GreyHatnDart Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 My comparison is that they are both "hard workers" but they don't get it done. Matthias' goal was not the result of hard work, it was the result of trying that same damn move over and over until it just happens to go in (look at his reaction on the bench, he even surprised himself). The other 40 times he's done that this season, he's lost the puck as a result and his linemates have to skate back and regain possession. . I'm not saying they are physically and contractually the same person, just that they play a similar style of game. Okay, I understand what you're trying to say, Except the main difference is Booth was brought in to be a scoring second lineman.. Heck there was even talk of him playing top line minutes with the Sedin's (seemingly like every player we pick up lol), and he HUGELY disappointed. Matthias however was a bit of a wildcard, whom we acquired as part of letting Luongo go. By and large hes a checking 3rd/4th liner, so in my mind if he's defensively sound, plays the body well, and pops in the odd goal, I for one am very happy with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 That hit was about as dirty as it gets, had everything going for it, jumping, unsuspecting player, blindside, head shot, intent to injure.............. Wow. Actually, by NHL standards, the only thing wrong with the hit was leaving his feet. Otherwise it would have been hitting into the body where head contact was unavoidable. A 20 game suspension was rather excessive. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypW1CeNCmt0&list=PL1NbHSfosBuG3y72SAdlnoXidgdWeb6pG&index=53 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nino Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 Actually, by NHL standards, the only thing wrong with the hit was leaving his feet. Otherwise it would have been hitting into the body where head contact was unavoidable. A 20 game suspension was rather excessive. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypW1CeNCmt0&list=PL1NbHSfosBuG3y72SAdlnoXidgdWeb6pG&index=53 Jumping into the head is a key part of the hit and if he didn't then the head shot, and intent to injure wouldn't have been part of the hit. Not sure what your trying to say, let me try one of your justifications....... The only difference between the man that got off with a death threat and the man convicted with first degree murder was only that he pulled the trigger. Is that how it works? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2SKATES1STICK Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 Matthias lacks Truculence. Kassian is much more valuable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekey Pete Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 ^ lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tre Mac Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 Man i want this kid to succeed but then he transforms into Zachary Kassianov for 3 or 4 games and becomes a Russian flake. Doesn't use his body, doesn't hussle, and he doesn't even register on the stat sheet. His time is running out with the new Canuck brass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekey Pete Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 Okay, I understand what you're trying to say, Except the main difference is Booth was brought in to be a scoring second lineman.. Heck there was even talk of him playing top line minutes with the Sedin's (seemingly like every player we pick up lol), and he HUGELY disappointed. Matthias however was a bit of a wildcard, whom we acquired as part of letting Luongo go. By and large hes a checking 3rd/4th liner, so in my mind if he's defensively sound, plays the body well, and pops in the odd goal, I for one am very happy with that. i think the way Willie's coaching this team he expects more than the odd goal. Our third line has had some good games, yes, but they are not getting points on a regular basis! Zack has a lot of offensive potential, I think anyone can agree on that, he just needs to put in the effort and realize that potential. I just don't think that he has the right linemates to do that unfortunately. I know it sounds like I'm just making excuses for him, and someone said goal scorers don't use their linemates as excuses. Hello... Sedin line last year? Kesler line last year? Obviously those guys are going to take the blame personally at the pressers, because they are pros, but take a look at the facts. Sedin's get a pure goal scorer and they are rejuvenated. Ryan Puck Hog/shoot at the crest Kesler leaves for a playmaking centre and suddenly Burrows and Higgins are new players. Linemates have a HUGE effect on players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nino Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 i think the way Willie's coaching this team he expects more than the odd goal. Our third line has had some good games, yes, but they are not getting points on a regular basis! Zack has a lot of offensive potential, I think anyone can agree on that, he just needs to put in the effort and realize that potential. I just don't think that he has the right linemates to do that unfortunately. I know it sounds like I'm just making excuses for him, and someone said goal scorers don't use their linemates as excuses. Hello... Sedin line last year? Kesler