students who have taken out a Canada Student Loan will not have to repay their debt until he or she is earning at least $25,000 per year, Does it help you?

[Sean Monahan]

5 minutes ago, Kragar said:

Only if you are out of state.  I've taken a few courses at the local JC, and tuition & fees for a full load now is under 1,200 per year, so your estimates are off by a factor of 10 in that case.  UCLA is 13K/year, and a more "normal" state school (Cal State system instead of the better/more expensive UC system) is 5,500.

 

Too many use the out-of-state numbers to talk about how expensive things are, but the only good reason to go out of state is if you are after a particular program that your state doesn't offer, and in many cases, the out-of-state rates will be waived.  But when you have so many kids using it as a vacation away from home, that's their own problem.

Right, forgot about the out of state fees.

 

Even for locals it's still more expensive. You can get a world-class education here in Canada for anywhere between 8-12 grand per year. A school like Arizona State will run you easily 25K per year, even for an in-state student.

 

edit: from what I can see in a quick Google search, UCLA appears to cost upwards of 15K for tuition, fees, and books.

[Kragar]

1 minute ago, Sean Monahan said:

Right, forgot about the out of state fees.

 

Even for locals it's still more expensive. You can get a world-class education here in Canada for anywhere between 8-12 grand per year. A school like Arizona State will run you easily 25K per year, even for an in-state student.

Are you counting all expenses, or just tuition?  I just checked ASU's site, and in-state tuition is only 10K.  Tack on books, room and board, and you hit the 25K you mention.

 

Just want to be sure we are talking apples to apples, as the numbers I gave before were only tuition and all the fun admin fees.  If you were counting housing originally, then it's a whole different story  

[Lancaster]

The Generation Y and beyond have been sold that having a post-secondary education is the base requirement for a success job.  

 

Gone are the days that one can just simply exit their highschool with a diploma, walk into a garage or local bank and just speak to the owner/manager for a job.  Learning the tools of the trade, become an apprentice/protege and then work you way up.  While a few of those opportunities probably still exist, they are becoming a rarity.  

 

As more and more people are getting higher and higher levels of education, all job requirements as just gotten higher.  I remember first entering my accounting programs and being told that there's almost no requirement to do an entry level account job.  When I last searched a few years back.... Accounting Assistant roles or A/P and A/R clerks are like asking for bachelor's degrees and minimum completion of the level 3 CGA program..... for a job that's pretty much just glorified data entry.  

 

In 10 years time, the Masters Degree will be the main requirement for call centres.  

 

[Sean Monahan]

2 hours ago, Kragar said:

Are you counting all expenses, or just tuition?  I just checked ASU's site, and in-state tuition is only 10K.  Tack on books, room and board, and you hit the 25K you mention.

 

Just want to be sure we are talking apples to apples, as the numbers I gave before were only tuition and all the fun admin fees.  If you were counting housing originally, then it's a whole different story  

I was only talking books and tuition fees, just went off the number that popped up on my google search. Nonetheless, if we're talking numbers in Canadian dollars a UCLA degree will still cost you nearly double a UBC degree.

[kingofsurrey]

37 minutes ago, Sean Monahan said:

I was only talking books and tuition fees, just went off the number that popped up on my google search. Nonetheless, if we're talking numbers in Canadian dollars a UCLA degree will still cost you nearly double a UBC degree.

 

UBC PDP teaching program costs over 10,000 tuition only for final year.

If you are attending from somewhere in BC , factor in another 15,000 for rent and living expenses...

25,000 dollars   for this one year program.....

 

This is a 1 yr program after you have done a  4-5 year BA program....  

 

Canadian post secondary programs are now out of reach for way too many canadian youth. 

 

Education should be a way for hardworking / bright kids to get ahead.  

 

Most kids working mininum wage ( summers / part time )  can not afford these kinds of costs.

