No Place But Up

[Jiggs50]

Hard to do anything when all of the dead weight has NTCs

Booth, Hansen, and Sestito are the dead weight aha. If Kes wants out he can go as well.

[deized_kanuck604]

This team is too washed up, old, and the core needs to be changed.

And we were in the thick of it to the end? The thick of what...trying to secure that 8th spot? And then what? So we could get swept in the first round again...like we were the previous two years?

Yeah, we're much closer than people think. Exactly how the Flames finally devalued the remaining assets they had of any worth.

I felt from day one that its stale, It needs youth. It needs a change. Were not in 2011.

- John Tortorella

Quoting the guy that couldnt coach an elite player list such as the canucks smh

[Kevo882]

I know this is going to go off on a "this is what the Canucks should do" rant in certain parts but bear with me as I respond to OP.

The reason it was a down year for the Sedins was that they got way overplayed by Torts and in situations they didn't need to be in which led to fatigue and injuries that they don't usually get (are in great shape, but eventually too many minutes catches up to you). But even then, I'm not sure they 'll ever get back to the level of their glory days in terms of production because, as I've stated before, the entire NHL has figured out their one-trick show (cycle, pass, cycle, pass, hope someone opens up out front of the net or at the point, etc.). They're getting older and have less speed and creativity than they once did. I guess I agree with some on CDC that they are still good mentors to the younger guys (and can still be counted on for a certain guaranteed level of production), but so is Kesler and he is younger and has a much better all-around game (I know, this is why most feel we should trade HIM instead of a/both Sedin(s) but I would much rather re-build/re-tool around him and his style of game).

Burrows' off year was partially attributed to so many injuries and not being able to get into a groove. Edler, who knows. Some say it was Torts but he's had a couple bad years in a row. He does possess great offensive skills which is always good to have, but we have other dmen with the same abilities who are less of a defensive liability. Bieksa: sure he had less points this year, but is still the guy with the most heart on our team and has the best all-around game of any of our dmen. Hansen: ya, off year for him. For him, no excuses as he is a two-way third/fourth liner with speed who should have thrived under Torts. Had some flashes, but overall lacklustre year. Might be gone this summer as we have a couple others with similar skillsets.

As for our young guns, I somewhat agree with you. So far, Kassian and Corrado haven't been anything to write home about, but they're still young. Tanev has been developing into a solid, safe dman and Jensen has had flashes of brilliance. So it's been a mixed bag. But now we've got guys like Horvat, Shinkaruk, Fox, Guance, Cassels, etc. coming up that are looking extremely promising.

So, like you said, the future looks bright. If we can make the right trades, draft smart, and sign a UFA or two this summer and add in a young gun or two to the line-up next year, there's a perfect re-tool to jump right back into the playoffs next year like Linden and Aquilini want and we can build into the future. I am optimistic as well

[Dogbyte]

This team is

OLD,

WASHED UP, and the

CORE NEEDS TO BE CHANGED

that's reality.

[aGENT]

...as I've stated before, the entire NHL has figured out their one-trick show (cycle, pass, cycle, pass, hope someone opens up out front of the net or at the point, etc.)...

I'm so tired of reading this. It has nothing to with them being "figured out".

It's largely a combination of two things:

1- The league/officiating has allowed clutching and grabbing back in to the game. This affects all offensive players including the Sedins as they have less time and space to make plays.

2-A lack of scoring depth means opposing teams can key in all their best defensive players against the twins and not worry terribly much about the other lines scoring on them.

That's it. Has literally nothing to do with being "figured out"

[Zedlee]

Oh man OP...whatever it is you're smoking, I want some.

We could easily be WORSE next year, not better.

Our core is past it's prime...The Sedins, Kesler, Burrows, Bieksa, Edler...their career years are all behind them. Serious concern over Daniel...they guy was a shadow of himself last year.

Our prospect pool is considered one of the worst in the league (28th I read recently)

We have two goalies with hardly any experience.

We have no GM or coach.

Best thing to do now is REBUILD. Trade Kesler, Hansen, and whoever you can for young propects and picks. Take the time to develop our players and farm team. Then maybe in 3-5 years we can compete for the conference and cup.

[Dogbyte]

I'm so tired of reading this. It has nothing to with them being "figured out".

It's largely a combination of two things:

1- The league/officiating has allowed clutching and grabbing back in to the game. This affects all offensive players including the Sedins as they have less time and space to make plays.

2-A lack of scoring depth means opposing teams can key in all their best defensive players against the twins and not worry terribly much about the other lines scoring on them.

