2017 NHL Draft - Chicago, Illinois June 23-24 2017

[jagaha]

How about Tanev and our 5th for Dallas 3rd and the rights to Nikushkin?

[Sugar baby watermelon]

SB Nation is doing a mock draft with different fan sites picking for each team, today is Colorados turn.  Here is the link if you are interested.  

http://www.milehighhockey.com/2017/6/13/15775012/nhl-mock-draft-2017-colorado-avalanche-select-miro-heiskanen-with-no-4-pick

 

NHL Mock Draft 2017: Colorado Avalanche select Miro Heiskanen with No. 4 Pick

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With Dallas reaching for Casey Mittelstadt at No. 3, Colorado is able to pick 2017’s best defensive prospect.

by Ryan Murphy  Jun 13, 2017, 11:00am MDT

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R1KU Exposures

The Colorado Avalanche roster has a great many needs.

Although that’s generally an undesirable situation, come draft time, fans of such a team will be hard-pressed to find fault in the reasoning of selecting a player of any particular position. When you need both forwards and defensemen in a bad way, adding a top talent of any kind to the system isn’t likely to warrant major complaints.

After April 29th’s devastating draft lottery result, where general manager Joe Sakic saw his league-worst club fall all the way to fourth in the order results, the Burgundy & Blue faithful resigned themselves to selecting whatever was leftover after New Jersey, Philadelphia and Dallas picks. That almost certainly meant losing out on the consensus Top-2 forward talents, Nolan Patrick and Nico Hischier. It also likely meant missing out on the top defensive prospect in the draft, Finnish blue liner Miro Heiskanen, as the Dallas Stars have also long been identified as defense-needy roster.

Only that’s not the way it turned out.

The Draft Board

Our compadres at Defending Big D opted to pick Casey Mittelstadt, the American center from from the USHL’s Green Bay Gamblers, whom many anticipate to go pretty high in the draft, but maybe not quite that high. This was quite a coup for the Brain Trust here at Mile High Hockey. Sure, we were still missing out on Patrick and Hischier, but we now had the opportunity to choose from all of our favorite remaining players.

• Would we pick right wing Owen Tippett with his explosive skating ability and amazing shot?
• Perhaps the fast-rising center Gabriel Vilardi, quickly becoming known for his wonderful hands and elite hockey sense?
• Or would it be the talented Finnish defenseman, Heiskanen, that Dallas just passed up in lieu of adding to their already considerable forward talent?

The Verdict

Where would Heiskanen fit in?

The 17-year-old would immediately rise to the top of an already-intriguing group of young signed blue liners in the Avalanche system, many of whom should start to make an impact at the NHL level in the coming years.

• Miro Heiskanen
• Nicolas Meloche
• Andrei Mironov
• Chris Bigras
• Anton Lindholm
• Sergei Boikov
• Mason Geertsen

We liked each of these players—and like I said earlier, the Avalanche system could use all of them. A choice had to be made. Ultimately, it was decided, despite improvements made in the last year, the team could most benefit from a top blue-line talent like Heiskanen. A left-handed shooter like many of our other defensive prospects, sure, but one that’s been playing the right side. He doesn’t have gaudy offensive numbers or an intimidating shot, but he has room to grow in these areas and already possesses a well-rounded game and ice awareness this roster badly needs.

Heiskanen also had another thing going for him: he’s been playing in the top professional Finnish league, which has been turning out some of the most exciting prospects in the NHL in recent years, including our own Mikko Rantanen. Unlike his Canadian CHL contemporaries, he’s been developing his game against professional men and navigating a professional practice and travel schedule. Considering that Heiskanen is already on the young side of this draft (he doesn’t turn 18 until July 18th), he’s really ahead of the curve in a number of important areas.

His path would also allow him to play in the AHL next season and fast-track his way onto the NHL roster, just like his fellow Fin, Rantanen. For an Avalanche team that needs to properly develop players withing its system as badly as it needs immediate talent infusion, the possibility of another top European skater is too good to pass up.

The Word

So what’s the big deal about of Miro Heiskanen? Let’s get the run-down from some great sources from around SBNation.

