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trades to shake up core and get a lil younger

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#1 canuktravella

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 06:03 AM

heres my proposal

1st trade- capitals dmitri orlov for janick hansen
solid 2way 3rd pair dman 19 points last yr in 60 games due to call up due to injuries.
have to give sonethng to get a good player.

2nd trade- stars jamie benn 2nd round pick for alex edler.

edler will be a ufa next yr unless we resign him. plus he has a bad back. this ones risky
does it seem like a fair trade or would we want more for him?
the way i look at one of either ballard or edlers will be gone.
we as a team have to many four million dmen ones gotta give
bieska 4.6 hamhuis 4.5 ballard 4.2 garrison 4.6 edler could get 7 mill in offseason or more
specially with wings and flyers drooling over any big name ufa dman.

3rd trade- bobby luo for tyler bozak karl gunnarson 2nd rounder
do you think thats fair or would you want leafs first round pick instead of 2nd??

4th trade raymond for a bag of bbq dorito chips or give him a one way ticket to siberia.

sign a free agent 4th liner thats gritty any ideas let me know.

new lines would look like this ....
sedin sedin burrows - old steady line
benn kesler booth - this line would be fast and score bunches
kassian bozak higgins - hard working 3rd
manny lapps freeagent - shutdown line

bieska hamhuis solid first pair
ballard garrison scores and defensive
orlov gunnarson cheaper third pair responsible
alberts
tanev connauton corrado fight for spots next yr

schneider
backup plug or lack

good or bad ??

Edited by canuktravella, 06 December 2012 - 02:05 AM.

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#2 Gooseberries

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 06:20 AM

I like orlov for Hansen. slight underpayment on our part I think. the only way I'd ever trade edger was if we got a grade a defensive prospect back like orlov so that works. stop trying to trade for benn. he is untouchable. Dallas is building around him. love the raymond trade. the lu trade is fair...just not a fan of gunnarson.

Edited by TruCanuck, 04 December 2012 - 06:27 AM.

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#3 Gooseberries

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 06:25 AM

definitely not the worst proposal I've seen. Lu trade is realistic. hansen trade is close. Raymond trade is spot on. and it's OK to have a hard on for benn. I do along with half if CDC. we should start a support group.
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#4 canuktravella

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 08:17 AM

thanks guys first proposal no ones trolled me haha i only would trade edler if he isnt gonna sign long term
but if he does then ballard would need to go but since av has killed his worth its not worth trading him i sure hope gillis fixes this.
Oh ya orlovs awesome wishful thinking in three yrs hamhuis corrado
garrison connauton
orlov sauve would be good
i hope this yr sauve gets a shot
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#5 Pears

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 08:21 AM

Not bad, but not great either. Getting better though.
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs

Gaudreau has one NHL goal whereas all your "prized" prospects have none.

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#6 canuktravella

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 09:45 AM

ok if its ok lets hear u make 4 trades that are better. not unrealistic and moves that shake the core up a bit getting younger id love to hear if you come up with anything better
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#7 Aladeen

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 10:27 AM

Logged in just to respond to this crap

1. We will NEVER get back in return for trading Hansen the value and work ethic he brings to the table.
2. You are dreaming to think that the Stars would ever Trade Benn. If they were to Kesler would be a starting point.
3. If leafs don't pony up a 1st ++ I don't think MG should do it --> that is just my opinion though.
4. Hmm let Raymond go for nothing or take a zero risk (consider the canucks already have him) potential high reward (should he have a bounce back year) - As unlikely as it is for him to become a solid top-6 player, some chance is better than just cutting him and ending up with a cap hit anyways.

If this is your first proposal I hope it is your last. Very weak use some common sense!
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#8 Phil_314

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 10:29 AM

From Vancouver's perspective it's not bad and I would do these trades; I'm not sure Hansen has the value to get Orlov, plus the back end might not have enough scoring for my liking
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#9 Gooseberries

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 10:40 AM

Logged in just to respond to this crap

1. We will NEVER get back in return for trading Hansen the value and work ethic he brings to the table.
2. You are dreaming to think that the Stars would ever Trade Benn. If they were to Kesler would be a starting point.
3. If leafs don't pony up a 1st ++ I don't think MG should do it --> that is just my opinion though.
4. Hmm let Raymond go for nothing or take a zero risk (consider the canucks already have him) potential high reward (should he have a bounce back year) - As unlikely as it is for him to become a solid top-6 player, some chance is better than just cutting him and ending up with a cap hit anyways.

