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[Report] Canucks File 'Cutdown' Arbitration With Raymond


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#91 goblix

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 08:05 PM

Sure, why wouldn't we bring back the most useless player on this team, who has been given EVERY opportunity to succeed, but continuously failed....

And I'm tired of the 'no off season' crap people keep saying. What about the year before? He had a full of season then and still crapped the bed. He's had ONE good season...flukes happen.


I hate the Mason Raymond abuse... Sure he was frustrating to watch in all of the games this year but he's still 26 and is the top 3 fastest in our team. Lets look at the stats you are calling him out for:

2010-2011 season he 15 goals, 24 assists, 39 assists in 70 games... so terrible isn't it? nah it's a bit subpar but not terrible.
2011-2011 season he had 10 goals, 10 assists, 20 ponts in 55 games... pretty bad indeed but one bad year isn't indicative that he is a bad player.

Having this arbitration we can give Raymond the assurance that we gave Sturm, he'll have a shot at pre-season and a few weeks into the season. If it works then we have a killer scoring speed line in Booth - Kesler - Raymond at a reduced cost, alongside his penalty killing capabilities, and 2nd powerplay time. At worst we find a trade for pick or bottom 6 depth. There is definitely more Reward then Risk in this move.

So peeps take a chill pill, use your head and stop bashing players because everyone else is.

#92 BenSurgeon

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 09:03 PM

Raymond may be a better fit elsewhere but for the Canucks he is too soft. The early playoff exit showed that they are too soft and then MG offers Raymond a contract of 2.21 million. I think that money could be better spent elsewhere.
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#93 hockeyking

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 09:06 PM

I hate the Mason Raymond abuse... Sure he was frustrating to watch in all of the games this year but he's still 26 and is the top 3 fastest in our team. Lets look at the stats you are calling him out for:

2010-2011 season he 15 goals, 24 assists, 39 assists in 70 games... so terrible isn't it? nah it's a bit subpar but not terrible.
2011-2011 season he had 10 goals, 10 assists, 20 ponts in 55 games... pretty bad indeed but one bad year isn't indicative that he is a bad player.

Having this arbitration we can give Raymond the assurance that we gave Sturm, he'll have a shot at pre-season and a few weeks into the season. If it works then we have a killer scoring speed line in Booth - Kesler - Raymond at a reduced cost, alongside his penalty killing capabilities, and 2nd powerplay time. At worst we find a trade for pick or bottom 6 depth. There is definitely more Reward then Risk in this move.

So peeps take a chill pill, use your head and stop bashing players because everyone else is.


I agree

#94 oldnews

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 09:37 PM

Not a surprise. Gillis said he wasn't giving up on Raymond, and flame away all you want, but a healthy Raymond at 2.2 could turn out to be a very good deal. If the Canucks decide to move him, there would definitely be interest in Raymond at a less than average NHL cap hit. Very reasonable move by Gillis. Nothing I'd love more than to see Raymond score 30 goals and 60 points, and shut CDC up.

#95 RunningWild

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 09:39 PM

I realize that there are people who have some sort of personal vendetta with Raymond. I'm not one of them. But I do feel he's not a fit on this team anymore. We know how AV uses each line - he's the most radical coach in the NHL, I don't see Raymonds style of play contributing on any of them.

But I do find it strange that this whole situation is happening. Risking further public image issues and peeving off current/future players over a potential $400K of cap space? This is a guy who was drafted by the Canucks and came up in their system. $400K of cap space. They've got a bottom 6 d-man making $4.2M, and this is the course they take? Perhaps they trade Ballard in the offseason, perhaps they are clearing this space for a bigger trade. Amidst all this are rumors (a rumor) that Raymond wants to leave. Strange situation.

Edited by RunningWild, 13 June 2012 - 09:42 PM.


#96 Mr.DirtyDangles

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 09:44 PM

Bringing down his caphit will make him more appealing in a trade.

Good on Gillis.