That's it. Has literally nothing to do with being "figured out"

Really, you don't think anyone has learned anything about the way they play?

[Canucklehead73]

Yes I'd say we have some good pieces, not as optimistic as the OP, but there is a foundation there.

I'm not sure if we will see many changes until our new coach and GM fully realize who has got to go. We will go no-where until we can play a solid disciplined defensive game in our own end. The puck watching, aggressive out of position double-teaming, leaving guys alone in the slot crap has got to stop.

I like the way Kassian's game is progressing, he had some dominating games down the stretch. If he can stick on the second line and be the puck control play-maker feeding Kelser it will be a game changer for our team...

Biggest question mark for me is Burrows... Can he regain his form? If not we really need a top six forward. I think most of our other wingers would suit our team better providing solid depth on the bottom six lines. I like Santorelli, I like Mattias's speed and size... but we would be much deeper if we signed a top six forward.

[aGENT]

Our prospect pool is considered one of the worst in the league (28th I read recently)

I believe we're actually rated closer to middle of the pack ~15th-20th (depending on whose list you look at).

[asian player]

Booth, Hansen, and Sestito are the dead weight aha. If Kes wants out he can go as well.

Can't trade Booth's contract. Hansen has ntc. Sestito is what you'll get out of any 4th liner

[aGENT]

Really, you don't think anyone has learned anything about the way they play?

No more so than any other top offensive players in the league. And they were just as "figured out" in 09/10 after Hank won the scoring title and yet Daniel went on to win it the following year despite coaches and players scouting/planning for them.

Ask yourself why that was.

[aGENT]

Can't trade Booth's contract. Hansen has ntc. Sestito is what you'll get out of any 4th liner

Booth will be bought out or traded for say a 4th (if possible). Hansen's NTC hasn't kicked in yet.

[awalk]

There's a pretty good chance things are going to get worse before they get better.

Relying heavily on the Sedins having a major bounce back year. If Kesler isn't traded, big reliance that he can get back to some kind of solid offensive output.

Dubious Goaltending with lots of potential...

The list could go on, but this team isn't in great shape. Big moves needed.

[Jiggs50]

I know this is going to go off on a "this is what the Canucks should do" rant in certain parts but bear with me as I respond to OP.

The reason it was a down year for the Sedins was that they got way overplayed by Torts and in situations they didn't need to be in which led to fatigue and injuries that they don't usually get (are in great shape, but eventually too many minutes catches up to you). But even then, I'm not sure they 'll ever get back to the level of their glory days in terms of production because, as I've stated before, the entire NHL has figured out their one-trick show (cycle, pass, cycle, pass, hope someone opens up out front of the net or at the point, etc.). They're getting older and have less speed and creativity than they once did. I guess I agree with some on CDC that they are still good mentors to the younger guys (and can still be counted on for a certain guaranteed level of production), but so is Kesler and he is younger and has a much better all-around game (I know, this is why most feel we should trade HIM instead of a/both Sedin(s) but I would much rather re-build/re-tool around him and his style of game).

Burrows' off year was partially attributed to so many injuries and not being able to get into a groove. Edler, who knows. Some say it was Torts but he's had a couple bad years in a row. He does possess great offensive skills which is always good to have, but we have other dmen with the same abilities who are less of a defensive liability. Bieksa: sure he had less points this year, but is still the guy with the most heart on our team and has the best all-around game of any of our dmen. Hansen: ya, off year for him. For him, no excuses as he is a two-way third/fourth liner with speed who should have thrived under Torts. Had some flashes, but overall lacklustre year. Might be gone this summer as we have a couple others with similar skillsets.

As for our young guns, I somewhat agree with you. So far, Kassian and Corrado haven't been anything to write home about, but they're still young. Tanev has been developing into a solid, safe dman and Jensen has had flashes of brilliance. So it's been a mixed bag. But now we've got guys like Horvat, Shinkaruk, Fox, Guance, Cassels, etc. coming up that are looking extremely promising.

So, like you said, the future looks bright. If we can make the right trades, draft smart, and sign a UFA or two this summer and add in a young gun or two to the line-up next year, there's a perfect re-tool to jump right back into the playoffs next year like Linden and Aquilini want and we can build into the future. I am optimistic as well

Nice. I'm thinking things pretty similar.

[Jiggs50]

Oh man OP...whatever it is you're smoking, I want some.

We could easily be WORSE next year, not better.