It’s All About the Jersey

“Heiskanen seems to have the potential to turn into a reliable top 4 defensemen that can play in all situations and do it well. He may even have the potential to be a #1 down the road. The tools are certainly there, he just needs to keep getting stronger and rounding out his game.”

Raw Charge

“In 30 games last season for HIFK U20, Heiskanen only had 6 penalty minutes. The year before for HIFK U18, he had eight penalty minutes in 35 games. To add even more perspective to his lack of penalties, in 51 games of international play with Team Finland, he has exactly two penalty minutes.”

So clearly, according to the logic of a certain hockey beat writer, he’s way too soft to be a good NHLer! Forget we ever said anything!

[Fanuck]

1 minute ago, Sugar baby watermelon said:

SB Nation is doing a mock draft with different fan sites picking for each team, today is Colorados turn.  Here is the link if you are interested.  

http://www.milehighhockey.com/2017/6/13/15775012/nhl-mock-draft-2017-colorado-avalanche-select-miro-heiskanen-with-no-4-pick

 

NHL Mock Draft 2017: Colorado Avalanche select Miro Heiskanen with No. 4

 

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The Colorado Avalanche roster has a great many needs.

Although that’s generally an undesirable situation, come draft time, fans of such a team will be hard-pressed to find fault in the reasoning of selecting a player of any particular position. When you need both forwards and defensemen in a bad way, adding a top talent of any kind to the system isn’t likely to warrant major complaints.

After April 29th’s devastating draft lottery result, where general manager Joe Sakic saw his league-worst club fall all the way to fourth in the order results, the Burgundy & Blue faithful resigned themselves to selecting whatever was leftover after New Jersey, Philadelphia and Dallas picks. That almost certainly meant losing out on the consensus Top-2 forward talents, Nolan Patrick and Nico Hischier. It also likely meant missing out on the top defensive prospect in the draft, Finnish blue liner Miro Heiskanen, as the Dallas Stars have also long been identified as defense-needy roster.

Only that’s not the way it turned out.

The Draft Board

Our compadres at Defending Big D opted to pick Casey Mittelstadt, the American center from from the USHL’s Green Bay Gamblers, whom many anticipate to go pretty high in the draft, but maybe not quite that high. This was quite a coup for the Brain Trust here at Mile High Hockey. Sure, we were still missing out on Patrick and Hischier, but we now had the opportunity to choose from all of our favorite remaining players.

• Would we pick right wing Owen Tippett with his explosive skating ability and amazing shot?
• Perhaps the fast-rising center Gabriel Vilardi, quickly becoming known for his wonderful hands and elite hockey sense?
• Or would it be the talented Finnish defenseman, Heiskanen, that Dallas just passed up in lieu of adding to their already considerable forward talent?

The Verdict

I like this article.....because they don't mention Glass......meaning he'll be there at #5! 

[Sugar baby watermelon]

Just now, Fanuck said:

I like this article.....because they don't mention Glass......meaning he'll be there at #5! 

Haha awesome, I am hoping between Glass or Vilardi but won't be disappointed with Middlestadt

 

Is that skull picture Skull skates?  I seem to recall that one from way back when

[Fanuck]

Just now, Sugar baby watermelon said:

Haha awesome, I am hoping between Glass or Vilardi but won't be disappointed with Middlestadt

 

Is that skull picture Skull skates?  I seem to recall that one from way back when

You're close.....Powell Peralta Bones Brigade from back in the day! 

[Sugar baby watermelon]

yes, I was just trying to research it online!!  haha thanks..  you know what that would make a sick tattoo

[TheHitman]

9 minutes ago, jagaha said:

How about Tanev and our 5th for Dallas 3rd and the rights to Nikushkin?

Why would we want the rights to Nichuskin? This is pretty much Tanev straight up for a player that probably won't come back to the NHL...

[ashlynnbrookefan]

23 minutes ago, The Sedge said:

Meh, Kings won with stellar goaltending and great defensive systems.  

Bruins won with great defense and a little help from the stripes.  They basically did it with an AHL level goalie in Tim Thomas too (sorry, but he's garbage)

Both teams also had fast skilled players.

 

I don't think the style of the NHL has changed as drastically as people say it has.  Guys speed and skill will never be obsolete.  Speed, skill and size, that's the player everyone wants.

