[TRADE] Teravainen & Bickell to Carolina

[Bob Long]

Wow CHI coughed up a good prospect in this one. Just shows you how hard it is to get a deal done these days. 

[LaBamba]

Just now, Hutton Wink said:

Evidently you have the bar set extremely low.

 

As for the trade, this is a prime example of how important capspace is, and how it's not just about resigning your own players or UFAs.  It gives a lot of options, and management has hinted as much.  Considering the coming expansion draft, it may be in our best interests to do something similar as opposed to adding another vet or two we'd have to protect and then expose some younger players.

After your feeble attempt to belittle my comical genius you make a very good argument. It's something I have been preaching for what seems like days. 

 

We need to exploit teams who are under the salary cap gun. It's unfortunate that we already cashed in a lot of our chips with the Gudbranson trade considering most of these teams want to liquidate for only picks in exchange. Benning won't eat a bad contract because he legitimately wants to spend all of his cap on the inevitable Stanley cup run next spring.  

[Bob Long]

36 minutes ago, CHYCHRUN said:

It was bad... The 33rd pick that the Canucks gave up, all on its own, probably would've been enough to fetch both Bickell and Teravainen. Canucks would've still owned McCann and the 4th pick that we surrendered.

 

 

 

You're assuming that CHI is looking to make a western team better. They would not have done that deal with us. 

[gobi]

I think this is an instance where the failure of getting picks at the tdl really came back to bite us.  The Canucks could have both Gudbranson and TT.

[saucypass]

Outside of just this last year's playoff series, has anyone seen Teravainen perform in the playoffs? This guy proved that he was lights out the year before. 

 

Not to mention, Teuvo is still extremely young. He hasn't been getting the opportunities he could be because of such a stacked Blackhawks roster. He scored 35 points in a sheltered role in the bottom 6. He's going to breakout eventually given he gets the right coaching, the opportunity, and the right line mates. 

[Monty]

1 hour ago, SwedeHockey said:

I see. 

 

Didn't realize they got Saarela as well. 

 

Monty will pleased  

Aside from Rasmus Andersson, there is no other prospect I'm excited to see in the NHL than Saarela. At first, I was disappointed with him being traded by the Rangers; but, considering where the Rangers are headed in the future (Spoiler: Nothing pretty), the Canes are very quietly building something quite impressive. If they can land James Reimer or Fleury, they'll start to be looking like a playoff year in a year or two.

[saucypass]

1 minute ago, gobi said:

I think this is an instance where the failure of getting picks at the tdl really came back to bite us.  The Canucks could have both Gudbranson and TT.

This is very true. Might have even been able to catch up with Toronto in the Matthews sweepstakes with the way we were playing.

[Kakanucks]

The price might be different if it was offered by a team in the Western Conference.

[The Weasel]

That's it? Where the hell was JB?

[Bombastik der Teutone]

wondering if bickell is able to earn a spot on the nhl roster next season. 

[CHYCHRUN]

7 minutes ago, theminister said:

I think your math is really quite bad if you say we would come out ahead in that scenario, especially since you include Hansen going the other way, even if that would be true of Florida's perspective which i don't think it would be. They weren't wanting another contract back on top of McCann, so your logic fails there IMO.

 

Gudbranson, Bickell, TT for McCann, Hansen, 33rd, ++

 

Regardless, it's endemic to judge one GM for what another GM does especially when the whole picture has not been decided and we don't know what other moves the team has in store. It's possible that they knew the price on this trade and weren't interested in the players.

My math isn't bad, yours is. If my scenario played out, which is all wishful thinking, it would've looked like this.

 

Canucks would've had:

Teravainen

Bickell

Gudbransen

 

Florida would've had:

McCann

Hansen

 

Chi would've had:

33rd overall

 

To top that off, The Canucks would also still own the 4th rounder that they've surrendered.

[theminister]

18 minutes ago, gobi said:

I think this is an instance where the failure of getting picks at the tdl really came back to bite us.  The Canucks could have both Gudbranson and TT.

Not failure because no one wanted to give us anything of value for Vrbata or Hamhuis. Vrbata we never had any interest in and CHI was out after getting Ladd and DAL was out after getting Russel.

 

Unless you are suggesting we had moved another piece in which you would have to minus that from the asset column too so that you get a fair picture of the opportunity cost.

 

Frankly, there was'nt much we could have done.

[theminister]

Just now, CHYCHRUN said:

My math isn't bad, yours is. If my scenario played out, which is all wishful thinking, it would've looked like this.

 

Canucks would've had:

Teravainen

Bickell

Gudbransen

 

Florida would've had:

McCann

Hansen

 

Chi would've had:

33rd overall

 

To top that off, The Canucks would also still own the 4th rounder that they've surrendered.

Except you are making an assumption that Florida would have wanted Hansen at the same value of the two picks. I'm saying that is an erroneous assumption and not backed by anything tangible. 