If this is your first proposal I hope it is your last. Very weak use some common sense!

lay off man it's not terrible. far from the worst we've seen on cdc. and you know when you consider hansen an untouchable you overvalue our players. although he has truck loads of heart and work ethic he is far far from an offensive Juggernaut.

Edited by TruCanuck, 04 December 2012 - 10:42 AM.

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#10 Dogbyte

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 11:02 AM

Don't mind the first one.

Benn is far more valuable then UFA Edler.

Don't like Bozak as a return, barely, if a hockey player on a real NHL team.
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#11 Aladeen

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 11:08 AM

lay off man it's not terrible. far from the worst we've seen on cdc. and you know when you consider hansen an untouchable you overvalue our players. although he has truck loads of heart and work ethic he is far far from an offensive Juggernaut.

Yah it is terrible and its up there with the worst. I did not say Hansen was untouchable I merely stated the fact that he will never bring back in return what he is worth because most in the league do not see his heart and work ethic only his stats.

If you think the Canucks can get Benn for UFA Edler we may as well trade Raymond Ballard and a 1st for Stamkos or Crosby.\

That return for Luu is weak and does not make the Canucks better

Getting rid of Raymond for zero return unless cap space is truly needed DOES NOT make the Canucks better

So yah his propsal sucks period no matter how you want to spin it.

Edited by Aladeen, 04 December 2012 - 11:10 AM.

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#12 Gretzky's Mullet

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 11:08 AM

With a trade proposal, you need a "why do it?" rationale (as opposed to just "why not?") and you need the trades to be realistic. As has been said, the only significant improvement amongst these moves is the acquisition of Benn, and Dallas isn't trading him, least of all for a UFA-to-be. The Lu trade is pretty unoriginal, and the other ones don't seem to have much of a point save for "shaking up the team", which I strongly doubt Gillis is seeking to do. Not a downright awful proposal, but not really exciting either.
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#13 Red-Haired_Shanks

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 11:48 AM

can you spell correctly please?
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#14 Monty

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 12:02 PM

can you spell correctly please?


If you have read his 14 other threads he's posted in the last week, no he can't. I think everyone has stopped ragging on his spelling. I'm just getting over it now.As for your proposal, not great. As Aladeen has said, Hansen isn't untouchable, but he does bring so much to the table: work ethic, heart, and most of all he is popular with his teammates. The Canucks just wouldn't get what he's worth in return. Adding to that, Washington is weak on the backend with a mediocre goaltender, so they need all their defensive prospects at this point. Hansen wouldn't be worth their time.Although the Canucks won't get what Lu is worth in return, they can get more than what you proposed, but not much more.Yes, Benn is good and any team would love to have him, which is why Stars won't be giving him up. Also, as I have said numerous times, people absolutely do not appreciate Edler as much as they should in Vancouver. They would be foolish to give him up, UFA or not.
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#15 Dancin'Droid

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 12:44 PM

Getting rid of Raymond for zero return unless cap space is truly needed DOES NOT make the Canucks better


Raymond is getting a return, a bag of doritos
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#16 Gooseberries

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 12:47 PM

Raymond is getting a return, a bag of doritos

hmmmmm doesn't state what kind... I'm intrigued
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#17 Machine Gun Kelly

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 01:13 PM

Just a tip, people will take you way more seriously if you use proper spelling, punctuation, and grammar. And the joke about Raymond wasn't funny.
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#18 Jägermeister

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 01:33 PM

The Caps would never go for it. They have a plethora of gritty wingers, and Orlov has the potential to be a solid top 4 D.
Dallas would also not go for it. Benn is the future of their team.
Not a fan of Bozak, so I wouldn't do the TO trade. I would want one of their high end prospects in return.
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#19 Pears

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 01:35 PM

How does this sound hockey trade-wise?