Our core is past it's prime...The Sedins, Kesler, Burrows, Bieksa, Edler...their career years are all behind them. Serious concern over Daniel...they guy was a shadow of himself last year.

Our prospect pool is considered one of the worst in the league (28th I read recently)

We have two goalies with hardly any experience.

We have no GM or coach.

Best thing to do now is REBUILD. Trade Kesler, Hansen, and whoever you can for young propects and picks. Take the time to develop our players and farm team. Then maybe in 3-5 years we can compete for the conference and cup.

Playoffs next year! Bank on it.

[Jiggs50]

This team is

OLD,

WASHED UP, and the

CORE NEEDS TO BE CHANGED

that's reality.

Kassian, Tanev, Jensen, and Corrado. Those guys are basically locks to be on the team. There's change! Not to mention Horvat or Gaunce or perhaps our 6th overall pick could be competing for a spot on the team!

[PhillipBlunt]

Going into next season as a negative nelly is pointless. Yes, changes need to be made, but I believe the right ones will be made this off season.

Letting go of Mike Gillis will prove to be a hugely positive turning point for the Canucks. Tortorella was merely a victim of Gillis' ineptitude in hiring a good coach who wasn't suited for the team.

I, for one, am looking forward to next season, and the changes that are coming.

[coastal1]

I admire your optimism. You listed a list of reasons for the team's struggles. I'd have to disagree with some of your reasons.

In my opinion the real reasons for the struggles were coming for a few years in the form of mismanagement of assets in addition to hiring a coach who's style is best suited to a different type of roster. Playing the top guys too many minutes wasn't a problem of depth. Although the depth was a bit spotty. It was a sign of a coach who didn't trust the depth he was given.

I really can't see the Sedins, Burrows, Hamhuis, Edler (well maybe Edler) being as bad as they were this year. Just too much pride there to mail it in. Though father time may have something to say about how much they bounce back.

The goal is not the playoffs. It's the cup. For this team the road to the cup goes through California. The way the team is they can't beat either of the 3 California teams in a 7 game series.

The core does need changing.

You look at the playoffs and what do the successful teams have:

1- elite goaltending (Quick, Price, Rask, Gibson...)- we have that in Lack

2- a couple of world class forwards (Toews,Kane, Getzlaf, Perry...): we have that in the Sedins

3- a couple of strong supporting forwards (Sharp, Lucic...): we have that in Kesler and Burrows

4- a do it all defenceman (Keith, Doughty, Subban...): we have that in Hamhuis

The Canucks have all the required ingredients, they are that close. The job now is to perform to capabilities.

[MJDDawg]

You look at the playoffs and what do the successful teams have:

1- elite goaltending (Quick, Price, Rask, Gibson...)- we have that in Lack

2- a couple of world class forwards (Toews,Kane, Getzlaf, Perry...): we have that in the Sedins

3- a couple of strong supporting forwards (Sharp, Lucic...): we have that in Kesler and Burrows

4- a do it all defenceman (Keith, Doughty, Subban...): we have that in Hamhuis

The Canucks have all the required ingredients, they are that close. The job now is to perform to capabilities.

Not sure if you're serious or just trolling, but here's my view, which is based on the reality:

1. A goalie with 41 NHL games under his belt is elite and in the same class as those you've listed? Good one!

2. The Sedins were world class forwards once. They will never be that again.

3. Yeah I'll go along with Kes and Burr being strong supporting forwards, with the caveat that they are both in decline.

4. Comparing Hamhuis to any of those defencemen makes me wonder if you actually understand hockey.

To summarize, we have nowhere near the ingredients you suggest. Pretty much every player that's not a Canuck you've mentioned are, or are going into, their prime peak years and are the best of the best at their positions. Our core players are on the back end of that curve.

Will they have a rebound year under a new coach? Probably, but to nowhere near the levels of their peak years again.

[Zedlee]

You look at the playoffs and what do the successful teams have:

1- elite goaltending (Quick, Price, Rask, Gibson...)- we have that in Lack

2- a couple of world class forwards (Toews,Kane, Getzlaf, Perry...): we have that in the Sedins

3- a couple of strong supporting forwards (Sharp, Lucic...): we have that in Kesler and Burrows

4- a do it all defenceman (Keith, Doughty, Subban...): we have that in Hamhuis

The Canucks have all the required ingredients, they are that close. The job now is to perform to capabilities.

LOL..do you even watch hockey? We have NONE of the required ingredients. And maybe one player(Kesler) that can be compared to the elite players mentioned. Start the re-build...asap.