line last year? Obviously those guys are going to take the blame personally at the pressers, because they are pros, but take a look at the facts. Sedin's get a pure goal scorer and they are rejuvenated. Ryan Puck Hog/shoot at the crest Kesler leaves for a playmaking centre and suddenly Burrows and Higgins are new players. Linemates have a HUGE effect on players. Your missing the key part of this, I've rarely if ever hear people criticize zack because of the lack of points he putting up. Sure you put him with the twins and his stats as sure to improve but the same could be said for any player on the team. You put any player in the lineup with better players and they will produce better is kind of obvious. With zack the criticism he gets is not his scoring ability or even his lack of scoring it's that he floats around the ice and doesn't become involved in the play as he should, both on the back check and the forecheck. You could put him with the biggest plugs in the nhl and he would still have the opportunity to show that he can be involved in the play and can hustle. This idea that he's being held back by his line mates is insane and needs to die. When he shows he's ready to take the next step he will get the chance to play with better line mates and in turn will put up better numbers, till that time players that have already shown what the coach wants to see will have the opportunity to play with the better players and in turn be putting up more points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil_314 Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 "Time to give him more offensively-oriented line-mates" is more like it. From CanucksArmy's player report card: Zack Kassian's most frequent linemates are -25 and -35 for Corsi, compared to Kass' -2. In case you were wondering where the problem was. Plays come to die on Richie's stick; he's good on defense but not on offense. Maybe it's time to try him with Horvat and Hansen, and put Matthias and Richie with Dorsett? I'm sure that with his vision he can at least replicate what Dorsett did against the Hawks in terms of play-making since Zack also likes to make plays from the perimeter and off the rush, and it would be a solid two-way line as well. Then we'd have a strong crash-and-bang/ work off the rush fourth line that would be better than most. Hansen - Horvat - Kassian Matthias - Richie - Dorsett // Vey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 Jumping into the head is a key part of the hit and if he didn't then the head shot, and intent to injure wouldn't have been part of the hit. Not sure what your trying to say, let me try one of your justifications....... The only difference between the man that got off with a death threat and the man convicted with first degree murder was only that he pulled the trigger. Is that how it works? It would help if you actually understood the rules pertaining to head contact. Delivering a full body check into the body makes any head contact incidental and legal. PIcking the head without hitting into the body, or leaping into a players head is not legal. Regardless of your gross exaggerations, by NHL standards, Kassian's hit was charging, as described in the the NHL disciplinary video I supplied above. Had he not left his feet it would have been a hard legal hit again by NHL standards regardless of head contact (see the video below). Kassian deserved a suspension, but a 20 game suspension is rather heavy compared to the 4 games Zolnierczk received in the NHL. So I'd have to agree that Kassian was being made an example of. The video below shows hard legal hits where head contact is incidental to a full body check. Take particular note of the Kronwall hit. Then it shows examples of illegal head contact hits. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GornRqDMS_g&list=PL1NbHSfosBuG3y72SAdlnoXidgdWeb6pG&index=44 Contacting the head, nor whether the player sees the hit it coming or not, constitutes an illegal hit. How the hit was delivered determines the legality. /lesson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zverta Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 If Horvat is able to make an impact, aside from his face-off numbers, on the 4th line, I think Kassian should be put up to the same amount of pressure and expectation on the 3rd. It has nothing to do with his linemates. Dorsett ain't Henrik Sedin 2.0 and Hansen plays with the same amount of urgency as Matthias; albeit with a boost of speed. The dude doesn't hussle for jack and plays like he's a 5'5" russian floater. I'm baffled that Willie Desjardins is giving him 1st line power play time. He straight up looks lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jagorim Jarg Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 Whichever. Much like the OP, it's only right twice a day.... That clock is right an infinite number of times per day. I don't know why people have trouble looking at Zack Kassian objectively. He's a character guy, other than that I'm still not really sure what he is. Watching him play it sometimes looks like he doesn't either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hearditall Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 "Had a good deep cycle going untill Richie and Mathias flubbed his passes a couple of times." Goal scorers find ways to put the puck in the net,they don't blame their line mates for their lack of production. Then what's Cody's problem??