[Kragar]

18 minutes ago, Sean Monahan said:

I was only talking books and tuition fees, just went off the number that popped up on my google search. Nonetheless, if we're talking numbers in Canadian dollars a UCLA degree will still cost you nearly double a UBC degree.

Yeah, I agree UCLA isn't cheap.  But there are plenty of other options here.  The Cal State system is comparable in cost to UBC (current exchange makes it worse, of course) and more widespread.  I don't know how the quality compares to make a better comparison to UBC, but the UC system is world famous (UCLA and Berkeley especially), so I'm not surprised their costs would be higher.

 

My point was just to be careful on what numbers you see for US tuition, since so many news stories and concerns over high student loan debt are often based on the twits from out-of-state.

 

Do Canadian universities charge differently if you go out-of-Province?  Back when I was in Canada, I never looked at going out of BC, and I don't see anything about extra charges for going to a different province when I check a few sites.  I did some poking and it looks like tuition in Newfoundland and Quebec are half that of BC.  I'm curious to know if their significantly lower tuition is making a difference, and/or attracting noticeably more people from other provinces.  

[Sean Monahan]

2 hours ago, Kragar said:

Yeah, I agree UCLA isn't cheap.  But there are plenty of other options here.  The Cal State system is comparable in cost to UBC (current exchange makes it worse, of course) and more widespread.  I don't know how the quality compares to make a better comparison to UBC, but the UC system is world famous (UCLA and Berkeley especially), so I'm not surprised their costs would be higher.

 

My point was just to be careful on what numbers you see for US tuition, since so many news stories and concerns over high student loan debt are often based on the twits from out-of-state.

 

Do Canadian universities charge differently if you go out-of-Province?  Back when I was in Canada, I never looked at going out of BC, and I don't see anything about extra charges for going to a different province when I check a few sites.  I did some poking and it looks like tuition in Newfoundland and Quebec are half that of BC.  I'm curious to know if their significantly lower tuition is making a difference, and/or attracting noticeably more people from other provinces.  

Of course, the Cal system is outstanding. I don't know a ton about the other institutions (say, Fullerton or Riverside for example) but I know Berkeley and UCLA are world-class. 

 

FWIW this list of the best schools (http://www.thebestschools.org/features/100-best-universities-in-world-today/) had UCLA and Berkeley somewhere in the top 10, with ubc down around 37. Somewhat significant drop off but a world-class education nonetheless. University of Toronto is more esteemed and costs roughly the same I believe. I should mention that I'm not really an education snob and I find those who are to be pretty annoying. When I had a better GPA at an American school (a pretty good private school, I should say) than my friends at UBC they'd usually come up with some crap about how that would "adjust to about a 2.5-2.7 at UBC". 

 

As for your question, no I don't think there's any difference to go to school out of province. I've tossed around the idea of going to UPEI since I've moved back to BC and from the research I did I didn't see anything about out-of-province costs. I have family there I could've lived with for free, the major deterrent to me was the cost of flights (I think they average around a grand round trip, with variance from time to time of course). That's one place the US would have us beat.

[Kragar]

22 minutes ago, Sean Monahan said:

Of course, the Cal system is outstanding. I don't know a ton about the other institutions (say, Fullerton or Riverside for example) but I know Berkeley and UCLA are world-class. 

 

FWIW this list of the best schools (http://www.thebestschools.org/features/100-best-universities-in-world-today/) had UCLA and Berkeley somewhere in the top 10, with ubc down around 37. Somewhat significant drop off but a world-class education nonetheless. University of Toronto is more esteemed and costs roughly the same I believe. I should mention that I'm not really an education snob and I find those who are to be pretty annoying. When I had a better GPA at an American school (a pretty good private school, I should say) than my friends at UBC they'd usually come up with some crap about how that would "adjust to about a 2.5-2.7 at UBC". 

 

As for your question, no I don't think there's any difference to go to school out of province. I've tossed around the idea of going to UPEI since I've moved back to BC and from the research I did I didn't see anything about out-of-province costs. I have family there I could've lived with for free, the major deterrent to me was the cost of flights (I think they average around a grand round trip, with variance from time to time of course). That's one place the US would have us beat.

