[Discussion] Karlsson FA

[canucksnihilist]

I know it is extremely unlikely, but I'd like your thoughts on the possibility:

 

Pros:

1. Elite D. 

2. Age.  28 years old.

3. Longevity.  Most elite D can play to mid-30s and be productive.  Most can still make a difference in their late 30s.  So 6-10 years.

4. Mentor

 

Cons:

1. Cap hit.  Would we even have 10 million to spend?  Would that cause us huge problems in a few years?

 

There must be more pros and cons.  Is he a good team player?  Is that how the canucks should spend cap space?

 

Just looking for opinions.  There is a small possibility he might agree to play here - but pie in the sky dreaming:  do we want him?  Does he fit into the plan?  I'd rather have him than another 3 more mid-level FAs, but maybe there is more to it than that.

 

thanks for your replies...

 

/peace

 

 

 

[goalie13]

I have said this before in similar threads.  Stay the course.

 

This team is still a few years away from really competing.  Bringing on a high priced, long term FA now will only handcuff the team from signing their own players down the road, and likely not have the returns you are hoping for.

 

You can get much cheaper guys to be mentors.

 

Besides, it has been reported that Karlsson included the Canucks on his 10 team no trade list.  Why would he turn around and sign here as a free agent?  It's more likely that he will sign with a contender.

[PhillipBlunt]

19 minutes ago, canucksnihilist said:

I know it is extremely unlikely, but I'd like your thoughts on the possibility:

Quote

Pros:

1. Elite D. 

2. Age.  28 years old.

3. Longevity.  Most elite D can play to mid-30s and be productive.  Most can still make a difference in their late 30s.  So 6-10 years.

4. Mentor

5. Can quarterback a powerplay with the best of them

6. Is underrated defensively

7. Has amazing physical endurance, playing through serious injuries

 

Cons:

1. Cap hit.  Would we even have 10 million to spend?  Would that cause us huge problems in a few years?

2. Injury history. Achilles tendon lacerated, two hairline heel fractures, torn tendons in left foot

 

There must be more pros and cons.  Is he a good team player?  Is that how the canucks should spend cap space?

 

Just looking for opinions.  There is a small possibility he might agree to play here - but pie in the sky dreaming:  do we want him?  Does he fit into the plan?  I'd rather have him than another 3 more mid-level FAs, but maybe there is more to it than that.

 

thanks for your replies...

 

/peace

 

I'd love to see Karlsson in a Canucks uniform.

[PhillipBlunt]

Just now, goalie13 said:

I have said this before in similar threads.  Stay the course.

 

This team is still a few years away from really competing.  Bringing on a high priced, long term FA now will only handcuff the team from signing their own players down the road, and likely not have the returns you are hoping for.

 

You can get much cheaper guys to be mentors.

 

Besides, it has been reported that Karlsson included the Canucks on his 10 team no trade list.  Why would he turn around and sign here as a free agent?  It's more likely that he will sign with a contender.

Never heard this. Is there a source?

[goalie13]

1 minute ago, PhillipBlunt said:

I'd love to see Karlsson in a Canucks uniform.

Sure, but I don't think Karlsson would love to see Karlsson in a Canucks uniform.

 

2 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said:

Never heard this. Is there a source?

It was never confirmed, but at the time there was lots of media speculation that most of Canada was on that list.

 

It's funny, in the last Karlsson thread people jumped on me for saying 'speculated' as they claimed it was fact.  I won't claim it as a fact as I have no source to back it up.  But it remains a solid possibility that it is true and that EK is only interested in contending teams.

[kloubek]

Even if we were on the no-trade list, it might have been because we really sucked.  Maybe people can start to see what we are building here now.

 

It is rare someone of this caliber becomes available as a FA.  If he was, I would consider it.  Him and Hughes would give us that 1-2 punch from the back end we haven't had since... well... ever.  Imagine - a true quarterback on each PP unit?  Yes please.

[PhillipBlunt]

1 minute ago, goalie13 said:

Sure, but I don't think Karlsson would love to see Karlsson in a Canucks uniform.

 

It was never confirmed, but at the time there was lots of media speculation that most of Canada was on that list.

 

It's funny, in the last Karlsson thread people jumped on me for saying 'speculated' as they claimed it was fact.  I won't claim it as a fact as I have no source to back it up.  But it remains a solid possibility that it is true and that EK is only interested in contending teams.

Well, until it is confirmed by either Karlsson or his agent, it is speculation.

[Outsiders]

1 minute ago, goalie13 said:

Sure, but I don't think Karlsson would love to see Karlsson in a Canucks uniform.

 

It was never confirmed, but at the time there was lots of media speculation that most of Canada was on that list.

 

It's funny, in the last Karlsson thread people jumped on me for saying 'speculated' as they claimed it was fact.  I won't claim it as a fact as I have no source to back it up.  But it remains a solid possibility that it is true and that EK is only interested in contending teams.

I think you got it backwards. I'm pretty sure the media was saying NO Canadian teams were on his list. 

[goalie13]

1 minute ago, Outsiders said:

I think you got it backwards. I'm pretty sure the media was saying NO Canadian teams were on his list. 

I think I got it right.

 

It was a 10 team no-trade list.

[goalie13]

2 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said:

Well, until it is confirmed by either Karlsson or his agent, it is speculation.

Agreed.  But I think it's one of those "where there's smoke, there's fire" kind of things.  It seems fairly plausible.