To Montreal: Jamie Benn

To Dallas: PK Subban

May not happen but I think its alright in value.
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs

Gaudreau has one NHL goal whereas all your "prized" prospects have none.

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#20 Monty

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 01:49 PM

How does this sound hockey trade-wise?

To Montreal: Jamie Benn

To Dallas: PK Subban

May not happen but I think its alright in value.


Dallas may actually do that. And yes, Montreal definitely could use Benn. However, I don't think they need him at the expense of giving up Subban. Montreal is already a small team and look even worse on defense. Giving up Subban who has the size, offensive output for a dman, and is their best defenseman would be a bad move.Also, for marketing purposes, Subban is a gold mine for selling jersey vs. Benn.
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#21 JHansenFan

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 02:02 PM

Alright lets start with the first trade and break it down. Why would a team like Vancouver want Orlov, and where did you get the solid two way defensemen part from. Have you never seen him play, and just look at his stats to justify that statement. Vancouver's defense is good enough, and we don't need another player in the press box, because there is no room on our blue line. The following is a quote from Hockey's future that states that Orlov is a freelancing offensive minded blueliner. His defensive game could be refined, but in no way is he a two way defensemen at this point in his career. If you look further down on the site, it also says that at this stage in his career he still needs to develop defensive aspects of his game. Thus this disproves your statement judging how good he is.


Talent Analysis

Orlov is a talented, smooth skating offensive defenseman who prefers to press the attack and create scoring opportunities at all times. His freelancing at times creates openings for the opposition, but Orlov is a constant threat. He is a decent sized player with a strong core but does not play an overly physical game. His strong suit is his creativity and high skill level which allows him to execute the complex plays he conceives. His shooting is accurate if not powerful and he is also adept at finding teammates with quick passes.


Onto the trade. Why would Vancouver give up a player like Hansen, when our forwards is the group that needs more depth. We are creating a hole in our roster to plug a non existent hole on our blueline. Furthermore Hansen can kill penalties, has speed, is gritty, and has some playmaking ability. All aspects that you like in your forward group, as shown in your other threads. That's just pure contradiction. Your trading a forward who can hit for a defense man who cannot hit and has an undeveloped defensive game at this point in time.

On the Dallas Stars trade. I would love to make that deal, but unfortunately Dallas would not. They have a decent defense group which is anchored by Alex Goligoski, Stephane Robidas, Trevor Daley, and Phillip Larsen. They don't need another big defensemen, and certainly not at the cost of their star forward Jamie Benn. Dallas needs more offense, and they would be looking and acquiring one of David Booth or Alex Burrows before Alex Edler. One more point that would make this trade fall through quickly is the fact that Edler may be a UFA, and might never even throw on the Stars Jersey. You don't trade your star forward for a potential rental player. The theory of filling one hole, but creating another hole applies here again, except this time with the Stars having nothing to do with the trade. We trade our big hitter defensemen which again you seem to like, for a forward who can hit in the mould of Kesler (More offensively skilled though)

Now onto the Leafs trade. Using the same points as before, why do we need another defensemen that has trouble cracking the leafs roster. Our center position is pretty set, and we have prospects such as Schroeder who is ready for a chance to play in the NHL. We have Jensen and Gaunce who are developing that again could potentially make our squad in the coming years. Even with a 1st round pick from the Leafs that trade needs major major work. We would have to look at prospects such as Tyler Biggs or Jerry D'Aimgo for this to ahppen.

Now for the Raymond trade. True we do get younger getting a bag of chips in return, unless that bag is from the 1980's than we are in trouble. However Raymond does have value, but not whilst playing on our team just like Grabner. Raymond has speed, and he has offensive skill and on the right team where he can play a second line spot consistently he could be used. His speed is used to kill penalties, and to forecheck. You don't need to trade him for a bag of scraps. He doesn't have the most value, but he does have some. CDC in general needs to realize his value isn't the sky, but it's not the ground either.