Thanks for the interesting info.  37's nothing to sneeze at, for sure, and when you look at what else is on the list, that's some good company to be in.  I knew good things about UBC, and wish I was more motivated when I went there.  Impossible to know how things would have been different, and definitely not complaining about my situation now, but parts of my life would have been easier had I completed my degree.  The snobbery you describe would definitely be annoying.  You might well end up with a better experience going to a top school and learn something special from it, but it doesn't necessarily make you smarter like your friends would suggest.  It often depends as much on the student as the school.

[Sean Monahan]

15 minutes ago, Kragar said:

Thanks for the interesting info.  37's nothing to sneeze at, for sure, and when you look at what else is on the list, that's some good company to be in.  I knew good things about UBC, and wish I was more motivated when I went there.  Impossible to know how things would have been different, and definitely not complaining about my situation now, but parts of my life would have been easier had I completed my degree.  The snobbery you describe would definitely be annoying.  You might well end up with a better experience going to a top school and learn something special from it, but it doesn't necessarily make you smarter like your friends would suggest.  It often depends as much on the student as the school.

When did you go UBC? It's grown hugely in the last twenty or so years I believe.

 

It's a fantastic school, I just hate the "elitist" attitude that some of its students seem to feel. Personally I was happier to go to a smaller school anyway.

[Kragar]

Just now, Sean Monahan said:

When did you go UBC? It's grown hugely in the last twenty or so years I believe.

 

It's a fantastic school, I just hate the "elitist" attitude that some of its students seem to feel. Personally I was happier to go to a smaller school anyway.

Mid-80's, and I'm sure there's lots of changes.  Only went for one year, spending too much time in the SUB vs going to class.  One of the clubs I joined claimed to have the highest fail rate, due to skipping classes.  Guess they were right 

[kingofsurrey]

11 minutes ago, Kragar said:

Mid-80's, and I'm sure there's lots of changes.  Only went for one year, spending too much time in the SUB vs going to class.  One of the clubs I joined claimed to have the highest fail rate, due to skipping classes.  Guess they were right 

 

Problem with UBC now is trying to find affordable housing nearby or even a reasonable commute away, Next to impossible to find. 

 

Really think UBC is going to miss out on a lot of very capable students if all they target is the  rich elite OR  foreign students. 

Too bad , UBC used to be a great school. 

[Kragar]

Just now, kingofsurrey said:

 

Problem with UBC now is trying to find affordable housing nearby or even a reasonable commute away, Next to impossible to find. 

 

Really think UBC is going to miss out on a lot of very capable students if all they target is the  rich elite OR  foreign students. 

Too bad , UBC used to be a great school. 

Yeah, I wasn't too impressed with that new school being set up for foreign students, as it didn't seem right to me.  And the city as a whole could suffer (already is?) with the inability of more and more middle-class earners to live nearby, not just UBC.

 

I had a long commute when I went there, who's to say how reasonable it was.  I was living at home rather than on/near campus, and the Pattullo/Marine Way/Marine Drive route was painful, but I guess that experience helped me prepare for the LA commute I have now .  Oh joy.

[Sean Monahan]

30 minutes ago, Kragar said:

Mid-80's, and I'm sure there's lots of changes.  Only went for one year, spending too much time in the SUB vs going to class.  One of the clubs I joined claimed to have the highest fail rate, due to skipping classes.  Guess they were right 

Was this club a frat? 

[Kragar]

4 minutes ago, Sean Monahan said:

Was this club a frat? 

Delta Tau Chi... toga, toga 

 

Naw, war-gamers club was my downfall.  I'd have been better off taking a year to grow up some.  School wasn't all that tough until I got there, so it was a bit of a shock that I had to actually try harder to do get good grades.  So, despite my piss-poor transcript, I did learn something at UBC... woohoo!