 

So clearly you are leaving off a big part of that equation. And we take on the liability of Bickell while losing Hansen so that's where your math doesn't add up as being equal. We would still be giving up the same asset value regardless. 

 

Otherwise, we could have moved Hansen to CHI for the same deal (since you think they equal out) or moved him to another team for those picks and done the swap for TT and Bickell. Either way, the ledger looks the same.

[gobi]

6 minutes ago, theminister said:

Not failure because no one wanted to give us anything of value for Vrbata or Hamhuis. Vibrate we never had any interest in and CHI was out after getting Ladd and DAL was out after getting Russel.

 

Unless you are suggesting we had moved another piece in which you would have to minus that from the asset column too so that you get a fair picture of the opportunity cost.

 

Frankly, there was'nt much we could have done.

This wasn't the version I heard.  Chicago was interested in Hamhuis and Ladd.  Initially, Chicago went after Hamhuis but got tired of waiting and so went after Ladd instead.  I don't know whether it was because Hamhuis waited too long to make his decision or JB waited too long before approaching Hamhuis about waiving his no-trade.  In any case, the interest in Hamhuis was there.

 

I agree about Vrbata though.

[Warhippy]

5 minutes ago, CHYCHRUN said:

My math isn't bad, yours is. If my scenario played out, which is all wishful thinking, it would've looked like this.

 

Canucks would've had:

Teravainen

Bickell

Gudbransen

 

Florida would've had:

McCann

Hansen

 

Chi would've had:

33rd overall

 

To top that off, The Canucks would also still own the 4th rounder that they've surrendered.

It's fun though isn't it, to assume that EVERYTHING you fantasize happens exactly the way you wanted it too.

 

You know, believing that the Panthers would have accepted something other than McCaan the 2nd and the + for Gudbranson

 

Assuming that Chicago would willingly trade TT and that contract to a former western rival for a mere 2nd

 

I mean, hell at this rate we'd be accepting the 2nd overall and Trouba for Virtanen and the 5th right?

 

because that's how this works isn't it?  We assume everything goes the way we want it to in hindsight because the reality is to difficult to understand

[SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME]

Pretty good work this year by Ron Francis. A poster on another board summarized Carolina's moves as follows:

 

Quote

OUT

Jake Massie
Dennis Robertson
5th round pick
Eric Staal
J-M Liles
Kris Versteeg
2nd Round Pick - Rangers
3rd Round Pick (2017) - Blackhawks 

IN
Kris Versteeg
Joakim Nordstrom
3rd Round Pick (2017) - Blackhawks
3rd Round Pick - Boston
5th Round Pick (2017) - Boston
5th Round Pick - Kings
2nd Round Pick - Rangers
2nd Round Pick (2017) - Rangers
Anthony Camara
Aleksi Saarela
Valentin Zykov
Bryan Bickell
Tuevo Teravainen

 

EDIT: Caroline also holds LA's 1st and Winnipeg's 3rd in this years draft (from the Sekera and Tlusty trades in 2015).

 

[Warhippy]

Just now, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said:

Pretty good work this year by Ron Francis. A poster on another board summarized Carolina's moves as follows:

 

That's a solid return of youth and futures and only the 1 glaringly bad contract among it all

[theminister]

5 minutes ago, gobi said:

This wasn't the version I heard.  Chicago was interested in Hamhuis and Ladd.  Initially, Chicago went after Hamhuis but got tired of waiting and so went after Ladd instead.  I don't know whether it was because Hamhuis waited too long to make his decision or JB waited too long before approaching Hamhuis about waiving his no-trade.  In any case, the interest in Hamhuis was there.

 

I agree about Vrbata though.

I don't think the version you heard was correct at all. 

[CHYCHRUN]

6 minutes ago, theminister said:

Except you are making an assumption that Florida would have wanted Hansen at the same value of the two picks. I'm saying that is an erroneous assumption and not backed by anything tangible. 

 

So clearly you are leaving off a big part of that equation. And we take on the liability of Bickell while losing Hansen so that's where your math doesn't add up as being equal. We would still be giving up the same asset value regardless. 

 

Otherwise, we could have moved Hansen to CHI for the same deal (since you think they equal out) or moved him to another team for those picks and done the swap for TT and Bickell. Either way, the ledger looks the same.

Chicago didn't want any salary so no Hansen wasn't an option. This was a salary dump.

 

It was no secret that Florida wanted McCann, the 2nd was the kicker.  I'm not saying Florida would've wanted Hansen but they may have. They are an analytical team that likes good contracts who are concidered a playoff team.  

 

I did say, "if my scenario played out, which is wishful thinking".

 

 

[The Weasel]

1 hour ago, c00kies said:

TT seemed to be a bit rushed, and I think he needs to bulk up a bit. I hope Carolina plays him in the AHL if he's not ready to handle the NHL.

Sounds like McCann.