[PhillipBlunt]

2 minutes ago, goalie13 said:

Agreed.  But I think it's one of those "where there's smoke, there's fire" kind of things.  It seems fairly plausible.

Fair enough. Sometimes where there's smoke, there's just some dudes getting stoned though.

 

It wouldn't surprise me though. When you're where he's at in his career, you'd want to be closer to the playoffs versus farther away. We'll see how things play out. I'd be happy to see Karlsson signed by the Canucks, if that were to happen, but I'd be even happier if Juolevi and Hughes join the team next year and run with it.

[goalie13]

Just now, PhillipBlunt said:

Fair enough. Sometimes where there's smoke, there's just some dudes getting stoned though.

 

It wouldn't surprise me though. When you're where he's at in his career, you'd want to be closer to the playoffs versus farther away. We'll see how things play out. I'd be happy to see Karlsson signed by the Canucks, if that were to happen, but I'd be even happier if Juolevi and Hughes join the team next year and run with it.

And sometimes it's the media needing something to keep viewers / listeners / readers engaged 24 hours a day when there's not enough news to actually fill the time.

 

If it were a short term, Sundin-like deal I would totally agree.  I just worry that he's going to be looking for a deal that would become an albatross over the years of the deal.

 

I totally agree with your last line, but I also look at Woo being close behind them as well.

[PhillipBlunt]

1 minute ago, goalie13 said:

And sometimes it's the media needing something to keep viewers / listeners / readers engaged 24 hours a day when there's not enough news to actually fill the time.

Totally. The hockey rumour mill is it's own media industry.

1 minute ago, goalie13 said:

If it were a short term, Sundin-like deal I would totally agree.  I just worry that he's going to be looking for a deal that would become an albatross over the years of the deal.

My main concern with Karlsson is the multiple injuries he's sustained to his lower half. That stuff will catch up with him

1 minute ago, goalie13 said:

I totally agree with your last line, but I also look at Woo being close behind them as well.

Good point. Forgot about Woo.

[goalie13]

Just now, PhillipBlunt said:

My main concern with Karlsson is the multiple injuries he's sustained to his lower half. That stuff will catch up with him

Same here.  That's why I worry about long term deals.  Those injuries may already be catching up with him.

 

2015-16 82 pts

2016-17 71 pts

2017-18 62 pts

2018-19 on pace for 48 pts

[PhillipBlunt]

1 minute ago, goalie13 said:

Same here.  That's why I worry about long term deals.  Those injuries may already be catching up with him.

 

2015-16 82 pts

2016-17 71 pts

2017-18 62 pts

2018-19 on pace for 48 pts

Achilles tendon lacerated, two hairline heel fractures, torn tendons in left foot.

 

Both skeletal and muscular damage within a fairly short time frame. Yikes.

[aGENT]

I'm personally fine with either route. Continue building through the draft/trade etc or look in to signing Karlsson to compliment our rebuild. 

 

I think it would be foolish to not at least kick tires on the possibility of bringing him here if he's interested. He's an elite, generational D.

 

And with EP40 doing what he's doing, not to mention Boeser, Horvat etc, guys like Hughes and OJ on the way...we may just have pieces UFA's like him will actually WANT to come play with.

 

We also have the low cap/cash commitments the next few years that would allow us to front load a deal.

 

As for his contract/cap hit:

 

On 2018-11-17 at 10:48 AM, aGENT said:

Probably work out even better if you did the first two years at $12 (large bonuses for cash up front) and lets you go down to $6 on the final two.

 

Something like

12, 12, 10, 8, 8, 6, 6 = 62 / 7 years = $8.857

 

That averages out to $10m per over the first 5 years and more money up front is always preferred (more opportunity for interest/investment gains).

 

Point stands that there's a quite conceivable route to get Karlsson at or near that $8.5-$9 range.

Imagine we re-sign Edler for 2+/- years and go with something like this next year:

 

Edler, Karlsson

Hughes, Tanev

Hutton/Juolevi, Gudbranson/Stecher

 

Hutton/Juolevi, Gudbranson/Stecher

 

That's a ridiculously deep/good top 8 with killer puck movement ability. Those bottom 4 guys can probably swap in/out depending on injuries, opponent, slumps etc and you move Tanev at the TDL for futures.

 

Maybe rotate all of Hughes/Hutton/OJ if healthy to keep young guys fresh (or start OJ in Utica, no rush).

 

Yes please.

[oldnews]

Pass.

[Tre Mac]

Pass.  Past his prime and sounds like a 'me first' kind of player. 

 

1 hour ago, goalie13 said:

I have said this before in similar threads.  Stay the course.

 

This team is still a few years away from really competing.  Bringing on a high priced, long term FA now will only handcuff the team from signing their own players down the road, and likely not have the returns you are hoping for.

 

You can get much cheaper guys to be mentors.

 

Besides, it has been reported that Karlsson included the Canucks on his 10 team no trade list.  Why would he turn around and sign here as a free agent?  It's more likely that he will sign with a contender.

Agreed.  I really hope they don't go all in on Karlsson or Bobrovsky(sp?) and stay the course, but I am highly skeptical of that happening. 

[timmylu1]

All Swedish and no finnish 

[Nucker 67]

He's already said "no" to Canadian teams (or teams with intelligent fan bases). He just wants to collect his millions without being recognized around town. So, why are we still pining for him? Karlsson signed with a contender, and that team isn't very good this year. He has 1 goal in his first 21 games (and a -6). 

 

over-rated