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[Report] Canucks MIGHT retire Pavel Bure's #10


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#481 ChuckNORRIS4Cup

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 01:53 AM

Now is the time too retire Bures number! Also it's a good way to get some older fans back, who may have lost interest from the lockout.

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Trevor Linden Quote Nov. 29th 2012 [Asked if he would return to the game?]
"The game has been with me for a long time, if the right opportunity came about, you never know"


 

 

"You don't know this, but Trevor Linden had cracked ribs and torn rib cartilage for the last four games of the 1994 Stanley Cup Final," Cliff Ronning said. "You can't imagine what it's like to hear your captain, in a room down the hall, screaming at the top of his lungs as they injected the needle into his rib cage. Knowing him, he probably thought we couldn't hear. He would then walk into our dressing room like nothing had happened. That was inspirational."

 


#482 ChuckNORRIS4Cup

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 01:29 PM

Looks like CDC is back to their old selves typical. Someone sees a topic bumped about Bure's number being retired notices no one else posts in it, so they decide to make their own topic to get their questioned answered, nice work! Maybe I should just start a new topic as well and ask the same question as this topic! Will it be deleted or not? I guess there is only one way to find out.

Eh8NO.jpg

Trevor Linden Quote Nov. 29th 2012 [Asked if he would return to the game?]
"The game has been with me for a long time, if the right opportunity came about, you never know"


 

 

"You don't know this, but Trevor Linden had cracked ribs and torn rib cartilage for the last four games of the 1994 Stanley Cup Final," Cliff Ronning said. "You can't imagine what it's like to hear your captain, in a room down the hall, screaming at the top of his lungs as they injected the needle into his rib cage. Knowing him, he probably thought we couldn't hear. He would then walk into our dressing room like nothing had happened. That was inspirational."

 


#483 viking mama

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Posted 28 March 2013 - 02:47 AM

I guess we need to retire #21 (for Neely) and #11 (for Messier)? Both are former Canucks in the HHoF.

You're totally kidding - right? The Messier years in Vancouver were the "Dark Ages". How that weasel ever thought he could supplant Linden as the true Captain of this team...is beyond me? How he/Keenan/absentee-owner John McCaw...ever thought the room would follow anyone who would dishonorably goon Linden while he was on all 4's... breakin' Trevors' nose as the game-ending siren sounded...is beyond me too! Messier hoped to put Linden outta game 7 & knew others risked suspensions if they retaliated. But - Messier was pretty CONFIDENT that nothin' would happen to him. NOT a peep about it in the eastern media reports post-game either. He had full-backing of the league power-brokers. Our valiant captain stormed back & he scored 2 goals in the final game...& despite the lop-sided officiating - gave the league's fore-ordination plans a scare. What an INSULTING notion it was - bringing that villain to play in this market - so soon after that! Only an "ABSENTEE" owner with TOTAL disconnect to this city - would even dream of it. A complete gong show! Messier in the rafters ...NEVER in VanCity...& not in the ring of honour either. The time he & his inflated ego spent....& did NOT spend....in our fair city....was ALL pretty shame-filled.

Edited by viking mama, 17 April 2013 - 12:06 AM.


#484 Twilight Sparkle

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Posted 28 March 2013 - 02:49 AM

i recall making a thread about this, like 5 years ago, and suggesting a hall of fame, and i was trolled to the fiery pits of hell

Edited by Olias, 28 March 2013 - 02:50 AM.