 

To your point about defense though, you're right.  There have been a lot of dud defensemen picked early on, and a lot of all stars picked in later rounds.  It's a risk for sure.

It took Thomas a long time to figure it out and make it in the NHL but when he did he certainly wasn't garbage, he was damn good for a few years. 

[ForsbergTheGreat]

2 minutes ago, Fanuck said:

All things being equal, I will always, always defer to knowledgeable hockey people who have actually seen the prospects play live versus quality competition.  I thought that the book on Makar however is that he was playing among older competition and not only surviving, but dominating. 

 

According to who, the people pumping him up.  He's comp is extremely watered down, the only overagers still in that league are the ones that either couldn't cut it in the WHL and came back to play, or the ones that never had any scholarship offers, 

 

They way the last 5 year in that league have went (and the BCHL), anyone who's any good, gets plucked out to play NCAA before their 19th birthday. Just like Fabbro, Jost, & Cholowski did last year in the BCHL.  Or like last years AJHL top draft eligible D Pasichnuk who put up even more impressive numbers than Makar.  It's not bigger faster and strong, in fact is the opposite, even Ferraro stated the from him making the jump from Ontario Junior A to the USHL.

 

Quote

Ferraro, a native of King City, Ontario, and ranked 78th among North American skaters for the NHL Draft, is in his first year in the USHL after competing in the OJHL for the two prior seasons.

“It’s been a great experience. It’s definitely a different game. The speed and physicality,” Ferraro said. “It’s been a huge adjustment, but my teammates and coaches have really supported me.”

 

Now you compare that to a player like Vilardi where on any give night there's 20 out of 40 players, already have their rights are owned NHL clubs. 

 

 

2 minutes ago, Fanuck said:

 

Yes, I know all the concerns about the AJHL vs. BCHL vs. WHL, vs. USHL ect....but when the also-rans were eliminated from the playoffs and his team was facing excellent competition, he still dominated.  Furthermore, when he played in the WJAC he dominated there as well - that tournament produced guys like Jost, Tarasenko and Turris. 

The WJAC is only eligible to junior A players, so it's the same level of competition just on a world level. Had he did that in the u18 or WJC then maybe he would have proved something but he didn't so it's still high risk.

 

Turris destroyed the BCHL apart, people thought he was going to be a franchise player and ended up going 3rd overall because of it.  Sure he's a decent NHL, but he's not even close to being considered elite. He's barley passable for a #1 c.  It took him 8 years to crack 30 points.  He's the perfect example of game not translating as smoothly into the NHL. 

 

2 minutes ago, Fanuck said:

Don't get me wrong, I'm not sold on this kid and am leaning towards Glass who comes from a tried and true league where success can be far more accurately (not perfectly, but more accurately) projected into NHL success - but I don't see him as being risky in the sense that some people do where they're making it sound like taking him at 5 is a wasted pick.  I'd have my reservations, but there's enough body of work there for me to be confident he could develop into something useful of a 5th overall in a mediocre draft. 

 

People act as if Makar is the only talented, offensive skating defenseman in this draft.  Plenty of young D players have that dynamic skill set but it all comes down to will that game translate.  Typically D men like him don't go in the first round (see; Gostisbehere, Letang, Vatanen, Montour, Barrie and recently Mete) simply due to the risk/reward.  Since they are a higher risk, if they don’t produce they become reliabilities.  That's also why D men who have nearly similar skill sets in this year’s draft like Ferraro, Walsh & Jokiharju are all expected to be taken in the late second areas. The biggest thing that separates the players is hype, 4 games shouldn’t define a players draft value, but it so often does.  Had Walsh.  Draft hype can greatly over inflate a player or lack of hype could hurt them (see Chychrun last year).