Overall your proposals are terrible, with absolutely no reasoning for any team to do a thing. You suggested we sign a 4th liner. Well why don't you suggest one instead of making us work since you are writing the proposal. I could make a proposal equally as easy doing this

To Vancouver: Kris Letang, Sidney Crosby, Evgeni Malkin
To Pittsburgh: Everything worth value

Next... sign 4 top six forwards, 2 shutdown forwards, 4 puckmoving mobile defensemen, a starting goalie, and a 4th line hitter.

Fix these in your proposals... and you might have something half readable:

1. Spelling and Grammer (hard to believe your roughly 27. The school must have been really poor)
2. Reasoning for both teams
3. Proper value of players
4. Use players names instead of a hypothetical "4th liner" etc.
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#22 JHansenFan

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 02:05 PM

Oh quick note. Corrado fighting for a roster spot next year? Yann Sauve and KC are much further ahead in development than Corrado.
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#23 Phil_314

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 02:07 PM

Dallas may actually do that. And yes, Montreal definitely could use Benn. However, I don't think they need him at the expense of giving up Subban. Montreal is already a small team and look even worse on defense. Giving up Subban who has the size, offensive output for a dman, and is their best defenseman would be a bad move.Also, for marketing purposes, Subban is a gold mine for selling jersey vs. Benn.


I disagree; both sides should be better off keeping their young stud. Dallas without Benn looks terribly small and thin up the middle (Roy, Eakin, Fiddler and Wandell would be their center group and Eakin's still unproven, their biggest guy would also only be 6'1" (Wandell)) unless somehow Faksa plays his way into the Top 6-- considering he's still in the OHL that's highly unlikely. Dallas' D-group is actually not bad already.

Montreal would look better up front but on the back they'd be going with

Gorges - Markov (defensive D - injury-prone star)
Emelin - Kaberle (big hitter, not much else - offensive D-man in decline)
mishmash of Bouillon, Diaz and Weber in the third pair, unless Beaulieu and Tinordi are ready to step in, which may give the Habs more incentive (and depth on the back end) to make this trade
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#24 Monty

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 03:52 PM

I disagree; both sides should be better off keeping their young stud.  Dallas without Benn looks terribly small and thin up the middle (Roy, Eakin, Fiddler and Wandell would be their center group and Eakin's still unproven, their biggest guy would also only be 6'1" (Wandell)) unless somehow Faksa plays his way into the Top 6-- considering he's still in the OHL that's highly unlikely.  Dallas' D-group is actually not bad already.

Montreal would look better up front but on the back they'd be going with

Gorges - Markov (defensive D - injury-prone star)
Emelin - Kaberle (big hitter, not much else - offensive D-man in decline)
mishmash of Bouillon, Diaz and Weber in the third pair, unless Beaulieu and Tinordi are ready to step in, which may give the Habs more incentive (and depth on the back end) to make this trade


How are we disagreeing? I don't see Montreal agreeing to this. If proposed, Dallas would actually think about it, but may not do it. However, Montreal would say no if Dallas were to propose this. Not gonna happen.
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#25 RonMexico

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 04:27 PM

The Canucks already had their chance to part ways with Raymond...instead they re-signed him to a 1 year deal.
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#26 canuktravella

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 05:07 PM

ya its unfortunate that they resign raymond hes overrated anyone who thinks hes good is stupid all he does is skate fast and fall on his ass. rather throw 2.3 mill on a tough 4th line thats dependable.
alandeen you have no clue about values on hockey players. hansen is a hardworker but hes not untradeable.
orlov was amazing in playoffs was one of caps best defenseman and one goal nineteen assists and plus one in sixty regular games most mean he isnt that bad. plus he makes 3.4 mill less than ballard on his entry level contract id sayvthat would be a perfect 5th dman.
Read the article on gills talking about corrado i could see him playing next yr up on the bigs gillis even said he wants players like him to help with cap hits on team. Hes on team canada camp and probably will make the team.
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#27 JHansenFan

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 05:22 PM

I love how you never directly respond to me, and yet you try to take on posters around me. My points are well developed, and in the article Gillis is talking about why Corrado got games with the Wolves last season after his junior season ended. He wanted Corrado to know he could play in the AHL at this moment, and no where does he say that he is ready to push for an NHL spot. The part about how important it is to get kids on NHL entry level contracts due to the salary cap does not imply Corrado. I'm not sure if you understand, but most defensemen can't just spend one season in the AHL and step right into the NHL. At this moment, He is not even in the AHL, but is playing in the OHL. You always say that you want a tough 4th liner who can play big minutes.