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#485 Nuxfanabroad

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Posted 28 March 2013 - 04:00 AM

You're totally kidding - right? The Messier years in Vancouver were the "Dark Ages". How that weasel ever thought he could supplant Linden as the true Captain of this team...is beyond me? How he/Keenan/absentee-owner John McCaw...ever thought the room would follow anyone who would dishonorably goon Linden while he was on all 4's... breakin' Trevors' nose as the game-ending siren sounded...is beyond me too! Messier hoped to put Linden outta game 7 & knew others risked suspensions if they retaliated. But - Messier was pretty CONFIDENT that nothin' would happen to him. NOT a peep about it in the eastern media reports post-game either. He had full-backed by the power-brokers. Our valiant captain stormed back & he scored 2 goals in the final game...& despite the lop-sided officiating - gave the league's fore-ordination plans a scare. What an INSULTING notion it was - bringing that villain to play in this market - so soon after that! Only an "ABSENTEE" owner with TOTAL disconnect to this city - would even dream of it. A complete gong show! Messier in the rafters ...NEVER in VanCity...& not in the ring of honour either. The time he & his inflated ego spent....& did NOT spend....in our fair city....was ALL pretty shame-filled.


Well said!

#486 lowest common denominator

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 08:46 AM

BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE BURE

#487 Baggins

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 10:40 AM

Bure's NHL HHOF career spanned from 1991 to 2003

Naslund's NHL career spanned from 1993 to 2009


Commitment to franchise:

Naslund 884 games (5th all-time)
Bure 428 games (31st all time)

That's the difference. Bieksa has already played more game for this franchise than Bure.

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#488 snucks

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 12:09 PM

Commitment to franchise:

Naslund 884 games (5th all-time)
Bure 428 games (31st all time)

That's the difference. Bieksa has already played more game for this franchise than Bure.

At half the speed maybe.

#489 Baggins

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 12:30 PM

And BTW Baggins, this is the point I would like to hear your response too.

Posted Imagescottiecanuck, on 08 December 2012 - 02:47 PM, said:

You don't retire a number for what could have been, you do it for what actually was.
What it actually was was a hhof career, elite play for his entire time in the NHL, helped to save the franchise, brought a whole new generation of canuck fans and hockey fans in general. Too bad he only played 500- games, kinda like Orr#4.


Gladly. Although most of it has already been covered repeatedly.

1 - Number retirement and HHoF are two distinctly different honors. The former relates to the players relationship and accomplishments with a franchise while the latter encompasses a players entire career. One does not automatically mean the other.

2 - Attendance went down during Bures time here, not up. How does that translate into saving the franchise? As a matter of fact the the attendance went up after Linden and Maclean joined the team which was prior to Bures arrival. I've already posted the attendance numbers which clearly show this.

3 - Naslund brought a new generation of fans to the team. Every player has their fans. Stars simply attract more new fans than others. I don't see that a reason to retire a number.

4 - In my mind Bure doesn't even belong in the same sentence with Orr. Bobby Orr changed the way the game was played. The only real comparison is they both won the Calder Trophy and had shortened careers due to knee injuries. After that it moves drastically in Orrs favor.....

First all-star team 8 times.
8 Norris trophies
2 Art Ross trophies
6 time league +/- leader (still an NHL record)
3 Hart trophies
2 Conne Smythe trophies
1 Lester B. Pearson trophy
1 Lester Patrick trophy
2 Stanley Cups (scoring the cup winning goal both times)

Some standing NHL Records:
Most points in one NHL season by a defenseman (139; 1970–71)
Most assists in one NHL season by a defenseman (102; 1970–71)
Highest plus/minus in one NHL season (+124; 1970–71)
Only player in history to win four major NHL awards in one season (Hart, Norris, Art Ross, and Conn Smythe in 1970)
Only defenseman to win the scoring title
Only player to win both the Norris and Art Ross in the same season more than once

I won't bother listing the multitude of records he held when he retired or individual game records.

5 - Orr played 657 NHL games (631 with Boston). Scottie should try to get something right when referencing a legend. In addition he played 74 playoff games (all with Boston).


Will that suffice Smashian? Would you care to list Bure's vast NHL accomplishments in comparison to Orr? You know, "what actually was". Orr may have had a shortened career, but it was jam packed with accomplishments.