 

In the last 10 years only 3 D under 6'0" were drafted in the top 10.  It does occasionally happens but usually that's when they have far less risk, and have proven themselves at the higher levels. Reilly, Dumba, & Hickey, and even in Hickey’s case he hasn’t really translated that well at the NHL level

 

D are already extremely hard to predict there development, not if you consider that and the fact that he’s even a bigger unknown due to the competition you have zero way of being able to predict how his game would translate.  It’s so hard to judge a player dominated a lesser league.  Last summer I played against Ferklund in a charity rec league tournament and if you wouldn’t have known you would have thought he was a 60 goal scorer in the NHL.   Dale Wiese was known at the dutch Greztky from how he was able to play in that lesser league, yet he couldn’t even crack the 30 point mark in the NHL.  And the best example is Jankowski who dominated high School hockey to the point where flames thought he was going to be the best player to come out of the draft.  He still looks like he will be an NHLer but not the elite 1st line center flames pegged him to become,  and instead of the flames taking Hertl, Ceci, Teravainen, Maatta, they took a high risk player.  A player that could have been had in the second round.   

 

2 minutes ago, Fanuck said:

He's going to the NCAA where he'd be eligible for 4 years of development as well and he wouldn't have to be stuck like Virt was between leagues (WHL/NHL). 

He's going to the NCAA where he will be compared directly with his future teammate and draft eligible Mario Ferraro.  The last thing this fan base needs is a player canucks could have taken in the 3rd round out performing the 3rd overall pick. 

[ForsbergTheGreat]

32 minutes ago, The Sedge said:

Meh, Kings won with stellar goaltending and great defensive systems.  

Bruins won with great defense and a little help from the stripes.  They basically did it with an AHL level goalie in Tim Thomas too (sorry, but he's garbage)

Both teams also had fast skilled players.

 

I don't think the style of the NHL has changed as drastically as people say it has.  Guys speed and skill will never be obsolete.  Speed, skill and size, that's the player everyone wants.

 

To your point about defense though, you're right.  There have been a lot of dud defensemen picked early on, and a lot of all stars picked in later rounds.  It's a risk for sure.

That's not how some people saw it.

 

"If you watch the NHL playoffs, you need size and strength to get to the net, stay in front of the net, to deflect pucks, to get rebounds," "We were looking for that style of players and we were happy who we ended up with. 

 

When asked aobut picking that type of player over skill....

 

"We're going to get back to a meat and potatoes style of in the trenches. Play hard, So we really didn't consider that"

[-Vintage Canuck-]

 

[stawns]

37 minutes ago, ForsbergTheGreat said:

 

According to who, the people pumping him up.  He's comp is extremely watered down, the only overagers still in that league are the ones that either couldn't cut it in the WHL and came back to play, or the ones that never had any scholarship offers, 

 

They way the last 5 year in that league have went (and the BCHL), anyone who's any good, gets plucked out to play NCAA before their 19th birthday. Just like Fabbro, Jost, & Cholowski did last year in the BCHL.  Or like last years AJHL top draft eligible D Pasichnuk who put up even more impressive numbers than Makar.  It's not bigger faster and strong, in fact is the opposite, even Ferraro stated the from him making the jump from Ontario Junior A to the USHL.

 

 

Now you compare that to a player like Vilardi where on any give night there's 20 out of 40 players, already have their rights are owned NHL clubs. 

 

 

The WJAC is only eligible to junior A players, so it's the same level of competition just on a world level. Had he did that in the u18 or WJC then maybe he would have proved something but he didn't so it's still high risk.

 

Turris destroyed the BCHL apart, people thought he was going to be a franchise player and ended up going 3rd overall because of it.  Sure he's a decent NHL, but he's not even close to being considered elite. He's barley passable for a #1 c.  It took him 8 years to crack 30 points.  He's the perfect example of game not translating as smoothly into the NHL. 

 

 

People act as if Makar is the only talented, offensive skating defenseman in this draft.  Plenty of young D players have that dynamic skill set but it all comes down to will that game translate.  Typically D men like him don't go in the first round (see; Gostisbehere, Letang, Vatanen, Montour, Barrie and recently Mete) simply due to the risk/reward.  Since they are a higher risk, if they don’t produce they become reliabilities.  That's also why D men who have nearly similar skill sets in this year’s draft like Ferraro, Walsh & Jokiharju are all expected to be taken in the late second areas. The biggest thing that separates the players is hype, 4 games shouldn’t define a players draft value, but it so often does.  Had Walsh.  Draft hype can greatly over inflate a player or lack of hype could hurt them (see Chychrun last year).