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nino Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 It would help if you actually understood the rules pertaining to head contact. Delivering a full body check into the body makes any head contact incidental and legal. PIcking the head without hitting into the body, or leaping into a players head is not legal. Regardless of your gross exaggerations, by NHL standards, Kassian's hit was charging, as described in the the NHL disciplinary video I supplied above. Had he not left his feet it would have been a hard legal hit again by NHL standards regardless of head contact (see the video below). Kassian deserved a suspension, but a 20 game suspension is rather heavy compared to the 4 games Zolnierczk received in the NHL. So I'd have to agree that Kassian was being made an example of. The video below shows hard legal hits where head contact is incidental to a full body check. Take particular note of the Kronwall hit. Then it shows examples of illegal head contact hits. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GornRqDMS_g&list=PL1NbHSfosBuG3y72SAdlnoXidgdWeb6pG&index=44 Contacting the head, nor whether the player sees the hit it coming or not, constitutes an illegal hit. How the hit was delivered determines the legality. /lesson Possibly we are watching another clip, the clip I'm watching is zack lunging directly at the player head almost looking like he's trying to play supper man and knock his head off, not only that but the player never even saw him till a split second before the impact. I understand the rules and I'd agree with you other then the hits your trying to use are not compatible to that hit. This was far from a charging call it was a gross intent to take a players head off. Bert's hit on Moore is a love tap in comparison, he lucky that he wasn't seriously hurt. Watch the clip again you probably just glanced at it. Regardless this nothing to do with if we should or shouldn't trade zack it's old news from the past and a little off topic. I think it's safe to assume he's not going to throw a hit like that again, we hope anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nino Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 Then what's Cody's problem??? Cody plays for the sabers, what his problem is there problem not ours. We've got enough of a problem wondering what zacks problem is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oliewud Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 Regardless of Kassians point production, you NEED guys like him against big teams like boston. How awesome would it have been to have Zack come on with the Sedins after marchand punched the sh!t out of Daniel in the finals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beefcake Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 I wouldn't mind a trade like Kassian plus Markstrom and maybe a 4th round draft pick for Evander Kane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekey Pete Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 "Time to give him more offensively-oriented line-mates" is more like it. From CanucksArmy's player report card: Quote Plays come to die on Richie's stick; he's good on defense but not on offense. Maybe it's time to try him with Horvat and Hansen, and put Matthias and Richie with Dorsett? I'm sure that with his vision he can at least replicate what Dorsett did against the Hawks in terms of play-making since Zack also likes to make plays from the perimeter and off the rush, and it would be a solid two-way line as well. Then we'd have a strong crash-and-bang/ work off the rush fourth line that would be better than most. Hansen - Horvat - Kassian Matthias - Richie - Dorsett // Vey Thank you! At least someone gets it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancaster Posted November 27, 2014 Share Posted November 27, 2014 "Time to give him more offensively-oriented line-mates" is more like it. From CanucksArmy's player report card: Plays come to die on Richie's stick; he's good on defense but not on offense. Maybe it's time to try him with Horvat and Hansen, and put Matthias and Richie with Dorsett? I'm sure that with his vision he can at least replicate what Dorsett did against the Hawks in terms of play-making since Zack also likes to make plays from the perimeter and off the rush, and it would be a solid two-way line as well. Then we'd have a strong crash-and-bang/ work off the rush fourth line that would be better than most. Hansen - Horvat - Kassian Matthias - Richie - Dorsett // Vey If the Canucks wanted a perimeter player to make passes, they would have kept Hodgson. Kassian is brought in to be a net front presence, to drive to the net and to be physical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nino Posted November 27, 2014 Share Posted November 27, 2014 If the Canucks wanted a perimeter player to make passes, they would have kept Hodgson. Kassian is brought in to be a net front presence, to drive to the net and to be physical. Too bad he's a perimeter player as well? Kinda the thing I don't get, how can you be called a power forward when you play the perimeter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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