[Sean Monahan]

2 minutes ago, Kragar said:

Delta Tau Chi... toga, toga 

 

Naw, war-gamers club was my downfall.  I'd have been better off taking a year to grow up some.  School wasn't all that tough until I got there, so it was a bit of a shock that I had to actually try harder to do get good grades.  So, despite my piss-poor transcript, I did learn something at UBC... woohoo!

Can't put a price on life experience!

 

Were you away from home when you went to UBC? For myself, having to move away and take care of myself did me wonders. I matured about 5 years in my first semester.

[Kragar]

9 minutes ago, Sean Monahan said:

Can't put a price on life experience!

 

Were you away from home when you went to UBC? For myself, having to move away and take care of myself did me wonders. I matured about 5 years in my first semester.

I lived at home then.  Being on your own and paying your own bills surely helps you grow.  For good or bad, that was about 3 years down the road for me.

[SamJamIam]

10 hours ago, kingofsurrey said:

 

UBC PDP teaching program costs over 10,000 tuition only for final year.

If you are attending from somewhere in BC , factor in another 15,000 for rent and living expenses...

25,000 dollars   for this one year program.....

 

This is a 1 yr program after you have done a  4-5 year BA program....  

 

Canadian post secondary programs are now out of reach for way too many canadian youth. 

 

Education should be a way for hardworking / bright kids to get ahead.  

 

Most kids working mininum wage ( summers / part time )  can not afford these kinds of costs.

 

Some added colour:

 

Girlfriend is a teacher who went to UBC.  The teaching program costs considerably more than 10k.

 

It's also longer than a year but less than 2 including practicum.  However you can stretch that out to 2 years if you need to spread out the fiscal pain.  Lots of people she went to school with had jobs they worked while in the program which was just as well as most universities train way more teachers than are needed.  It's a battle royale to even secure a job as a substitute teacher.

 

Also almost no one who enters the teaching program just finished a bachelors.  Maybe the costs are too daunting and people don't feel like upping the ante on their debt.  Maybe it's just a job that doesn't appeal to 21 year olds.

 

[riffraff]

13 hours ago, kingofsurrey said:

 

Problem with UBC now is trying to find affordable housing nearby or even a reasonable commute away, Next to impossible to find. 

 

Really think UBC is going to miss out on a lot of very capable students if all they target is the  rich elite OR  foreign students. 

Too bad , UBC used to be a great school. 

 

To further this point:

 

as an employer would you hire the spoon fed kid or the had to work hard kid who wanted it more?

[Down by the River]

16 hours ago, kingofsurrey said:

 

Problem with UBC now is trying to find affordable housing nearby or even a reasonable commute away, Next to impossible to find. 

 

Really think UBC is going to miss out on a lot of very capable students if all they target is the  rich elite OR  foreign students. 

Too bad , UBC used to be a great school. 

 

This implies that they are actually looking for capable students... though I'm certainly not suggesting this applies to UBC only.

 

I went to my fiancee's sister's highschool graduation. Private school. 95% of the grad class was going to post-sec institutions, the vast majority were attending either UBC or schools in California, NY, etc. 

 

Don't tell me that half the graduating class was a highly capable student. Money talks, especially when you have private school kids and their parents threatening teachers' livelihoods for better grades.

[kingofsurrey]

1 hour ago, Down by the River said:

 

This implies that they are actually looking for capable students... though I'm certainly not suggesting this applies to UBC only.

 

I went to my fiancee's sister's highschool graduation. Private school. 95% of the grad class was going to post-sec institutions, the vast majority were attending either UBC or schools in California, NY, etc. 

 

Don't tell me that half the graduating class was a highly capable student. Money talks, especially when you have private school kids and their parents threatening teachers' livelihoods for better grades.

 

BC MInistry of Ed has now removed provincial exams pretty much so it will be hard for Uni's to decide on admittance...

 

Is a  Canadian SAT the solution ?