 

In the last 10 years only 3 D under 6'0" were drafted in the top 10.  It does occasionally happens but usually that's when they have far less risk, and have proven themselves at the higher levels. Reilly, Dumba, & Hickey, and even in Hickey’s case he hasn’t really translated that well at the NHL level

 

D are already extremely hard to predict there development, not if you consider that and the fact that he’s even a bigger unknown due to the competition you have zero way of being able to predict how his game would translate.  It’s so hard to judge a player dominated a lesser league.  Last summer I played against Ferklund in a charity rec league tournament and if you wouldn’t have known you would have thought he was a 60 goal scorer in the NHL.   Dale Wiese was known at the dutch Greztky from how he was able to play in that lesser league, yet he couldn’t even crack the 30 point mark in the NHL.  And the best example is Jankowski who dominated high School hockey to the point where flames thought he was going to be the best player to come out of the draft.  He still looks like he will be an NHLer but not the elite 1st line center flames pegged him to become,  and instead of the flames taking Hertl, Ceci, Teravainen, Maatta, they took a high risk player.  A player that could have been had in the second round.   

 

He's going to the NCAA where he will be compared directly with his future teammate and draft eligible Mario Ferraro.  The last thing this fan base needs is a player canucks could have taken in the 3rd round out performing the 3rd overall pick. 

well said

[messier's_elbow]

If we skip on the Gabe at 5 heads will roll!

[Alflives]

2 minutes ago, messier's_elbow said:

If we skip on the Gabe at 5 heads will roll!

Would skipping Vilardi be like skipping Tkatchuk last draft?

[messier's_elbow]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

Would skipping Vilardi be like skipping Tkatchuk last draft?

In my mind it would be, especially if we take Makar at 5 who will play 3 years in college or Vilardi who will probably be a pro in the 2018-19 season. Glass is my second choice at 5, but I see Vilardi being slightly better long term. 

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, messier's_elbow said:

In my mind it would be, especially if we take Makar at 5 who will play 3 years in college or Vilardi who will probably be a pro in the 2018-19 season. Glass is my second choice at 5, but I see Vilardi being slightly better long term. 

Heard on 1040 this morning that Vilardi is a "man child" who gets it done.  He's got a super high compete too.  He was compared (I forgot by whom) to a tougher Draisatl.

[stawns]

4 minutes ago, messier's_elbow said:

In my mind it would be, especially if we take Makar at 5 who will play 3 years in college or Vilardi who will probably be a pro in the 2018-19 season. Glass is my second choice at 5, but I see Vilardi being slightly better long term. 

I see it the opposite way, similar to Tkachuk and OJ.  I think Vilardi has the body to come into the league earlier and have a good start, but Glass will be the better player, over time.

[CanuckGAME]

1 hour ago, The Sedge said:

Meh, Kings won with stellar goaltending and great defensive systems.  

Bruins won with great defense and a little help from the stripes.  They basically did it with an AHL level goalie in Tim Thomas too (sorry, but he's garbage)

Both teams also had fast skilled players.

 

I don't think the style of the NHL has changed as drastically as people say it has.  Guys speed and skill will never be obsolete.  Speed, skill and size, that's the player everyone wants.

 

To your point about defense though, you're right.  There have been a lot of dud defensemen picked early on, and a lot of all stars picked in later rounds.  It's a risk for sure.

Yeah.    Had to stop reading this ridiculous post after i saw you say Tim Thomas was trash.  I don't like the guy, not even a little, but he was a beast.

 

Stanley cup champion

Conn smythe winner

2x vezina winner

Jennings winner

4x all star

[messier's_elbow]

21 minutes ago, stawns said:

I see it the opposite way, similar to Tkachuk and OJ.  I think Vilardi has the body to come into the league earlier and have a good start, but Glass will be the better player, over time.

I like Vilardi and Glass. Would love them at 3 and 5 but probably a pipe dream...

[messier's_elbow]

26 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Heard on 1040 this morning that Vilardi is a "man child" who gets it done.  He's got a super high compete too.  He was compared (I forgot by whom) to a tougher Draisatl.

I honestly don't have much faith in JB. He probably wants Makar or Petterson over Vilardi and Glass