THIS ^^^ I have followed MayrRay since juniors. I want him to shut up CDC'ers with a break out year but it may be time for a change of scenery.

Edited by vanfan73, 13 June 2012 - 09:46 PM.

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#97 RyanKeslord17

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 10:03 PM

This makes me think that MG will see how MayRay plays and if he continues to slump, or play poorly, he'll likely shop him around or he's gone at the deadline.
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#98 oldnews

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 10:07 PM

Gilman stressed that Raymond is a player the Canucks still very much view as a valuable asset.
"If we didn't feel that Mason was worthwhile we would have not qualified him and allowed him to become an unrestricted free agent on July 1," Gilman said.
"Mason is an important part of our team and has been for five years. We obviously plan for Mason to be a component of this team going forward. And Mason has the full support of our organization through this process."

http://www.faceoff.c...8024/story.html

#99 Phamda

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 10:17 PM

The Canucks should just do what STL and PIT did last year with D'Agostini and Kennedy. Don't qualify either but signed them both on July 1st to "cheaper" deals.

#100 EternalCanuckFan

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 10:29 PM

The Canucks should just do what STL and PIT did last year with D'Agostini and Kennedy. Don't qualify either but signed them both on July 1st to "cheaper" deals.


Maybe the Canucks' brass doesn't see Raymond sticking around if he gets to test unrestricted free agency. There was a thread about there being some interest in Raymond around the league. If that's true and if that means that other GMs are willing to pay him more than the Canucks, why wouldn't he consider those options?

#101 L'Orange

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 10:39 PM

The Canucks would only be signing Mason Raymond so that they may use him in a larger trade.

His value alone is not enough to sign him. I liked the kid's speed and sandpaper, but the back injury is a red flag.

This is something that will be the most significant trade since Luongo coming here.

It involves a roster player and a new addition with Raymond for either a marquee defenceman or a dominant power forward.

I've even heard a rumor of a Schneider to Boston, Lucic to Vancouver trade being looked at.

The Canucks need something serious. Either goaltender in my mind is golden.

You give Vancouver's defence a couple of top 4 additions to compliment Hamhuis, Bieksa, Salo (resigned), and Tanev, and either goalie is elite. Canucks fans should consider this before opening their yaps.

Defence, defense, defence.
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#102 knuck

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Posted 14 June 2012 - 11:36 AM

no one can sign him to an offer sheet while in arbitration, correct? obviously the canucks can't qualify and trade him, so what's the out?

#103 n00bxQb

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Posted 14 June 2012 - 01:11 PM

So do you guys think MayRay will opt for a 1-year or 2-year deal? I think he'll probably do 2 years.

#104 The Lock

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Posted 14 June 2012 - 01:19 PM

Agreed. I personally would be happy with either goalie, just as long as we get better on defence. I'm really interested to see what can get addressed this offseason.
This thread was really just a figment of your imagination...

#105 TheCammer

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Posted 14 June 2012 - 02:26 PM

The idea of icing all the same forwards next yr who could only win 1 playoff game - is alarming. Seriously, call 911. Considering they are all under contract next season (minus Pahlsson), it's a distinct possibility. *sobs*

I don't think you will see that. I think this is a matter of holding onto as many assets as possible
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#106 Canuck Surfer

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Posted 14 June 2012 - 04:05 PM

The Canucks have shown Raymond loyalty a few times now by re-signing him

I'd hope Raymond reciprocates by not being such a bloody floater of a player next season.


Wow, that is pretty heavy cursing Hockeyville? :blush:

Because Raymond is an RFA, we would have to qualify him meaning we have no choice but to offer 2.6 mil or let him walk as a UFA. But by taking him to arbitration it can go as low as 2.21. The max saving we can get is 15%. I'm hoping they get that 15% saving and then turn around and trade him.


I'd like to know if there is a mandatory term in this arbitration, 1 year, 2 year, 2??? Weber had 2 years, Parise 1. I would assume one year, but term also impacts the decision. Anyone know???