Where would you throw this money on... is he a free agent, would it be through trade, or perhaps would we be resigning one of our prospects to play that role as they develop? The points Orlov put up were in the regular season. However this is the part where you will be hurt in the argument.


You said that Orlov was amazing for the caps in the playoffs.... I fail to see how someone can be amazing without playing in a single playoff game.

http://capitals.nhl.com/club/player.htm?id=8475200&view=stats

Unless of course you mean the Hershey Bears.... or in the KHL. However you did state that he was the "Caps" best defensemen. Really you should know what your talking about.
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#28 -Vintage Canuck-

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 05:24 PM

I love how you never directly respond to me, and yet you try to take on posters around me. My points are well developed, and in the article Gillis is talking about why Corrado got games with the Wolves last season after his junior season ended. He wanted Corrado to know he could play in the AHL at this moment, and no where does he say that he is ready to push for an NHL spot. The part about how important it is to get kids on NHL entry level contracts due to the salary cap does not imply Corrado. I'm not sure if you understand, but most defensemen can't just spend one season in the AHL and step right into the NHL. At this moment, He is not even in the AHL, but is playing in the OHL. You always say that you want a tough 4th liner who can play big minutes.

Where would you throw this money on... is he a free agent, would it be through trade, or perhaps would we be resigning one of our prospects to play that role as they develop? The points Orlov put up were in the regular season. However this is the part where you will be hurt in the argument.


You said that Orlov was amazing for the caps in the playoffs.... I fail to see how someone can be amazing without playing in a single playoff game.

http://capitals.nhl....5200&view=stats

Unless of course you mean the Hershey Bears.... or in the KHL. However you did state that he was the "Caps" best defensemen. Really you should know what your talking about.


I like that quote in your sig. Haha!
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#29 JimLahey

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 06:57 PM

ya its unfortunate that they resign raymond hes overrated anyone who thinks hes good is stupid all he does is skate fast and fall on his ass. rather throw 2.3 mill on a tough 4th line thats dependable.


Raymond is good defensively and has offensive upside. Coming off a broken back, I see him having a good next season, whenever that may be.

alandeen you have no clue about values on hockey players. hansen is a hardworker but hes not untradeable.
orlov was amazing in playoffs was one of caps best defenseman and one goal nineteen assists and plus one in sixty regular games most mean he isnt that bad. plus he makes 3.4 mill less than ballard on his entry level contract id sayvthat would be a perfect 5th dman.



I believe he was saying that Hansen is more valuable to us than Orlov would be. A very effective third line forward is way more valuable to us than another defenseman in our solid d-core. We do not need more defensemen at the cost of trading a key forward.

Read the article on gills talking about corrado i could see him playing next yr up on the bigs gillis even said he wants players like him to help with cap hits on team. Hes on team canada camp and probably will make the team.


Corrado is a good defensive prospect and a terrific find by Gillis. He will not be on the big club next year. He will not outplay Hamhuis, Bieksa, Garrison or Ballard. Tanev, Connauton and Sauve will resign. There is our top seven for next year. Corrado doesn't fit and will have a season or two with the Wolves, which will only be good for him.

Again, Corrado is a good defenseman, but he isn't "probably going to make the team." I'm hopeful he will outplay Hamilton, Harrington, Reilly, Dumba, Murphy, Oullet, or Reinhart and make the team, but it is less than a sure thing. (I HOPE I am wrong and we see Corrado in red and white in a few weeks).

BUT, I don't see a need for the hate you get, canuk. You make original proposals and don't think you deserve the ridicule, but your deals do need to come with a sense of "why each team would make this proposed deal."
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#30 canuktravella

canuktravella

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 11:35 PM

i have faith in corrado making team canada snd who knows if he wont play in bigs next yr unless u can predict the future. who knows edler could be gone or ballard or a bad injury. or if corrado shines he could be on team next yrvmwait an see
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