's exactly what I am doing.


DAN:
Nuclear war?
Human extinction?


ADRIAN: Of course, my moral safeguards gave me pause at the necessary sacrifice.

A few key regions around the globe:
New York, Los Angeles, Moscow, Hong Kong... disintegrated in an instant.
Fifteen million people killed by Dr. Manhattan himself. The world's punishment for flirting with World War III.


DAN: Jon wouldn't do that.


ADRIAN: A fact no one outside this room ever has to know. The energy breakthrough I was working on just came to fruition. All these years, Jon was helping me replicate his power unaware of how I planned to use it.


You see... the Comedian was right. Humanity's savage nature will inevitably lead to global annihilation. So in order to save this planet...I had to trick it with the greatest practical joke in human history.

DAN: Killing millions.


ADRIAN:- To save billions. A necessary crime.


Good movie that was. Great cast, great dialogue.
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#57 Bitter Melon

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 10:53 PM

Good comic that was. Great writing, great illustration.


Fixed.

Edited by CAPSLOCK, 26 September 2012 - 10:54 PM.

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#58 Sharpshooter

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 10:57 PM

Fixed.


Really? Well, i suppose for a purist it would be. It was my first foray into that particular world and I thoroughly enjoyed it.

I'd blow up 1000 Incredible Hulk movies and 10,000 Superman Returns to save it.
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Posted Image Pittsburgh Penguins - CDC GML Posted Image


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#59 Watermelons

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 11:13 PM

LOL I"M TAKING A MORAL PHILOSOPHY CLASS RIGHT NOW AND THIS IS WHAT WE DISCUSS.


Just out of curiosity, what would your opinion on this topic be?
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#60 Bitter Melon

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 11:35 PM

Really? Well, i suppose for a purist it would be. It was my first foray into that particular world and I thoroughly enjoyed it.

I'd blow up 1000 Incredible Hulk movies and 10,000 Superman Returns to save it.


Its a good movie. But like the vast majority of adaptations, it doesn't live up to it's original medium. I think this is most likely because an author/director/whatever creates something in the original medium, and at that point it can only be translated, for lack of a better term.
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