On the surface, taking a player to arbitration for lower pay seems like a harsh way to treat someone who is coming back from a very serious injury. BUT if Gillis informed Mason's camp that the intent is to keep him at 85% of this year's salary and protect him from arbitration, I can see Raymond appreciating that gesture.

I just hope this won't turn out to be another Willie Mitchel in the making.


In hindsight, Willie had a right to be mad. The Canucks made a business decision to sign other players because Willie did not have medical clearance. Really it was tactical, get players July 1 when available because Willie was not. I bet they would have liked to sign Willie, but were being conscientious to committing $'s. Would you sign a construction worker who could not walk a beam? Sounds harsh, but players and teams can secure injury insurance to protect wages...

Willie was a casualty, but really it looks like we wore the decision even if it sounded reasonable at the time.

And the situation was a bit different, Willie was a UFA.

Squire Barnes just reported on Global news at 6:30 that he heard that Raymond wants to go somewhere else, maybe Winnipeg. He gave a little blurb about the arbitration thing, then reiterated "I heard he wants to go somewhere else".


I could see a guy who broke his back for the team getting a bit bitter about arbitration?

Bigger picture > Willie left pissed, Lou is (heavily) rumoured to want out, CoHo is gone, Kesler has squawked a couple of times in response to AV (and possibly played disinterested this year). Add Raymond, and are we loosing our positive destination status?

I dont agree with SOB that team meetings at the Roxy were on the up, but???? :huh:

And think about it, all could have had issues with injury management (cept Lou)!

More likely, he just see's a logjam forming at left wing (Danny,Booth,Higgins,Jensen,Raymond), and perhaps wants a landing spot with a bigger role!

:emot-parrot:

The Canucks should just do what STL and PIT did last year with D'Agostini and Kennedy. Don't qualify either but signed them both on July 1st to "cheaper" deals.


This just in > Raymond was a free agent! Free agent means he can sign for whatever and wherever he wants.

a) He was RFA, IF we qualify him, that only meant we had the right to match any offer.
B) Key point, Raymond even NOW is completely free to sign a contract lower than the qualifying amount, including with us!

Maybe he would, if he got security from a longer term?

So we do not have to wait till July 1st to sign for less. In this case the qualifying amount is a bargaining chip to help keep his salary up. Taking him to arbitration reduces that leverage, even if just a little bit. Now he can only negotiate with the Canucks.

Who knows!

#107 ba;;isticsports

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Posted 14 June 2012 - 04:53 PM

I believe Gilles stated Raymond is a Valuable asset to the Team. That does not mean that they will keep him

The Canucks are aware that they need more Grit
I believe his spot will be taken by someone who will be able to knock people on the ice,instead of being the one down on the Ice
The replacement may not have the same speed,but he will be more effective with some good hockey sense to create Havoc in front of the net, and easily get over 15 goals with pp time

Raymonds time as a Canuck is on borrowed time IMO

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or a
Olympic speed skater into a hockey player
Speed will not be enough

#108 Burnsey

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 04:54 AM

When i first heard about this i was hoping we could get him down to $2M at most. He will still be overpayed, but then again I still think he can offer a lot to the team. Getting back from a injury is hard, Kesler obviously had to deal with it. I still believe Raymond can be a top 6 guy for us. We'll have to see if a long summer of training and what not can help him become a better player and the player he can be.

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#109 DownUndaCanuck

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 05:03 AM

2 million for Raymond is just about right, and this Canucks team desperately needs an element of speed, because the rest of our forwards are big, bulky powerforwards. Kings won the Cup with the right mix of speed and toughness, as did Boston and just about every forward group before them.

Right now the only 2 skilled Canucks are the Sedins - the rest are big, bulky powerforwards who's lack of skill really showed in the Kings series. We need Raymond, or if not him someone who plays a skilled game like Alex Semin or Samuelsson/Hodgson to mix up the skill and toughness.