Some of you try to make Bure out to be more than he was. He was a very talented goal scorer whose speed made him exciting to watch. I don't see exciting as a reason to retire a players number. Nor do I see talent alone as a reason enough for a franchise retire a number. There needs to be more to it relating to the franchise itself. Games played for the franchise and accomplishments with the franchise should be large factors. And yes, even community involvement as a lesser factor but a factor nonetheless. The most glaring shortcoming for Bure is games played. Nor is the accomplishment column chocked full (See Orr above). Community is just big void. Take the Bure fan glasses off and put the three together and despite his talent, there really isn't much there to warrant a teams highest honor. His career is deserving of the HHoF and I've maintained that for years. But there aren't enough check marks with this franchise for a number retirement. If he had a multitude of NHL records or NHL awards like Orr did with Boston during his time as a Canuck you could certainly make a real case for ignoring the 428 games played. But he doesn't even have a tiny fraction of that countermeasure that Orr had.

He belongs in the ring of honor because he was a great player. But number retirement should be for great Canucks. I just don't see him as a great Canuck.

That's my opinion.

Edited by Baggins, 05 April 2013 - 12:43 PM.

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#490 DeNiro

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 12:43 PM

That's my opinion.


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#491 Baggins

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 12:45 PM

You're totally kidding - right? The Messier years in Vancouver were the "Dark Ages". How that weasel ever thought he could supplant Linden as the true Captain of this team...is beyond me? How he/Keenan/absentee-owner John McCaw...ever thought the room would follow anyone who would dishonorably goon Linden while he was on all 4's... breakin' Trevors' nose as the game-ending siren sounded...is beyond me too! Messier hoped to put Linden outta game 7 & knew others risked suspensions if they retaliated. But - Messier was pretty CONFIDENT that nothin' would happen to him. NOT a peep about it in the eastern media reports post-game either. He had full-backed by the power-brokers. Our valiant captain stormed back & he scored 2 goals in the final game...& despite the lop-sided officiating - gave the league's fore-ordination plans a scare. What an INSULTING notion it was - bringing that villain to play in this market - so soon after that! Only an "ABSENTEE" owner with TOTAL disconnect to this city - would even dream of it. A complete gong show! Messier in the rafters ...NEVER in VanCity...& not in the ring of honour either. The time he & his inflated ego spent....& did NOT spend....in our fair city....was ALL pretty shame-filled.


You should look up the word "context".

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#492 Baggins

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 12:46 PM

Posted Image


Good argument. You're "special".

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#493 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 02:34 PM

Gladly. Although most of it has already been covered repeatedly.

1 - Number retirement and HHoF are two distinctly different honors. The former relates to the players relationship and accomplishments with a franchise while the latter encompasses a players entire career. One does not automatically mean the other.

2 - Attendance went down during Bures time here, not up. How does that translate into saving the franchise? As a matter of fact the the attendance went up after Linden and Maclean joined the team which was prior to Bures arrival. I've already posted the attendance numbers which clearly show this.

3 - Naslund brought a new generation of fans to the team. Every player has their fans. Stars simply attract more new fans than others. I don't see that a reason to retire a number.

4 - In my mind Bure doesn't even belong in the same sentence with Orr. Bobby Orr changed the way the game was played. The only real comparison is they both won the Calder Trophy and had shortened careers due to knee injuries. After that it moves drastically in Orrs favor.....

First all-star team 8 times.
8 Norris trophies
2 Art Ross trophies
6 time league +/- leader (still an NHL record)
3 Hart trophies
2 Conne Smythe trophies
1 Lester B. Pearson trophy
1 Lester Patrick trophy
2 Stanley Cups (scoring the cup winning goal both times)

Some standing NHL Records:
Most points in one NHL season by a defenseman (139; 1970–71)
Most assists in one NHL season by a defenseman (102; 1970–71)
Highest plus/minus in one NHL season (+124; 1970–71)
Only player in history to win four major NHL awards in one season (Hart, Norris, Art Ross, and Conn Smythe in 1970)
Only defenseman to win the scoring title
Only player to win both the Norris and Art Ross in the same season more than once

I won't bother listing the multitude of records he held when he retired or individual game records.

5 - Orr played 657 NHL games (631 with Boston). Scottie should try to get something right when referencing a legend. In addition he played 74 playoff games (all with Boston).


Will that suffice Smashian? Would you care to list Bure's vast NHL accomplishments in comparison to Orr? You know, "what actually was". Orr may have had a shortened career, but it was jam packed with accomplishments.

Some of you try to make Bure out to be more than he was. He was a very talented goal scorer whose speed made him exciting to watch. I don't see exciting as a reason to retire a players number. Nor do I see talent alone as a reason enough for a franchise retire a number. There needs to be more to it relating to the franchise itself. Games played for the franchise and accomplishments with the franchise should be large factors. And yes, even community involvement as a lesser factor but a factor nonetheless. The most glaring shortcoming for Bure is games played. Nor is the accomplishment column chocked full (See Orr above). Community is just big void. Take the Bure fan glasses off and put the three together and despite his talent, there really isn't much there to warrant a teams highest honor. His career is deserving of the HHoF and I've maintained that for years. But there aren't enough check marks with this franchise for a number retirement. If he had a multitude of NHL records or NHL awards like Orr did with Boston during his time as a Canuck you could certainly make a real case for ignoring the 428 games played. But he doesn't even have a tiny fraction of that countermeasure that Orr had.

He belongs in the ring of honor because he was a great player. But number retirement should be for great Canucks. I just don't see him as a great Canuck.

That's my opinion.


Haha this is kinda an old thing. I read part of it.

I agree with some of your points, and disagree with others. I agree he isn't Orr (Who I think is the best player ever) and I don't really know what context that comparison was in because its been so long I just don't remember. :P And I am feeling lazy right now so I don't want to read the last few pages.

I think Bure's # should hang because talent wise he is the best player in our franchise's history. This is like the Caps not retiring Ovechkin's # at the end of his career IMO.

So many people became fans of the team because of him. yeah that might no have translated in the attendence numbers. But remember those we tough economic times.

I think we are seeing the Bure affect still, like for example someones parents become fans because of Bure, then they children become fans because the family is, and now we have a massive fanbase. And that's surely part of it.

Then you also add the arena being dubbed "the house that Bure built" and for good reason, without a superstar I don't think we would have built the arena, that we badly needed or else we might have moved like Winnipeg.

This is all I can think of off the top of my head. If you disagree thats fine but I think Bure's # should be retired as he was a paramount reason as to why our franchise is so successful now. And thats his contribution to this franchise.

Hopefully it goes up.

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#494 Nicklasjensen46

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 02:36 PM

I could only hope! Him and markus my two all time favorite Canucks...

My 2012 Canucks
Sedin Sedin Burrows
Higgins Kesler Hodgson
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Sammuelson Lapiere Oreskovich

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#495 Kass9

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 02:39 PM

His number is definitely getting retired.

Aquilini is probably making him partake in all these events to make fans love him again (he does deserve the recognition)

Before yesterday, did we even know where Bure was?

#496 TimberWolf

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 02:48 PM

You're totally kidding - right? The Messier years in Vancouver were the "Dark Ages". How that weasel ever thought he could supplant Linden as the true Captain of this team...is beyond me? How he/Keenan/absentee-owner John McCaw...ever thought the room would follow anyone who would dishonorably goon Linden while he was on all 4's... breakin' Trevors' nose as the game-ending siren sounded...is beyond me too! Messier hoped to put Linden outta game 7 & knew others risked suspensions if they retaliated. But - Messier was pretty CONFIDENT that nothin' would happen to him. NOT a peep about it in the eastern media reports post-game either. He had full-backed by the power-brokers. Our valiant captain stormed back & he scored 2 goals in the final game...& despite the lop-sided officiating - gave the league's fore-ordination plans a scare. What an INSULTING notion it was - bringing that villain to play in this market - so soon after that! Only an "ABSENTEE" owner with TOTAL disconnect to this city - would even dream of it. A complete gong show! Messier in the rafters ...NEVER in VanCity...& not in the ring of honour either. The time he & his inflated ego spent....& did NOT spend....in our fair city....was ALL pretty shame-filled.