Raymond has been at a 15-20 goal pace over the last few seasons, good for around 40 points which is exactly right for 2 million. Malhotra's making that much and he didn't clear the 10 goal mark, both players are coming off life-threatening injuries but no one hates on Malhotra. The reason? Because we traded Grabner, not Raymond, and he's taking the heat because people expect him to score 30 goals. 30 goals for a 2 million player is rare, don't go comparing him to the Burrows' contract now because he's an anomaly who can attribute half of those 30 goals to the Sedins.
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#110 ice orca

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 05:30 AM

The Canucks would only be signing Mason Raymond so that they may use him in a larger trade.

His value alone is not enough to sign him. I liked the kid's speed and sandpaper, but the back injury is a red flag.

This is something that will be the most significant trade since Luongo coming here.

It involves a roster player and a new addition with Raymond for either a marquee defenceman or a dominant power forward.

I've even heard a rumor of a Schneider to Boston, Lucic to Vancouver trade being looked at.

The Canucks need something serious. Either goaltender in my mind is golden.

You give Vancouver's defence a couple of top 4 additions to compliment Hamhuis, Bieksa, Salo (resigned), and Tanev, and either goalie is elite. Canucks fans should consider this before opening their yaps.

Defence, defense, defence.


Odd i thought that Lucic was untouchable but heard that he could be traded if the deal was right. Big if on a small rumour tho. Jesus imagine a line with Lucic and Kassian on it with Coturier.

#111 Mr. White

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 03:31 PM

Does everyone forget that the kid BROKE HIS FREAKIN BACK one year ago. Give him a break!
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#112 Dr.G

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 04:33 PM

I hate the Mason Raymond abuse... Sure he was frustrating to watch in all of the games this year but he's still 26 and is the top 3 fastest in our team. Lets look at the stats you are calling him out for:

2010-2011 season he 15 goals, 24 assists, 39 assists in 70 games... so terrible isn't it? nah it's a bit subpar but not terrible.
2011-2011 season he had 10 goals, 10 assists, 20 ponts in 55 games... pretty bad indeed but one bad year isn't indicative that he is a bad player.

Having this arbitration we can give Raymond the assurance that we gave Sturm, he'll have a shot at pre-season and a few weeks into the season. If it works then we have a killer scoring speed line in Booth - Kesler - Raymond at a reduced cost, alongside his penalty killing capabilities, and 2nd powerplay time. At worst we find a trade for pick or bottom 6 depth. There is definitely more Reward then Risk in this move.

So peeps take a chill pill, use your head and stop bashing players because everyone else is.


Because everyone else is? I really couldn't care less what other people say about the issue. Mason Raymond is not what the Canucks need. He's small, can't hit, can't score (he had ONE good year), can't pass, and all he can do is skate...whoopty freaking do. I've disliked Raymond for a long time. For 2.5 I'd rather get a decent defender that can actually play hockey unlike Rome and Alberts. Or address the multiple needs our bottom 6 requires.

#113 Phil_314

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Posted 01 July 2012 - 06:17 PM

*BUMP* (haven't heard about it lately and needing a break from GarriMania)

Any news on this front? Did he accept? Decline? Or is it still ongoing?

Sure hope that he and (one #1 goalie) warrants enough interest to land a (hopefully young) Top-6 play making forward out East, I would call that a successful off-season already!

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#114 Pasific Coluseum

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Posted 01 July 2012 - 06:21 PM

I've even heard a rumor of a Schneider to Boston, Lucic to Vancouver trade being looked at.


Talk about a sh***ty rumor. Lucic for Schneider lol
More like Lucic + Kreicji & Hamilton for Schneider & Raymond 2nd/3rd

Schneider is in the Jonathan Quik comparisons. Will be the leagues best goalie in a few years.

Sorry but no happening for just Lucic. I like Lucic and we could use him but he's benefited a lot from having Horton.




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