He wasn't campaigning to retire Messiers number. He was pointing out that HHOF doesn't make it mandatory for us to do so or we would have Sundin up there as well for example. Numbers getting retired are based off of a bond with a team, not personal achievements the entire league recognizes. Hence why it would be ridiculous to have Messiers up there.

Well said!


If this was a "why I hate Messier thread" it would be very well said. Unfortunately it was a retaliation to an argument that was not made, so not very well said at all.

I was saying Lu-Urns...

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#497 viking mama

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Posted 17 April 2013 - 12:02 AM

Your mad at his lack of community service? Why does that matter? What if he was shy? Or not a people person. Or crazy vancity fans would leave him alone?


Or what if he served the community in more inconspicuous ways? Ask the First Nations folks how they feel about Bure? He accompanied Gino to events & met with native youth. Service doesn't have to be splashed about the news to be relevant or meaningful. Bure was simply a non-English speaking foreign kid who played hockey & was also severely over-shadowed by a Svengali-dad who tagged along & over-saw most of his training. The Canucks even had daddy-Bure on the pay-roll. Think Daddy Hodgson x 10! Bure's immersion experiences were irregular....to say the least!

Has anyone floated the idea about that Bure may be offered the Ring-Of-Honour and/or a STATUE as the "Russian Rocket" either inside or outside of the building? A glassed over jersey permanently on display could be another offering - instead of having one raised. Who knows? But - whatever transpires will be remarkable & befitting the player.

Edited by viking mama, 17 April 2013 - 01:59 AM.


#498 viking mama

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Posted 17 April 2013 - 12:55 AM

He wasn't campaigning to retire Messiers number. He was pointing out that HHOF doesn't make it mandatory for us to do so or we would have Sundin up there as well for example. Numbers getting retired are based off of a bond with a team, not personal achievements the entire league recognizes. Hence why it would be ridiculous to have Messiers up there.



If this was a "why I hate Messier thread" it would be very well said. Unfortunately it was a retaliation to an argument that was not made, so not very well said at all.


My address was responding to the scenario where the proposal was a serious one. Thus my opening question or remark: "You're totally kidding - right?" The very inkling of retiring Messier's jersey in VanCity filled me with rage & I chose to share my thoughts on the matter.

No dissing of the sarcasm or the commenter's points to the contrary was ever intended. I regret none of the words posted.

@ Nuxsfanabroad - Thanks for being a comrade on the board. And - for agreeing with my views on what a gaff it t'was to make Messier a...Canuck. Shudder! If the dude had only come over & toiled a spell to honestly earn an "A"? Had Mess only expressed some praise, respect & support for the resident "C" Trevor Linden? Or had he chosen to shoot-down all of the chatter begging that he be offered an unearned "C" by the very squad that had previously viewed him as a villified opponent? Any of those acts, gestures or choices would have been better received by the fans.

But - those very CHOICES are at the heart of the glaring differences between these 2 former captains. Humility/Heart/Service vs. Ego/Ambition/Avarice. I'm extremely proud of the players VanCity has already chosen to honor by placin' their jersies in the rafters....and altho' I'm unopposed to honoring Bure...but I might have more ambivelent feelings should Bure's jersey be included among 'em. I suppose IF... #10 were raised...I'd accept it as a decision by the OWNER. It is his team after-all....& then I'd have NO need to discuss it further...and I'd move on.

Edited by viking mama, 04 June 2013 - 02:24 PM.


#499 frazzY

frazzY

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Posted 17 April 2013 - 05:48 AM

Might?




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